Schiano

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

I personally thought there's simply no place for such action in the final plays (knee down) of any football game at any level.

It's just poor sportsmenship. I wonder if he would feel the same way if his team was on the receiving end of it and Freeman goes down with a season ending injury. The game is already violent enough with so many injuries happening every week. To try to do something that will NOT change the outcome of this game (1 second on game clock), i can't see why any coaches would even do this.

 

Isn't this game about winning? Isn't this game about coaching in a way where your player RESPECT you? I would think that Schiano lost some serious respect from his defensive players this weekend.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/tom-coughlin-greg-schiano-harsh-words-giants-beat-220922704--nfl.html

[kicked in the zombos 0]

Really? So the other team should give up when they are 1 score away? They fought all game and are hoping for a miracle. They do happen from time to time. Try to force a fumble and pick it up and run. I have absolutely no issue with what they did. If anything the offensive line of the Giants should've recognized they were coming. You can tell by the stances if they are. If they aren't supposed to play the down then the NFL should change the rule. Nothing for them to concede at that point with a chance to win, even if its a tiny chance.

[cyclone24 1,836]

I think thats the unwritten rule.....we'll stop running plays against you, and pounding your guys.....but you relax on a kneel down. Sure the game was 6 points....but cmon...its over.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

Really? So the other team should give up when they are 1 score away? They fought all game and are hoping for a miracle. They do happen from time to time. Try to force a fumble and pick it up and run. I have absolutely no issue with what they did. If anything the offensive line of the Giants should've recognized they were coming. You can tell by the stances if they are. If they aren't supposed to play the down then the NFL should change the rule. Nothing for them to concede at that point with a chance to win, even if its a tiny chance.

 

A QB knee down has happened for decades. The game's been play this way forever. HAVE YOU EVER WITNESS A QB KNEE DOWN FUMBLE THAT GETS RECOVER FOR A TD?

 

No. This is NOTHING about playing hard. When the game is over, it's over. True idiots pull chit like that. True idiots support chit like this. Even the defensive players apologized for doing this.

 

 

RESPECT THE GAME!!!

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

Have any coaches in the history of the game EVER even attempted to pull chit like this?

If coaches can WIN superbowls without needing to pull chit like this, then why does Schiano do? Playing til the clock ends is a load of crap. The dude was pissed off at the end and it was obvious he wanted to sent a message.

[kutulu 1,561]

Doosh move...glad Coughlin called him on it.

[dreen626 17]

No problem with it and the NFL league office said they have not problem with it either.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

This is a college coach making it to the NFL and not knowing the unwritten rules. He knows now and I will bet that he does not do it again.

[shutdown 40]

Listened to Mike Golic on ESPN this morning. He said that the offense will come out in that situation and tell the defense they are going to take a knee. He said it's up to the defense to accept that and communicate that acceptance of not really playing to the offense, or ignore it and line up to play hard. He said from his point, it was obvious the way Tampa lined up that they were going to attempt to disrupt the snap and that the Giants O-line should have seen that and been prepared to go low.

 

He said the only issue would be if Tampa acknowledged the agreement to back off on the clock kill play, but then came after the snap. Said he had no problem with this tactic in a one score game.

 

They also interviewed Tim Hasslebeck who said basically that it was a cheap shot, but he's a QB so I would expect that a little bit.

 

In a one score game, I don't see why a defense would concede a clean snap for a clock kill.

[dreen626 17]

Mike Ditka and the ex-NYG LB on ESPN and had no problem with it.

 

Dan Marino said it was bush league but this is the same QB who faked a spike and threw a TD vs the Jets

[cyclone24 1,836]

And Schiano's 'We play til the end of the game' schtick rings a little hollow...considering your guys spent the whole game giving up 500 passing yards to basically two guys. Maybe try playing in the middle of the game.....

 

Heck....be happy Eli didnt decide to go 4 wides on you....lord knows you werent stopping it.

[dreen626 17]

And Schiano's 'We play til the end of the game' schtick rings a little hollow...considering your guys spent the whole game giving up 500 passing yards to basically two guys. Maybe try playing in the middle of the game.....

 

Heck....be happy Eli didnt decide to go 4 wides on you....lord knows you werent stopping it.

 

Well the Bucs did score a lot of points also.

[steelers2101 7]

Listened to Mike Golic on ESPN this morning. He said that the offense will come out in that situation and tell the defense they are going to take a knee. He said it's up to the defense to accept that and communicate that acceptance of not really playing to the offense, or ignore it and line up to play hard. He said from his point, it was obvious the way Tampa lined up that they were going to attempt to disrupt the snap and that the Giants O-line should have seen that and been prepared to go low.

 

He said the only issue would be if Tampa acknowledged the agreement to back off on the clock kill play, but then came after the snap. Said he had no problem with this tactic in a one score game.

 

They also interviewed Tim Hasslebeck who said basically that it was a cheap shot, but he's a QB so I would expect that a little bit.

 

In a one score game, I don't see why a defense would concede a clean snap for a clock kill.

 

I agree with Golic. Jaworski, a former QB, saw nothing wrong with it. TB was clearly playing that last snap, and the Giants' linemen knew it. It's not as if they weren't prepared for it. It would have been a cheap shot if they were pretending to concede and then went for it. It clearly looks like that wasn't the case.

[The Next Generation 10]

So, because the Giants said, "Hey Bucs, you should quit now" the Bucs should have just said, "Yeah, OK, you win."

 

I could see if it was a 2 or 3 score game, but a fumble return for a TD means something right there. Almost worked, too. YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!

[kicked in the zombos 0]

A QB knee down has happened for decades. The game's been play this way forever. HAVE YOU EVER WITNESS A QB KNEE DOWN FUMBLE THAT GETS RECOVER FOR A TD?

 

No. This is NOTHING about playing hard. When the game is over, it's over. True idiots pull chit like that. True idiots support chit like this. Even the defensive players apologized for doing this.

 

 

RESPECT THE GAME!!!

 

This is an absolutely ridiculous and asinine response.

 

1. Is the game still going? YES

2. Is it winnable? YES, just because you don't believe chances are great means nothing.

3. Have other teams done this in the past? YES

[da_budman 0]

A QB knee down has happened for decades. The game's been play this way forever. HAVE YOU EVER WITNESS A QB KNEE DOWN FUMBLE THAT GETS RECOVER FOR A TD?

 

No. This is NOTHING about playing hard. When the game is over, it's over. True idiots pull chit like that. True idiots support chit like this. Even the defensive players apologized for doing this.

 

 

RESPECT THE GAME!!!

Have you ever witnessed a rb fumbling and costing his team the game on a meaningless run? Id bet you have because the defense plays for the fumble. Youve never seen one with a kneel down because....well defenses for some strange reason just give up and say...ok YOU WIN!! I, for one, find it kind of refreshing that the guy didnt just give up. Its a long shot to be sure but given the chance that the qb doesnt take a knee quickly and there is a possibility of him being careless with the ball assuming the defense just gives up then YES there is a chance and nothing wrong with the defense trying to win the game with that slim chance. If they were more than 1 score down I would agree with you. To me respecting the game is trying to win it and not giving up until such time as the game is over.

[Serpent 51]

Every team that plays the Buccs should keep playing then. But the same people defending the Buccs for "playing the game" would whine and complain about "running up the score" because that's how sheep always think.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

So, because the Giants said, "Hey Bucs, you should quit now" the Bucs should have just said, "Yeah, OK, you win."

 

I could see if it was a 2 or 3 score game, but a fumble return for a TD means something right there. Almost worked, too. YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!

 

Have you ever seen a QB kneel down that was botched and return for a TD?

[The Next Generation 10]

Every team that plays the Buccs should keep playing then. But the same people defending the Buccs for "playing the game" would whine and complain about "running up the score" because that's how sheep always think.

 

If it's a 1 score game, damn right they should keep playing. Only a loser would think any differently. HTH

[steelers2101 7]

Have you ever seen a QB kneel down that was botched and return for a TD?

 

I saw Philip Rivers botch a snap last year, costing SD the game winning FG against KC on Monday night. If they get the fumble, the return TD wasn't necessary as it would have given them one offensive play.

[steelers2101 7]

Every team that plays the Buccs should keep playing then. But the same people defending the Buccs for "playing the game" would whine and complain about "running up the score" because that's how sheep always think.

 

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

 

It seems the sheep in this case are the ones that fault Schiano for having his team play that last play.

 

Playing that last play is consistent with running up the score, while conceding the last play is consistent with stepping off the gas and not running up the score as they both are based on "the game is already over" mentality. The unwritten rules the sheep would defend are not running up the score and conceding the kneel down. So, again, the sheep, in this case, are those who think Schiano did something wrong by having his team try to force a fumble on that snap.

[Serpent 51]

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

 

It seems the sheep in this case are the ones that fault Schiano for having his team play that last play.

 

Playing that last play is consistent with running up the score, while conceding the last play is consistent with stepping off the gas and not running up the score as they both are based on "the game is already over" mentality. The unwritten rules the sheep would defend are not running up the score and conceding the kneel down. So, again, the sheep, in this case, are those who think Schiano did something wrong by having his team try to force a fumble on that snap.

 

Sheep don't even understand why they're sheep, they just follow the mob. There's no point in explaining why because the sheep never get it and come up with a million qualifiers afterwards. Stupid people are hella clever.

[steelers2101 7]

Sheep don't even understand why they're sheep, they just follow the mob. There's no point in explaining why because the sheep never get it and come up with a million qualifiers afterwards. Stupid people are hella clever.

 

This is true, but the mob of sheep here is going after Schiano and supporting Couglin, which is consistent with you not even understanding why you're a sheep, but not consistent with the expectation that you would be clever.

[t-birdie 8]

I remember watching an Eagles/Giants game from the mid 80's. Can't remember who won but there was only time for one last play. The QB didn't kneel but handed it to the RB (inexplicably) who fumbled the exchange. The other team picked it up and ran it in for a TD and won.

[jgcrawfish 232]

I'm not sure your post makes sense.

 

It seems the sheep in this case are the ones that fault Schiano for having his team play that last play.

 

Playing that last play is consistent with running up the score, while conceding the last play is consistent with stepping off the gas and not running up the score as they both are based on "the game is already over" mentality. The unwritten rules the sheep would defend are not running up the score and conceding the kneel down. So, again, the sheep, in this case, are those who think Schiano did something wrong by having his team try to force a fumble on that snap.

 

That's BS. It's BS in the NFL, it's BS in college, it's BS in high school...complete, utter and total BS. That game was over, you lost, deal with it and be thankful the other team isn't running up the score. I hope the rest of the NFL brethren of head coaches decides to declare open season Schiano's QB and run the freakin score up every week. I don't care if it's within the rules or not.

 

Years ago I used to play basketball against a guy who would do what I called the Pillsbury defense...he'd wait until you were taking a shot then poke you in the belly with his index finger. Guy never got called for a foul because it was so ticky-tacky. But it was, in my mind, utterly against the spirit of the game. I was playing in a tournament and facing his team and warned him not to employ that defense on my teammates or me. Of course the first time I was taking a shot with him guarding me I knew it was coming. He was late on the rotation and only got to me when I was at the peak of my jump and reached to do his old dirty trick. I purposely flailed back with my upper body like I got hit and made sure to kick him in the head when I did. He got a busted lip and sat for about 10 minutes while the bleeding stopped and I got two fouls shots. Unfortunately the NFL players can't kick Schiano in the head, but I might just instruct my players to run right at him out of bounds if they get the chance while avoiding excessive on-field contact. Bush league begets Bush league.

 

Hopefully every coach is now implementing the "drop to your knees regardless if there's an arm/hand under there" victory formation.

[Serpent 51]

I remember watching an Eagles/Giants game from the mid 80's. Can't remember who won but there was only time for one last play. The QB didn't kneel but handed it to the RB (inexplicably) who fumbled the exchange. The other team picked it up and ran it in for a TD and won.

 

haha that was Herm Edwards, and that's how he got a coaching job.

[unloopme 4]

Mike Ditka and the ex-NYG LB on ESPN and had no problem with it.

 

Dan Marino said it was bush league but this is the same QB who faked a spike and threw a TD vs the Jets

Are you trying to compare the two plays, or just taking a shot at Marino?

[t-birdie 8]

Oh, I guess it was earlier than that - 1978

 

Miracle at the Meadowlands

 

I didn't know it had a name.

[t-birdie 8]

haha that was Herm Edwards, and that's how he got a coaching job.

 

 

Heh, you're right - never knew that was Herm.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

I saw Philip Rivers botch a snap last year, costing SD the game winning FG against KC on Monday night. If they get the fumble, the return TD wasn't necessary as it would have given them one offensive play.

 

No, the botch snap was for a running play. It was not a QB knee down.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

Oh, I guess it was earlier than that - 1978

 

Miracle at the Meadowlands

 

I didn't know it had a name.

 

That was a running play.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

That's BS. It's BS in the NFL, it's BS in college, it's BS in high school...complete, utter and total BS. That game was over, you lost, deal with it and be thankful the other team isn't running up the score. I hope the rest of the NFL brethren of head coaches decides to declare open season Schiano's QB and run the freakin score up every week. I don't care if it's within the rules or not.

 

Years ago I used to play basketball against a guy who would do what I called the Pillsbury defense...he'd wait until you were taking a shot then poke you in the belly with his index finger. Guy never got called for a foul because it was so ticky-tacky. But it was, in my mind, utterly against the spirit of the game. I was playing in a tournament and facing his team and warned him not to employ that defense on my teammates or me. Of course the first time I was taking a shot with him guarding me I knew it was coming. He was late on the rotation and only got to me when I was at the peak of my jump and reached to do his old dirty trick. I purposely flailed back with my upper body like I got hit and made sure to kick him in the head when I did. He got a busted lip and sat for about 10 minutes while the bleeding stopped and I got two fouls shots. Unfortunately the NFL players can't kick Schiano in the head, but I might just instruct my players to run right at him out of bounds if they get the chance while avoiding excessive on-field contact. Bush league begets Bush league.

 

Hopefully every coach is now implementing the "drop to your knees regardless if there's an arm/hand under there" victory formation.

 

Yes.

There's a difference between playing hard and giving all you got, but you have to do it fairly.

 

The game was essentially over. If you watch the end of the game, Schiano was pissed off and ORDERED the bull rush. They caught him on film all fired up. That to me shows you he's a coach that will go above and beyond proper "sportsmenship" to win.

[t-birdie 8]

That was a running play.

 

 

Reading up on the situation, there are similarities. The play before was a kneel-down. On that play the defense charged through knocking the center into the QB. Kneel-downs at the time were considered unsportsmanlike to some degree. The Giants coach didn't want to risk an injury to the QB so he called a FB dive. The players in the huddle couldn't believe it and said to just take a knee. The QB was a second year starter and not a Super Alpha QB, so he was afraid to change the call. Csonka didn't take the handoff.

 

I guess the moral of the story is that you should be prepared to play all 60 minutes of the game.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

I would love to see the opposing team do the same and blow up his starting QB, center, guard's knee. Especially if there's 1 second on the clock and they are down by 4 TD.

[t-birdie 8]

I would love to see the opposing team do the same and blow up his starting QB, center, guard's knee. Especially if there's 1 second on the clock and they are down by 4 TD.

 

 

If it were a 4 TD differential, I'd call it poor sportsmanship.

[Stewburtx8 67]

I honestly hate when coaches/teams give up. Play until the final whistle. If you have timeouts left and it's a one score game, use them even if the other team could run the clock out on the next play. If they were down 2+ scores, I would understand Coughlin's argument. But it was still a one score game. However unlikely it is, there is still a CHANCE the Giants could botch the QB/Center exchange. If that were to happen and the Bucs had quit, they likely would not even be in a position to recover it. Play hard until the game is over. And imagine if the Bucs did get to Eli or force a fumble/bad snap. Wouldn't we be singing the praises of Schiano? I can't really fault the "don't give up" attitude. If they were intentional trying to hurt Eli or Snee, that would be a different story. I didn't see it that way. Just my opinion.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

I honestly hate when coaches/teams give up. Play until the final whistle. If you have timeouts left and it's a one score game, use them even if the other team could run the clock out on the next play. If they were down 2+ scores, I would understand Coughlin's argument. But it was still a one score game. However unlikely it is, there is still a CHANCE the Giants could botch the QB/Center exchange. If that were to happen and the Bucs had quit, they likely would not even be in a position to recover it. Play hard until the game is over. And imagine if the Bucs did get to Eli or force a fumble/bad snap. Wouldn't we be singing the praises of Schiano? I can't really fault the "don't give up" attitude. If they were intentional trying to hurt Eli or Snee, that would be a different story. I didn't see it that way. Just my opinion.

 

When i was in high school, i was playing varsity basketball. There was this game where we were up by 20+ points. With only 1 minute left to play, one of the opposing team player drove to the basket to make a layup. Looked very routine, until the center of my team pushed him while he was in the air. He was trying to 'prevent' the score. The player felt backwards and landed awkwardly and broke his leg. It was an ugly sight. Why would he need to foul him? He was confronted by angry parents, coaches, etc. His response, he just didn't want him to score and would like to keep the 20+ point victory.

We live in a country where it's no longer about winning/losing. It's about 'proving' points. It's about winning at all cost (cheating, hurting your opponent, etc.). You talk about giving up. I say BULLCHIT. The clock doesn't have to be at 0 in order for you to know a game is over.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

I honestly hate when coaches/teams give up. Play until the final whistle. If you have timeouts left and it's a one score game, use them even if the other team could run the clock out on the next play. If they were down 2+ scores, I would understand Coughlin's argument. But it was still a one score game. However unlikely it is, there is still a CHANCE the Giants could botch the QB/Center exchange. If that were to happen and the Bucs had quit, they likely would not even be in a position to recover it. Play hard until the game is over. And imagine if the Bucs did get to Eli or force a fumble/bad snap. Wouldn't we be singing the praises of Schiano? I can't really fault the "don't give up" attitude. If they were intentional trying to hurt Eli or Snee, that would be a different story. I didn't see it that way. Just my opinion.

 

Okay, they force the fumble but there was only 1 second on the clock. They would have to force the fumble and run it back for a TD.

In the HISTORY of the game and at ALL levels. Have a botch QB knee down ever get RETURN for a TD?

 

How bout this. Work on your effing defense and play calling. Eli shredded them for 510+ passing yards.

[cyclone24 1,836]

Ok ask yourself this.....if TAMPA was running out the clock, the Giants barreled through like that, the center falls back on Freemans knee popping it, putting him out for the season.....do you honestly think Schiano's response would be "Ah well...they are just playing to the end"?

 

Fock no.

 

It was a bush move by a college coach......