Swing state residents reap benefits of Biden student loan handout

[seafoam1 1,879]

7 minutes ago, zsasz said:

Yeah...you guys are playing checkers while we're playing 3 Dimensional Chess.  Great political manuvering.  

pimpledoosh here watched another episode of the big bang theory. 

[Pimpadeaux 2,281]

 

[seafoam1 1,879]

18 hours ago, Cloaca du jour said:

Securing liberal votes

No two ways about it. 

[Baker Boy 1,489]

For some reason, the board liberals are equating education with intelligence. Eduction today has turned into nothing more than indoctrination. The more education you have the more indoctrinated you are. What I don’t understand is why the liberals on this board are so excited to pay the student loans of others.

I am wondering how much education I need before I can understand why we would pay off billions of dollars of student loans without even addressing the problem that’s caused it.

This is more "rinse, spit, repeat" legislation by the Democrats.  

Next we will be paying off the massive credit card debt that people have been accumulating under Biden.

 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

14 minutes ago, Baker Boy said:

For some reason, the board liberals are equating education with intelligence. Eduction today has turned into nothing more than indoctrination. The more education you have the more indoctrinated you are. What I don’t understand is why the liberals on this board are so excited to pay the student loans of others.

I am wondering how much education I need before I can understand why we would pay off billions of dollars of student loans without even addressing the problem that’s caused it.

This is more "rinse, repeat" legislation by the Democrats.  

All pretty good points

To me the root cause of this is the baby boomers refused to pay for higher education. Pulled the ladder up after themselves. So now we’re kind of having to do this post-hoc with mountains of debt people had to pile up, even for in state schools, because funding for higher ed was consistently undermined from the 70s onward.

But it isn’t a long term solution and I agree that part of it is ill-advised. I’d like to see student loan relief coupled with 1) measures to address the spiraling costs of higher education and 2) additional funding for actual necessary expenses of higher ed (not bloated administrations and football stadiums, but actual costs of attending college).

Anyway, I wouldn’t discount the value of higher education. It is immense. You are correct that independent thinking is also critical (they taught me that in college as well, at least the good professors did), but anti-intellectualism is not necessary to get there.

[seafoam1 1,879]

1 minute ago, IGotWorms said:

All pretty good points

To me the root cause of this is the baby boomers refused to pay for higher education. Pulled the ladder up after themselves. So now we’re kind of having to do this post-hoc with mountains of debt people had to pile up, even for in state schools, because funding for higher ed was consistently undermined from the 70s onward.

But it isn’t a long term solution and I agree that part of it is ill-advised. I’d like to see student loan relief coupled with 1) measures to address the spiraling costs of higher education and 2) additional funding for actual necessary expenses of higher ed (not bloated administrations and football stadiums, but actual costs of attending college).

Anyway, I wouldn’t discount the value of higher education. It is immense. You are correct that independent thinking is also critical (they taught me that in college as well, at least the good professors did), but anti-intellectualism is not necessary to get there.

I went to college in the 90s. Paid off my own education. What was your problem? 

And baby boomers had zero to do with this shlt. 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

1 minute ago, seafoam1 said:

I went to college in the 90s. Paid off my own education. What was your problem? 

And baby boomers had zero to do with this shlt. 

90s was before the problem really became acute in the early to mid aughts.

But good for you, I don’t mean to take away from your accomplishments. That was impressive of you

And yes, it was the boomers that did this. In their day college was pretty cheap and could be literally actually free for many. Now it’s a six figure obligation for public colleges. 

[Baker Boy 1,489]

51 minutes ago, zsasz said:

Yeah...you guys are playing checkers while we're playing 3 Dimensional Chess.  Great political manuvering.  

Give me a break. This board is playing a collective game of Candyland.

[DonS 3,078]

16 hours ago, Bert said:

Very true.   The blue states on the other hand are full of idiots with multiple degrees and 10’s of thousands of dollars in useless liberal art sh!t like environmental studies, diversity studies, mico-aggression theory, art history, communication, etc.  

Yep.  All that student loan debt just so they can get a degree which qualifies them to be a barista.

Whatever happened to folks planning for college with the end goal of choosing a field of study which would result in a career with a good paying job? 

[Mike Honcho 4,053]

6 hours ago, Pimpadeaux said:

 

That's some pretty funny sh!t

[IGotWorms 3,343]

30 minutes ago, DonS said:

Yep.  All that student loan debt just so they can get a degree which qualifies them to be a barista.

Whatever happened to folks planning for college with the end goal of choosing a field of study which would result in a career which a good paying job? 

Some of it is poor planning for sure, but you also have to remember that these folks were told college was a golden ticket and you figure it out later.

Which I think is still true, btw. Even those baristas a couple years out probably eventually made their way into at least a halfway-decent job. Especially in this economy.

But the value proposition isn’t what it used to be with college costing an average of $100k now instead of a couple grand in 1970

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

Private college enrollment exploded with the ease of student loans. They are hotels at  this point. 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

5 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Private college enrollment exploded with the ease of student loans. They are hotels at  this point. 

Nice try but no. Public colleges are where the real issue is. Private school has always been comparatively expensive. If somebody picks that without a real plan for making it worthwhile, that’s on them. But public higher ed was supposed to be affordable 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

33 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Nice try but no. Public colleges are where the real issue is. Private school has always been comparatively expensive. If somebody picks that without a real plan for making it worthwhile, that’s on them. But public higher ed was supposed to be affordable 

If the population of the private colleges exploded its an indication that it’s not just the rich attending them anymore.  And the middle class and down fund it via student loans, that is where the added students came from. I know I said something and you feel the need to respond in the contrary, but your impulse has caused you to look foolish again 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

20 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

If the population of the private colleges exploded its an indication that it’s not just the rich attending them anymore.  And the middle class and down fund it via student loans, they are here the added students came from. I know I said something and you feel the need to respond in the contrary, but your impulse has caused you to look foolish again 

Nope, wrong again. That’s you reflexively wanting to make the issue about people that made bad choices.

Of course they are out there.

But this isn’t really about middle class kids going to a private school they couldn’t afford (though I would like you to think about the implications of the best opportunities only being for those who are already rich).

This is about the “safe” and “pragmatic” option — here being public colleges — becoming itself prohibitively expensive. If it costs $100k to go to a public school then you really can’t point the finger at students for failing to stick within their means.

Which brings me to another point. I would argue it is perhaps a reasonable decision to take on more than you can afford to go to a ritzy private school. Either way you are in over your head with private school costs or public school costs. So why not go with the one that gives you the best chance for success? Its certainly at least an arguable strategy.

So again, the issue is investing in public colleges. If private school costs $200k and public school is, say, $16,000 (inflation adjusted from 1970 costs), then you’d be an absolute idiot to choose private school in most circumstances. And the market would reflect that.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

1 minute ago, IGotWorms said:

Nope, wrong again. That’s you reflexively wanting to make the issue about people that are bad choices.

Of course they are out there.

But this isn’t really about middle class kids going to a private school they couldn’t afford (though I would like you to think about the implications of the best opportunities only being for those who are already rich).

This is about the “safe” and “pragmatic” option — here being public colleges — becoming themselves prohibitively expensive. If it costs $100k to go to a public school then you really can’t point the finger at students for failing to stick within their means.

Which brings me to another point. I would argue it is perhaps a reasonable decision to take on more than you can afford to go to a ritzy private school. Either way you are in over your head with private school costs or public school costs. So why not go with the one that gives you the best chance for success? Its certainly at least an arguable strategy.

So again, the issue is investing in public colleges. If private school costs $200k and public school is, say, $16,000 (inflation adjusted from 1970 costs), then you’d be an absolute idiot to choose private school in most circumstances. And the market would reflect that.

Tuition at a SUNY college is 7k. 17 k to live on campus.  Look it up. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

Tuition is free in NY at SUNY schools for those making below 125k.  

[jerryskids 5,237]

I still can't get over that 43% (I think that was the number) of GenZ doesn't think Biden is doing enough for student loan debt.  These people literally just graduated, or are still in college, and they already want free stuff.

We've raised a generation of people with no ability to deal with adversity.

And these are the geniuses that the Lefties here use as evidence of their party's greater brain skillz!   

[5-Points 2,745]

17 hours ago, Bert said:

Very true.   The blue states on the other hand are full of idiots with multiple degrees and 10’s of thousands of dollars in useless liberal art sh!t like environmental studies, diversity studies, mico-aggression theory, art history, communication, etc.  

Exactly.

About the time those useless morons started paying off their over priced college loans, I started paying off my first home loan. 

Only I didn't need a government bail-out. 

Yet, these idiots continue to tout their "education" as something to be proud of. They'd be embarrassed if they had an ounce of common sense. 

 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

19 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Tuition at a SUNY college is 7k. 17 k to live on campus.  Look it up. 

Temple is $20k per year and that doesn’t even include living expenses.

Great on NY but they are the bluest or second bluest state in the country. If you think the rest of the country should look like that and have that tax burden, well I agree

Though I’d point out that even there and even if your numbers are correct, that’s still $68k for four years. Not too horrible but if that’s the absolute best you’ve got…

But the rest of the country should be like NY and SUNY. That would be a great start

[jerryskids 5,237]

2 hours ago, IGotWorms said:

Temple is $20k per year and that doesn’t even include living expenses.

Great on NY but they are the bluest or second bluest state in the country. If you think the rest of the country should look like that and have that tax burden, well I agree

Though I’d point out that even there and even if your numbers are correct, that’s still $68k for four years. Not too horrible but if that’s the absolute best you’ve got…

But the rest of the country should be like NY and SUNY. That would be a great start

ASU is about $10K per year for in state tuition, but that's list price.  Two of my kids got free rides, and the third almost free, for HS grades or SAT scores.  Basically, Arizona wants it's smart, college-qualified kids to go to school there, get jobs here, and contribute to the economy/tax base.  

Two of them spent 1 year in a dorm, the third, 0 years.  The rest were in apartments or houses near campus they rented with friends.  

I presume that ASU has fairly robust need-based aid as well, but we never applied.

One of our best friends was a high-level finance person there -- learned some inside info, like finance people hate lower-tier bowl games, because they cost more money than they generate.  But I digress... tuition increases are controlled by a Board of Regents, and they often went years without changing.  Her position was that they were not printing money.

[TimHauck 1,822]

7 hours ago, MDC said:

This thread sure got spicy.  

The headline is deliberately misleading. Loan relief isn’t targeted at swings states. Right there in the article it says Texas and Florida alone will receive a combined $336m in relief. 

Fake news.

This.  The alternate headline is “All state’s residents reap benefits of Biden student loan handouts.”   Of course sheep like the OP ate it right up.

[IGotWorms 3,343]

51 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

ASU is about $10K per year for in state tuition, but that's list price.  Two of my kids got free rides, and the third almost free, for HS grades or SAT scores.  Basically, Arizona wants it's smart, college-qualified kids to go to school there, get jobs here, and contribute to the economy/tax base.  

Two of them spent 1 year in a dorm, the third, 0 years.  The rest were in apartments or houses near campus they rented with friends.  

I presume that ASU has fairly robust need-based aid as well, but we never applied.

One of our best friends was a high-level finance person there -- learned some inside info, like finance people hate lower-tier bowl games, because they cost more money than they generate.  But I digress... tuition increases are controlled by a Board of Regents, and they often went years without changing.  Her position was that they were not printing money.

This link says $36,000 including on campus housing: https://admission.asu.edu/cost-aid/resident-first-year

I’m sure scholarships and such help but that’s a pretty hefty starting point.

And that’s just for the first year

[jerryskids 5,237]

27 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

This link says $36,000 including on campus housing: https://admission.asu.edu/cost-aid/resident-first-year

I’m sure scholarships and such help but that’s a pretty hefty starting point.

And that’s just for the first year

I said tuition, which your link says is $11K.  It also says, at the very top:

Quote

$13,161/yr

Average resident tuition and mandatory fees for 2023-24

$3,866/yr

Average net tuition residents pay after gift aid, work-study and on-campus employment (ABOR Financial Aid Report Fiscal Year 2021)

I also said that my kids lived all but two student-years off campus.

I'm not saying that there isn't a problem in both public and private schools with costs -- that cost of living number you stated is unacceptable IMO, for instance.  And the primary cause is... no checks and balances on these costs by the government who provides these loans.  And, for anyone who thinks about incentives, paying off student debt will have the opposite effect -- schools can just charge more.

[shadrap 117]

regardless of political persuasion the vast majority of this board knows this is simply buying votes..    For that reason alone WE should all be against it.

 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

10 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I said tuition, which your link says is $11K.  It also says, at the very top:

I also said that my kids lived all but two student-years off campus.

I'm not saying that there isn't a problem in both public and private schools with costs -- that cost of living number you stated is unacceptable IMO, for instance.  And the primary cause is... no checks and balances on these costs by the government who provides these loans.  And, for anyone who thinks about incentives, paying off student debt will have the opposite effect -- schools can just charge more.

Yes, I agree, costs have to be brought under control. But there also needs to be more public funding, not in the form of loans (which only encourage cost increases, really), but in bringing down actual, necessary costs of higher education.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

4 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Yes, I agree, costs have to be brought under control. But there also needs to be more public funding, not in the form of loans (which only encourage cost increases, really), but in bringing down actual, necessary costs of higher education.

So we should give more money to colleges? Ones with multi billion dollar endowments? And more administrators than professors? 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

5 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

So we should give more money to colleges? Ones with multi billion dollar endowments? And more administrators than professors? 

It’s like you didn’t read a word I’ve said.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,758]

38 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

It’s like you didn’t read a word I’ve said.

I have. You want the tuition to be less. How are you going to make private colleges get on board? They are sitting on a fortune and still don’t do it.  Also, Florida’s public school tuition is less than NY’s. Face it, too many students don’t want a public education. 

[IGotWorms 3,343]

35 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

I have. You want the tuition to be less. How are you going to make private colleges get on board? They are sitting on a fortune and still don’t do it.  Also, Florida’s public school tuition is less than NY’s. Face it, too many students don’t want a public education. 

Private schools can do whatever they want. Loan caps for them and no loan forgiveness if you just went ahead and decided to do that AFTER public colleges are actually made affordable again 

[DonS 3,078]

How about having a percentage of NIL deals for "student" athletes go into a scholarship fund for the school that gave these athletes a free ride?