can anyone rationalize this poker hand

[paradoxical 1]

***** Hand History for Game 5116714575 *****

$50 NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 06, 19:08:18 ET 2006

Table Table 97467 (Real Money)

Seat 2 is the button

Total number of players : 10

Seat 3: AMike128 ( $62.65 )

Seat 4: Beckmaster ( $86.62 )

Seat 6: LUCKYME1959 ( $22.80 )

Seat 10: jdb121 ( $81.35 )

Seat 1: mulmur ( $7.22 )

Seat 9: popes4poker ( $46.13 )

Seat 2: InternetJunk ( $51.80 )

Seat 7: jh175 ( $48 )

Seat 8: pusoyking7 ( $36.20 )

Seat 5: GotItTwizted ( $50 )

AMike128 posts small blind [$0.25].

Beckmaster posts big blind [$0.50].

** Dealing down cards **

Dealt to AMike128 [ Qs Qh ]

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$0.50].

jh175 folds.

pusoyking7 calls [$0.50].

popes4poker folds.

jdb121 folds.

mulmur folds.

InternetJunk folds.

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

AMike128 raises [$1.75].

Beckmaster folds.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$1.50].

pusoyking7 calls [$1.50].

** Dealing Flop ** [ 4d, 2h, 5c ]

AMike128 bets [$2.95].

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$2.95].

pusoyking7 folds.

** Dealing Turn ** [ Ah ]

AMike128 bets [$5].

LUCKYME1959 calls [$5].

** Dealing River ** [ Ts ]

AMike128 bets [$9].

LUCKYME1959 calls [$9].

AMike128 shows [ Qs, Qh ] a pair of queens.

LUCKYME1959 shows [ As, 4h ] two pairs, aces and fours.

LUCKYME1959 wins $38.40 from the main pot with two pairs, aces and fours.

 

calls in first position with A-4 and calls raise of 4x the big blind afterwards. This b!tch and some guy go on to defend her play. Did I miss something?

[Big Blue 06 195]

I can't think of a really good defense for their play. Maybe if you tell me how they were defending it, I could rip holes in that. Sounds like someone just stuck around with middle pair and an inside str8 draw, and got lucky with 2 pair on the turn.

[JasperisOK 0]

Let me see if I can rationalize this mathematically for you...

 

Newb + A few $$$ to play with + Any Ace + Degree All-In Moment = donkasaurus play

[Big Blue 06 195]

Let me see if I can rationalize this mathematically for you...

 

Newb + A few $$$ to play with + Any Ace + Degree All-In Moment = donkasaurus play

 

Basically what I said.

[paradoxical 1]

I can't think of a really good defense for their play. Maybe if you tell me how they were defending it, I could rip holes in that. Sounds like someone just stuck around with middle pair and an inside str8 draw, and got lucky with 2 pair on the turn.

his only defense was 'she called $1.5 at a $3 pot. Great, thats 50/50 odds. To do that with A-4 is to put me on 3s, 2s or KQ. Given that i was playing tightly, I dont think you can do this. There is a very significant chance you are dominated or against a higher pocket pair than 4. So I felt this was an obvious play, but not as bad as A4 in first position.

 

[image 0]

I can't explain their play... but i think i would have ratcheted the bet machine back after that ace... you continued to bet hard at it when all the newb needed was an ace or a three to beat ya.

 

-image

[jerryskids 5,264]

If you are going to get upset about people online playing an ace for those stakes and with that flop, save yourself the trouble and kill yourself now.

[JasperisOK 0]

Basically what I said.

 

Ah, but my math skills shine here!

[dolfan06 1]

Doesn't seem like a terribly outrageous play to me. All he did was call a raise with an ace and one bet with a pair. He could have put you on two high cards, trying to push him around in position with a big stack.

[JasperisOK 0]

his only defense was 'she called $1.5 at a $3 pot. Great, thats 50/50 odds. To do that with A-4 is to put me on 3s, 2s or KQ. Given that i was playing tightly, I dont think you can do this. There is a very significant chance you are dominated or against a higher pocket pair than 4. So I felt this was an obvious play, but not as bad as A4 in first position.

 

 

You'll find that many people don't pay as much attention, as you might think, to the play characteristics of others at the table.

[paradoxical 1]

I can't explain their play... but i think i would have ratcheted the bet machine back after that ace... you continued to bet hard at it when all the newb needed was an ace or a three to beat ya.

 

-image

put him on a mid pocket pair, but in retrospect, i should have checked on the river

[Greedo 13]

Could have put you on a high pocket pair easily, but here's the thing: donkeys play ace anything. If YOU were paying attention at the table, and knew he was a donkey, when the ace came you could check it down from there and save yourself $15.

 

I know it sucks, but make sure you do just what you're saying donkeys should be doing, which is, thinking about what the other player might have.

[jets24 6]

I can't think of a really good defense for their play. Maybe if you tell me how they were defending it, I could rip holes in that. Sounds like someone just stuck around with middle pair and an inside str8 draw, and got lucky with 2 pair on the turn.

 

 

You got it exactly right.

[Mephisto 15]

I can think of a good defense... look at his user ID. I would have left the table as soon as he arrived.

 

Lucky him...

[MLCKAA 415]

***** Hand History for Game 5116714575 *****

$50 NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 06, 19:08:18 ET 2006

Table Table 97467 (Real Money)

Seat 2 is the button

Total number of players : 10

Seat 3: AMike128 ( $62.65 )

Seat 4: Beckmaster ( $86.62 )

Seat 6: LUCKYME1959 ( $22.80 )

Seat 10: jdb121 ( $81.35 )

Seat 1: mulmur ( $7.22 )

Seat 9: popes4poker ( $46.13 )

Seat 2: InternetJunk ( $51.80 )

Seat 7: jh175 ( $48 )

Seat 8: pusoyking7 ( $36.20 )

Seat 5: GotItTwizted ( $50 )

AMike128 posts small blind [$0.25].

Beckmaster posts big blind [$0.50].

** Dealing down cards **

Dealt to AMike128 [ Qs Qh ]

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$0.50].

jh175 folds.

pusoyking7 calls [$0.50].

popes4poker folds.

jdb121 folds.

mulmur folds.

InternetJunk folds.

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

AMike128 raises [$1.75].

Beckmaster folds.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$1.50].

pusoyking7 calls [$1.50].

** Dealing Flop ** [ 4d, 2h, 5c ]

AMike128 bets [$2.95].

>You have options at Sign Me Up Table!.

LUCKYME1959 calls [$2.95].

pusoyking7 folds.

** Dealing Turn ** [ Ah ]

AMike128 bets [$5].

LUCKYME1959 calls [$5].

** Dealing River ** [ Ts ]

AMike128 bets [$9].

LUCKYME1959 calls [$9].

AMike128 shows [ Qs, Qh ] a pair of queens.

LUCKYME1959 shows [ As, 4h ] two pairs, aces and fours.

LUCKYME1959 wins $38.40 from the main pot with two pairs, aces and fours.

 

calls in first position with A-4 and calls raise of 4x the big blind afterwards. This b!tch and some guy go on to defend her play. Did I miss something?

 

 

Look, I TOTALLY get why this honks you off, but her only defense of this play should be that she doesn't have to defend her play. She won the hand fair and square. Just because it was an irrational play doesn't mean it wasn't fair. This is part of what you risk when you play poker. You absolutely MUST account for the fact that some people wll make senseless plays, just the same as some people are going to bluff early to scare you off your hand or slow play to get you pot commited when their hand is strong and so forth. You have no complaint.

[De Novo 0]

You misplayed your hand. You bet $5 on the turn. As soon as you were called, you should have slowed down on the river. You bet $9 for what? Only a better hand calls you there. You misplayed it.

 

If I know you're a tight player as you stated, I play this hand against you because I know you're going to pay me off if I catch my 9-outer on the turn. The flop call was the same as drawing to a flush, but more concealed, and more likely to get paid off. And you paid this person off.

 

put him on a mid pocket pair, but in retrospect, i should have checked on the river

Looks like you made a bad read. 80% of the money went in when this person had the best hand.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Ya got beat in an online poker hand. Get over it.

 

You've been watching too much poker on TV. You are not playing against the pros.

[Birdseed 1]

Look, I TOTALLY get why this honks you off, but her only defense of this play should be that she doesn't have to defend her play. She won the hand fair and square.

 

 

 

B!tch & moan....B!tch & moan....

 

"I'm mad cause you didn't play like the book that everybody reads says you play!"

 

 

:oldrolleyes:

[mjj 0]

I may think you missed the flop too and my midpair, top kicker is good as gold. I'd probably reraise to see what you do, but a smooth call with what you think is the best hand isn't that bad. Good thing they didn't reraise and get more from you too.

[nobody 2,070]

his only defense was 'she called $1.5 at a $3 pot. Great, thats 50/50 odds. To do that with A-4 is to put me on 3s, 2s or KQ. Given that i was playing tightly, I dont think you can do this. There is a very significant chance you are dominated or against a higher pocket pair than 4. So I felt this was an obvious play, but not as bad as A4 in first position.

 

 

I think she's getting better than 2:1 odds at that point

 

Big Blind + her call + another call + your blind = 2.00

 

you raise another 1.50

 

betting 1.50 to win 3.50

 

Then on top of that, the guy behind her called the 1.50 as well, so the implied odds there were

 

5:1.5

 

So she was actually getting better than 3:1 on that pre-flop bet.

 

Post flop

 

pot is at 6.50

 

you bet 3 bucks

 

she's betting 3 to win 9.50, so that's better than 3:1

 

That's actually a pretty good call with 9 outs since 9 outs is about 3:1 anyway.

[Artist Formerly Known as Big O 0]

itsatiplowstakespokerhasalotofstupidcallsgetoverit

 

 

HTH

[Mephisto 15]

I agree on much simpler terms (that Luckyme had justification for staying in the hand).

 

Pre-flop, Lucky calls just for having an A. Post-flop, Lucky has a pair of 4s and probably figures… “eh, unlikely the only over, a 5, is going to be enough, I’ll hang one more bet.” On the turn, there is an A and after calling the 5-spot, you should be operating on the assumption that Lucky has an A and stop paddling on the river. You toss in $9 on the river and you’re dead in the water.

[cbfalcon 824]

It's a reasonable play by your oponent IMO.

 

On the flop, you have one of 2 hands.

 

A. An overpair, which means you'll probably pay off if my 8 outer hits. Definitely getting implied odds here.

 

B. You are making a follow up bet with a hand like AK or AQ, thus you are drawing at a 3 outer.

 

The $9 river bet was horrible. In summary, you got outplayed.

[paradoxical 1]

It's a reasonable play by your oponent IMO.

 

On the flop, you have one of 2 hands.

 

A. An overpair, which means you'll probably pay off if my 8 outer hits. Definitely getting implied odds here.

 

B. You are making a follow up bet with a hand like AK or AQ, thus you are drawing at a 3 outer.

 

The $9 river bet was horrible. In summary, you got outplayed.

for the last time, my beef is not on the flop. Its preflop. My arguement is she shouldn't have even gotten to the flop.

[cday 0]

for the last time, my beef is not on the flop. Its preflop. My arguement is she shouldn't have even gotten to the flop.

 

you didn't raise enough.

[hellothere 1]

as stated, you are a tight player, that's a fine strategy but you have to be aware that everyone will not play in a traditional manner, especially online.

 

first off, in my experience, you didn't raise near enough, while 3x the BB is said to be a good raise, nobody folds for that, even if you drop pure ratio's, why would someone fold for another dollar or two, a lot of people are on there for fun and will call most reasonable bets with practically anything. i would suggest bumping it to at least 5 in that structure, or more. yes, you will get tons of folds, but the occasional call, and when called, you aren't likely to be drawn out on my randomness usually its another at least reasonable hand. then if you clear the flop and don't feel any resistance, just take down the 10 out there, don't get cute.

 

also from their persepctive.

 

i started out a very tight, math oriented etc. player, but my cash game has gotten to the point where i will call with anything practically. if there is what they (the general public) considers a big raise, then if i have position, i am in there. if it is suited and can and able to make a straight, im in. i miss a lot, yes, but the implied odds are so huge, because (no offense intended) tight "by the book" players can't put you on random hands and will commit their whole stacks with an overpair. which in reality is just one pair, and not that great. or they will flop a set and slop play so much you can make a straight or something. i will continue to all those 5x BB raises, because i have that player's hands narrowed down to all but a select few. then he flops a set, checks, bets something small, and i river a straight with a 9 5 suited. we each have for instance $200, then i will risk, knowing im behind, but people who play like that can't reason out unconventional play and you can take their whole stack if you hit.

[sanders 0]

Look, the odds weren't there but it was still only a whopping $1.50 to call.

 

Even if I put you on a poket pair I might call because I know that even if an Ace flops most people still try to bet hard and could win a big hand.

 

That being said if you play exactly how you are "supposed" to you become awefully predictable so even great players will make a move that is against the odds form time to time in order to keep themselves from being read by their betting patterns.

 

If you think that hand is terrible you got another thing coming. I've seen (and most people have seen) hands ten times that bad.

[Greedo 13]

Well said. I've actually gotten to the point in cash games that I hate good hands. All I do is lose money with them. Give me 5-6 suited all day long -the worse hand the better. Those are the only hands I win money with.

[Belichick Is God 0]

Thats poker, you cant rationlize anything

[Riddlen 1]

man, this one guy had this hand, and my hand was so good and I bet and no way he shoulda stayed in cause I am SOOO good at poker and I know that he totally shoulda folded and crap and he didnt and he got lucky cause after all I am SOOOOO good and the only time I lose is if the other guy got lucky.

 

 

I am so fockingtired of poker stories.

[Korben Dallas 0]

calls in first position with A-4 and calls raise of 4x the big blind afterwards. This b!tch and some guy go on to defend her play. Did I miss something?

 

What kind of world do we live in where a man can't play dumbass cards if he wants to...

[NJJoe20 0]

Pre-flop, after two callers, you simply bet 1.75 into a 1.75 pot. That bet needs to be much larger, at least 3X the pot.

[Captain Allen 0]

Only donkey cack suckers play online poker.