Mass Shooting at Perry Iowa H.S., Multiple injuries. Suspect identified. No further danger to public.

[seafoam1 3,025]

16 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I get your point. But if we as a society can save lives, I have to regard that as a win. 

I agree with you on this one. 

Once I was with a couple in my family driving to Midway airport in Chicago to drop off a couple of them. Midway has a short runway and just a few days earlier a plane that landed there  couldn't stop in time and went through a fence and into the road hitting a car with, I think it was like 5 people in it right where there was a stoplight. And there were many other cars at the light as well.

1 person died in the crash. When we got to that spot in the intersection I mentioned the accident and we saw the gaping hole in the fence and I said "Thank God only one person died after something like that." My brother freaked out on me and said, "Thank God someone died? Are you kidding me? Oh yeah, thank the great God that a kid was killed." 

Everyone in the car knew what I meant but he was going through an anti-God phase in his life.

All that said, my take is you can't trust nurses and counselors to make all the kids want to behave especially if they have different ideals in life. It starts and finishes at home. Protection like police and security measures are invaluable. They need to keep finding ways to improve those.  

[Strike 5,543]

16 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

The idea is that you give a kid like yesterday maybe one person the kid to talk to about his issues. Maybe someone catches something in a social media post a little quicker. You’re looking at it through the lens of altering the kid when I don’t think that’s, the focus. It’s maybe giving that kid that just has issues that doesn’t know how to cope with them…handle them better. 

So here's my question to you.  Do you want to give the kid the resources, such as a mental health counselor he can seek out, or do you want to force all kids to see one?  I suspect there are already counselors available if the kid wants/needs one.  So exactly what are you proposing?

Regarding your comment that Peafoam is looking at it through the lens of altering the kid, that's a valid position for him to take.  Because when government is involved, if you give them an inch they TAKE a mile.  So when you say what you propose is NOT that, it's valid for others to be skeptical that it won't BECOME that. 

[cyclone24 1,913]

6 minutes ago, Strike said:

So here's my question to you.  Do you want to give the kid the resources, such as a mental health counselor he can seek out, or do you want to force all kids to see one?  I suspect there are already counselors available if the kid wants/needs one.  So exactly what are you proposing?

Regarding your comment that Peafoam is looking at it through the lens of altering the kid, that's a valid position for him to take.  Because when government is involved, if you give them an inch they TAKE a mile.  So when you say what you propose is NOT that, it's valid for others to be skeptical that it won't BECOME that. 

They are there if the kid wants to. I would make it mandatory yes. Just like attending any other class.
 

I understand but I don’t think that would be the parameters or focus of something like that. More of dealing with those identity issues, problems at home. Not trying to convince a kid to become one way or the other. 
 

I think most of us would agree that kids coping skills with literally anything adverse is comical. I just don’t think kids know how to deal with issues. So that’s what I mean about the lens or the focus not being changing someone but more of a focus on. Hey I’m here to talk you’ve got somebody you can talk to and wants to help you deal with these issues. Is mandatory a big step? Of course, but man the numbers just don’t lie on how many of these incidents we are having. 

[Strike 5,543]

1 minute ago, cyclone24 said:

They are there if the kid wants to. I would make it mandatory yes. Just like attending any other class.
 

Let me get this straight.  Most kids take 6-7 classes a day.  You'd have one of their classes be a mental health clinic? 

[cyclone24 1,913]

2 minutes ago, Strike said:

Let me get this straight.  Most kids take 6-7 classes a day.  You'd have one of their classes be a mental health clinic? 

They now get 45 seconds for lunch. Ha Hey look, there’s going to be a ton of hurdles trying to propose something no question. Fitting it in, staffing, paying for it. But I’d much rather see where something like that goes then doing what we are doing or Trying to arm the home ec teacher or something crazy. 

[Strike 5,543]

2 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

They now get 45 seconds for lunch. Ha Hey look, there’s going to be a ton of hurdles trying to propose something no question. Fitting it in, staffing, paying for it. But I’d much rather see where something like that goes then doing what we are doing or Trying to arm the home ec teacher or something crazy. 

What's wrong with that?  I've documented this tactic in these threads before.  There has not been a single incident in a school with armed teachers since that practice started.  Do you have some data refuting that? 

What you're proposing would be a huge waste of resources.  99.9% of kids don't have issues but you're going to waste their time in mental health counseling instead of what school was intended for.  And even in the .1% of cases where a kid is unstable, there's a good chance you're not going to prevent an incident anyways.

[seafoam1 3,025]

6 minutes ago, TheNewGirl said:

Children need to feel safe to be vulnerable and talk about thoughts and feelings. 

Done correctly, therapists are literally trained on how to do this. It can take a long time for anyone to feel comfortable talking to a therapist, even adults. Crap, it took me a long time to try and find a new one after a previous one retired. 

These kids have to feel like they are safe, someone is listening, someone cares about them. There really is a psychology to this, and if you can address those thoughts and issues BEFORE little Johnny goes and grabs his dad's gun, or stabs his 1st grade teacher, then maybe there is hope. 

Thing is that if the therapist/counselor SEES an issue that needs to be further addressed, then it needs to be addressed. That's where the parents having an issue with it would likely put a stop to it. MANY parents don't want to hear that their kid has mental issues, because it shows that there was something that parent did "wrong." 

Yeah. I don't disagree fully with you nor Cyclone. I just look at the quality of teachers in public schools getting really poor results from their students in many cases, and wonder how they could get seriously high quality, non subjective, mental health professionals lining the schools.

If they want to squash bullying for example, if that seems to be one of the bigger problems for kids, I would be all in to get a couple hard nosed private detectives to monitor the school grounds and even watching kids walking home within the area of the school. They could certainly cut to the chase on what's going on with bullying. Just call them safety guards or whatever. Or patrol boys I think we had in grade school.

I don't know. It's complex.  I would rather just take a more straight forward, aggressive stand without getting into some people interpreting the minds of kids. 

 

[cyclone24 1,913]

1 minute ago, Strike said:

What's wrong with that?  I've documented this tactic in these threads before.  There has not been a single incident in a school with armed teachers since that practice started.  Do you have some data refuting that? 

Well, most of these are small communities that usually don’t have these kinds of problems anyway. You’re certainly not trying this in inner-city Chicago. I’m not going to give the lunacy of making our planet the wild west where everybody just carries a gun on a holster much merit. Not exactly the world I’d like to live in. 

[Strike 5,543]

2 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

Well, most of these are small communities that usually don’t have these kinds of problems anyway. You’re certainly not trying this in inner-city Chicago. I’m not going to give the lunacy of making our planet the wild west where everybody just carries a gun on a holster much merit. Not exactly the world I’d like to live in. 

You've clearly never researched the requirements for teachers to carry or you wouldn't be making the statements that you are.

[cyclone24 1,913]

4 minutes ago, Strike said:

You've clearly never researched the requirements for teachers to carry or you wouldn't be making the statements that you are.

Well, there’s plenty of research or evidence that shows even schools that have armed guards haven’t prevented the shootings or even slowed them down. But you think Susie, the math teacher is going to do it.?

The problem with your premise is 3 fold.

first, the kid bringing guns to school is going to heavily outgun any teacher with a side arm. Secondly, is the element of surprise. If I have a gun and you have a gun, if you want to shoot me it doesn’t really matter what I do or if I have it, you were going to catch me off guard. Thirdly, Susie, the math teacher has a self-preservation that a teenage kid looking to mow down his classmates is not going to have. She wants to get home. The idea that she’s suddenly going to turn into freaking Rambo is pretty much zero. 
 

not slap fighting you here, but I just don’t know how one could see the evidence or numbers of guns we have in this country, the number of mass shootings we have and say, do you know what would actually fix this? Is if we just threw more guns at the issue. That should do it. Just makes no sense.

[Strike 5,543]

6 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

Well, there’s plenty of research or evidence that shows even schools that have armed guards haven’t prevented the shootings or even slowed them down. But you think Susie, the math teacher is going to do it.?

The problem with your premise is 3 fold.

first, the kid bringing guns to school is going to heavily outgun any teacher with a side arm. Secondly, is the element of surprise. If I have a gun and you have a gun, if you want to shoot me it doesn’t really matter what I do or if I have it, you were going to catch me off guard. Thirdly, Susie, the math teacher has a self-preservation that a teenage kid looking to mow down his classmates is not going to have. She wants to get home. The idea that she’s suddenly going to turn into freaking Rambo is pretty much zero. 
 

not slap fighting you here, but I just don’t know how one could see the evidence or numbers of guns we have in this country, the number of mass shootings we have and say, do you know what would actually fix this? Is if we just threw more guns at the issue. That should do it. Just makes no sense.

You are slap fighting.  You clearly haven't even done the requisite research to understand the issues and reasoning behind having teachers armed.   Using your logic we should disarm all cops because just "throwing more guns" at the issue makes no sense.

[cyclone24 1,913]

3 minutes ago, Strike said:

You are slap fighting.  You clearly haven't even done the requisite research to understand the issues and reasoning behind having teachers armed.   Using your logic we should disarm all cops because just "throwing more guns" at the issue makes no sense.

Jesus. OK, link me to the study you did. Not that you looked up that YOU researched with sources, etc. You haven’t. You’re just spewing the viewpoint you want to sell and so you found something that somehow supported it. Let’s stop acting like you were Doing some sort of study that’s been peer reviewed and published or some nonsense. 
So let’s stop with this holier than thou you haven’t done your research gibberish. 
 

Police are highly trained. Police understand that their job can potentially lead to their death. Susie, the math teacher does not operate under that in any fashion. Id argue that teachers are the least risk averse people on the planet. They want to deal with children. 

If you want the world to look like Wyatt Earp all over the place? Have at it. . Propose it. It’s amazing you can’t correlate the number of guns in the number of mass shootings. But do your thing. Not an avenue I personally feel does any good whatsoever 

[Patented Phil 1,469]

1 hour ago, TheNewGirl said:

I think this could be something great for schools. 

I remember when I was in elementary school, we'd have a dentist come into class and teach proper brushing and tooth/oral hygiene. And you went home with a free toothbrush. 

Nowadays they have trannies come in and teach kids how to masturbate.  And they go home with a free dilldo.

[seafoam1 3,025]

28 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

Well, there’s plenty of research or evidence that shows even schools that have armed guards haven’t prevented the shootings or even slowed them down. But you think Susie, the math teacher is going to do it.?

 

I'll just say, if my kid is in Susie's class, and a shooter is in the school, and Susie is expertly trained and locked and loaded, I would trust her more than anyone else inside or outside the school. 

[weepaws 3,193]

31 minutes ago, Patented Phil said:

Nowadays they have trannies come in and teach kids how to masturbate.  And they go home with a free dilldo.

They do not, never heard of that taking place, and if so shame on the parents, they should be removing their kids from harm.  But they continue to allow them to participate in these kind of actions, since they’re the ones taking them to schools, and social events that are allowing trannys to read to kids.  

I think all parents should be a shame of themselves, an jailed for doing this crime.  

Also any one that practices porn watching is no better then any one of those names on th Epstein list.  

HTH.  God bless, I hope. 

[squistion 2,201]

43 minutes ago, Patented Phil said:

Nowadays they have trannies come in and teach kids how to masturbate.  And they go home with a free dilldo.

No they don't. 

[Strike 5,543]

58 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

Jesus. OK, link me to the study you did. Not that you looked up that YOU researched with sources, etc. You haven’t. You’re just spewing the viewpoint you want to sell and so you found something that somehow supported it. Let’s stop acting like you were Doing some sort of study that’s been peer reviewed and published or some nonsense. 
So let’s stop with this holier than thou you haven’t done your research gibberish. 
 

Police are highly trained. Police understand that their job can potentially lead to their death. Susie, the math teacher does not operate under that in any fashion. Id argue that teachers are the least risk averse people on the planet. They want to deal with children. 

If you want the world to look like Wyatt Earp all over the place? Have at it. . Propose it. It’s amazing you can’t correlate the number of guns in the number of mass shootings. But do your thing. Not an avenue I personally feel does any good whatsoever 

Dude, I went down this road a year or two ago.  Go through the old gun control threads and you'll find numerous links.  I'm done doing other people's homework TWICE.

[seafoam1 3,025]

7 minutes ago, squistion said:

No they don't. 

You are wrong. 

[squistion 2,201]

1 minute ago, seafoam1 said:

You are wrong. 

Link to anything that proves this claim?

This is like the "Kids are allowed to act like cats in schools" nonsense that no could find a link for here that it actually happened.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,433]

So the trannys do this stuff due to bullying? 

[Ron_Artest 1,532]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

So the trannys do this stuff due to bullying? 

What tranny?

[Hardcore troubadour 15,433]

1 minute ago, Ron_Artest said:

What tranny?

The ones that do this stuff. Is it due to bullying? 

[squistion 2,201]

Just now, Hardcore troubadour said:

The ones that do this stuff. Is it due to bullying? 

What stuff?

[Hardcore troubadour 15,433]

1 minute ago, squistion said:

What stuff?

Shoot up a school and other acts of violence. 

[Ron_Artest 1,532]

3 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Shoot up a school and other acts of violence. 

There was only one tranny that shot up a school.

[squistion 2,201]

2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Shoot up a school and other acts of violence. 

No, no proof of that. But there have so few trans related mass shootings (less than 1% in the last 5 years I would guess) there is not enough data to determine if this is a causal factor. 

[OldMaid 2,130]

Leave Susie out of this!!!

[Hardcore troubadour 15,433]

10 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

There was only one tranny that shot up a school.

Ok. Lgbtq gender fluid etc then. Do they do acts of violence due to being bullied? 

[Ron_Artest 1,532]

Just now, Hardcore troubadour said:

Ok. Lgbtq gender fluid etc then. Do they do acts of violence due to being bullied? 

Wrong again but keep trying.

Like watching a cat try and bury a turd on a frozen pond 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,433]

Just now, Ron_Artest said:

Wrong again but keep trying.

Like watching a cat try and bury a turd on a frozen pond 

Oh. So they don’t do any violence. Cool. 

[cyclone24 1,913]

38 minutes ago, Strike said:

Dude, I went down this road a year or two ago.  Go through the old gun control threads and you'll find numerous links.  I'm done linking other people's homework that fits what i already wanted to think TWICE.

FIFY. 
 

cool propose holsters for everyone on the planet. More bullets whizzing around surely should help curb gun death. Holy shiit.

I don’t mind debating topics, but my God, the level of disconnect from reality is terrifying.

[jonnyutah 288]

1 hour ago, Patented Phil said:

Nowadays they have trannies come in and teach kids how to masturbate.  And they go home with a free dilldo.

100% true story. Link added below.

[weepaws 3,193]

59 minutes ago, cyclone24 said:

FIFY. 
 

cool propose holsters for everyone on the planet. More bullets whizzing around surely should help curb gun death. Holy shiit.

I don’t mind debating topics, but my God, the level of disconnect from reality is terrifying.

Yea removing guns from people who use them for righteousness is wrong, but of course a gun ban would mean all those who plan to use guns in the wrong way would of course turn them in.  

[cyclone24 1,913]

2 minutes ago, weepaws said:

Yea removing guns from people who use them for righteousness is wrong, but of course a gun ban would mean all those who plan to use guns in the wrong way would of course turn them in.  

You’re coming in on page 125 without any context. Wasn’t really what we were talking about. 

[BuckSwope 654]

4 hours ago, cyclone24 said:

JFC nevermind.

again, I’m reminded of why i stopped coming over to the side of the forum. 
 

Counselor to these people = blue haired tranny loving freak that is going to convert all our kids to LBGTQ mass shooters.  

[EternalShinyAndChrome 4,106]

2 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

Counselor to these people = blue haired tranny loving freak that is going to convert all our kids to LBGTQ mass shooters.  

I mean, your side of the aisle has already groomed and entire generation of kids to the point they are confused at what they even are.  You're mocking something that has LITERALLY already happened. 

I guess they don't call you Buck Dope because you're smart. 

[BuckSwope 654]

4 hours ago, Strike said:

What's wrong with that?  I've documented this tactic in these threads before.  There has not been a single incident in a school with armed teachers since that practice started.  Do you have some data refuting that? 

What you're proposing would be a huge waste of resources.  99.9% of kids don't have issues but you're going to waste their time in mental health counseling instead of what school was intended for.  And even in the .1% of cases where a kid is unstable, there's a good chance you're not going to prevent an incident anyways.

This is a rare event.   There are something like 100K public schools and what, 10 of these types of active shooter incidents a year, tops?   Yeah, chances are very good there wasn't an incident at those schools, but also good chances it's not because of armed teachers either.  

To me it wouldn't make sense that these shooters - who plan, bring multiple weapons, want to be killed, and have started wearing body armor are going to stop their plan because a couple teachers could be armed.  I'm open to proof that's not the case though.  

[weepaws 3,193]

1 hour ago, weepaws said:

Yea removing guns from people who use them for righteousness is wrong, but of course a gun ban would mean all those who plan to use guns in the wrong way would of course turn them in.  

 

1 hour ago, cyclone24 said:

You’re coming in on page 125 without any context. Wasn’t really what we were talking about. 

No I did not,  posted my view.  Stop going out drinking late at night with your wife.  

[weepaws 3,193]

40 minutes ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

I mean, your side of the aisle has already groomed and entire generation of kids to the point they are confused at what they even are.  You're mocking something that has LITERALLY already happened. 

I guess they don't call you Buck Dope because you're smart. 

Reason why putting prayer, and the Bible back into schools would make a big difference, why continue with what’s going on in schools now, of course unless you agree with what’s going on in schools now. Maybe you do. 

[cyclone24 1,913]

5 minutes ago, weepaws said:

 

No I did not,  posted my view.  Stop going out drinking late at night with your wife.  

Like I said. I’m reminded why I stopped coming over to the side of the forum. Just morons running their mouth.  Think I’ll revisit that and let goobers like you play tough guy on literally every thread.

so brave