Labor Department warns that ICE enforcement is driving up food prices

[Voltaire 5,441]

7 hours ago, jonnyutah said:

Of course. Rednecks still prefer privacy when they take a dump. Messicans will just drop it in the field right next to the cantaloupe. 

My preference is the doorway to San Francisco City Hall.

[Voltaire 5,441]

Are there enough American workers in rural areas to provide the farm labor needs? Those small towns in the area around Lake Eufaula in SE Alabama where we stayed for a few days of water recreation on the way back from my daughter's graduation from basic training seemed rather depressed. If farm labor paid a good wage, it would help them a lot it seems to me. Also the ongoing problem of big-Agra farms buying up all the farmland from family farms, not being a farmer myself, nor seeing much about it lately in the news, its hard to gauge how extensive that problem has become.

Anyway, if there is simply not enough domestic labor to go around to perform the work that needs doing, this carveout expansion of H2B visas for farm labor seems the right policy. That said, I'm not sure that artifically lowering the wages of farm labor work is going to do the people in communities like the one I visited in Abbeville, Alabama any good where good paying jobs are already hard to find.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

2 hours ago, Voltaire said:

None of us know fock all about Bolivia's economic recovery plan to comment, but good on Bolivia for finding a useful way forward for them.

Yes, I’m happy for Asunción policy makers.

The USA is not Bolivia. We are the richest nation on Earth. We just *gave Argentina $20 billion.

[The Real timschochet 7,273]

7 hours ago, BunnysBastatrds said:

Pulling off the bandaid ain’t easy 

Yeah you guys really don’t get it. 

Attempting to mass deport all undocumented immigrants isn’t “pulling off the band-aid.” It’s more like trying to pull off your right arm. It won’t work, and if it DID work you’d be far worse than you are now. 

Look you guys can scramble around and try to find justifications (“we’re willing to pay a little more”) or new solutions (“more Americans already here can do the work”) but it’s all pointless. Eventually you will come to the conclusion that you really don’t want to face but that I suspect deep down you already know is true: we need these undocumented immigrants to stay. 

[squistion 2,428]

6 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Yeah you guys really don’t get it. 

Attempting to mass deport all undocumented immigrants isn’t “pulling off the band-aid.” It’s more like trying to pull off your right arm. It won’t work, and if it DID work you’d be far worse than you are now. 

Look you guys can scramble around and try to find justifications (“we’re willing to pay a little more”) or new solutions (“more Americans already here can do the work”) but it’s all pointless. Eventually you will come to the conclusion that you really don’t want to face but that I suspect deep down you already know is true: we need these undocumented immigrants to stay. 

But they (including the unemployed MAGA folks) are not exactly lining up to take the place of migrant workers in the field picking crops at minimum wage.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

Right, it’s not just the “slave wages” it’s the fact no one is filling the jobs at all.

[TBayXXXVII 2,649]

So, what I've learned from this thread is that the Democrat party is STILL pro-slavery, just that now, they just can't be black. 

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

10 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

So, what I've learned from this thread is that the Democrat party is STILL pro-slavery, just that now, they just can't be black. 

I think you’re assuming the people who own the big farms & factories are Democrats. They might be sometimes but usually they’re not. If you left it up to the Dems they’d be paying them a “living wage.”

[seafoam1 3,345]

8 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you’re assuming the people who own the big farms & factories are Democrats. They might be sometimes but usually they’re not. If you left it up to the Dems they’d be paying them a “living wage.”

If democrats are running farms, what are they paying their employees vs. what are conservatives paying? 

Timmy on this site hires illegals and pays them less than a living wage and doesn't give them any benefits and they don't pay taxes.

Where are you getting your information from?

[squistion 2,428]

8 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you’re assuming the people who own the big farms & factories are Democrats. They might be sometimes but usually they’re not.

If you left it up to the Dems they’d be paying them a “living wage.”

True dat! 

[TimHauck 3,231]

20 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you’re assuming the people who own the big farms & factories are Democrats. They might be sometimes but usually they’re not. If you left it up to the Dems they’d be paying them a “living wage.”

Be careful, I tried telling them (may have even been @TBayXXXVII) previously that owners of companies that commonly employ illegals such as in construction and landscaping often lean right but they didn’t believe me

[seafoam1 3,345]

2 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Be careful, I tried telling them (may have even been @TBayXXXVII) previously that owners of companies that commonly employ illegals such as in construction and landscaping often lean right but they didn’t believe me

What are the stats on that? And where did you get them from? 

[Ray_T 779]

23 hours ago, The Real timschochet said:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2025/10/11/immigration-crackdown-food-prices/

Well it’s not like anyone with common sense didn’t already know this. Entirely predictable. 

it was.

its pure market dynamics.     a considerable amount of the labor that was used to harvest food was illegal.

when those people leave (regardless of the reason they leave)  there are consequences:

1) the supply of labor goes down, but the demand for labor remains the same.  so wages do go up.   and some places paid less than minimum wage to these workers which allows them to be uber competitive in the market due to cheap labour.

2) so we remove the cheap labor and replace it with more expensive labor who (in the short term at least) will not be as productive.   it always takes a cerain amount of time for a new employee to become good at their job.   this is no exception.   so in the short term, the work wont be as good, or as fast.   so farmers, food companies etc.  will all feel the pinch financially which results in higher food costs for you, the consumer.

 

for the record, I dont actually take issue with this.  the exploitation of illegal labor at less than market rates has made this sector of the economy profitable even at low food prices.    its not anymore.    so the cost to produce will go up and prices will go up

its that simple.

Take the politics out of it and it is purely a supply and demand story.

the problem with the food companies is it doesnt seem that a lot of americans actually want these jobs.    I guess thats the rub.

in the short term, the easier result was to allow it to happen, and this has been happening since the '70's or likely even before that.

but in the end, I'd guess the cost of labor for most of these companies has likely gone up by at least 10% (probably more)   and with this type of  industry, at least half of your costs are labor.   so anyone trivializing the increase in the price of food isnt living in the real world.        in some cases, the company will absorb some of the cost increases and will face a loss in profitability.   some may even go out of business.... but in most cases the cost increase will be passed on to the consumer.

This is just the way business operates.

[jonnyutah 513]

50 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

So, what I've learned from this thread is that the Democrat party is STILL pro-slavery, just that now, they just can't be black. 

This whole thing really exposes their whole agenda. 

I mean imagine starting this thread, lol. 

"See we told you illegals getting paid slave wages makes harvesting cheaper!"

Lol.

These same idiots will tell us that grocery prices only go higher because of corporate greed when democrats are in power. 

[Alias Detective 1,455]

19 hours ago, jonnyutah said:

Yes what a shocker.

Lol. 

Spend .02 more on lettuce. Save money as a society because we will have fewer e coli outbreaks and our kids will get a better education because so much time  and money wont be wasted teaching idiots from mexico how to read. 

 

ESL.  I mean come the F on.  English as a Second Language is a waste of time, money and energy.

[The Real timschochet 7,273]

1 hour ago, TBayXXXVII said:

So, what I've learned from this thread is that the Democrat party is STILL pro-slavery, just that now, they just can't be black. 

Not at all. 

Minimum wage doesn’t work in certain industries: agriculture, construction, food service. In those industries you have to pay less to survive. By less are we talking about below a living wage? Hardly. If it was swarms of people wouldn’t come here. They come for a better life. They earn less than minimum wage but their children will not. Thats the key. 

Your comments about slavery shows an incredible ignorance of facts and history. Slavery means forced servitude. Chattel slavery, which was practiced in the United States, means that any children born of slaves are also slaves. None of this applies to our current agricultural workers being paid less than minimum wage. 
 

In addition your comments about the Democratic Party are ignorant as well. Though it’s true that, prior to 1916 the Democratic Party was largely conservative (and the Republicans liberal) and it’s also true that the Democrats remained the home of southern racists until around 1964, it is NOT true that the Democrats were ever pro-slavery outside of the Deep South. In fact, it the refusal of southern Democrats in 1860 to unify behind a northern Democrat, Stephen Douglas, with an anti-slavery platform, that allowed Abe Lincoln to get elected and brought about the Civil War. In that war plenty of northern Democrats fought for the Union. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,649]

2 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you’re assuming the people who own the big farms & factories are Democrats. They might be sometimes but usually they’re not. If you left it up to the Dems they’d be paying them a “living wage.”

Nope.  I KNOW FOR A FACT, that the Democrat party is all for keeping illegal immigrants here, while acknowledging, preferring, and condoning them, getting paid less money than they should be. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,649]

1 hour ago, The Real timschochet said:

Not at all. 

Minimum wage doesn’t work in certain industries: agriculture, construction, food service. In those industries you have to pay less to survive. By less are we talking about below a living wage? Hardly. If it was swarms of people wouldn’t come here. They come for a better life. They earn less than minimum wage but their children will not. Thats the key. 

Your comments about slavery shows an incredible ignorance of facts and history. Slavery means forced servitude. Chattel slavery, which was practiced in the United States, means that any children born of slaves are also slaves. None of this applies to our current agricultural workers being paid less than minimum wage. 
 

In addition your comments about the Democratic Party are ignorant as well. Though it’s true that, prior to 1916 the Democratic Party was largely conservative (and the Republicans liberal) and it’s also true that the Democrats remained the home of southern racists until around 1964, it is NOT true that the Democrats were ever pro-slavery outside of the Deep South. In fact, it the refusal of southern Democrats in 1860 to unify behind a northern Democrat, Stephen Douglas, with an anti-slavery platform, that allowed Abe Lincoln to get elected and brought about the Civil War. In that war plenty of northern Democrats fought for the Union. 

Lot of words for saying "you're right, but I'll play word salad games to deflect."

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

We need ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS TO PICK FRUIT AND BERRIES at slave wages. 

Because only ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS CAN DO IT 

@Ron_Artest @The Real timschochet @SaintsInDome2006 @squistion

[seafoam1 3,345]

1 minute ago, Maximum Overkill said:

We need ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT TO PICK FRUIT AND BERRIES at slave wages. 

Because only ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS CAN DO IT 

@Ron_Artest @The Real timschochet @SaintsInDome2006 @squistion

Remember not long ago the liberals cried about living wages? The need to increase minimum wages? Fock all that I guess. 

[easilyscan 992]

4 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

The USA is not Bolivia. We are the richest nation on Earth. We just *gave Argentina $20 billion.

Not sure if you were being sarcastic or not ?

Anyway, are we really the richest nation on earth ?

The United States has the largest national debt in the world in absolute terms, surpassing $37 trillion. However, when debt is measured as a percentage of a nation's economy (debt-to-GDP ratio), other countries like Japan and Italy have higher ratios.

The United States has the highest amount of unfunded liabilities, primarily due to long-term obligations from Social Security and Medicare. Estimates place the total unfunded obligations for the US at over $73 trillion over the next 75 years, though other estimates suggest a total of around $120 trillion when accounting for other pensions and veteran benefits. 

[MDC 7,762]

3 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

So, what I've learned from this thread is that the Democrat party is STILL pro-slavery, just that now, they just can't be black. 

What I’ve learned from Trump is that we can kick all the day workers out AND enjoy low low Day 1 prices.

Ice cream and unicorns for everybody!  

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

3 minutes ago, MDC said:

What I’ve learned from Trump is that we can kick all the day workers out AND enjoy low low Day 1 prices.

Do you want slave labor/cheap blueberries or both? 

You liberals need to make up your minds 

[MDC 7,762]

5 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

Do you want slave labor/cheap blueberries or both? 

You liberals need to make up your minds 

Your Messiah promised Day 1 low prices. Kind of late in the game to tell us prices are actually going up.

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

2 minutes ago, MDC said:

Your Messiah promised Day 1 low prices. Kind of late in the game to tell us prices are actually going up.

What's that got to do with deporting the Berry Pickers? Slave wages? 

[MDC 7,762]

Just now, Maximum Overkill said:

What's that got to do with deporting the Berry Pickers? Slave wages? 

It’s why Trump’s approval rating is crap — 30 points underwater on costs and inflation, oof!

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

1 minute ago, MDC said:

It’s why Trump’s approval rating is crap — 30 points underwater on costs and inflation, oof!

You're not answering the question.

You approve slave wages for ILLEGAL Immigrants? Yes or no. 

It sounds like that's what you want. I'll pay a little more for berries so these people aren't taken advantage of and deported as they should be. 

You??? 

[MDC 7,762]

4 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

You're not answering the question.

You approve slave wages for ILLEGAL Immigrants? Yes or no. 

It sounds like that's what you want. I'll pay a little more for berries so these people aren't taken advantage of and deported as they should be.

You??? 

Too bad Trump never made that argument on the campaign trail. But I guess guys like you have your black jobs back. Thanks for picking berries Jamal!

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

Just now, MDC said:

Too bad Trump never made that argument on the campaign trail. But I guess guys like you have your black jobs back. Thanks for picking berries Jamal!

 Hahaaa, you're totally spun out and won't answer the question because you're racist. You're a typical blue hair, nice job! 

[MDC 7,762]

4 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

 Hahaaa, you're totally spun out and won't answer the question because you're racist. You're a typical blue hair, nice job! 

I won’t answer the question because you’re a worthless troll, in addition to being a trans obsessed weirdo. HTH!

[Maximum Overkill 2,338]

1 hour ago, MDC said:

I won’t answer the question because you’re a worthless troll, in addition to being a trans obsessed weirdo. HTH!

You're from.Fishtown 

[jonnyutah 513]

1 hour ago, MDC said:

Your Messiah promised Day 1 low prices. Kind of late in the game to tell us prices are actually going up.

Lol. Why dont you say it 73 more times? 

[MDC 7,762]

Just now, jonnyutah said:

Lol. Why dont you say it 73 more times? 

Alright, I will!  

[jonnyutah 513]

Next thing you know they will tell us trump is implementing tariffs without telling us, lol.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

2 hours ago, Maximum Overkill said:

We need ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS TO PICK FRUIT AND BERRIES at slave wages. 

Because only ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS CAN DO IT 

I hear you - I do - but it’s not happening. Shockingly Americans aren’t dropping everything to go pick grapefruits & almonds. And btw it’s not that easy, there’s a lot of skill to it. - But here’s what is happening, countries that we used to sell to are just buying less or just not buying at all. We are the capitalists. Us. We built the system and we are completely screwing ourselves out of what we built.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

2 hours ago, easilyscan said:

Not sure if you were being sarcastic or not ?

Anyway, are we really the richest nation on earth ?

The United States has the largest national debt in the world in absolute terms, surpassing $37 trillion. However, when debt is measured as a percentage of a nation's economy (debt-to-GDP ratio), other countries like Japan and Italy have higher ratios.

The United States has the highest amount of unfunded liabilities, primarily due to long-term obligations from Social Security and Medicare. Estimates place the total unfunded obligations for the US at over $73 trillion over the next 75 years, though other estimates suggest a total of around $120 trillion when accounting for other pensions and veteran benefits. 

It’s just getting worse this way. Our cost of debt has skyrocketed and now we’re paying welfare (cough, subsidies) to our farmers to cover up the costs of this Great Leap Forward.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

14 minutes ago, jonnyutah said:

Next thing you know they will tell us trump is implementing tariffs without telling us, lol.

This I agree with. People bought this bullshit sandwich & gobbled it up whole.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

2 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Nope.  I KNOW FOR A FACT, that the Democrat party is all for keeping illegal immigrants here, while acknowledging, preferring, and condoning them, getting paid less money than they should be. 

Do you remember the illegal alien who murdered that poor girl in Iowa? The plant he was working at was the facility of a major GOP donor. What’s more is he played fast & loose with the immigration check platform he used. I’m guessing that’s the case with a lot of the truly awful, horrific cases we read about with the alien criminals. But those are really exceptions. The factories & Big Ag farms where these people work are generally GOP donor owned.

And please everyone with the harrumphing - do you have family & neighbors shopping at WalMart, Target, & big box groceries? They buy from people who employ these people. You mean what you say? Go shop organic with the hippy progressives who truck this stuff from a couple counties away. Go to the farmers markets & stock up and Buy American. Sure you’ll pay more but it will be fresh, American & extra-expensive.

[TimHauck 3,231]

11 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I hear you - I do - but it’s not happening. Shockingly Americans aren’t dropping everything to go pick grapefruits & almonds. And btw it’s not that easy, there’s a lot of skill to it. - But here’s what is happening, countries that we used to sell to are just buying less or just not buying at all. We are the capitalists. Us. We built the system and we are completely screwing ourselves out of what we built.

I’m no agricultural expert, is it even that common for illegal farm workers to get less than minimum wage?  I would’ve figured they typically got something like $15-$20/hour, which to your point is still probably not enough for many of the locals to do it.

[SaintsInDome2006 561]

5 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I’m no agricultural expert, is it even that common for illegal farm workers to get less than minimum wage?  I would’ve figured they typically got something like $15-$20/hour, which to your point is still probably not enough for many of the locals to do it.

I agree. I think there’s a premise they either 1. Don’t have work permits or 2. They get paid less than minimum wage. I’ll add that my understanding frequently these people have taxes taken out out heir paycheck. It’s a complex subject.