dogcows 1,435 Posted January 5 4 minutes ago, supermike80 said: For focks sake...Already discussed this. It's NOT THE SAME THING as the video those TDSers posted. It's context and it was a bad idea. jesus. It's different because Hegseth has amazing hair and Kelly is bald. It's SOOOO DIFFERENT! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
supermike80 2,187 Posted January 5 1 minute ago, SaintsInDome2006 said: Thanks for pointing this out. So what illegal scenario do you think Hegseth was referring to in 2016? Absolutely no idea. nor is it in any way relevant to this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 5 6 minutes ago, supermike80 said: Absolutely no idea. nor is it in any way relevant to this. Sorry, just trying to understand - why do you say it’s different then? Because the words are arranged differently? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
supermike80 2,187 Posted January 5 2 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said: Sorry, just trying to understand - why do you say it’s different then? Because the words are arranged differently? Watch the video, review the quote I provided. this was simply an attempt to undermine the military chain of command. Plain and simple. They didn't like what they were seeing so made this, which comes off as an appeal to openly defy the orders given to them. Every person in the military knows they do not have to follow illegal orders(on paper) so there was no need for this video. It seriously screams of sedition. I wouldn't go so far as to call it that, but it comes off that way. Again, Kelly isn't being charged with anything.....Just going to have to deal with potential military punishment. Oh well, that's what you get when you try to pull this crap. I don't like it one bit. And again, if you don't think it was driven by Trump hatred(TDS) then you are simply not paying attention. They knew exactly what they were doing when they did this crap. And yeah, if this happened when Biden was in office, I wouldn't like it either. At all Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 5 4 minutes ago, supermike80 said: Watch the video, review the quote I provided. this was simply an attempt to undermine the military chain of command. Plain and simple. They didn't like what they were seeing so made this, which comes off as an appeal to openly defy the orders given to them. Every person in the military knows they do not have to follow illegal orders(on paper) so there was no need for this video. It seriously screams of sedition. I wouldn't go so far as to call it that, but it comes off that way. Again, Kelly isn't being charged with anything.....Just going to have to deal with potential military punishment. Oh well, that's what you get when you try to pull this crap. I don't like it one bit. And again, if you don't think it was driven by Trump hatred(TDS) then you are simply not paying attention. They knew exactly what they were doing when they did this crap. And yeah, if this happened when Biden was in office, I wouldn't like it either. At all Your point above - I bolded it - resolves this. Exactly right, because Hegseth’s JAG prosecution would’ve had to have argued that his comments reiterating the UCMJ violated the UCMJ, which is nonsensical. If there was so much of a remote chance of showing sedition Hegseth would’ve pushed it through. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
supermike80 2,187 Posted January 5 1 minute ago, SaintsInDome2006 said: Your point above - I bolded it - resolves this. Exactly right, because Hegseth’s JAG prosecution would’ve had to have argued that his comments reiterating the UCMJ violated the UCMJ, which is nonsensical. If there was so much of a remote chance of showing sedition Hegseth would’ve pushed it through. I agree and I said it earlier. No crime here. So no criminal charges. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dogcows 1,435 Posted January 5 27 minutes ago, supermike80 said: Watch the video, review the quote I provided. this was simply an attempt to undermine the military chain of command. Plain and simple. They didn't like what they were seeing so made this, which comes off as an appeal to openly defy the orders given to them. Every person in the military knows they do not have to follow illegal orders(on paper) so there was no need for this video. It seriously screams of sedition. I wouldn't go so far as to call it that, but it comes off that way. Again, Kelly isn't being charged with anything.....Just going to have to deal with potential military punishment. Oh well, that's what you get when you try to pull this crap. I don't like it one bit. And again, if you don't think it was driven by Trump hatred(TDS) then you are simply not paying attention. They knew exactly what they were doing when they did this crap. And yeah, if this happened when Biden was in office, I wouldn't like it either. At all I don’t want to be like Horseman, but seriously… Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tree of Knowledge 2,300 Posted January 5 Senator Dobby knew exactly what he was saying and implying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 16,229 Posted January 5 1 hour ago, SaintsInDome2006 said: >>> In 2016, as then-presidential candidate Donald Trump vowed that US troops would carry out even his most extreme battlefield orders as commander in chief — some of which former military leaders said would be illegal — Pete Hegseth warned that service members had a duty to refuse unlawful orders from a potential President Trump. “You’re not just gonna follow that order if it’s unlawful,” Hegseth said in a March 2016 appearance on “Fox & Friends,” referring to veterans he spoke with. “The military’s not gonna follow illegal orders,” Hegseth said of Trump in another March appearance on Fox Business. A Fox News contributor at the time, Hegseth echoed similar sentiments during a speaking appearance a month later, saying the US military “won’t follow unlawful orders from their commander in chief,” in previously unreported comments unearthed exclusively by CNN’s KFile.<< CNN Everyone in the military is taught you don’t obey unlawful orders. It’s one of the first things. So what’s your point here? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 5 2 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said: Clinton, Bush, Trump, Biden. All draft dodgers. It’s like Dogcows was born yesterday. What gets me about this list is the opponents: - Bush Sr. - hero - Dole - hero - Gore (arguably a push with Bush Jr in TX NG, but Gore did serve in the Army & in Vietnam) - McCain - hero Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dogcows 1,435 Posted January 5 Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said: What gets me about this list is the opponents: - Bush Sr. - hero - Dole - hero - Gore (arguably a push with Bush Jr in TX NG, but Gore did serve in the Army & in Vietnam) - McCain - hero Most Americans pay lip service to supporting the troops but they don’t actually give a . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 5 5 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said: Everyone in the military is taught you don’t obey unlawful orders. It’s one of the first things. So what’s your point here? My point is Hegseth said that exact same thing, & he didn’t even have the Debate Clause to lean on, he was just a tatted up newstainment talking head. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 16,229 Posted January 5 5 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said: My point is Hegseth said that exact same thing, & he didn’t even have the Debate Clause to lean on, he was just a tatted up newstainment talking head. It’s not the same. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 5 Just now, Hardcore troubadour said: It’s not the same. Yeah I heard Mike say the same, but then he & I agreed that if they aren’t really the same then Hegseth would’ve brought a court martial proceeding. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dogcows 1,435 Posted January 6 This pretty much proves Hegseth is giving illegal orders. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maximum Overkill 2,713 Posted January 6 22 minutes ago, dogcows said: This pretty much proves Hegseth is giving illegal orders. Got e'm now Cuzzin! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 3,520 Posted January 6 19 hours ago, Strike said: Agreed. Kelly and anyone like him should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Telling people not to follow illegal orders is illegal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SaintsInDome2006 882 Posted January 8 The Military Isn’t MAGA ~~~ The Trump administration attempts to silence veterans. >> Mark Kelly will probably be fine. The senator and Navy veteran isn’t likely to be cowed by Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth’s lawless attempt to silence him by seeking to demote him post-retirement. “It’s dead on arrival,” Gene Fidell, an expert on the Uniform Code of Military Justice who teaches at Yale Law, told me. “If this ever gets in front of a judge, the judge is going to say, ‘F¥ck you.’”<< Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seafoam1 3,585 Posted January 8 On 1/6/2026 at 7:50 AM, TimHauck said: Telling people not to follow illegal orders is illegal? You live that life. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Honcho 5,576 Posted 11 hours ago Sen. Mark Kelly files lawsuit alleging Hegseth violated his rights with push for punishment over illegal orders video Lawyers for Sen. Mark Kelly filed a lawsuit Monday seeking to block Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth’s move to cut Kelly’s retirement pay and reduce his rank in response to Kelly’s urging of US service members to refuse illegal orders. The lawsuit argues punishing Kelly violates the First Amendment and will have a chilling effect on legislative oversight. “If permitted to stand, the Secretary’s censure and the grade-determination proceedings that he has directed will inflict immediate and irreparable harm,” the lawsuit says. “The censure, the grade-reduction process, and its inevitable outcome impose official punishment for protected speech, chill legislative oversight, and threaten reductions in rank and pay.” 3 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 3,520 Posted 3 hours ago On 1/5/2026 at 12:02 PM, Strike said: Agreed. Kelly and anyone like him should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. On 1/6/2026 at 7:50 AM, TimHauck said: Telling people not to follow illegal orders is illegal? Bump for @Strike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 8,256 Posted 2 hours ago On 1/7/2026 at 9:25 PM, SaintsInDome2006 said: The Military Isn’t MAGA ~~~ The Trump administration attempts to silence veterans. >> Mark Kelly will probably be fine. The senator and Navy veteran isn’t likely to be cowed by Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth’s lawless attempt to silence him by seeking to demote him post-retirement. “It’s dead on arrival,” Gene Fidell, an expert on the Uniform Code of Military Justice who teaches at Yale Law, told me. “If this ever gets in front of a judge, the judge is going to say, ‘F¥ck you.’”<< I wonder how much $ the American taxpayer is spending on DOJ’s baseless lawfare? Not to mention the dozens of lawsuits against the admin from states and institutions based on their legally questionable actions. 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
