Bobby Abreu Should be in the Hall of Fame. Change my Mind

[TimHauck 3,399]

One of the most under-rated players ever.

The ironic thing IMO is Philly fans would often criticize him for "looking for a walk instead of a hit."   But if he had converted 530 of his 1476 walks into hits he would have gotten 3,000 hits and been a lock

 

[edjr 7,031]

   Why not,  Ozzie Smith,  Harold Baines and Bert Blyleven are in and Clemens and Bonds are not.

Who gives a fock who they let in?

[Twinsdad 66]

IF he converted 530 of his 1476 walks into HRs he would be the all-time home run leader.

BUT...guess what, he didn't.

 

if ifs and buts were candy and nuts....

[Hawkeye21 2,457]

No

[posty 2,848]

Nope...

[edjr 7,031]

you've never been right before when you post here, why start now?

[TimHauck 3,399]

46 minutes ago, Twinsdad said:

IF he converted 530 of his 1476 walks into HRs he would be the all-time home run leader.

BUT...guess what, he didn't.

 

if ifs and buts were candy and nuts....

a single is a lot different than a HR...

[TimHauck 3,399]

Just now, edjr said:

you've never been right before when you post here, why start now?

I was right (and you were wrong) that the FHA loan qualification requirements didn't change

[Hardcore troubadour 16,020]

Very good player.  Sometimes those guys get in, sometimes the don’t. Kirby Puckett and Don Mattingly have very similar numbers. KP first ballot, DM never getting in.  And that’s ok. Post season should count when judging a players career.  

[Twinsdad 66]

17 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

a single is a lot different than a HR...

ok then, but for him to convert those walks into singles, he'd have to hit .360 for those at bats.....he's a lifetime .291 hitter.   So your reach to 3,000 is just as absurd as my reach to them being homeruns.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

no, and neither should half the people in there

but I would say if Baines is why not Abreu

the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in

they have already let in plenty of juicers, so they are total hypocrites

 

[Hardcore troubadour 16,020]

8 minutes ago, Twinsdad said:

ok then, but for him to convert those walks into singles, he'd have to hit .360 for those at bats.....he's a lifetime .291 hitter.   So your reach to 3,000 is just as absurd as my reach to them being homeruns.

[zsasz 392]

Nah man.  Minimal black ink.  Never above 10th in MVP voting. Never led his league in BA/OBP/OBS/HRs etc. 30HRs in a season once.

 

He was a good player.....but he's not HOF material. 

 

ETA: None of his player comps are in the HOF...AND he doesn't even have the support of his hometown(PHI) sports writers.  There weren't many who liked him much.  

[League Champion 1,926]

1 hour ago, TimHauck said:

One of the most under-rated players ever.

The ironic thing IMO is Philly fans would often criticize him for "looking for a walk instead of a hit." 

I agree but I don't think he's a Hall of Famer,  very nice player though. He was very frustrating in the fact that he he'd be looking for a walk with 2 outs and a runner on third. It was more of his timing of looking for a walk. Sometimes you just need a hit. 

 

[posty 2,848]

1 hour ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in

BINGO!!!

[League Champion 1,926]

And especially Pete Rose 

[iam90sbaby 2,727]

Did he wear metal helmets too?

[posty 2,848]

1 minute ago, League Champion said:

And especially Pete Rose 

Nope...  He should only get in after Joe Jackson gets in and after he has been dead for as long as Jackson was before he got in (if he ever does)...

[League Champion 1,926]

Just now, posty said:

Nope...  He should only get in after Joe Jackson gets in and after he has been dead for as long as Jackson was before he got in (if he ever does)...

Pete got caught as a coach, not a player. 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

6 minutes ago, League Champion said:

And especially Pete Rose 

Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute  doush

[League Champion 1,926]

Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute  

Apparently he never bet against his team though. 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

3 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Apparently he never bet against his team though. 

You don’t have any idea how insider gambling works do you? I’ve been in that industry for 25 years and know people who had players on the take 

it goes like this

pete bets on reds to win. Bookie he bets with loads up cause he knows rose is gonna go all out to win

pete doesn’t bet on reds to win what does that tell the bookies to do

jose rijo talked a lot about his usage in games 

[League Champion 1,926]

2 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

You don’t have any idea how insider gambling works do you? 

Jesus, calm down. Sorry I'm not a degenerate. 

[TimHauck 3,399]

1 hour ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

no, and neither should half the people in there

but I would say if Baines is why not Abreu

the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in

they have already let in plenty of juicers, so they are total hypocrites

 

I’m of the opinion that Bonds and Clemens should be in because they would’ve been HoF’ers without the roids. McGwire and Sosa wouldn’t have been, so I’m OK leaving them out.

I think that’s kinda part of the argument for Abreu too.  If you take out the juicers from his era he looks a lot better.

[posty 2,848]

10 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute  doush

You got that right, Pete Rose is a huge douche...

[League Champion 1,926]

Just now, posty said:

You got that right, Pete Rose is a huge douche...

No doubt, but a hell of a ball player. 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

5 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Jesus, calm down. Sorry I'm not a degenerate. 

I wasn’t calling you out. I went on to explain bro reread 

[League Champion 1,926]

Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

I wasn’t calling you out. I went on to explain bro reread 

No worries, I gotcha 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

4 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I’m of the opinion that Bonds and Clemens should be in because they would’ve been HoF’ers without the roids. McGwire and Sosa wouldn’t have been, so I’m OK leaving them out.

I think that’s kinda part of the argument for Abreu too.  If you take out the juicers from his era he looks a lot better.

Maybe. This is true. But you got a couple guys in like sosa and McGwire. Bagwell and piazza I don’t know if they are hof without juice 

[League Champion 1,926]

If Abreu is a Hall of Famer then there's tons of others who are deserving as well. How many people do we need in the Hall? 

[BufordT 444]

You got me to look at his career stats.  Better than I thought

He had 10 seasons with an OBP of .400 or better and 2 more at .390+ with a career OBP of .395.  Not too shabby.

He had 8 seasons with 100+ runs scored and 3 more seasons with 90+ runs scored.  Not too shabby

He had 8 seasons with 100+ RBI's.  

14 seasons with 20+ SB's

He did strike out a lot for someone who didn't hit a lot of HR's

Surprised he only has 1 gold glove but he was a plus outfielder defensively with a good arm.

All that said.  Not quite a HOFer in my book but better than some of the schlubbs already in there.

 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

1 minute ago, League Champion said:

If Abreu is a Hall of Famer then there's tons of others who are deserving as well. How many people do we need in the Hall? 

I think I’d eliminate at least half of the hall of good to decent 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

2 minutes ago, BufordT said:

You got me to look at his career stats.  Better than I thought

He had 10 seasons with an OBP of .400 or better and 2 more at .390+ with a career OBP of .395.  Not too shabby.

He had 8 seasons with 100+ runs scored and 3 more seasons with 90+ runs scored.  Not too shabby

He had 8 seasons with 100+ RBI's.  

14 seasons with 20+ SB's

He did strike out a lot for someone who didn't hit a lot of HR's

Surprised he only has 1 gold glove but he was a plus outfielder defensively with a good arm.

All that said.  Not quite a HOFer in my book but better than some of the schlubbs already in there.

 

He’s a lessor tim Raines who I don’t think is deserving 

[League Champion 1,926]

Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

I think I’d eliminate at least half of the hall of good to decent 

I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

2 minutes ago, League Champion said:

I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? 

I have the strictest guideline for the hof of anyone. 
 

I think you should get one vote after 5 years and require 90% to get in. If you get 75% you get a second shot the following year. 
 

however for those who have votes. If a player gets 90% and you voted no. Like these holier than thou reporters do you lose your vote for 5 years since clearly you have no clue anyways 

[BufordT 444]

5 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

He’s a lessor tim Raines who I don’t think is deserving 

Too me, Raines had 2 careers.  Before the age of 30 then after the age of 30.

Agree. Shouldn't be in.

[TimHauck 3,399]

8 minutes ago, League Champion said:

I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? 

I assume you're a Phillies fan.   What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases?  I'm probably biased as Abreu was my favorite player but I'd take Abreu over both of them.   The only advantage they have over Abreu is better defense (and Abreu was an OF'er which where the competition is more stiff), and Rollins had one MVP year.  Saw Jayson Stark voted for both Rolen and Rollins, but not Abreu, which was part of my motivation for this thread.

 

 

 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,579]

4 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I assume you're a Phillies fan.   What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases?  I'm probably biased as Abreu was my favorite player but I'd take Abreu over both of them.   The only advantage they have over Abreu is better defense (and Abreu was an OF'er which where the competition is more stiff), and Rollins had one MVP year.  Saw Jayson Stark voted for both Rolen and Rollins, but not Abreu, which was part of my motivation for this thread.

 

 

 

Easy no to all 3

i think you need to be at least top 2 at your position for a decade to be considered 

[League Champion 1,926]

6 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases? 

I love Rollins, not a Hall of Famer but a clutch player who I always enjoyed. 

I hate Scott Rolen (not a Hall of Famer). He was such a d-bag that his teammates, fans and probably his own Wife hated him. 

Chase Utley, now I'm listening 

[TimHauck 3,399]

9 minutes ago, League Champion said:

I love Rollins, not a Hall of Famer but a clutch player who I always enjoyed. 

I hate Scott Rolen (not a Hall of Famer). He was such a d-bag that his teammates, fans and probably his own Wife hated him. 

Chase Utley, now I'm listening 

Fair enough.   I did see this on Rollins which was interesting: