Controversial author claims college athletes are being 'exploited'

[DanXIII 8]

I heard this guy on ESPN Radio yesterday. He makes some very good arguments in favor of paying college athletes. Also, before you jump to conclusions, this guy is a professor of finance from Syracuse University, and an avowed capitalist.

 

Agree or disagree?

 

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http://news10now.com/content/all_news/?ArI...61&SecID=83

 

Should college athletes be paid?

 

By: Cait McVey

 

Boyce Watkins said he loves college basketball just as much as the next guy, but he does have one complaint; it's no longer a game, it's a business.

 

"What a lot of people see is a bunch of kids running up and down the courts having fun, representing their schools, but they don't hear the cha-chings going on in the background," said Watkins.

 

Watkins pointed out the NCAA's $6 billion deal for television rights to March Madness. Combine that with corporate sponsors, ticket sales, and team merchandise, and Watkins said universities make millions every season. He said the only people not getting paid are the ones who matter most.

 

"There's something wrong when I'm the coach of this team, and I'm showing up to games on a private plane, but my star player's mother is taking the Greyhound bus. That doesn't make any sense because we know basketball games don't happen without players," said Watkins.

Should college athlete's get paid? Many of them already get a free ride to school, but Watkins argues that's not enough. He said players should get at least a yearly stipend for their work.

 

"Do you know the University probably makes more money in one nationally televised basketball game than it costs them to pay an entire year's tuition for every member of that team?" asked Watkins.

 

The debate could go on and on. Some say student athletes are amateurs, therefore shouldn't get a pay check. Others argue athletes don't have time to work after classes, so they should be reimbursed. There are two sides to this story, but Dr. Boyce Watkins is sticking to his.

 

Right now, NCAA rules prohibit players from receiving any form of payment for their performance.

[davebg 0]

The NCAA is a corrupt institution that exploits students under the guise of providing them opportunities.

 

For every example of a player that gets to the pros there are dozens of players who get an opportunity to work at McD's after they fail to graduate w/a degree.

[Saturday Night Beaver 2]

DAMN THE MAN

[Mephisto 15]

I agree.

 

Further, if the student/athletes themselves wanted to make a point... don't show up for something like March Madness and watch the money machine come to a grinding halt. Of course, those very few that actually have a shot at pro basketball wouldn't dream of making such a statement...

[wiffleball 4,797]

I did a thread on this a while back. As college coaches, programs and the NCAA get more and more millions and millions each year, it's harder and harder to justify the old collegiate system. The pay for everybody BUT the players has grown exponentially, while the compensation to the players has remained relatively the same.

 

The NFL and NCAA are pretty much in cahoots - You basically need to go through the NCAA servitude system before you can get the bucks in the NFL. - Damn few - if any - exceptions come to mind. The NCAA doesn't want an MLB - type 'farm club' system to rob from their coffers and the NFL doesn't want semi-pro to rob from theirs. If this were any other bidness, the gubmint would be sniffing around with Anti-Trust charges years ago.

 

The only possible hope for a 'farm club' type system on the horizon is indoor football. But, I don't really see that happening either. Basically, the indoor football league is made up of cast-offs from the NFL - not up and comers going to the NFL.

 

Even if you factor in the lifetime value of a college education (which sadly, most college programs are so demanding that many don't / can't graduate), it comes nowhere NEAR the kind of pay that a college coaches / programs make in any single year.

[Cdub100 3,996]

Huh if they are being exploited so bad why even play?

[wiffleball 4,797]

Huh if they are being exploited so bad why even play?

 

Same reason the poor spend a disproportionate amount of their disposable income on lotteries, i spose. A lot of these kids don't have any other options; They come from socio-economically disadvantaged families and football is seen as their one way out. When the choice is wal-mart stocker or this, most are going to chase the money. - Even though something like less than 1% of all College FB players ever make it to the pros and fewer still last longer than 3 years.

[IGotWorms 4,063]

I'd be in favor of allowing more scholarships. A lot of these kids are getting a free education, and there is a lot of value to that. If they put forth half of an effort academically, they can use their athletic ability to set themselves up reasonably well in life after their college years.

[Cdub100 3,996]

Same reason the poor spend a disproportionate amount of their disposable income on lotteries, i spose. A lot of these kids don't have any other options; They come from socio-economically disadvantaged families and football is seen as their one way out. When the choice is wal-mart stocker or this, most are going to chase the money. - Even though something like less than 1% of all College FB players ever make it to the pros and fewer still last longer than 3 years.

 

But...but... they are being exploited. Nobody can make them do anything they don't want to do.

 

And if this guy was a true capitalist he would understand these players can go to the CFL or AFL or wait a year to get drafted in the NBA. There are other choices out there. Yeah they might not be better, but guess what thems the breaks. Sometimes you have to work hard and sacrifice to get what you want.

 

The problem is does the star QB get paid the same as the womens swimmer? How decides who gets what?

 

What about schools that don't make a lot of money?

[IGotWorms 4,063]

The NCAA is a corrupt institution that exploits students under the guise of providing them opportunities.

 

For every example of a player that gets to the pros there are dozens of players who get an opportunity to work at McD's after they fail to graduate w/a degree.

 

Whose fault is it when students fail to graduate with a degree?

[Cdub100 3,996]

Whose fault is it when students fail to graduate with a degree?

 

Once they are admitted to the university they are in. If they are being exploited, quit and just go to school.

[davebg 0]

I'd be in favor of allowing more scholarships. A lot of these kids are getting a free education, and there is a lot of value to that. If they put forth half of an effort academically, they can use their athletic ability to set themselves up reasonably well in life after their college years.

While I agree that much of the responsibility to succeed in college is on the student atheletes themselves, the schools and the NCAA need to assume some of the accountability as well. I'd imagine that it takes more than "half of an effort" to do well when you are in the middle of a road trip during exam week.

 

The problem is does the star QB get paid the same as the womens swimmer? How decides who gets what?

Do you think that the men's football team and the women's swim team get the same amount of scholarships or money for facilities, uniforms, travel, etc at major universities w/big time football programs?

 

Who decides on the distribution of those funds?

[Cdub100 3,996]

Do you think that the men's football team and the women's swim team get the same amount of scholarships or money for facilities, uniforms, travel, etc at major universities w/big time football programs?

 

Who decides on the distribution of those funds?

 

Not sure where you're going with this are you saying the football players should be paid while the womens swim team shouldn't?

[wiffleball 4,797]

1) But...but... they are being exploited. Nobody can make them do anything they don't want to do.

 

And if this guy was a true capitalist he would understand these players can go to the CFL or AFL or wait a year to get drafted in the NBA. There are other choices out there. Yeah they might not be better, but guess what thems the breaks. Sometimes you have to work hard and sacrifice to get what you want.

 

2) The problem is does the star QB get paid the same as the womens swimmer? How decides who gets what?

 

What about schools that don't make a lot of money?

 

1) Same argument's been made for virtually every other exploitative scenario.

 

2) Agreed. To be honest though, other than maybe basketball, most of the other programs are net money losers.

 

A lot more questions than answers, but as the money gets more and more ridiculous, it brings the scenario into much sharper focus. Personally, I think the best answer is one closer to baseball: Have a collegiate system wherein college-interested players can still go to college on scholarships as WELL as a 'farm' / semi-pro system wherein others can work toward the pros and obtain at least a living wage.

 

A number of these kids anymore have kids and wives (or baby mommas) on their own. Bad choice, I know. but the NCAA disallows these guys from making anything other than a ridiculously small amount of money. (fear of 'plum' jobs / bribery by boosters). For these guys, free room and board ain't gonna feed the family. (which leads to more corruption in the system) Not to mention, many in the NCAA system right now could give a fock about college - and shouldn't be there in the first place. A semi-pro system would give them the option while freeing up scholarship money for kids who really DO value their education.

 

Again, both the NCAA and the NFL don't want that because they fear losing money. But ultimately it's in their best interest to have this kind of system (less fraud in college, more opportunities for great FB players who are idiots). Fine, they lose 2% of the billions they're making. Still better for both in the end. - And better for the players too.

[Let Da Big Dog Eat 42]

Who says they don't get paid? At UW it costs about $5,000 a semester for tuition and books. Room and board is about another $5,000. So that's about $20,000 per year. I can't begin to put a price on all the free tutoring they get. Where else could a high school grad go and make $20,000 a year without any other training? Add to that that college grads can be expected to make apporx 3 times lifetime earnings that non grads make. If the student athlete does not take advantage of this fact and get their degree they deserve exactly what they don't get.

 

Many of them also get "summer jobs" from alum that they never even show up to.

 

Last, the contacts that they can get with alums to start a career is something us non student athletes couldn't even dream about.

[davebg 0]

Not sure where you're going with this are you saying the football players should be paid while the womens swim team shouldn't?

Personally, I'd say that they should be paid the same amount, as the amount of money needed to live on should be the same regardless of whether or not your play football or are a swimmer.

 

However, IMO that is only applicable if we are saying that the students should get a bigger stipend so they don't have to work an extra job and can concentrate on their studies and their committment to the team.

 

If we are talking about how the NCAAs and the schools make an amount of money that is dispraportionate to what the students are getting in return, then we are talking less about a stipend and more about getting paid. In that case, yes, I believe that the amount should be tied to the revenue that a particular sport is bringing in and that a football player at a major school should get more than a swimmer.

[IGotWorms 4,063]

While I agree that much of the responsibility to succeed in college is on the student atheletes themselves, the schools and the NCAA need to assume some of the accountability as well. I'd imagine that it takes more than "half of an effort" to do well when you are in the middle of a road trip during exam week.

 

D1 schools go pretty far out of their way to accomodate student athletes when it comes to things like tournaments conflicting with finals schedules. I'm not saying that it would be easy to be on the basketball team and maintain a 4.0, but it really does not take a whole lot to maintain the bare minimum necessary to graduate. If a player doesn't do it, its because they don't value it enough. Their fault and their loss.

 

Who says they don't get paid? At UW it costs about $5,000 a semester for tuition and books. Room and board is about another $5,000. So that's about $20,000 per year. I can't begin to put a price on all the free tutoring they get. Where else could a high school grad go and make $20,000 a year without any other training? Add to that that college grads can be expected to make apporx 3 times lifetime earnings that non grads make. If the student athlete does not take advantage of this fact and get their degree they deserve exactly what they don't get.

 

Many of them also get "summer jobs" from alum that they never even show up to.

 

Last, the contacts that they can get with alums to start a career is something us non student athletes couldn't even dream about.

 

Very well said. Just because they don't "get paid" in the sense of a conventional salary does not mean that they aren't benefitting greatly from being a student athlete. They are given a whole lot of advantages that, if utilized properly, should easily set them up to do well in life.

[davebg 0]

D1 schools go pretty far out of their way to accomodate student athletes when it comes to things like tournaments conflicting with finals schedules. I'm not saying that it would be easy to be on the basketball team and maintain a 4.0, but it really does not take a whole lot to maintain the bare minimum necessary to graduate. If a player doesn't do it, its because they don't value it enough. Their fault and their loss.

What you say is true, provided you were smart enough to get into the school on your own in the first place. Unfortunately, that is not always the case when it comes to college athletics. We know that often times schools will recruit students who don't have the grades or test scores anywhere near what the rest of the incoming student body has. So, for these student athletes who got into the school not b/c of their acedemic achievements, but b/c of what they can do on the court/field it may not be as easy to maintain that minimum necessary to graduate. Since it is the schools who are actively recruiting such students, I feel that they bear a great deal of the responsibility for them.

[IGotWorms 4,063]

What you say is true, provided you were smart enough to get into the school on your own in the first place. Unfortunately, that is not always the case when it comes to college athletics. We know that often times schools will recruit students who don't have the grades or test scores anywhere near what the rest of the incoming student body has. So, for these student athletes who got into the school not b/c of their acedemic achievements, but b/c of what they can do on the court/field it may not be as easy to maintain that minimum necessary to graduate. Since it is the schools who are actively recruiting such students, I feel that they bear a great deal of the responsibility for them.

 

Yeah, but student athletes are hardly held to the same academic standards as the rest of the student body. As a student athlete, if you can't get a C in just about any class, you just flat out aren't trying.

[Strike 6,030]

1 out of every 10000 athletes in college is going to make it in pro sports. And with few exceptions noone knows who those individuals are. This is a ridiculous argument. Who do you pay? How much do they get? What about the ones you choose not to pay who end up making it? Do they get retroactive pay? Do all sports get paid, cause I mean I"m sure the NCAA makes a ton off of women's lacrosse.

[DanXIII 8]

I don't think that anyone, not even the author, is arguing that athletes get nothing out of the deal. The issue is one of equity, not absolutes.

 

And yes, Strike, you are right. The overwhelming majority of college athletes do not go on to the pros.

 

The NCAA "cartel" (his words) even prevents these guys from making there own money using their own likenesses! I don't know about you, but this sounds to me like the polar opposite of capitalism.

 

Take Ohio State and Greg Oden. The school is free to use Oden's likeness any way it sees fit, to the profit of the school. Yet, if Oden signs a shoe deal with Nike or Reebok to put his mug on a T-shirt or his name on a shoe, he gets kicked out of the school. As NBA regulations stipulate that he cannot play in the pros until he reaches a certain age, he is basically forced out of a "job." Is this fair?

 

Or, to follow your premise, take OU's Jason White. Heisman Trophy winner, never got drafted, never played in the pros. Think of how many MILLIONS of dollars he probably could have made on his name when he was in college. Think of how many millions OU made off his likeness. How many countless millions did his mug generate for the OU "brand" as it was plastered on the cover of every major sports publication.

 

last I heard he was selling cars in Norman btw.

[Riddlen 1]

they are