League Controversy

[mathja 0]

Does anyone know how to find out the precise kickoff time for last night's game?

 

There is a rule in my league that states if a team owner calls in a lineup change to the commissioner before kickoff, the commissioner can honor that request and make the change for the team owner if he can confirm that kickoff for that game has not taken place. I don't want to debate whether or not the rule is good or bad --- it is the rule.

 

Last night, the team owner called the commissioner at 8:29. The commissioner was in his car. He received the call. Bluetooth kicked in and shut the radio down. So, the commissioner couldnt confirm for certain if the request was made on time. We need to know the official kickoff time to settle this debate. It might seem nit-picky, but it has definitely stirred a hornets nest --- the player in question is Andre Brown.

 

Any suggestions on finding out the official kickoff time would be appreciated.

[kicked in the zombos 0]

Why split hairs? The whole point is to change the lineup before anything happens. If the call was 8:29 I can tell you that nothing had happened except perhaps the ball was set on the tee. Let the lineup change go through. This is a friggin game.

[Bruce Benedict 0]

I don't have the time, but I remember it was right before the first play from scrimmage.

[mathja 0]

I don't have the time, but I remember it was right before the first play from scrimmage.

 

Great contribution. I'll be sure to help when you need some assistance.

[uflouie 0]

8:20pm that is what is posted on the official box score.

[montana 89]

Look, the game was scheduled for 830pm. If the call was placed to the Commish at 829 & he has the time stamp from the call on his phone, the change stands.

My watch/phone could say 831, while yours says 830, while the Commish says 829.

If the time stamp reads 829 to the Commish, that's the league time.

I don't see the problem, unless there is proof from the NFL that the game started much sooner than expected.

[Stewburtx8 67]

I'm not sure where you can find the OFFICIAL kickoff time. The game was scheduled to start at 8:20, but I'm pretty confident the game started after 8:29 based on my own memory. Then looking at the "Giants/Panthers game" thread on this board, someone posted at 8:31 about how awful the Cee Lo intro was. Then at 8:40, 2-3 people posted about "Manning to Bennett TD." Since the Giants opening drive only took 8 plays (with only 1 incompletion) and 3:27 of game time, I'm going to say that the game started after 8:30. Your league may not accept that, but I think it's certainly close enough that no one should be that upset about it.

[montana 89]

I'm not sure where you can find the OFFICIAL kickoff time. The game was scheduled to start at 8:20, but I'm pretty confident the game started after 8:29 based on my own memory. Then looking at the "Giants/Panthers game" thread on this board, someone posted at 8:31 about how awful the Cee Lo intro was. Then at 8:40, 2-3 people posted about "Manning to Bennett TD." Since the Giants opening drive only took 8 plays (with only 1 incompletion) and 3:27 of game time, I'm going to say that the game started after 8:30. Your league may not accept that, but I think it's certainly close enough that no one should be that upset about it.

Good points.

[southcarolina 166]

Look, the game was scheduled for 830pm. If the call was placed to the Commish at 829 & he has the time stamp from the call on his phone, the change stands.

My watch/phone could say 831, while yours says 830, while the Commish says 829.

If the time stamp reads 829 to the Commish, that's the league time.

I don't see the problem, unless there is proof from the NFL that the game started much sooner than expected.

 

Kickoff was 8:20

 

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=320920029

[TheUsualSuspect 207]

1. If you are not the Commish, it's not your problem.

2. What kind of a league still has team managers calling in line-ups?

3. The guy that called at 8:29 is a ######.

 

And I'm sorry, I know that I am not helping here but this incident sounds preposterous to me. I am assuming the league is on-line and if 8:29 guy does not have access to a computer or a smart-phone, I think he is out of luck.

[Bruce Benedict 0]

Great contribution. I'll be sure to help when you need some assistance.

Thank you on both fronts.

[Buffalo Rob 0]

 

2. What kind of a league still has team managers calling in line-ups?

 

 

 

Um yeah, It's 2012 man. Time to get your league online.

[wild_and_crazy_guy 5]

A couple of thoughts on this...the scheduled kickoff of the game was actually 8:20pm, but maybe they waited for 5-10 minutes before kickoff. I would look at the time stamps on Twitter discussions about the game to see when people commented on Andre Brown's 1st run. Obviously if the game did kick off at 8:20 and Andre Brown ripped a long run in the first drive, it would be too late to make lineup adjustments. However, assuming that the game actually kicked off at 8:30pm, if the commish got a call at 8:29, then the commish should let the owner make the line-up adjustment.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

I was looking at the clock at kickoff and it was after 8:30. I think that it was 8:32.

 

P.S. I drink a lot

[montana 89]

Kickoff was 8:20

 

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=320920029

I stand corrected. 830 for mnf.

[jgcrawfish 232]

Kickoff was 8:20

 

 

http://scores.espn.g...ameId=320920029

 

that was the scheduled kickoff time.

[southcarolina 166]

that was the scheduled kickoff time.

 

Yup. And it was that time ever since they released the schedule a million weeks ago. Everyone knew that. Or at least they should have. Setting a precedent of using twitter feed time stamps to decide when a game actually kicked off is insane. But its not my league so do what you want.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Yup. And it was that time ever since they released the schedule a million weeks ago. Everyone knew that. Or at least they should have. Setting a precedent of using twitter feed time stamps to decide when a game actually kicked off is insane. But its not my league so do what you want.

 

Actually, that is not the kickoff time. That is when coverage starts on NFL Network. Kickoff is 8:30.

 

You should have a buffer in there that rosters lock at least 5 minutes before the time listed. Then you don't have to worry.

 

Punch. Face. Family.

[montana 89]

Personally, I just posted on my leagues LM Notes "Line ups must be entered online (your teams page) & can not be submitted by email, voicemail, fax, text message, or otherwise".

 

There's my "out" if this happens in my league.

[12th Place 2]

If you can find someone who DVR'd the game, it shows the real time when you press FF/REW etc... At least with FIOS.

[rumbleready00 3]

I remember looking at the clock before kickoff and I know it was past 8:30 pm. However, if I am the opposing team I need one of two things to happen. Either the commissioner needs to make the change in the system by kickoff or some notification needs to be made before kickoff whether it is a post to the league message board which is time stamped or communication to me (the other team owner) prior to kickoff. The commissioner telling me "Joe Blow" called me with a lineup change and I find out at half or after the game is over that scored 40 points is not going to happen. Many commissioners are trustworthy, but many are not!!!!

[Laurence Maroney's Nuts 2]

The lineup swap should be disallowed.

 

The Bradshaw or Nicks owner had plenty of time to adjust their lineup.

[edjr 5,567]

Stop being a bunch of cvnts. of course the change should be allowed.

 

I would burn someone's house down if they didn't allow me to make a change when I called the commish.

 

Who cares what time the game started? I'm certain nothing had happened in the game before he called.

 

leagues like this are supposed to be a bunch of friends that play. You're not roger goodell, don't be a ######.

[travis_henrys_baby_momma 10]

Based on tweets I would say he called too late. What kind of retard can't set a lineup earlier than kickoff time?

 

And the OFFICIAL kickoff time was 8:20 which should be what the rules is based upon. How the heck can the commish be expected to monitor the ACTUAL kickoff time of every game?! That is ridiculous.

[BTL99 34]

The kickoff was DEFINITELY after 8:20.....more like 8:30

[travis_henrys_baby_momma 10]

ACTUAL kickoff time is not practical. For the Sunday morning games I guess the commish has a war room with 10 TVs so he can monitor EXACTLY when each game kicks off just in case someone text him a lineup change. Stoopid.

[jkil22 1]

Sounds like a horrible league. You might think you're winning and later on when the Commish has time (Who knows when?) to make a change for your opponent that was requested before kickoff you find out your getting your ass handed to you. Shut down the league, you guys aren't ready.

[Serpent 51]

The rule is the commissioner can honor the request.

 

The commissioner however was not able to process the request prior to kickoff, hence the request will not be honored, as the rule gives sole discretion to the commissioner and the applicant assumes all risks, even if arbitrary. In this case, the commissioner was in transit and not able to effectuate any change. The petitioner does not allege capriciousness or even opposes the commissioner's discretion at all, his sole argument is he made a call and he does not know the time of kickoff.

 

Petition denied. The lineup change will not be honored. Applicants for the rule should be warned in the future to make lineup changes on their own, or place their calls well in advance and gain confirmation of a change well before kickoff.

 

P.S. I am actually a lawyer and that's probably how it would be handled. Look at your rule again closely, always take the cop out whenever you can.

[rallo 132]

this has been a flaw in fantasy football for as long as i can remember. Waiting til the last minute for that 'game time decision'. Are there any sites that allow you to set up an alogorithm based on injury status? for example you set your starting lineup, nicks is a GTD.. you have a function that says start hicks if he plays, if he's ruled out insert ________ (whichever player you have predetermined to start in his absence)... you'd think that it has to be out there... with all the predraft rankings and BS those sites have nowadays.

[Matthew's Berry's 0]

Stop being a bunch of cvnts. of course the change should be allowed.

 

I would burn someone's house down if they didn't allow me to make a change when I called the commish.

 

Who cares what time the game started? I'm certain nothing had happened in the game before he called.

 

leagues like this are supposed to be a bunch of friends that play. You're not roger goodell, don't be a ######.

 

How can you have "fun" if you can't trust the lineup you are looking at? I know Sunday morning at kickoff I like to see the matchup so I know who to root for and who to root against. This opponent sees ABrown on the bench and thinks, ok, no worries. But then finds out after the game, no, the owner wanted him in there. FOCK THAT. This type of "last minute manipulation" takes the fun OUT of the game. Everyone and their mom knew Bradshaw was out WAY before kickoff. Obviously the guy picked him up (can't imagine drafting him), so why didn't he INSERT the player into the lineup immediately ... or Tuesday ... or Wednesday ... or Thursday morning ... or afternoon. Look, I get we have "life", but if you are busy for three days in a row and don't care that much, then you shouldn't be playing this game.

 

Plus, splitting hairs on ACTUAL kickoff is ridiculous. ESPN and most sites LOCK the lineups 5-10 minutes prior to SCHEDULED kickoff. That is the time you need to go by, 8:20pm. Not 8:21, 8:25, 8:50. The scheduled time is 8:20.

 

Finally, they have this thing called the INTERNET with fantasy football WEBSITES that are mostly FREE ... it's awesome, check it out. The end.

[rallo 132]

How can you have "fun" if you can't trust the lineup you are looking at? I know Sunday morning at kickoff I like to see the matchup so I know who to root for and who to root against. This opponent sees ABrown on the bench and thinks, ok, no worries. But then finds out after the game, no, the owner wanted him in there. FOCK THAT. This type of "last minute manipulation" takes the fun OUT of the game. Everyone and their mom knew Bradshaw was out WAY before kickoff. Obviously the guy picked him up (can't imagine drafting him), so why didn't he INSERT the player into the lineup immediately ... or Tuesday ... or Wednesday ... or Thursday morning ... or afternoon. Look, I get we have "life", but if you are busy for three days in a row and don't care that much, then you shouldn't be playing this game.

 

Plus, splitting hairs on ACTUAL kickoff is ridiculous. ESPN and most sites LOCK the lineups 5-10 minutes prior to SCHEDULED kickoff. That is the time you need to go by, 8:20pm. Not 8:21, 8:25, 8:50. The scheduled time is 8:20.

 

Finally, they have this thing called the INTERNET with fantasy football WEBSITES that are mostly FREE ... it's awesome, check it out. The end.

 

i would be a little suspicious if bradshaw was in the starting lineup when the game started. You have to figure that the owner did not purposely place him amongst the other players for moral support. I have no problem with the switch. I, for one, don't like to get a cheap win, and hate it even worse when another team gets one because a player has an empty (or injured) roster spot. i feel like this is a non-issue... as long as this doesn't become a habit, let the roster spot be accounted for.

[madd futher mucker 36]

I have never seen a televised game (or any other NFL games either for that matter) start early or even exactly on time. FWIW, I believe I turned the game on at at 7:30 Central (8:30 ET) and they were just starting to line up for kick off. Yes I suppose I could have turned it on at 8:29, but I doubt it.

 

Regardless, this should not be a league controversy and the commish should have made the change. The rest of the league should not even have been brought into the discussion.

[ppierce 2]

he's the commisioner. its his decision thats why he's the commissioner. duh. whatever he decides goes. if your league doesn't trust the commish to make important decisions, don't have a commish or get a new one.

[cavern 70]

i went to the game. kickoff was scheduled for 8:20 - that was printed on the ticket. the countdown clock was on pace for about an 8:27 ACTUAL kick time. that expired and a few minutes went by, id say the ball left the kickers foot around like 8:31. hth

[kutulu 1,547]

Stop being a bunch of cvnts. of course the change should be allowed.

 

I would burn someone's house down if they didn't allow me to make a change when I called the commish.

 

Who cares what time the game started? I'm certain nothing had happened in the game before he called.

 

leagues like this are supposed to be a bunch of friends that play. You're not roger goodell, don't be a ######.

 

[Matthew's Berry's 0]

i would be a little suspicious if bradshaw was in the starting lineup when the game started. You have to figure that the owner did not purposely place him amongst the other players for moral support. I have no problem with the switch. I, for one, don't like to get a cheap win, and hate it even worse when another team gets one because a player has an empty (or injured) roster spot. i feel like this is a non-issue... as long as this doesn't become a habit, let the roster spot be accounted for.[/quote]

 

So you will allow it this time ... maybe next time ... definitely not the third time?!?! You either ALWAYS allow it or you DON'T. Walking your fine line will really piss off people and the reason why I'm glad I'm not in a league with "grey area" rules ... which is exactly why this league is having this problem. You say it's a non-issue, but I guarantee it's the opposite. Cheap wins don't happen in my league because people actually care and pay attention.

 

And being "suspicious" or "you have to figure/assume" is a horrible precedent. People should be accountable, and if they kept Bradshaw in, they obviously don't care enough about the league/team, and do not have the right to cry foul. Had plenty of time to make that fix.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Stop being a bunch of cvnts. of course the change should be allowed.

 

I would burn someone's house down if they didn't allow me to make a change when I called the commish.

 

Who cares what time the game started? I'm certain nothing had happened in the game before he called.

 

leagues like this are supposed to be a bunch of friends that play. You're not roger goodell, don't be a ######.

 

Who are you kidding? You would quit the league if one of your players got a hang-nail.

[Stewburtx8 67]

I don't know why everyone feels they need to tell the OP what they think based on the rules of THEIR league. Your league rules are irrelevant to the original poster.

 

Here is what the OP said:

 

"There is a rule in my league that states if a team owner calls in a lineup change to the commissioner before kickoff, the commissioner can honor that request and make the change for the team owner if he can confirm that kickoff for that game has not taken place. I don't want to debate whether or not the rule is good or bad --- it is the rule."

 

So basically the commish is trying to confirm that the kickoff did not take place before the lineup change was called in at 8:29. Is this a good rule for leagues? Probably not. But again, that's irrelevant to the discussion.

 

Based on all the data I've seen and what people have said in this thread, the kickoff occurred AFTER 8:29. Therefore, based on the rules laid out by the original poster, the commish/league should honor this roster change. It's not that difficult.

 

Now I think there should be some common courtesy where both the person who called in the lineup change and the commish should make an effort to notify this person's opponent of the change as soon as possible either by text, phone call, or at least on the league website.

[uflouie 0]

What site does your league us for the league? Didn't see this mentioned. And if you don't use a site then that just dumb.

 

Honestly are there that many sites these days that don't have apps for fantasy football? If you can make a phone call you should be able to get to the app and change your player.

[killersquids 3]

My two cents....I left my desk at 8:23pm to make a sandwich - I remember looking down the clock on my PC before leaving my desk. It took me approx five minutes to make the sandwich, then I walked down the hall to our kitchen/lounge room (I was at work). Got myself a glass of water from the fridge, then turned on the TV and changed to the game. The game came on, and the first thing I see is the Carolina kicker putting the ball on the tee. So it was probably right around 8:30, maybe a minute or two after. Hope this helps.