Those who didn't believe in Foles

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

I know there are a bunch of you out there. Do you still stand by your opinion that he isnt that good of a qb? I think he has put to rest all of the doubters out there, but i am curious if there are people who still think he is going to flop.

[BobSanders_33 127]

I don't believe in Foles. He has made poor throws and left tons of yardage on the field. I do believe in Chip Kelly. It is play design that creates these opportunities. I also like that he plays in high scoring games. Files is a perfect example of system player and that being great in fantasy does not mean a great real life player.

[Giants Fan 85]

LOL. You could not be any more wrong Bob.

 

Foles played a spread offense at Arizona under Mike Stoops. He was not supposed to be the starter, but Scott got hurt one week, and never got his job back. Gronk was hurt his entire senior year, and Foles pretty much had nobody. Javon Criner can thank Nick that he ever got drafted. Foles has incredible downfield vision and almost perfect mechanics. He throws the ball like Elway did.

 

Coming out of the draft, I said "Nick Foles is the most pro ready QB in this draft." and of course people freaked, because Luck is in that same class. Again, he was not supposed to be the starter, but when a guy throws 7 TDs in one game, it's hard to put him back on the bench. I even wrote an article for the PFFL where I said, "If you have Vick, you should pick up Foles." and I know some ppl around these parts picked him up in dynasty leagues.

 

But what do I know. i'm the worstest poster on this bored.

[ChocolateTown 4]

Javon Criner? Credibility goes out the window right there, sorry.

[Giants Fan 85]

Sorry, Juron Criner. That's how forgettable he is.

[Fozapd 8]

I've watched the eagles play and Foles does tend to make some bad throws. Overall the system makes him better. In any other system he is a bottom tier (15-20th) qb.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

I don't believe in Foles. He has made poor throws and left tons of yardage on the field. I do believe in Chip Kelly. It is play design that creates these opportunities. I also like that he plays in high scoring games. Files is a perfect example of system player and that being great in fantasy does not mean a great real life player.

Ok so if he continues to play great, will you ever change your opinion? I think "system qbs" are made up. Qb is probably the most difficult position to play in any sport. He still has to make the reads and make the throws. Aaron rogers has struggled mightily this year with a similarly banged up line. The difference is his receivers are arguably better.

[MDC 5,891]

I'm an Eagles diehard so take that for what it's worth. I am also while not quite a Foles doubter, a guy who came into this year wanting him to prove it over the course of a season.

 

Three games in and I can't say I'm convinced he's a championship caliber QB but I feel pretty sure that he's a franchise type QB who could be starting for this team and playing at a high level for years.

 

The thing about Foles is tht nothing physically leaps out at you, he's not a great athlete and his arm is just adequate / good. But he makes smart decisions, he moves really well in the pocket and he's tough as nails.

 

The guy's career passer rating is 100. At some point the body of work just speaks for itself. Looking forward to seeing how it plays out the rest of the year.

[p00h 85]

There are plenty of qbs, even when put in the ideal system, that fail. Spare you the examples, there's no shortage. So props where props are due. He's barely got a season worth of starts under him, he certainly has room to grow, and grow significantly. In a league where the Andy Dalton's and joe flacos get 100 mil contracts, he's a quality started with much upside. Hate all you want but there are 10 career starters playing on different teams that would be replaced by him right this minute. Could easily balloon to 20 by end of year. Chip got his man, enjoy the ride Philly fans...

 

Signed

 

Sad jets fan

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,584]

Tom Brady is the best system QB of all-time

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Tom Brady is the best system QB of all-time

Along with joe montana, dan marino, john elway, steve young, peyton manning.

[p00h 85]

Along with joe montana, dan marino, john elway, steve young, peyton manning.

Hators gonna hate...

[giraldi02 470]

Any person that says "system QB" is basically saying they don't know a thing about football and they want their opinion to sound somewhat professional.

 

It's the stupidest comment to ever be associated with sports.

 

Remember prior to training camp when EVERYONE insisted that Vick, Mariota, etc would be the perfect fit for Chip Kelly's offense?

 

Remember when everyone insisted that the Foles talk of legitimately competing for a starting role was exaggerated because he wasn't mobile and couldn't lead an up tempo dynamic offense?

 

The fock up outta here with system qb talk. There are MAYBE 7 qbs in the league I'd take over Foles if I'm starting a franchise.

 

Peyton, Brady, , Brees, Rodgers, Wilson, Luck, and MAYBE

Roethlisberger

[Giants Fan 85]

Well said. "He's a statue!" Is what ppl kept saying.

 

What really surprised me was that the Arizona Cardinals didn't draft the kid. There's really only two possibilities. Either ownership said, "How can we draft this kid out of Arizona when so many of our fans are also ASU fans?" or the Arizona Cardinals is the most inept franchise in the history of the NFL.

 

Also, he's younger than 6 out of the 7 QBs you mentioned. Just saying. And so far, he's put up better numbers than Luck.

[xenophobe 1]

In a fantasy sense, I never had any doubts. In a football sense, we have to see. It is much more meaningful to see how a player responds to adversity, and he has not had to deal with enough of that yet. The comebacks are the closest he has had to face, which is a good sign for him, but it is too early to tell. He has one playoff home loss. He has very good OLine help of a great running game and lots of weapons.

[xenophobe 1]

Great protection, huge running game, and lots of good targets, fantastic scheme. Do we get all of that with him, or just the player?

[Fozapd 8]

I guess system qb is not exactly what I meant. I mean that his system helps him become more fantasy relevant. He'd be a fine qb elsewhere but not a top 5 fantasy qb. Chip Kelly's tempo gets him so many additional plays in a game which means more stats. It doesn't hurt that the eagles have no defense

[giraldi02 470]

In a fantasy sense, I never had any doubts. In a football sense, we have to see. It is much more meaningful to see how a player responds to adversity, and he has not had to deal with enough of that yet. The comebacks are the closest he has had to face, which is a good sign for him, but it is too early to tell. He has one playoff home loss. He has very good OLine help of a great running game and lots of weapons.

The drive to take the lead against New Orleans?

 

The 70 yard TD drive after being "legally blindsided" by that fat POS foreskin last week?

 

The TD scoring drive after Dallas pulled within one in the winner-take-all NFC East week 17 match last year? Particularly after his poor performance in the first matchup last season(which most people blatantly ignored he was injured in coming into).

 

The kid has done everything he's been asked to do and then some. He's a goofy looking white statue quarterback that doesn't fit the "mold" for what this offense is supposed to be.

 

The critics of him will never silence themselves until he wins a Super Bowl. Whether or not that happens I can't say. Its not him that I don't believe in though to get the job done. But at some point, after all the performances he's had...people will have to eventually come to grips with the fact that Nick Foles is a legitimate GOOD NFL quarterback.

 

 

 

The question I have is though....would the criticism against him be lessened if Vick wasn't there last season and certain profiles of what this offense was supposed to look like didn't exist?

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

In a fantasy sense, I never had any doubts. In a football sense, we have to see. It is much more meaningful to see how a player responds to adversity, and he has not had to deal with enough of that yet. The comebacks are the closest he has had to face, which is a good sign for him, but it is too early to tell. He has one playoff home loss. He has very good OLine help of a great running game and lots of weapons.

He definitely doesnt have a good o line now, and the line last real was not great at pass blocking either.

[MDC 5,891]

I guess system qb is not exactly what I meant. I mean that his system helps him become more fantasy relevant. He'd be a fine qb elsewhere but not a top 5 fantasy qb. Chip Kelly's tempo gets him so many additional plays in a game which means more stats. It doesn't hurt that the eagles have no defense

Again I'm an Eagles fan here and agree with what you're saying to some extent but that's also true of almost every elite QB. It's pretty rare for a quarterback to play at a high level without a terrific scheme and/or elite receiving weapons.

[JediMaster 20]

Any person that says "system QB" is basically saying they don't know a thing about football and they want their opinion to sound somewhat professional.

It's the stupidest comment to ever be associated with sports.

Remember prior to training camp when EVERYONE insisted that Vick, Mariota, etc would be the perfect fit for Chip Kelly's offense?

Remember when everyone insisted that the Foles talk of legitimately competing for a starting role was exaggerated because he wasn't mobile and couldn't lead an up tempo dynamic offense?

The fock up outta here with system qb talk. There are MAYBE 7 qbs in the league I'd take over Foles if I'm starting a franchise.

Peyton, Brady, , Brees, Rodgers, Wilson, Luck, and MAYBE

Roethlisberger

Ok, I'll bite the bait....

 

Remember back in the mid to late 90s to the mid 2000s the Broncos running backs not name Portis or Davis? They had quite a few 1000 yard rushers. They were definitely a "product of the system". Let's name a few of those players.....

 

1999 Olandis Gary

2000 Mike Anderson

2004 Reuben Droughns

2005 Mike Anderson

2006 Tatum Bell

 

But I guess I don't know a thing about football......

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Ok, I'll bite the bait....

 

Remember back in the mid to late 90s to the mid 2000s the Broncos running backs not name Portis or Davis? They had quite a few 1000 yard rushers. They were definitely a "product of the system". Let's name a few of those players.....

 

1999 Olandis Gary

2000 Mike Anderson

2004 Reuben Droughns

2005 Mike Anderson

2006 Tatum Bell

 

But I guess I don't know a thing about football......

This is a thread about foles and the qb position. Not how rbs can be plugged into a system.

[JT 137]

Eagles fan who was not a fan of the Foles draft pick, nor did I think going into last year that he'd fit Kelly's offense.

 

I love most of what the kid has done so far, but when you ask if I believe, I need clarification.

 

Do I believe that he's the next great thing and a Top 5 QB as many here asserted about a game and a half into his career? No. That's the typical knee jerk reaction to most topics on this bored.

 

Do I believe that he shows promise and, with the right team around him, can be a successful NFL QB, maybe even a championship caliber QB? Yes. As someone else noted, at some point his stastical success has to speak for itself.

 

Do I think that this season's edition of the Eagles is that team? No. The O-line is a mess due to injury and the defense is a mess due to suckitude.

 

He's a young QB who has shown some really good things. Sustain that through an entire season when things aren't going so favorably in other aspects of the team and those things will mean even more.

[JT 137]

Remember prior to training camp when EVERYONE

There are some that would argue that this is the stupidest comment ever associated with anything.

[tanatastic 2,061]

I was wrong about Foles fantasy value. He should be a solid starter all year.

[Cuse9 128]

"For those of you who didn't believe in Foles"

 

You may be right? It's only one bad game though, actually, one quarter to make amends!

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,584]

hes getting killed and the defense has kept them off the field

[Cuse9 128]

hes getting killed and the defense has kept them off the field

Same thing with McCoy. He gets the handoff and there is a defender on him before he takes a step!

[Connorsdad 38]

I think Foles is a top 8 Qb with a lot of potential. It's a bonus for Foles to be in Chip Kelly's offense. Of course for him to be a successful fantasy Qb the Eagles must get their o-line straight. Yeah today's game for Foles was forgettable but he's a must start qb1 in all leagues. Also a great Dynasty Qb for years to come!

 

Good Luck !

[Giants Fan 85]

I watched this whole game today.

 

It was a weird game. Foles almost brought them back, once again. But, a bad game. Time of possession was redic. Philly defense scores, was no reason to pass .... Until he had to, and he did well.

 

San Fran made Philly play "their game" ... just one of those games. Magic comeback didn't happen this time.

 

No reason to panic. It's one game.

[Giants Fan 85]

Btw, the running game for Philly was totally stifled. Sproles had the KR, but Sproles and Shady were shut down.

 

Philly offense hardly had the ball when they were up 21 points. Weird game. Outlier.

[NEWPOSTERGUY! 266]

I watched this whole game today.

 

It was a weird game. Foles almost brought them back, once again. But, a bad game. Time of possession was redic. Philly defense scores, was no reason to pass .... Until he had to, and he did well.

 

San Fran made Philly play "their game" ... just one of those games. Magic comeback didn't happen this time.

 

No reason to panic. It's one game.

 

agreed.

 

in these tight matchups, always favor the 'desperate' team ... SF at home, staring a 1-3 start in the face, HAD to pull this one out.

 

they are not a great team this year, but they are very very good

 

Foles will be fine. keep the faith

[Giants Fan 85]

7 tds, next week?

[JT 137]

Btw, the running game for Philly was totally stifled. Sproles had the KR, but Sproles and Shady were shut down.

 

Philly offense hardly had the ball when they were up 21 points. Weird game. Outlier.

 

It's only an outlier if you don't acknowledge that the O-line is the reason for most of what happened yesterday, and until that unit is somewhat healthy we'll see more like yesterday. And last week vs Washington.

 

Their line was I believe the only one in the league last year to start the same 5 for all 16 games. Might that have had something to do with their productivity?

 

They can't run or pass block, and without the threat of the run there is no screen game.

 

I'll go back to what I said on these boreds last year when Philly, in the early stages of Foles-mania played Tampa, with Glennon starting his first or second game: change the uniforms of the QB at halftime and you won't see much difference.

 

The league's history is littered with guys with ability who never made it over the top for lots of reasons, and the beating that Foles is taking is one of those. If they don't fix that, and fast, his success will be short lived.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

The bears also started all 5 all 16 games.

[MDC 5,891]

The beating Foles is taking is mostly about the OL being unable to run block, which puts him in a lot of 3rd and long situations. Even when e has time though he looks hesitant and unwilling to let the ball go, which makes me wonder if the WR corps just isn't getting separation? The wideouts as a whole right now are a sub average group without anybody who really scares you.

[DankNuggs 305]

Riley Cooper has really regressed since signing his contract... Seems less involved across the middle and making those tough traffic catches where he made his mark last year... Jordan Matthews will be a good one once he internalizes the scheme. Maclin is a more well rounded WR than i expected.

 

They need to involve shady in the passing game more as it takes pressure off of foles. I'd have sproles and shady in the backfield and give numerous outlet options that can make big chunks of yards.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Riley Cooper has really regressed since signing his contract... Seems less involved across the middle and making those tough traffic catches where he made his mark last year... Jordan Matthews will be a good one once he internalizes the scheme. Maclin is a more well rounded WR than i expected.

 

They need to involve shady in the passing game more as it takes pressure off of foles. I'd have sproles and shady in the backfield and give numerous outlet options that can make big chunks of yards.

I agree on cooper. I thought he looked pretty good last year, so i am a little surprised at his lack of involvement. The scheme wasnt great yesterday but it was an odd game. I think we need to see how the team responds next week.

 

Foles also did throw a lot of balls away which probably is related to the lack of confidence in his receivers.

[JT 137]

Riley Cooper has really regressed since signing his contract... Seems less involved across the middle and making those tough traffic catches where he made his mark last year... Jordan Matthews will be a good one once he internalizes the scheme. Maclin is a more well rounded WR than i expected.

 

They need to involve shady in the passing game more as it takes pressure off of foles. I'd have sproles and shady in the backfield and give numerous outlet options that can make big chunks of yards.

 

You can't screen when you have no threat of the run. You can't run when your O-line gets whipped each and every snap.

 

Cooper has flat missed opportunities. Foles threw him an ill advised end zone pass yesterday (ill advised because of the coverage, but Foles did a great job of fitting the ball right where it needed to be). Announcers made a big deal out of the throw, without saying much about hoiw it went right through Cooper's hands.

[JT 137]

The beating Foles is taking is mostly about the OL being unable to run block, which puts him in a lot of 3rd and long situations. Even when e has time though he looks hesitant and unwilling to let the ball go, which makes me wonder if the WR corps just isn't getting separation? The wideouts as a whole right now are a sub average group without anybody who really scares you.

 

Floating long passes, which he's done with regularity the last 5 quarters, is often reflective of a QB whose motion is off. I think the ribs, shoulder and O-line play have much more to do with his issues than lack of confidence in the receivers. He lofted a couple punts out there yesterday, including two that should have been big gainers.