George Pickens losing snaps

[nobody 2,557]

It looks like Pickens wasn't in on 2 or 1 wide receiver sets for some reason.

https://www.si.com/nfl/mike-tomlin-gave-strange-explanation-for-george-pickenss-low-snap-count-vs-cowboys

When asked about it, Tomlin said it's like rotating defensive linemen which doesn't really make a ton of sense being d-linemen usually rotate for rest purposes.  But let's assume he's talking about when teams bring in pass rush specialists on passing downs.  Is Tomlin trying to say that Pickens is a bad run blocker so they'd prefer Calvin Austin and Van Jefferson over Pickens in 12 (1 back/two tightened) or 22 (2 backs and 2 tightened) personnel?  I find that hard to believe given their sizes.

My guess is he's got some attitude issues.  Like maybe he's not putting in max effort when he doesn't think he's getting the ball.  I don't watch enough Steelers to know, but Ceedee Lamb used to do that and it drove me nuts.  Lamb fixed it around week 4 of last season and became one of the best receivers in the league almost immediately.

 

[weepaws 3,152]

Maybe, he just had solid game the week before.  So another wr with deva tude. 

[polecatt 474]

It seems like the Steelers whole roster operates on a rotation basis...

Nobody knows who is gonna be the starting QB long term, or RB...

Now their WRs are mixed up...

Did they fire Tomlin and hire Belichick without me noticing?

[nobody 2,557]

He does appear to be half-assing it on many of these routes, but I don't know if that's a result of him pouting because he's being rotated out or if he always does this.

 

[kutulu 1,659]

Pitt is great at drafting WRs, the only problem is half the time they're headcases 

[Ray_T 740]

14 hours ago, kutulu said:

Pitt is great at drafting WRs, the only problem is half the time they're headcases 

or he just wants out of there and hes trying to force a trade.   Diva WR's tend to do that sort of thing.   I thought Diggs was doing it in the latter half of last season in Buffalo myself.

[TBayXXXVII 2,482]

20 hours ago, nobody said:

He does appear to be half-assing it on many of these routes, but I don't know if that's a result of him pouting because he's being rotated out or if he always does this.

 

Having a hard time believing this twitter post makes the point he's trying to make.  The first play, half speed or not, the play was clearly designed to go the other way and not only did Pickens keep his guy on the his side, he pulled the LB AND Safety over.  He literally kept 3 defenders away from the ball.

The second play, he was wide open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

The third play is just like the first, it was going the other way and was going to be a quick short pass.  What do you want Pickens do, run full speed the other way knowing that Fields is never going to look his way.  In fact, I think Pickens ran the perfect route.  The play was going to be a short pass to the opposite side of the field.  Pickens was slow as to not bring defenders on his side of the field to the ball side.  He's also drifting towards the ball in case the pass isn't made while staying behind the LB and in front of the DB leaving a window open.

The 4th play, the ball was over his head, he was open, but he should've caught it.

The 5th play, he was open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

 

I stopped watching.  On all 5 plays in the clip that I watched, I see absolutely nothing wrong with Pickens play.  Yeah, he should've caught the ball that was thrown to him, but he was where he was supposed to be and on time.  I mean, if there's an issue with him not catching it, sorry, I'm not buying it.  I'm sure I could go out and find a lot of passes that either Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, or Hill should've caught, but didn't.

[nobody 2,557]

He's running at about 75% (I hope)

I get backing off when the play is a screen to the other side of the field, but when you're in the pattern, you have to run your route full effort.

That's the early career Ceedee Lamb thing.  I'm telling you I could literally tell when he was getting the ball and when he wasn't just by watching his release at the snap.  Ceedee didn't become Ceedee until he fixed that and ran hard every play.

Or I guess he could just be a terrible route runner.

[polecatt 474]

3 minutes ago, nobody said:

He's running at about 75% (I hope)

I get backing off when the play is a screen to the other side of the field, but when you're in the pattern, you have to run your route full effort.

That's the early career Ceedee Lamb thing.  I'm telling you I could literally tell when he was getting the ball and when he wasn't just by watching his release at the snap.  Ceedee didn't become Ceedee until he fixed that and ran hard every play.

Or I guess he could just be a terrible route runner.

Yeah that's exactly right about CeeDee, he was used to coasting in college and it took him two seasons to get going.

Could say the same thing about Jerry Jeudy except he's not corrected the issue yet. Perhaps he's doing that now in Cleveland

[kilroy69 1,215]

58 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Having a hard time believing this twitter post makes the point he's trying to make.  The first play, half speed or not, the play was clearly designed to go the other way and not only did Pickens keep his guy on the his side, he pulled the LB AND Safety over.  He literally kept 3 defenders away from the ball.

The second play, he was wide open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

The third play is just like the first, it was going the other way and was going to be a quick short pass.  What do you want Pickens do, run full speed the other way knowing that Fields is never going to look his way.  In fact, I think Pickens ran the perfect route.  The play was going to be a short pass to the opposite side of the field.  Pickens was slow as to not bring defenders on his side of the field to the ball side.  He's also drifting towards the ball in case the pass isn't made while staying behind the LB and in front of the DB leaving a window open.

The 4th play, the ball was over his head, he was open, but he should've caught it.

The 5th play, he was open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

 

I stopped watching.  On all 5 plays in the clip that I watched, I see absolutely nothing wrong with Pickens play.  Yeah, he should've caught the ball that was thrown to him, but he was where he was supposed to be and on time.  I mean, if there's an issue with him not catching it, sorry, I'm not buying it.  I'm sure I could go out and find a lot of passes that either Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, or Hill should've caught, but didn't.

This is what I see also. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,482]

30 minutes ago, nobody said:

He's running at about 75% (I hope)

I get backing off when the play is a screen to the other side of the field, but when you're in the pattern, you have to run your route full effort.

That's the early career Ceedee Lamb thing.  I'm telling you I could literally tell when he was getting the ball and when he wasn't just by watching his release at the snap.  Ceedee didn't become Ceedee until he fixed that and ran hard every play.

Or I guess he could just be a terrible route runner.

I get that, but in 3 of the 5 routes I watched I don't see a problem with his effort and he was wide open and Fields didn't throw him the ball on two of them.

[nobody 2,557]

I saw a problem with his effort.  Either that or he has no explosiveness at all.

 

[TBayXXXVII 2,482]

40 minutes ago, nobody said:

You can actually see the difference in that cut-up.  On one of those routes he runs about a 7 yard out that fields puts on him too early and it sails over his head.  It's the one where I assume that's  Tomlin jumps up and down on the sideline.

He exploded off the line at the snap and tried to make a sharp cut to the sideline.  By the time he got his head around the ball was already on him so he missed it, but the point is he exploded off the line, and he tried to make a sharp cut.  The rest, he looks like he's just out there getting cardio.

The rest of them, there was no explosion off the line.  That's how you run good routes.  Especially when defenders are 5 yards off.  You have to close that space as quick as you can and put them to a decision.

Maybe, but I think that if he runs further, he only gets closer to the DB who'd have a better chance at making a play on the ball.  If the issue is that he ran the wrong route, ok, that's fair.  But it didn't look to me like a lack of effort.  It looked like he was slow playing the route to keep the defender playing back further.  I'm assuming this was a timing route, well, Pickens turned around in time, so he expected the ball to be there when it was there.  Also, pause that clip just before the clip isolates on Tomlin.  Tomlin is looking back at Fields.  If he's upset at Pickens, don't you think he'd be looking his way at that point in time?

I'm not sure where no explosion off the line comes in on that first one.  Even with the ball going the other way, he was more wide open than the guy he threw the ball to... at the time he threw the ball.  Look at the play closer.  The line is the 28 yard line and you can see that Pickens is lined up on the 27.  The guy on the bottom of the screen, was up on the line.  As the play runs, when that guy gets to the 35 yard line, Pickens is on the 33 which means that the other WR gained 1 yard of distance on Pickens.  Here's the thing, Pickens made a cut in at the 30 yards line while the other guy didn't.  Look at the guy in the slot at the bottom, he also was lined up a yard back, the 27, like Pickens.  When that guy gets to the 35, Pickens is on the 34, so this guy also gained 1 yard on Pickens.  Again, Pickens made a cut in at the 30 yard line, this guy didn't.  So, if Pickens had no explosion off the line on that play, neither did the other 2.  If the other two exploded off the line, then clearly Pickens did as well.  On top of that, both the guy who had the ball thrown to him and Pickens, were at the Dallas 45 yard line at the same time.  By then, the defense had already yelled "ball" because it was thrown and Pickens knew it was going the other way, so he backed off.

The second play, the line of scrimmage is the 42 yard line and Pickens is on the line.  The guy at the bottom is a yard back on the 41, the guy in the slot at the bottom is also on the line like Pickens, at the 42.  The ball is snapped... 2 yards later, both Pickens and the WR in the slot make contact with a defender.  By the time that Pickens gets his lead foot to the 48, he's over 2 yards of that guy now, whom is making a turn out.  I'm not sure where the lack of burst in the first 5 yards is on this play.  Either Pickens is fine or the other guy is slacking too.  If it's the latter, then maybe this is a team epidemic and not a Pickens issue.

Like I said, I stopped watching after the 5th play because I think there was no merit to the claim for the first 5 clips.  Maybe the rest had better examples.

[plasma george 62]

3 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Having a hard time believing this twitter post makes the point he's trying to make.  The first play, half speed or not, the play was clearly designed to go the other way and not only did Pickens keep his guy on the his side, he pulled the LB AND Safety over.  He literally kept 3 defenders away from the ball.

The second play, he was wide open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

The third play is just like the first, it was going the other way and was going to be a quick short pass.  What do you want Pickens do, run full speed the other way knowing that Fields is never going to look his way.  In fact, I think Pickens ran the perfect route.  The play was going to be a short pass to the opposite side of the field.  Pickens was slow as to not bring defenders on his side of the field to the ball side.  He's also drifting towards the ball in case the pass isn't made while staying behind the LB and in front of the DB leaving a window open.

The 4th play, the ball was over his head, he was open, but he should've caught it.

The 5th play, he was open and Fields didn't throw him the ball.

 

I stopped watching.  On all 5 plays in the clip that I watched, I see absolutely nothing wrong with Pickens play.  Yeah, he should've caught the ball that was thrown to him, but he was where he was supposed to be and on time.  I mean, if there's an issue with him not catching it, sorry, I'm not buying it.  I'm sure I could go out and find a lot of passes that either Jefferson, Chase, Lamb, or Hill should've caught, but didn't.

Agree 100%
He also has long strides so it doesn’t look like he’s running fast but he’s covering ground 

[Ray_T 740]

well, on the zone defense plays, the more important thing is that he gets to the soft spot in the zone and stays there.   if you go too fast you can run through that spot and you are no longer a good target.  so those plays need to be judged differently.

as for the others.  yeah the play was clearly going the other way, but I'd like to at least see him explode off the line to start the play.   when the D sees that they may lose focus on where they should be.

I dont fault him for not running full speed after that, but the explode off the line part is helpful to the play.

maybe its nitpicking but when the other side sees you explode off the line, they will look your way if only for a half second, but thats enough to make them not look where the ball is going.

so I can see an issue there.   Moss used to do this.  on plays where it wasnt to him hed coast.  but the defense keys on that and knows immediately to focus on someone else.