Pennsylvania judge blocks Voter ID law

[Frank M 181]

So center citer Philly is what 1 block in circumference? From your beloved Arch street location one can get the "hard to get" id's at any of these other locations.

 

Columbus Blvd.

1 Miles

 

Island Avenue

6 Miles

 

West Oak Lane

7 Miles

 

Lawndale

8 Miles

 

Are you suggesting it's that diffcult to go to these other locations?

 

Are you without a vehicle? A job? Money? Are you handicapped? Elderly? Incapacitated in some way?

 

What's not difficult for you may be impossible for someone else.

[Mungwater 601]

I think photo IDs are free at PennDOT, although it's been costing the state many millions to keep up with increased demand at ID centers. The money for the ID isn't the big issue. Asking the working poor to essentially take a half day off to wait hours in line at the DMV is the real problem.

 

If you're working you have to have an ID don't you for tax reasons? It seems every job I've had, I had to show ID and a SS card

[MDC 7,889]

So center citer Philly is what 1 block in circumference? From your beloved Arch street location one can get the "hard to get" id's at any of these other locations.

 

Columbus Blvd.

1 Miles

 

Island Avenue

6 Miles

 

West Oak Lane

7 Miles

 

Lawndale

8 Miles

 

Are you suggesting it's that diffcult to go to these other locations?

 

Center City is Philadelphia's downtown and it is bordered by rivers on the west and east, and roughly Spring Garden to the north and South Street to the South. That's something like 400+ square blocks.

 

Arch Street is the only one located in this radius. Yes, I'm guessing it's hard to get to a PennDOT location that's several miles outside the downtown if you don't own a car.

 

hth

[Frank M 181]

If you're working you have to have an ID don't you for tax reasons? It seems every job I've had, I had to show ID and a SS card

 

Technically, only a SS number is required for tax purposes. Companies may require an ID for their own purposes.

[MDC 7,889]

If you're working you have to have an ID don't you for tax reasons? It seems every job I've had, I had to show ID and a SS card

 

Me too but I've been at the same job for 8 years. What if you get a job and your ID expires? Or if you're unemployed?

 

These are obviously situations that are going to affect the working poor or unemployed more than your average Joe. It's a bigger issues here in Philly and other large cities than out in the suburbs too.

[JTB 52]

I think photo IDs are free at PennDOT, although it's been costing the state many millions to keep up with increased demand at ID centers. The money for the ID isn't the big issue. Asking the working poor to essentially take a half day off to wait hours in line at the DMV is the real problem.

 

 

So that's the real problem?

[JTB 52]

Photo

License

Center

 

8:30am-4:15pm 8:30am-4:15pm 8:30am-4:15pm 8:30am-7:00pm 8:30am-4:15pm 8:30am-4:15pm

 

Now what is the real problem?

[DankNuggs 305]

Notice how nobody says there is rampant voter fraud necessitating voter ID laws, just people saying "It seems to me to not be a big deal, why shouldn't they show ID?"

 

Great reasoning for preventing Americans from exercising a basic democratic right.

By this reasoning, having to actually register to vote is an inconvenient prevention from people execising basic democratic rights... Having to navigate to the polling center as well... Having to wake up on time (on that day) to vote is an inconvience... Having to have socially acceptible clothes as opposed to freely being able to walk nude to the polling center is also a deterrant... It can go on and on and on...

[MDC 7,889]

Now what is the real problem?

 

The fact that the lines are 2+ hours long and there's only one PennDOT location in center city.

 

How many times are you going to keep asking the same question?

[Frank M 181]

Now what is the real problem?

 

Are you without a vehicle? A job? Money? Are you handicapped? Elderly? Incapacitated in some way?

 

What's not difficult for you may be impossible for someone else.

[Thornton Melon 648]

And were you voting fraudulently?

 

No, but some a-hole could've come in before me and said he was me.

[Frank M 181]

By this reasoning, having to actually register to vote is an inconvenient prevention from people execising basic democratic rights... Having to navigate to the polling center as well... Having to wake up on time (on that day) to vote is an inconvience... Having to have socially acceptible clothes as opposed to freely being able to walk nude to the polling center is also a deterrant... It can go on and on and on...

 

There is no reasoning behind most people's thoughts about this type of law. They just think it seems reasonable because they find it easy to carry an ID, which has nothing to do with how difficult others may find it, not to mention that an unnecessary and discriminatory law is still unnecessary and discriminatory whether one finds it reasonable as it applies to them or not.

[JTB 52]

Are you without a vehicle? A job? Money? Are you handicapped? Elderly? Incapacitated in some way?

 

What's not difficult for you may be impossible for someone else.

 

 

Vehicle - Taxi

Job - Welfare

Hadicapped - Friend or Stepp

Elderly - Family

Incapacitated - Any of the above

 

[Mike Honcho 5,435]

Now what is the real problem?

 

 

Are you without a vehicle? A job? Money? Are you handicapped? Elderly? Incapacitated in some way?

 

What's not difficult for you may be impossible for someone else.

 

From reading his posts, he might be retarded...

[Frank M 181]

No, but some a-hole could've come in before me and said he was me.

 

Did that ever happen? Should we change the law because someone could have come in and said he was you? Even though it's never happened to you and doesn't happen on any level?

 

Is that a good enough reason to deny any American the right to vote?

[Recliner Pilot 61]

As if that has anything to do with anything about the topic.

It proves that the entire argument that photo ID laws discriminate against the poor is complete and utter bullsh1t. And anyone making that case is a moron.

[Mike Honcho 5,435]

No, but some a-hole could've come in before me and said he was me.

 

Well if he was an a-hole that would have been a good first step in impersonating you.

[JTB 52]

Serious question -

 

Let's assume the Voter ID law was not enacted until the next President election. Do you really think these same issues (too poor, too disabled, too lazy, too old, to long of a wait, too few locations, too expensive too, too, too) will not be rehashed over again in 4 years?

 

I say they will and thus proving the rights point. All the BS the lefties are spewing are strawman/smokescrean arguments against a law that should have been in place for decades.

[Thornton Melon 648]

Did that ever happen? Should we change the law because someone could have come in and said he was you? Even though it's never happened to you and doesn't happen on any level?

 

Is that a good enough reason to deny any American the right to vote?

 

1. No, it's never happened to me

2. It's never happened on any level??? How the fock would you know???

3. Yes, we should change the law because it could happen.

4. Yes, it's a good enough reason to require people to prove who they are before they vote. And again, voting is not a right guaranteed in the Constitution.

 

I can't fathom why people don't understand this.

[Frank M 181]

It proves that the entire argument that photo ID laws discriminate against the poor is complete and utter bullsh1t. And anyone making that case is a moron.

 

The poor are the least likely to have a photo ID. Creating a law that disproportionately targets a certain group is absolutely discriminatory. Why do we need a law that discriminates against a certain group to combat voter fraud that doesn't exist?

[JTB 52]

From reading his posts, he might be retarded...

 

I agree, MDC must be retarded. I'll post his real reason the law is bad again for all to read.

 

MDC, on 02 October 2012 - 02:09 PM, said:

 

I think photo IDs are free at PennDOT, although it's been costing the state many millions to keep up with increased demand at ID centers. The money for the ID isn't the big issue. Asking the working poor to essentially take a half day off to wait hours in line at the DMV is the real problem.

[DAVID RUFFIN 2]

This is why everyone should suport this. To keep BOTH sides honest.

 

 

If nine counties From a DEM-Backed Firm committed voter fraud the right wingers would be outraged.

[JTB 52]

If nine counties From a DEM-Backed Firm committed voter fraud the right wingers would be outraged.

 

 

Ok - Move along now.

[Frank M 181]

1. No, it's never happened to me

2. It's never happened on any level??? How the fock would you know???

3. Yes, we should change the law because it could happen.

4. Yes, it's a good enough reason to require people to prove who they are before they vote. And again, voting is not a right guaranteed in the Constitution.

 

I can't fathom why people don't understand this.

 

Incidence of fraud

 

A similar study released last month came to similar conclusions. News21, a student-journalism initiative funded by the Carnegie Corporation of New York and the John S. and James L. Knight Foundation, canvassed election officers throughout the U.S. for examples of all sorts of election fraud, and found that impersonation fraud was alleged 10 times, less than 1% of all fraud cases they turned up.

 

So, you're in favor of a law that prevents something that basically never happens on the off chance that it could happen, even if it means some Americans are denied their rights.

 

People already have to produce something to prove who they are. In my state, it can be any of these:

• A current and valid photo identification card issued by the State of Ohio or the United States government; or
• A military identification ("military ID"); or
• An original or copy of a current utility bill; or
• An original or copy of a current bank statement; or
• An original or copy of a current government check; or
• An original or copy of a current paycheck; or
• An original or copy of a current other government document, other than a voter registration acknowledgement notification mailed by the board of elections, that shows the voter's name and current address.

[MDC 7,889]

I agree, MDC must be retarded. I'll post his real reason the law is bad again for all to read.

 

I guess JTB has given up trying to claim that there are tons of PennDOT locations in downtown Philly and moved on to outright name calling.

 

I tried.

[Frank M 181]

I guess JTB has given up trying to claim that there are tons of PennDOT locations in downtown Philly and moved on to outright name calling.

 

I tried.

 

The "I have an ID, why doesn't everyone?" argument failed him as well.

[Frank M 181]

The poor are the least likely to have a photo ID. Creating a law that disproportionately targets a certain group is absolutely discriminatory. Why do we need a law that discriminates against a certain group to combat voter fraud that doesn't exist?

 

If you need help, RP, I'll tell you why: because the people most affected by these laws tend to vote Democrat.

 

HTH

[JTB 52]

I guess JTB has given up trying to claim that there are tons of PennDOT locations in downtown Philly and moved on to outright name calling.

 

I tried.

 

Link to where I said tons? You said 2 - I showed you more. You then say the real issue is the working poor missing a 1/2 day of work. I show you the locations are open until 7:30 on thursdays and from 8:30-4:30 on Saturday.

 

Next strawman argument MDC is?

[MDC 7,889]

Link to where I said tons? You said 2 - I showed you more. You then say the real issue is the working poor missing a 1/2 day of work. I show you the locations are open until 7:30 on thursdays and from 8:30-4:30 on Saturday.

 

Next strawman argument MDC is?

 

You posted a bunch of locations, one of which is 6 miles outside the city (Island Ave. is across the street from the airport) and one in a place called Lawndale I've honestly never heard of. One of your two isn't in center city, it's in South Philly along Delaware Ave. I have no idea how you'd get there via mass transit.

 

You realize that the working poor aren't necessarily 9-5ers and some work Saturdays? Or they're caring for kids they can't leave for the hours long ordeal of getting a photo ID?

 

I really deserve some credit for being so patient in this thread.

[Mungwater 601]

You posted a bunch of locations, one of which is 6 miles outside the city (Island Ave. is across the street from the airport) and one in a place called Lawndale I've honestly never heard of. One of your two isn't in center city, it's in South Philly along Delaware Ave. I have no idea how you'd get there via mass transit.

 

You realize that the working poor aren't necessarily 9-5ers and some work Saturdays? Or they're caring for kids they can't leave for the hours long ordeal of getting a photo ID?

 

I really deserve some credit for being so patient in this thread.

 

They don't allow kids in the DMV?

[Frank M 181]

You posted a bunch of locations, one of which is 6 miles outside the city (Island Ave. is across the street from the airport) and one in a place called Lawndale I've honestly never heard of. One of your two isn't in center city, it's in South Philly along Delaware Ave. I have no idea how you'd get there via mass transit.

 

You realize that the working poor aren't necessarily 9-5ers and some work Saturdays? Or they're caring for kids they can't leave for the hours long ordeal of getting a photo ID?

 

I really deserve some credit for being so patient in this thread.

 

Don't they all have friends and family? Can't they take a taxi?

[MDC 7,889]

They don't allow kids in the DMV?

 

So now you're leaving work @ 5, going home to your kids in North Philly or whatever, loading them onto a bus and getting back to the DMV between the hours of 5-7:30?

 

Good luck with that.

[Mungwater 601]

So now you're leaving work @ 5, going home to your kids in North Philly or whatever, loading them onto a bus and getting back to the DMV between the hours of 5-7:30?

 

Good luck with that.

 

If its important enough, yeah I would

[JTB 52]

Ok Liberal fuckos

 

If the voter id law isn't passed until the day after the election are you suggesting there would't be an issue?

[MDC 7,889]

If its important enough, yeah I would

 

You would. Most of the working poor I'm telling you about probably will. Like I said, I pass the Arch St. PennDOT every weekday and there are lines around the block. It was never like that before, so I'm guessing most are getting IDs to vote.

 

The thing is, a certain % of these people won't get their photo IDs renewed because it's a hassle. And the entire goal of this law is to throw up hoops so that % of people won't vote.

 

I'm fine with voter ID laws. I'm not fine with establishing voter ID laws during an election year, specifically to make it a pain in the ass for a certain type of voter (in this case urban and low income) to vote.

 

That sucks.

[Frank M 181]

Ok Liberal fuckos

 

If the voter id law isn't passed until the day after the election are you suggesting there would't be an issue?

 

I'm suggesting it shouldn't be passed at all, Conservative d1ckface.

[JTB 52]

I'm suggesting it shouldn't be passed at all, Conservative d1ckface.

 

I'm suggesting it should be.

[Frank M 181]

I'm suggesting it should be.

 

I'm happy for you that you are in favor of denying Americans their rights. You must be proud.

[BudBro 183]

If you're working you have to have an ID don't you for tax reasons? It seems every job I've had, I had to show ID and a SS card

you also have to fill and I-9, which shows you are a citizen to work here in the states. we haven't seen the president's I-9 either. there should be one from every job he received a salary. wait, has he ever worked anywhere?

[JTB 52]

I'm happy for you that you are in favor of denying Americans their rights. You must be proud.

 

 

And you are in favor of allowing fraudulent voting. You must be proud.