Gallup poll: 67% of Americans dissatisfied with economic inequality

[IGotWorms 3,315]

Bingo.

 

Back in the heyday of American industry, corporations were owned by the man that started them, and we're then family businesses. The officers cared about the long term view. They built "company towns" for the workers to live in, and actually cared about the well being of their employees.

 

Today, corporations are owned largely by absentee investors who only care about stock price and dividends, and run by some MBA owning cokehead who cares more about where his next yacht payment is coming from than the future of the company long term. And the workers? Fock them, they are a commodity like the paper clips in the supply closet.

 

And they're increasingly multinational. So no, a board of directors located simultaneously in North America, China, and Qatar doesn't give two sh1ts about the midwestern town that will be focked when they shut down the factory.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

Why is there such idolization and protectionism of the current generation of fat cats? These guys suck. Save a few of them, they produce nothing, employ almost no one, and basically make their fortunes moving money around based on inside information and access to our weakling elected officials. Geez, even the robber barons, who were heartless scumbags, built things and left something behind. What does the current crop have to show for their fortunes besides a Maybach and a mansion?

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

 

You don't work in a corporate environment but you feel qualified to judge corporations? Ok. How come you aren't railing against our government for eliminating things like shop classes where people learned skills? And for suggesting that everyone should go to college when a good portion of our kids probably should learn a trade? Why aren't you railing against our government for it's role in the skyrocketing cost of college, and subsequent student loan debt so many kids have after graduation?

Huh? Ok so i am supposed to rail against the things you think i should? That wasnt the topic of this thread, nor do i have time to go into every topic that strike wants me to. I never said our government wasnt responsible for reducing college funding or putting a bad stigma on trades.

 

I took computer classes because that was the future of our society. I looked down on shop classes because thats where the dumb kids went. After trying out computer engineering i hated it. Programming was so boring. Plus i partied way too much. Hating studying and partying were a bad combination.

 

I eventually got into my current trade and i honestly enjoy it a lot of the time. Sure sometimes it sucks, but thats most jobs. I get to build massive piping structures that people marvel at and think "how the hell did someone do that?" Unfortunately there still isnt much positive reinforcement given to a trade type career.

 

Did i rail enough on other topics for you?

[JTB 52]

Bingo.

Back in the heyday of American industry, corporations were owned by the man that started them, and we're then family businesses. The officers cared about the long term view. They built "company towns" for the workers to live in, and actually cared about the well being of their employees.

Today, corporations are owned largely by absentee investors who only care about stock price and dividends, and run by some MBA owning cokehead who cares more about where his next yacht payment is coming from than the future of the company long term. And the workers? Fock them, they are a commodity like the paper clips in the supply closet.

I've never read a post that felt like it could have come out of my own mouth. Absolutely spot on!

[MTSkiBum 1,594]

I agree, income inequality is a problem.

 

I do not know how to fix it and can offer no suggestions.

[KSB2424 3,083]

I agree, income inequality is a problem.

 

.

It's not ideal. I think a few people touched on the root cause issues with corporations taking advantage of a global economy, bringing the bottom up with education, etc.

 

What's not going to do it? Trying to somehow "fix" it through the tax code. That's short sighted and doesn't address the root causes.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

It's not ideal. I think a few people touched on the root cause issues with corporations taking advantage of a global economy, bringing the bottom up with education, etc.

 

What's not going to do it? Trying to somehow "fix" it through the tax code. That's short sighted and doesn't address the root causes.

You are fully indoctrinated. Outside of the guillotine, taxes are about the only thing that can slow it down

[DankNuggs 305]

I agree, income inequality is a problem.

 

I do not know how to fix it and can offer no suggestions.

Protect the American worker over the foreign worker. With globalization and free trade the amount of emerging foreign market workers are offsetting demand and it is keeping inflation and wage growth low

[DankNuggs 305]

You are fully indocrinated. Outside of the guillotine, taxes are about the only thing that can slow it down

That's nonsense. Taxes may slow down business, but it will slow down jobs and wage growth as well

[KSB2424 3,083]

You are fully indocrinated. Outside of the guillotine, taxes are about the only thing that can slow it down

Treating symptoms while ignoring the disease or illness causing the symptoms isn't good medicine.

 

In the private sector business, which is super competive, there is something called 'root cause analysis'. It's a business management and strategic tool to truly solve problems, opposed to keep spinning your wheels by focusing on the symptoms of problems.

 

You can raise capital gains to 50% and not tax the middle class at all. It won't stop the poor from being poor and the rich from getting richer.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

Treating symptoms while ignoring the disease or illness causing the symptoms isn't good medicine.

 

In the private sector business, which is super competive, there is something called 'root cause analysis'. It's a business management and strategic tool to truly solve problems, opposed to keep spinning your wheels by focusing on the symptoms of problems.

 

You can raise capital gains to 50% and not tax the middle class at all. It won't stop the poor from being poor and the rich from getting richer.

The super rich wrote the rules (taxes). They didn't have the rest of us in mind when they did. Why can't you see this?

[KSB2424 3,083]

The super rich wrote the rules (taxes). They didn't have the rest of us in mind when they did. Why can't you see this?

 

Look, if you want to close loopholes and simplify tax codes to keep the tax code more progressive as it is intended to be, then sure, that is a no-brainer. But that won't fix or even help in any significant fashion this income inequality issue we are speaking too.

 

This issue is much more deep than that. The "Tax the Rich" mantra to tackle "income inequality" is more or less just rhetoric to get votes.

 

You want to truly help? Education, Opportunity and Conscious Capitalism.

• Educate the people. Education is the tide that rises all boats.
• Opportunity - Jobs, creating jobs and keeping jobs here in America
• Conscious Capitalism - The hardest one.....The CEO's, the Top 1%'s don't need more taxes, they'll just find a different way around that. They need a change in mindset of how they do business. Investing more back into the business and the employees. Creating value and profits. Not just profits alone.
• And we have to find a way to tackle the globalization of business. "Cheap Labor" abroad.

But I'm sure we'll hear Bernie and Hillary yell about the rich not paying their "fair share" and the majority of folks will cheer and clap. Rinse and Repeat.

[IGotWorms 3,315]

[Pecos Rattlers 5]

Those of you who think our corporations are bending people over, answer me a few questions:

 

- How much does one have to make at said corporation before they can stop thinking they're being bent over?

 

- Do you think anyone at those corporations makes decent money? I mean, at McDonalds we know the people working the register don't make great money, but what about people a couple levels above them?

 

- If you're a college graduate with a marketable skill, do you think you make decent money at those evil corporations?

 

Just curious.....

 

- A fair wage depends on the job & the cost of doing business at the location in question. Costs vary greatly from say New York to middle of nowhere Oklahoma/etc, so a single # is not really helpful (or the point).

 

- Definitely many people do make decent money at large corporations. This doesn't mean that the distribution of income is fair at all levels & that it cannot be improved. I certainly did not claim that "Managers make too much at large companies" or "professional engineers make too much at large companies" or even "specialist doctors make too much". Someone might be able to make a case for some of those, but I'm just not interested in it. The salaries (even of specialists who make 500K+ a year) pales in comparison to executive salary.

 

- Those with more marketable skills and also experience (college degree or not) can command higher compensation, certainly. I have worked as a software developer for small startups more than large companies (but I have worked for 2 large companies) and I was happy with the salary I made during those years. So yes, the system as it stands is definitely working in some cases ... for some people. This doesn't mean it is without flaws or cannot be improved. Or that I thought our executives were worth multiple millions a year

 

 

You don't work in a corporate environment but you feel qualified to judge corporations? Ok. How come you aren't railing against our government for eliminating things like shop classes where people learned skills? And for suggesting that everyone should go to college when a good portion of our kids probably should learn a trade? Why aren't you railing against our government for it's role in the skyrocketing cost of college, and subsequent student loan debt so many kids have after graduation?

 

Everyone wanting to go to college & the cost of tuition rising are definitely also significant problems. I won't speak for anyone else (and I realize this was not posted in response to me directly), but I did not rail against any of those in my post, because I see them as separate, valid problems that are not linked to wage discrepancy. Thus, I don't think pointing out these problems invalidate any of the concerns about wage discrepancy. Rather it's just a tangent, if one worth of (separate) discussion.

 

 

 

I was going to be done with this thread but I'll give YOU one more shot. First you have to DEFINE the problem. Are you actually saying that the existence of corporations is the problem? Or the fact that their CEO's make 1000 times their lowest workers salary? If so, cite some stats. If Steve Ballmer made 20 times his lowest paid workers at Microsoft during his tenure as CEO would that have made even the slightest difference? Show me something. I asked some simple questions that I wanted people such as yourself to answer that might help me understand your problem with corporations, but all you did was call me an a-hole and a drunk. Help me understand what you believe the problem is with corporations that makes them so evil. If you can't define the problem how can we talk about solutions?

 

No one is saying executives should not make more than others - the issue is that they make ridiculously more than they did 30 years ago while others have not seen those gains. This graph shows how the gains from productivity were shared with wages in two periods. Note the remarkable difference!

 

http://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/posts/2015/02/labor_gap/04e656c70.png

 

And here is a graph showing the ratio of CEO to worker pay during a similar period. There seems to be some correlation, yes?

 

http://management.curiouscatblog.net/images/ceopay.jpg

 

So yes, I think the ratio of top tier vs bottom tier pay increasing by a factor of 10 is an issue.

 

How this has happened (globalization is a big part) & how to fix it are pretty lengthy topics though & I'm about out of time for now and I'm not an economist I'll just say some of this ... should slowly fix itself over time as global living standards equalize. Then there will not be any cheaper places to make things and productivity will (should!) continue to increase with innovation. But by then we may have hit the point where automation completely changes the market anyway - yet another topic!

 

Also, I don't believe corporations are evil (in general). They are morally ambivalent entities playing the game by the rules given (or pay the consequences). Many of the costs of their actions are not currently reflected in the rules (think carbon footprint) & they have significant control of the rules to prevent that from changing. Where we can .. we should try to change some of those rules, but it will be a very difficult thing to accomplish.

[SUXBNME 1,337]

Excellent post. It'd be great if we could penalize companies that exploit cheap labor/taxation etc. by setting up shop overseas, but there will always be other countries/customers willing to buy the cheapest stuff, despite the socioeconomic consequences.

Cut and paste

[MDC 5,893]

Wealth envy

[Voltaire 4,562]

Where can we get more of these Pecos Rattlers guys?

[penultimatestraw 473]

Cut and paste

[KSB2424 3,083]

Where can we get more of these Pecos Rattlers guys?

Yeah, I like this guy.

[RLLD 3,455]

Great thread and discussion guys, lots of good points, there us no simple answer. A problem exists, and likely there is no one answer, but good stuff

[tubby_mcgee 686]

Everyone has been taught life should be fair. If it isn't, complain, and you'll get your way.

Want more money? Work harder or be smarter.

 

Instead, you have focktards skipping work, holding signs and walking up and down the street yakking that they want mo' money.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

Everyone has been taught life should be fair. If it isn't, complain, and you'll get your way.

 

Want more money? Work harder or be smarter.

 

Instead, you have focktards skipping work, holding signs and walking up and down the street yakking that they want mo' money.

The conservative uncle at thanksgiving chimes in. Thanks for your simplistic solution to the problem. Everyone else is dumb, but you have it all figured out. You should run for something.