Murray and Jones as top 5 qb this year.....

[phins1921 10]

anyone agree that these two could  both be  ranked in the top 5 for tp by qbs? 

[TBayXXXVII 2,251]

I think both finish outside the top 10.  Just a hunch.

[AxeElf 787]

23 minutes ago, phins1921 said:

anyone agree that these two could  both be  ranked in the top 5 for tp by qbs? 

How will you determine how much tp they have--Costco receipts?

Assuming you're talking about fantasy points, however, you're not suggesting anything revolutionary.  Kyler Murray already scored the 7th-most fantasy points among QBs last season, so moving up two slots wouldn't be a superhuman feat--and Daniel Jones was already the 5th-best fantasy QB from Week 8 onward last season, so he just has to not get worse (and remember, Jones played exactly zero snaps last season with Barkley, Tate, Shepard, Slayton and Engram all on the field at the same time).

[Frozenbeernuts 1,658]

I don't see Jones doing it. I expect a Sam Darnold type regression

[Matt Mueller 146]

4 minutes ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

I don't see Jones doing it. I expect a Sam Darnold type regression

Lets Leave Sam out of this lol 

[Matt Mueller 146]

FWIW Darnold improved his completion %,  improved his tds and reduced his interceptions while coming back from mono on a team with no weapons 

 

This Jets fan was sitting here quite content at work.  Now all riled up.   HOOOOOO!   

[AxeElf 787]

6 minutes ago, Matt Mueller said:

...on a team with no weapons

Le'Veon Bell, Jamison Crowder and Ty Montgomery WERE weapons... until they went to the Jets.

[cmh6476 812]

I think Kyler Murray has a chance.  I think in order to be top 5, you have to have a really talented receiving corp or simply be an uber talented QB.  Jones might end up there someday, but I don't have much confidence in Golden Tate, Sterling Shepard and Darius Slayton helping him get there this year.

[weepaws 2,591]

5 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

I think Kyler Murray has a chance.  I think in order to be top 5, you have to have a really talented receiving corp or simply be an uber talented QB.  Jones might end up there someday, but I don't have much confidence in Golden Tate, Sterling Shepard and Darius Slayton helping him get there this year.

Would agree. 

Plus Murray did finish 7th last season , with the addition of Hopkins that might put him up those two big steps.  

[Ray_T 628]

12 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

I think Kyler Murray has a chance.  I think in order to be top 5, you have to have a really talented receiving corp or simply be an uber talented QB.  Jones might end up there someday, but I don't have much confidence in Golden Tate, Sterling Shepard and Darius Slayton helping him get there this year.

Kyler murray presents a nice floor due to his running ability.  I could see him doing it.

Jones has flashed potential, but i dont see top 5.  

Top 10 if he takes a step forward in his development (odds are good that he will)

for him to be top 5 literally everything would need to go right for him.

dont get me wrong.   I like Jones.   he looks like he has a bright future.   

but I think top 5 is a next year discussion.  Not a this year discussion.

 

 

[jtztdm 2]

Could Murray be this years Lamar Jackson? He has a better receiving corps for sure. I think Murray will finish in top 3.

[AxeElf 787]

1 hour ago, cmh6476 said:

Jones might end up there someday, but I don't have much confidence in Golden Tate, Sterling Shepard and Darius Slayton helping him get there this year.

Well, maybe he should go back to the crew he had last year, because from Week 8 on, Daniel Jones WAS the fifth-best QB in fantasy football.  So "someday" was last year.

1 hour ago, Ray_T said:

Jones has flashed potential, but i dont see top 5.

Then look at last year.

1 hour ago, Ray_T said:

I like Jones.   he looks like he has a bright future.   

but I think top 5 is a next year discussion.  Not a this year discussion.

Axually it was a "last year" discussion.

[Ray_T 628]

I'll have to agree to disagree with you on this one AxeElf.

I think fftoday has him ranked as the #11 or #12 QB. 

I do think he will do better than this.  I just dont think top 5 is in the cards for him this year.

In my keeper league where we start 2 QB's I'm looking at him as an option if his owner does not keep him (currently it looks like he wont)

If I can get him for the price of a high end QB2 or low end QB1 i'll buy all day.

but I'm not ready to get on the top 5 bandwagon.  not yet anyways.

-ediit  fftoday has him as the 15th ranked QB.  sorry for the mixup. I thought I saw him ranked higher.

[AxeElf 787]

3 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

I'll have to agree to disagree with you on this one AxeElf.

Ok, but I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with.  Are you saying that Daniel Jones was NOT the fifth-best QB in fantasy last year from Week 8 onward?

[weepaws 2,591]

21 minutes ago, jtztdm said:

Could Murray be this years Lamar Jackson? He has a better receiving corps for sure. I think Murray will finish in top 3.

He doesn’t have as far to go from last season. 

[weepaws 2,591]

2 hours ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

I don't see Jones doing it. I expect a Sam Darnold type regression

I wouldn’t go that far, for me at least, but I don’t see a top five.  

[Ray_T 628]

16 minutes ago, AxeElf said:

Ok, but I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with.  Are you saying that Daniel Jones was NOT the fifth-best QB in fantasy last year from Week 8 onward?

I'm saying he beat up on a couple of terrible defenses to get that ranking.

iif you look at any of the good defenses he faced the result was not great.

vikings in week 5  21-38 182 yards 1 TD 1 int

pats week 6 15-31 161 yards 1 td 3 INT

Chicago week 12 21-36 150 yards 2 TD 0 int.   the 2 TD saved his the day fantasy wise that week but he lost the game.

late season beat downs against washiiington and the jets dont instill a lot of confidence.  any mediiocre qb should put up decent stats agaiinst those defenses. I am encouraged by the good outcome agaiinst philly in week 17, so its not all bad.

I just dont see top 5 in this kid this year. he needs to get better

I'd say he is improving  week 4 against washington wasnt that good.  week 16 against the same team was fantastic.   to me that shows hes going the riight direction, but a lot of teams beat up on the Washinigton defense last year so lets not make this into more than it is.

[Ray_T 628]

to add to what I was saying, he needs to be able to have good fantasy days against those top defenses.

this year he plays pittsburgh, chicago, San fran, and the rams iini the first 4 weeks.   iif he passes those tests I'd say hes ready to roll as the rest of his schedule gets a lot easier after that

[jrokh 580]

2 hours ago, cmh6476 said:

but I don't have much confidence in Golden Tate, Sterling Shepard and Darius Slayton helping him get there this year.

You are forgetting the first 2 options in the passing game: Evan Engram and Saquon Barkley...

[AxeElf 787]

3 hours ago, Ray_T said:

I'm saying he beat up on a couple of terrible defenses to get that ranking.

Fine, but we're not talking about a two game sample; there were a few OTHER games in which he had to play well in order to finish as the #5 QB from Week 8 onward.

3 hours ago, Ray_T said:

iif you look at any of the good defenses he faced the result was not great.

vikings in week 5  21-38 182 yards 1 TD 1 int

pats week 6 15-31 161 yards 1 td 3 INT

Chicago week 12 21-36 150 yards 2 TD 0 int.   the 2 TD saved his the day fantasy wise that week but he lost the game.

I said from Week 8 onward.  I'm not going to hold subpar performances in a rookie's first 6 NFL games against him, when his more recent performances put him among the top 5.

Still concerned about the Chicago game?  Well, ok... but then you better fade Mahomes too; he had an abysmal outing in November against the Chargers, with only 182 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT.  If that wasn't bad enough, he followed up that performance with a 175/1/0 clunker against the Raiders just two weeks later after his bye.  So clearly Jones is better than Mahomes.

3 hours ago, Ray_T said:

I just dont see top 5 in this kid this year

Then look at last year, when he achieved it.