Discussion of Concerns for Trump Presidency

[Strike 4,732]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

The whole resist thing isn’t going to be real UNLESS Trump really goes through with the mass deportation deal and tries to send authorities to round up millions of people. If that actually happens (which I still kinda doubt) then we will see massive unrest, violence. And it will be really really ugly. But somehow I still can’t see it because the effects on the economy will be so detrimental. 
 

With the tariffs I hope Trump gets talked out of them.  But if he enacts them then my main hope the outcry from the public is so massive that they are quickly retracted. 

Just stop, dude.  I've told you many times in the past how we can get rid of a good chunk of illegals without going all gestapo on them.  You're such a horrible poster. 

[jerryskids 6,135]

6 minutes ago, Strike said:

Sorry Jerry but what you're looking for is futile.   And I answered your question.  I'm concerned about having too much money.

Sorry Strike, but I don't find this to be in the spirit of my post.  

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

1 minute ago, shadrap said:

this will not be Poland in 1939 even though MSNBC said it will be.  I am concerned with the tariffs although as bad as you spouted off on Trump's tariffs in 2018 I find it remarkable that Biden, et al did not do a thing with them.  Why is that?   Maybe they worked?  if we are presently getting hosed on trade, which apparently we are, then let's try something.

The tariffs that Trump placed on Chinese and a few other countries were bad and Biden was IMO not to repeal them. But these new tariffs aren’t the same- Trump says 20% on all countries which is a whole different deal. But hopefully he’s talked out of it.

As to your first point I don’t think it will look like Poland in 1939 either. But what will it look like? Thats what I don’t know. What does mass deportation mean? If we’re just getting rid of violent felons, which I have no problem with doing, that’s not mass deportation. So what is Trump really talking about and how does it work? 

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

5 minutes ago, Strike said:

Just stop, dude.  I've told you many times in the past how we can get rid of a good chunk of illegals without going all gestapo on them.  You're such a horrible poster. 

Are you in Trump’s ear? Because what you’ve suggested in the past doesn’t match what he’s been saying about this. 

[nobody 2,448]

In his first term he enacted some tax laws that kicked the can down the road to when he thought he wouldn't be president and thus wouldn't be blamed.  I'm worried he's going to enact more punitive tax measures for blue states such as his limitations on housing state tax and mortgage interest deductions, and in 6 years, taxes for everyone are going to go up.

 

[thegeneral 2,458]

16 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Most of you folks are not following the spirit of my intention in this thread.  @thegeneral provided a few good examples:

- Mass deportation

- Elon's streamlining of government (I have concerns here as well)

and there were one or two others.

I put the tag on the thread because I'm not looking for the typical partisan stuff like 

or any other number of posts from folks in this thread that, frankly, disappointed me.

I would like to use this victory as an opportunity to get to a bipartisan vision forward for this county.   

Thanks, Jere. A good thread and I think could spawn off many other good threads. I will do my best to avoid being overly snarky

[Strike 4,732]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

Are you in Trump’s ear? Because what you’ve suggested in the past doesn’t match what he’s been saying about this. 

Jerry has tried to explain it to you in the past but you're apparently incapable of understanding that Trump talks in big picture terms and you have to parse what the actual intent is.  His actions are intended to achieve a specific outcome.  The methodology isn't what's important to him.  So, when they get down to what the actual methodology is it may look markedly different than what he said in a speech, especially since so many of his speeches are off the cuff and not rehearsed over and over like Kamalatoe.  Just like Tariffs.  I will bet you $1000 right now that whatever he ends up doing on Tariffs will not be an across the board 20% Tariff.  If you truly believe that's what he intends to do here's your chance to make an easy grand. 

[jerryskids 6,135]

Here is what I've put in the summary post on the first page so far:

Quote

- Tariffs

- Mass deportation

- Elon streamlining government

- RFK's influence on health agencies

I am surprised the last one hasn't been mentioned yet, I added that.

Feel free to discuss any on these, or introduce a new, rational concern.   

[nobody 2,448]

I'm concerned that he is not a smart person, so we're going to be relying on his appointments to execute his broad policy vision, and he seems to alienate people around him, so the execution of broad policies which are in general good will be disrupted and haphazard as folks get removed or quit halfway through.

[nobody 2,448]

The tariff thing from China has a cap.  At some point, Canada and Mexico will just import it and repackage it as Mexican and Canadian goods.

[Strike 4,732]

Just now, nobody said:

I'm concerned that he is not a smart person, so we're going to be relying on his appointments to execute his broad policy vision, and he seems to alienate people around him, so the execution of broad policies which are in general good will be disrupted and haphazard as folks get removed or quit halfway through.

I disagree that he alienates people around him.  He's had a lot of the same people working for/with him at his company for decades.  He alienated a lot of people in Washington because he didn't know anyone in Washington and chose the wrong people.  I think he's a  lot more educated that he was last time and will pick much better people for his administration. 

As far as not being a smart person, I don't think it's debatable that he IS a smart person.  I don't like the man personally.  I think he's a d*ck.  But that doesn't mean he's not smart and I can acknowledge and respect the strengths of people. 

[thegeneral 2,458]

20 minutes ago, Horseman said:

https://www.sandiegocharterbuscompany.com/

So that part I think is very doable - transporting them somewhere. Busses would be fine, prolly not the best way and I do feel to avoid complete humanitarian shitshow that would also need quite a bit of discussion.

I’m concerned about the rounding up portion. Who, how, what resources etc.

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

3 minutes ago, Strike said:

Jerry has tried to explain it to you in the past but you're apparently incapable of understanding that Trump talks in big picture terms and you have to parse what the actual intent is.  His actions are intended to achieve a specific outcome.  The methodology isn't what's important to him.  So, when they get down to what the actual methodology is it may look markedly different than what he said in a speech, especially since so many of his speeches are off the cuff and not rehearsed over and over like Kamalatoe.  Just like Tariffs.  I will bet you $1000 right now that whatever he ends up doing on Tariffs will not be an across the board 20% Tariff.  If you truly believe that's what he intends to do here's your chance to make an easy grand. 

I’m hoping you’re right. We’ll know soon enough. The tariffs can be done by executive order so if he wants to do 20% or whatever it’s fairly easy. The mass deportations, whatever that means, is a much more involved process. Let’s see how it goes. 

[Strike 4,732]

1 minute ago, The Real timschochet said:

I’m hoping you’re right. We’ll know soon enough. The tariffs can be done by executive order so if he wants to do 20% or whatever it’s fairly easy. The mass deportations, whatever that means, is a much more involved process. Let’s see how it goes. 

Wow, just gonna gloss over my offer to give you $1000?  You don't want it? 

[Horseman 1,983]

7 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Here is what I've put in the summary post on the first page so far:

I am surprised the last one hasn't been mentioned yet, I added that.

Feel free to discuss any on these, or introduce a new, rational concern.   

WTF?

45 minutes ago, Horseman said:

I'll give it a go because it's pretty clear our band of board lefties are struggling with what you're even asking for, even if they were able to articulate.  Heavy emphasis on "potentially" though because as I read his policy, and nothing else, I don't see much a rational human could be concerned about.

#1 - Trump recently came out with a policy to END Gender Affirming Care.  He's going to cut all funding, make it illegal, and set up a victims fund to sue doctors.  He wants to pass a bill that defines only two genders MALE and FEMALE assigned at birth!!!

Why it's a concern:

- my kids have gender dysphoria and I'm afraid they won't be able to be the sex they truly are that makes them happy! 

- only having two genders immediately discriminates against all my friends that are BTQRZ.

- I fear that this will empower hatred towards the alphabet community.

 I don't know why I even try.

[shadrap 163]

5 minutes ago, nobody said:

I'm concerned that he is not a smart person, so we're going to be relying on his appointments to execute his broad policy vision, and he seems to alienate people around him, so the execution of broad policies which are in general good will be disrupted and haphazard as folks get removed or quit halfway through.

be concerned all you want & you are maybe justified in doing so BUT if he can stop this illegal immigration thing I will be happy.  Biden did it for votes.  Trump will reverse that because it is in the best interests of our country.  IMHO

[shadrap 163]

5 minutes ago, Strike said:

I disagree that he alienates people around him.  He's had a lot of the same people working for/with him at his company for decades.  He alienated a lot of people in Washington because he didn't know anyone in Washington and chose the wrong people.  I think he's a  lot more educated that he was last time and will pick much better people for his administration. 

As far as not being a smart person, I don't think it's debatable that he IS a smart person.  I don't like the man personally.  I think he's a d*ck.  But that doesn't mean he's not smart and I can acknowledge and respect the strengths of people. 

agree with all of this.

[Horseman 1,983]

5 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

 The mass deportations, whatever that means, is a much more involved process. 

No it isn't.  Securing our border and our nation is fully on the president and within his control.  

[Strike 4,732]

Just now, Horseman said:

No it isn't.  Securing our border and our nation is fully on the president and within his control.  

Biden unsecured our border in 5 minutes once he was inaugurated.  But Trump isn't allowed to fix that?  Fock that.

[thegeneral 2,458]

@jerryskids

Not sure how to make this not be too ambiguous but the idea that there will be a “lack of guardrails” in this term and I fear Trump isn’t capable of good self control. 

For example the SC has been forced to rule on aspects of cases that he has had brought against him. In my non-lawyer reading they have ruled that Congress is the only body (and voters of course) that can hold the prez accountable. For Congress, I don’t trust either side to do this and I feel this gives the office too much power.

This was always there I suppose but it wasn’t highlighted until Trump.

[nobody 2,448]

15 minutes ago, Strike said:

As far as not being a smart person, I don't think it's debatable that he IS a smart person.  I don't like the man personally.  I think he's a d*ck.  But that doesn't mean he's not smart and I can acknowledge and respect the strengths of people. 

LOL, that dude is dumb as fūck.  Anybody can just spit off broad policy direction.  It takes real talent, intelligence, and skill to execute a vision.  He has none of that.  He's the classic born on 3rd base and thinks he hit a triple guy.

[nobody 2,448]

The border will be secured day 1.  Trump just being president will deter migrants from crossing the border.  

[nobody 2,448]

I'm also concerned that because Trump is so dumb, he tends to get lead around by his ego.  That means he can be manipulated by industry and world leaders that stroke his ego.  All they have to do is say something nice about him and he'll make some "deal" that doesn't really benefit the US, but rather benefits his ego.  

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

26 minutes ago, Strike said:

Wow, just gonna gloss over my offer to give you $1000?  You don't want it? 

If you’re wrong I will lose way more than $1000. This isn’t a game for me. So I really hope you’re right. 

[thegeneral 2,458]

As for Elon’s government cleanup.

Issues I would have are these people while doing a bunch of tedious crap that is cumbersome…the processes got there through years of dealing with tedious, cumbersome crap they needs to be done. 

A quick review and just dumping areas is classic sounds good on paper but unrealistic in real world. 

A review is welcome though and while Elon is a super ballbag weirdo dork he has proven skills being the face of some impressive projects. 

An ancillary problem of just eliminating thousands of jobs is where do these people go for work? Isn’t there something to be gained from paying someone a minimal salary to perform some duties? True it’s a loss as it’s a government job but they are working, they are spending their salaries, contributing back to society, etc. Is private sector just going to suck them all up?

[Strike 4,732]

3 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

If you’re wrong I will lose way more than $1000. This isn’t a game for me. So I really hope you’re right. 

So if I'm wrong you could use that 1k and if I'm right you can afford to pay me 1k.  Why are you avoiding saying yes or no to the bet?  Either accept it or don't.  Quit avoiding answering.

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

1 minute ago, Strike said:

So if I'm wrong you could use that 1k and if I'm right you can afford to pay me 1k.  Why are you avoiding saying yes or no to the bet?  Either accept it or don't.  Quit avoiding answering.

I’m not interested in betting on something I want desperately to lose. So no. 

[nobody 2,448]

2 minutes ago, thegeneral said:

As for Elon’s government cleanup.

Issues I would have are these people while doing a bunch of tedious crap that is cumbersome…the processes got there through years of dealing with tedious, cumbersome crap they needs to be done. 

A quick review and just dumping areas is classic sounds good on paper but unrealistic in real world. 

A review is welcome though and while Elon is a super ballbag weirdo dork he has proven skills being the face of some impressive projects. 

An ancillary problem of just eliminating thousands of jobs is where do these people go for work? Isn’t there something to be gained from paying someone a minimal salary to perform some duties?True it’s a loss as it’s a government job but they are working, they are spending their salaries, contributing back to society, etc. Is private sector just going to suck them all up?

The real problem with government cleanup is that government workers on average are pretty unmotivated and not overly intelligent.  Elon is used to working with highly motivated, highly intelligent leaders.  He ain't going to find those in government jobs.  

[squistion 1,637]

42 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

The tariffs that Trump placed on Chinese and a few other countries were bad and Biden was IMO not to repeal them. But these new tariffs aren’t the same- Trump says 20% on all countries which is a whole different deal. But hopefully he’s talked out of it.

As to your first point I don’t think it will look like Poland in 1939 either. But what will it look like? Thats what I don’t know. What does mass deportation mean? If we’re just getting rid of violent felons, which I have no problem with doing, that’s not mass deportation. So what is Trump really talking about and how does it work? 

Who, in his inner circle, will tell him that he is wrong and try to talk him out of it? Seriously? 

[Frozenbeernuts 1,878]

2 hours ago, IGotWorms said:

I’m reserving judgment to see what he actually does. Based on his first term and who he is as a person I expect chaos and vitriol but I hope I’m proven wrong. Hopefully he goes way lighter on the tariffs then threatened hopefully it works. Hopefully he doesn’t give away fock tons of tax cuts to billionaires who certainly don’t need even more tax cuts. Hopefully we have a real election in four years and Vance or whomever gives way if they lose. I don’t know, I don’t see the point in screaming and crying about every little thing but I’d be lying if I said I was optimistic for the Trump Administration Pt 2

I think he has his stuff together this go around. Even he was shocked he won the first time.

[MDC 6,705]

I worry about Trump himself less than some of the weirdos he’s aligned himself with: conspiracy theorists, racists, Christianist weirdos and hangers on. I think Trump’s first term paved the way for freaks like MTG and we’re already seeing glimmers of the same with RFKJ.

I also worry about Trump inflaming situations with his rhetoric: for example the death threats on FEMA abd bomb threats in Youngstown. 

In the grand scheme I don’t expect him to do much that will impact my life.

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

4 minutes ago, squistion said:

Who, in his inner circle, will tell him that he is wrong and try to talk him out of it? Seriously? 

Elon? He should know better

[Frozenbeernuts 1,878]

Here's one. Trump will remove the ability to aquire American citizenship if someone is born here to illegal aliens. I'm good with it. We need to be selective as a country.

[thegeneral 2,458]

7 minutes ago, nobody said:

The real problem with government cleanup is that government workers on average are pretty unmotivated and not overly intelligent.  Elon is used to working with highly motivated, highly intelligent leaders.  He ain't going to find those in government jobs.  

I mean his team of investigators reviewing will be doing that part, right?

I don’t want to shet on government workers as they do have to deal with all kinds of weird procedures and sure some are totally stagnant some are dumb etc. but many are just doing the job that is a super grind.

That was kind of one of my other points is they have a spot now, they are making a minimal salary, they are spending it, contributing, etc. There are worse alternatives. Also, I certainly don’t want to have to deal with the dude who is responsible for say zoning paperwork on easements.

[The Real timschochet 5,170]

1 minute ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

Here's one. Trump will remove the ability to aquire American citizenship if someone is born here to illegal aliens. I'm good with it. We need to be selective as a country.

That would require a Constitutional amendment. Ain’t gonna happen. 

[Strike 4,732]

1 minute ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

Here's one. Trump will remove the ability to aquire American citizenship if someone is born here to illegal aliens. I'm good with it. We need to be selective as a country.

Trump can't do that.  It's an interpretation of a constitutional amendment.  Now, that interpretation could be changed by the SCOTUS and I would welcome that.  Much like Roe, this SC ruling was always wrong so it would be great if they overturn it.

[Strike 4,732]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

That would require a Constitutional amendment. Ain’t gonna happen. 

No it wouldn't.  It would just require another case to make it to the SCOTUS and for them to interpret the current amendment as it was intended and not how it was interpreted by a previous SCOTUS.

[squistion 1,637]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

Elon? He should know better

And he will stand up to Trump and tell him he is wrong with the tariffs? I doubt that.

[Strike 4,732]

I'm concerned about an increase in unemployment of unemployable non skilled people due to massive layoffs in the Federal Government by Elon's efficiency initiatives.

[thegeneral 2,458]

19 minutes ago, Strike said:

I'm concerned about an increase in unemployment of unemployable non skilled people due to massive layoffs in the Federal Government by Elon's efficiency initiatives.

This is a very legitimate concern!