Trump and The Constitution

[Hardcore troubadour 14,906]

2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Yep. 
https://www.rosenblumlawlv.com/what-miranda-rights/#:~:text=No%2C Miranda Rights apply to everyone in the U.S.%2C not just citizens. This includes non-citizen residents%2C visitors%2C and undocumented immigrants.

 

I asked if they have to have them read to them. The answer is no. X

[The Real timschochet 6,391]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

I asked if they have to have them read to them. The answer is no. X

The answer is yes. 

[The Real timschochet 6,391]

3 minutes ago, Strike said:

I thought we were talking about legal things.  If we're going to include anything illegal as well there's no discussion.  Anyone can do anything illegally, EFFECTIVELY.

In that case the answer is that most gun rights do apply to non-citizens: 

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-nonimmigrant-alien-who-has-been-admitted-united-states-under-nonimmigrant-visa-and

[Hardcore troubadour 14,906]

So, without going any further, we have established that non citizens are not entitled to all of the same constitutional rights as the citizen. Tim is wrong.  XXX

[HellToupee 1,582]

2 hours ago, The Real timschochet said:

No you f@ck off. Number one I don’t know if any of those numbers are true. Number two if they are true then shame on those Presidents. I didn’t like their immigration policies anyhow. Everyone gets due process. 

F’off and do your own research. It’s all out there. And that goes for your little sidekick as well. We had no say in the border being left recklessly open for 4 years. Save the tears

 

https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/speed-over-fairness-deportation-under-obama

Under today's removal system, only one quarter of all people facing expulsion get to present their case before an immigration judge. These judges, employed by the Justice Department, are experts in immigration law. They conduct formal court hearings where they hear live witnesses, review documentary evidence, and evaluate applications for immigration relief.

By contrast, nonjudicial removals are fast-track proceedings wholly controlled by the Department of Homeland Security ("DHS"), sometimes involving only a single border agent who acts as both judge and jury. Those facing nonjudicial removal have no lawyer and no chance to appeal.

The Obama administration has prioritized speed over fairness in the removal system, sacrificing individualized due process in the pursuit of record removal numbers.

A deportation system that herds 75 percent of people through fast-track, streamlined removal is a system devoid of fairness and individualized due process. Nonjudicial removals violate our constitutional tradition and cannot be reconciled with an administration that has repeatedly stated its commitment to immigration reform.

 

 

https://aflcio.org/2016/1/6/obama-administrations-crackdown-immigrants-ignores-due-process-and-creates-communities

The AFL-CIO has consistently urged the Obama administration to designate those fleeing violence in Central America as “refugees,” and to honor its legal commitments to ensure that individuals who are eligible for protective status will not be returned to danger. Instead, the shameful response of our government has been to erode due process protections by expediting legal proceedings and to lock families in remote detention facilities with little access to counsel. 
 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna672636

The report found that in 70 percent of those cases, which are decided by immigration judges, detained migrant families were processed through immigration courts without legal representation

[Strike 5,182]

4 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

In that case the answer is that most gun rights do apply to non-citizens: 

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-nonimmigrant-alien-who-has-been-admitted-united-states-under-nonimmigrant-visa-and

Doesn't apply to illegals.

[The Real timschochet 6,391]

@HellToupee did you bother to read what you posted? Let’s take your last line: processed through immigration courts without legal representation- that’s bad and shame on Obama and the others. But at least they were processed in a court- that’s more than the Trump folks are doing. 

[The Real timschochet 6,391]

2 minutes ago, Strike said:

Doesn't apply to illegals.

It doesn’t say that. 

[EternalShinyAndChrome 3,828]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

@HellToupee did you bother to read what you posted? Let’s take your last line: processed through immigration courts without legal representation- that’s bad and shame on Obama and the others. But at least they were processed in a court- that’s more than the Trump folks are doing. 

The problem for you is that you were not even once protesting and crying about "due process" when Obama or Biden was doing it.  

[The Real timschochet 6,391]

1 minute ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

The problem for you is that you were not even once protesting and crying about "due process" when Obama or Biden was doing it.  

You’re wrong. I certainly did. 

[EternalShinyAndChrome 3,828]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

You’re wrong. I certainly did. 

I'd like to see proof.  But I guarantee you most, if not ALL of your side was not screaming about "due process" when Obama and Biden were doing it.

Which tells everyone that "due process" isn't the issue with you guys.  It's all about Trump and Trump alone.

[Strike 5,182]

2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

It doesn’t say that. 

Yes it does.  You may have to do some research, as I did, but once you understand the terms in the wording it does in fact say that.

[The Psychic Observer 495]

Yes, under President Obama, there were many deportations of undocumented immigrants (often called "illegals" in political discussions, though that term can be seen as dehumanizing). In some cases, deportations happened with limited or no full due process — meaning people were removed without going through a full immigration court hearing.

This mainly happened through programs like:

Expedited removal, which allows immigration officers to deport individuals caught near the border without a hearing if they can't prove they've been in the U.S. for a certain amount of time.

Secure Communities, where local law enforcement shared fingerprints with immigration authorities, leading to quick removals.

Voluntary returns, where people agreed (or were pressured) to leave without going before an immigration judge.

Key point:

While the Constitution generally guarantees due process to everyone inside the U.S. (citizen or not), certain immigration enforcement tactics legally allowed for shortened or minimal procedures, especially for recent arrivals or border arrests.

 

[The Psychic Observer 495]

In Zadvydas v. Davis (2001), Justice Scalia agreed that non-citizens on U.S. soil are protected by the Due Process Clause of the Fifth Amendment.

> “It is well established that the Fifth Amendment entitles aliens to due process of law in deportation proceedings."

[HellToupee 1,582]

12 minutes ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

The problem for you is that you were not even once protesting and crying about "due process" when Obama or Biden was doing it.  

And Clinton did the same thing but OMB

[HellToupee 1,582]

3 minutes ago, The Psychic Observer said:

In Zadvydas v. Davis (2001), Justice Scalia agreed that non-citizens on U.S. soil are protected by the Due Process Clause of the Fifth Amendment.

> “It is well established that the Fifth Amendment entitles aliens to due process of law in deportation proceedings."

Gutter why change accounts from artest and the others

[HellToupee 1,582]

12 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

You’re wrong. I certainly did. 

Sure you did sport. Sure you did

[The Psychic Observer 495]

1 minute ago, HellToupee said:

And Clinton did the same thing but OMB

There is a difference between apprehending people who just crossed the border vs people who have lived here for 10 years

[squistion 1,942]

24 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

You’re wrong. I certainly did. 

To my recollection I thought you did object to Obama not adhering to due process. Maybe with Biden too, but I am not certain of that. 

And I am pretty sure I had an issue with Obama using a drone to kill US born American citizen Anwar al-Awlaki (that thread still might exist if one of the usual suspects wants to take the time to find it, as they seem to love to do to try and prove me wrong.). 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,906]

33 minutes ago, The Psychic Observer said:

There is a difference between apprehending people who just crossed the border vs people who have lived here for 10 years

Besides geography, what? 

[5-Points 3,385]

45 minutes ago, The Psychic Observer said:

There is a difference between apprehending people who just crossed the border vs people who have lived here for 10 years

Yeah, one broke the law briefly while the other has been breaking at least one law for a decade. 

[5-Points 3,385]

A guy who just broke the law should be held accountable. A guy who has gotten away with it for years should get a pass. 

 

[The Psychic Observer 495]

The reason for due process is not to let illegals "get a pass" but rather give them a chance to prove if they actually are illegal.  If someone sneaks over the border and is immediately apprehended, makes no claim to be a citizen, then he can be sent back rather easily.

However is someone is detained who has lived here for years and claims to have a legal stay order then they have a right to due process to make their case.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,906]

1 minute ago, The Psychic Observer said:

The reason for due process is not to let illegals "get a pass" but rather give them a chance to prove if they actually are illegal.  If someone sneaks over the border and is immediately apprehended, makes no claim to be a citizen, then he can be sent back rather easily.

However is someone is detained who has lived here for years and claims to have a legal stay order then they have a right to due process to make their case.

Like a trial? 

[The Psychic Observer 495]

2 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Like a trial? 

Something like that.

[jonmx 2,424]

8 hours ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

Boom!  

F@ck Off, @timschochet, @SaintsInDome2006, @squistion and the rest of you fake outrage mob cultists.,

This is all thst needs to be said.  I am so sick of discussing things with retards who worship actual authoritarianism of the corrupt deep state.  

[squistion 1,942]

48 minutes ago, jonmx said:

This is all thst needs to be said.  I am so sick of discussing things with retards who worship actual authoritarianism of the corrupt deep state.  

Well, if that is the way you feel, why are you still here?

It is not like anyone is forcing you "discussing things with retards"

[jbycho 579]

20 minutes ago, squistion said:

Well, if that is the way you feel, why are you still here?

It is not like anyone is forcing you "discussing things with retards"

At least you admit to being retarded. At least you are not alone. All liberals are. 

[HellToupee 1,582]

1 hour ago, jonmx said:

This is all thst needs to be said.  I am so sick of discussing things with retards who worship actual authoritarianism of the corrupt deep state.  

I agree with this guy   

[jbycho 579]

30 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

I agree with this guy   

#metoo

[Strike 5,182]

On 4/27/2025 at 1:25 PM, Strike said:

Yes it does.  You may have to do some research, as I did, but once you understand the terms in the wording it does in fact say that.

I see @The Real timschochet ran away again after being proven wrong.  He just slinks off in to the shadows. 

[squistion 1,942]

 

[SaintsInDome2006 374]

On 4/27/2025 at 8:03 PM, jonmx said:

This is all thst needs to be said.  I am so sick of discussing things with retards who worship actual authoritarianism of the corrupt deep state.  

Sorry, but don’t you work for the deep state, or have in the past? Bring it up with management.

[jonmx 2,424]

5 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Sorry, but don’t you work for the deep state, or have in the past? Bring it up with management.

The entire federal government is not the deep state.  The deep state are the ones who get us involved in useless war for personal gain, who use the power of government to infiltrated universities, Hollywood, big tech, media to brainwash the masses.  Who have filled the legal system with corrupt judges.  The deep state is not limited to government but include many mega corporations and most of the baning system including the federal reserve and world bank.  They started every war, killed the Kenedy's and MLK, did mind control experiments on citizens.  Their goal is to rule the world through big centralized government, global institutions, big corporations...but you are too fuking dumb to see what is going on 

[jbycho 579]

6 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Sorry, but don’t you work for the deep state, or have in the past? Bring it up with management.

Trump is management. And he's dealing with it.