Oberlin College - Mao would be so proud

[squistion 1,952]

14 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You think it’s ok that men should be allowed to shower with women at school. High school too. 

No, I don't. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

3 minutes ago, squistion said:

No, I don't. 

You don’t support gender affirming care? 

[Strike 5,186]

7 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I will read more. As I mentioned I’ve never heard of this story before. If you’re right then that’s awful, and would probably end my admiration for the college. 

You need to quit with the IF.  If anything I'm underdescribing their disgusting behavior. 

[jerryskids 6,565]

4 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Or perhaps to get a first rate education? 

Note that I edited my post since you replied:

Quote

ETA: and (3) so those parents can virtue signal to their other wealthy parent friends that they sent their kids to an appropriate school. 

I'm confident that they presume the education is first rate, since they are paying $70K/year so their kid can get a degree in Proust's Impact on French Literature.  But it's not a driving factor.  

I'm a member of the Phoenix Ivy Council, which actually includes a bunch of other expensive private schools:

Quote

Phoenix Ivy Council Alumni Clubs

Amherst, Barnard, Bates, Bowdoin, Brown, Bryn Mawr, University of Chicago, Colby, Columbia, Connecticut College, Cornell, Dartmouth, Hamilton, Harvard, Haverford, Middlebury, MIT, Mount Holyoke, Northwestern, University of Pennsylvania, Princeton, Smith, Stanford, Swarthmore, Trinity, Tufts, Vassar, Washington University in St. Louis, Wellesley, Wesleyan, Williams, and Yale

I'm actually surprised that Oberlin is not on this list.  Anyway, my wife went to Michigan which is public so it will never be accepted into this elite group, even though it is a pretty good school.

[squistion 1,952]

3 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You don’t support gender affirming care? 

Supporting gender affirming care means supporting men showering with women at school?

[The Real timschochet 6,416]

4 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Note that I edited my post since you replied:

I'm confident that they presume the education is first rate, since they are paying $70K/year so their kid can get a degree in Proust's Impact on French Literature.  But it's not a driving factor.  

I'm a member of the Phoenix Ivy Council, which actually includes a bunch of other expensive private schools:

I'm actually surprised that Oberlin is not on this list.  Anyway, my wife went to Michigan which is public so it will never be accepted into this elite group, even though it is a pretty good school.

I sent my kids to a pretty conservative school (Chapman University, where until recently, John Eastman was the Dean of Law) because it seemed like a good place to get an education. That’s really what I care about. I don’t think too many parents have different motives but I guess I could be wrong, 

[seafoam1 2,801]

14 minutes ago, squistion said:

Supporting gender affirming care means supporting men showering with women at school?

Yes. 

[squistion 1,952]

18 minutes ago, seafoam1 said:

Yes. 

I guess you don't know what gender affirming care is or you wouldn't make such an ignorant statement. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

37 minutes ago, squistion said:

Supporting gender affirming care means supporting men showering with women at school?

Yes

[seafoam1 2,801]

1 minute ago, squistion said:

I guess you don't know what gender affirming care is or you wouldn't make such an ignorant statement. 

I guess your gender affirming therapy is brainwashing you swimmingly. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

2 minutes ago, squistion said:

I guess you don't know what gender affirming care is or you wouldn't make such an ignorant statement. 

Are trans women women? 

[jonnyutah 248]

13 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You think men can menstruate, so what you have to say on these matters has to have that taken into account. 

Let's not forget he thinks that if a 13 year old has the body of a 20 year old it changes the game. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

2 minutes ago, jonnyutah said:

Let's not forget he thinks that if a 13 year old has the body of a 20 year old it changes the game. 

That too.  Dismissed. 

[GutterBoy 2,898]

Would you focking dopes stop lying and telling everyone here what they think.  The schtick is old, enough.  Act like focking grown men for once in your lives.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

3 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

Would you focking dopes stop lying and telling everyone here what they think.  The schtick is old, enough.  Act like focking grown men for once in your lives.

You mean repeating what they have said or support. 

[seafoam1 2,801]

8 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

Would you focking dopes stop lying and telling everyone here what they think.  The schtick is old, enough.  Act like focking grown men for once in your lives.

The oompa loompa has spoken. 

[GutterBoy 2,898]

6 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You mean repeating what they have said or support. 

Link to his quote or STFU.

[Dizkneelande 1,085]

1 hour ago, Strike said:

You need to quit with the IF.  If anything I'm underdescribing their disgusting behavior. 

People like Tim fail to accept that this isn’t a fringe case and that all of our institutions have adopted this perverse ideology. 

[jonnyutah 248]

26 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

Link to his quote or STFU.

His "crime" was to have sex with a promiscuous 13 year old with the body of a 20 year old. I don't approve of such behavior, but it's hardly worth lifelong comdemnafion.

 

Now I am sure you will defend it since he is on your team, but preemptively, you can piss right off. 

 

Guy even put quotes around crime ffs. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

30 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

Link to his quote or STFU.

If you support gender affirming care you believe that trans women are women.  Learn to put two and two together.  Then stfu.  

[squistion 1,952]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Yes

No, it isn't, look up any definition of gender affirmiing care and none talk about men showering with women.

https://www.aamc.org/news/what-gender-affirming-care-your-questions-answered

What is gender-affirming care?

Gender-affirming care, as defined by the World Health Organization, encompasses a range of social, psychological, behavioral, and medical interventions “designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity” when it conflicts with the gender they were assigned at birth. The interventions help transgender people align various aspects of their lives — emotional, interpersonal, and biological — with their gender identity. As noted by the American Psychiatric Association (APA), that identity can run anywhere along a continuum that includes man, woman, a combination of those, neither of those, and fluid.

The interventions fall along a continuum as well, from counseling to changes in social expression to medications (such as hormone therapy). For children in particular, the timing of the interventions is based on several factors, including cognitive and physical development as well as parental consent. Surgery, including to reduce a person’s Adam’s Apple, or to align their chest or genitalia with their gender identity, is rarely provided to people under 18.

[Fireballer 2,639]

5 minutes ago, squistion said:

No, it isn't, look up any definition of gender affirmiing care and none talk about men showering with women.

https://www.aamc.org/news/what-gender-affirming-care-your-questions-answered

What is gender-affirming care?

Gender-affirming care, as defined by the World Health Organization, encompasses a range of social, psychological, behavioral, and medical interventions “designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity” when it conflicts with the gender they were assigned at birth. The interventions help transgender people align various aspects of their lives — emotional, interpersonal, and biological — with their gender identity. As noted by the American Psychiatric Association (APA), that identity can run anywhere along a continuum that includes man, woman, a combination of those, neither of those, and fluid.

The interventions fall along a continuum as well, from counseling to changes in social expression to medications (such as hormone therapy). For children in particular, the timing of the interventions is based on several factors, including cognitive and physical development as well as parental consent. Surgery, including to reduce a person’s Adam’s Apple, or to align their chest or genitalia with their gender identity, is rarely provided to people under 18.

So what happens with locker room facilities when a man’s identity is “affirmed” as being a woman?  You do know Lia Thomas swung  his c0ck around real women in the locker room, right?  Gender affirming care supports biological men being in women’s locker rooms.

[Strike 5,186]

30 minutes ago, jonnyutah said:

His "crime" was to have sex with a promiscuous 13 year old with the body of a 20 year old. I don't approve of such behavior, but it's hardly worth lifelong comdemnafion.

 

Now I am sure you will defend it since he is on your team, but preemptively, you can piss right off. 

 

Guy even put quotes around crime ffs. 

Wait!!  I thought Tim has said he immediately changed his stance on Polanski.  Sure doesn't sound like it.  God he looks bad in that thread.  And in that thread he says he has made the exact same point in numerous threads.  So Tim admits he thinks it's ok for a 44 year old man to drug and rape a 13 year old. 

[jerryskids 6,565]

2 hours ago, The Real timschochet said:

I sent my kids to a pretty conservative school (Chapman University, where until recently, John Eastman was the Dean of Law) because it seemed like a good place to get an education. That’s really what I care about. I don’t think too many parents have different motives but I guess I could be wrong, 

Look, I'm not challenging your personal decision on schools for your kids, I'm confident you did what you thought best.  I'm not familiar with Chapman so have no opinion on it.  I also know that Cali has a much different dynamic for universities than AZ -- here if you stay in state you basically have 4 choices:  ASU, UofA (comparable), NAU (granolas) are the public schools, and Grand Canyon is a private Christian university in Phoenix getting some steam. In Cali you've got a ton of choices including school sizes (the AZ ones are all degrees of large), but the UC and CSU schools are fairly exclusive (and expensive I believe, even in state).  

Also, if you look at that list I provided, despite being in AZ, I believe Stanford is the only school west of the central time zone.  In general we westerners aren't considered blue blood enough, but I suspect Stanford had too many cross pollinations with graduates from places like Harvard and Yale to be ignored.

All 3 of my kids ended up going to ASU; I'll skip the details of why unless you are interested.  When I've mentioned this at Ivy events, people looked at me like I have 3 eyes.  In that crowd you get introduced as follows:  "Jerry, I'd like you to meet Biff, Harvard undergrad and Boudin MBA."  Also my anecdotal observation was that a lot of the wives/moms came from the non-actual Ivies in that list, and married an Ivy.  

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

1 hour ago, squistion said:

No, it isn't, look up any definition of gender affirmiing care and none talk about men showering with women.

https://www.aamc.org/news/what-gender-affirming-care-your-questions-answered

What is gender-affirming care?

Gender-affirming care, as defined by the World Health Organization, encompasses a range of social, psychological, behavioral, and medical interventions “designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity” when it conflicts with the gender they were assigned at birth. The interventions help transgender people align various aspects of their lives — emotional, interpersonal, and biological — with their gender identity. As noted by the American Psychiatric Association (APA), that identity can run anywhere along a continuum that includes man, woman, a combination of those, neither of those, and fluid.

The interventions fall along a continuum as well, from counseling to changes in social expression to medications (such as hormone therapy). For children in particular, the timing of the interventions is based on several factors, including cognitive and physical development as well as parental consent. Surgery, including to reduce a person’s Adam’s Apple, or to align their chest or genitalia with their gender identity, is rarely provided to people under 18.

So if you’re affirming their gender identity, acknowledging that they are women, why wouldn’t they be allowed to shower with women? 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

57 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

So what happens with locker room facilities when a man’s identity is “affirmed” as being a woman?  You do know Lia Thomas swung  his c0ck around real women in the locker room, right?  Gender affirming care supports biological men being in women’s locker rooms.

They support gender affirming care. Just not the affirming part I guess. What can you do with these idiots? 

[jonnyutah 248]

1 hour ago, Strike said:

Wait!!  I thought Tim has said he immediately changed his stance on Polanski.  Sure doesn't sound like it.  God he looks bad in that thread.  And in that thread he says he has made the exact same point in numerous threads.  So Tim admits he thinks it's ok for a 44 year old man to drug and rape a 13 year old. 

He claims he had wrong info, lol.

 

Sorry. No way to backtrack from that post. He had the info and didn't think it was a big deal. 

 

[squistion 1,952]

1 hour ago, Fireballer said:

So what happens with locker room facilities when a man’s identity is “affirmed” as being a woman?  You do know Lia Thomas swung  his c0ck around real women in the locker room, right?  Gender affirming care supports biological men being in women’s locker rooms.

By definition that is not gender affirming care.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

1 minute ago, squistion said:

By definition that is not gender affirming care.

Affirming someone’s gender isn’t gender affirming care. Are you from New Jersey? 

[The Real timschochet 6,416]

1 hour ago, jerryskids said:

Look, I'm not challenging your personal decision on schools for your kids, I'm confident you did what you thought best.  I'm not familiar with Chapman so have no opinion on it.  I also know that Cali has a much different dynamic for universities than AZ -- here if you stay in state you basically have 4 choices:  ASU, UofA (comparable), NAU (granolas) are the public schools, and Grand Canyon is a private Christian university in Phoenix getting some steam. In Cali you've got a ton of choices including school sizes (the AZ ones are all degrees of large), but the UC and CSU schools are fairly exclusive (and expensive I believe, even in state).  

Also, if you look at that list I provided, despite being in AZ, I believe Stanford is the only school west of the central time zone.  In general we westerners aren't considered blue blood enough, but I suspect Stanford had too many cross pollinations with graduates from places like Harvard and Yale to be ignored.

All 3 of my kids ended up going to ASU; I'll skip the details of why unless you are interested.  When I've mentioned this at Ivy events, people looked at me like I have 3 eyes.  In that crowd you get introduced as follows:  "Jerry, I'd like you to meet Biff, Harvard undergrad and Boudin MBA."  Also my anecdotal observation was that a lot of the wives/moms came from the non-actual Ivies in that list, and married an Ivy.  

My daughters best friend goes to ASU. Can’t believe how big that campus is. 

[jerryskids 6,565]

4 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

My daughters best friend goes to ASU. Can’t believe how big that campus is. 

Yeah, and it's growing all of the time.  The president, Michael Crow, sucks at sports but is good at the academic side of things.  Crow believes colleges should be inclusive, so they look for ways to grow and provide education to more people.  For instance, they have an agreement with Starbucks where employees can take classes online:

https://www.starbucks.com/careers/working-at-starbucks/education/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw0bunBhD9ARIsAAZl0E1BqFp7MICvF-jBKEmH4yqlhIdjkPwEk0S5KIe0xzHwCkMWRF8-kAEaAgLGEALw_wcB

ASU's fashion school recently merged with FIDM in LA, which is a super smart idea (and my daughter, a recent ASU fashion grad, already has "ASU FIDM" on her LinkedIn profile for name recognition).

https://asufidm.asu.edu/fidm-transition

Another thing the AZ state schools do is provide basically free tuition to smart in-state kids, in hopes of keeping them here to spur the economy.  My two older kids got these full tuition scholarships and majored in engineering/comp sci, for which ASU is ranked 41st nationally (the third one, in fashion, got a 3/4 scholarship).

That being said, Crow will forever fight ASU's reputation as a party school, which is somewhat still deserved and fueled a lot by out of state students, who are typically wealthy and come here for the awesome weather and hardbodies during the school year.

[EternalShinyAndChrome 3,833]

6 hours ago, MDC said:

I dated a girl who went there years ago. The school was like $50k/y at the time for a basic liberal arts education. Most private colleges and universities are such a scam.

I would say most public ones as well. 

[EternalShinyAndChrome 3,833]

3 hours ago, squistion said:

No, it isn't, look up any definition of gender affirmiing care and none talk about men showering with women.

https://www.aamc.org/news/what-gender-affirming-care-your-questions-answered

What is gender-affirming care?

Gender-affirming care, as defined by the World Health Organization, encompasses a range of social, psychological, behavioral, and medical interventions “designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity” when it conflicts with the gender they were assigned at birth. The interventions help transgender people align various aspects of their lives — emotional, interpersonal, and biological — with their gender identity. As noted by the American Psychiatric Association (APA), that identity can run anywhere along a continuum that includes man, woman, a combination of those, neither of those, and fluid.

The interventions fall along a continuum as well, from counseling to changes in social expression to medications (such as hormone therapy). For children in particular, the timing of the interventions is based on several factors, including cognitive and physical development as well as parental consent. Surgery, including to reduce a person’s Adam’s Apple, or to align their chest or genitalia with their gender identity, is rarely provided to people under 18.

Stop being a f'n idiot, squiz.  You know EXACTLY what your stance means - biological males in biological female locker rooms, changing, showering and all the stuff that happens in a locker room.  

I know you're not that f'n stupid so one can only assume you're deliberately playing obtuse here to avoid having to confront the cold hard facts of what your position advocates.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

Chapman University has 7 different graduation ceremonies. Sounds conservative all right. 

[MDC 7,129]

29 minutes ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

I would say most public ones as well. 

True. Unfortunately it’s mostly a ticket to enter the corporate world. 

[Patented Phil 1,469]

2 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Affirming someone’s gender isn’t gender affirming care. Are you from New Jersey? 

Here we go with SquidTard twisting words and definitions to suit the Narrative he is pimping.  Every.  Focking.  Time.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

5 minutes ago, Patented Phil said:

Here we go with SquidTard twisting words and definitions to suit the Narrative he is pimping.  Every.  Focking.  Time.

He’s not succeeding. It says affirming. If you don’t affirm someone’s gender then you don’t support gender affirming care. See  they call it care to make people like squidly get behind it.  It’s gender affirming policy.  

[jerryskids 6,565]

4 hours ago, squistion said:

No, it isn't, look up any definition of gender affirmiing care and none talk about men showering with women.

https://www.aamc.org/news/what-gender-affirming-care-your-questions-answered

What is gender-affirming care?

Gender-affirming care, as defined by the World Health Organization, encompasses a range of social, psychological, behavioral, and medical interventions “designed to support and affirm an individual’s gender identity” when it conflicts with the gender they were assigned at birth. The interventions help transgender people align various aspects of their lives — emotional, interpersonal, and biological — with their gender identity. As noted by the American Psychiatric Association (APA), that identity can run anywhere along a continuum that includes man, woman, a combination of those, neither of those, and fluid.

The interventions fall along a continuum as well, from counseling to changes in social expression to medications (such as hormone therapy). For children in particular, the timing of the interventions is based on several factors, including cognitive and physical development as well as parental consent. Surgery, including to reduce a person’s Adam’s Apple, or to align their chest or genitalia with their gender identity, is rarely provided to people under 18.

I think we need to isolate the social / psych / behavioral from the medical when defining "gender affirming".  I generally support the former, but medical changes it to "gender modifying".

[Hardcore troubadour 14,934]

Places like Oberlin have shifted to tearing down western civilization, from which it was able to exist in the first place. Some groups of people don’t deserve the freedoms they were gifted. They sure as hell didn’t create or maintain them. 

[squistion 1,952]

5 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Affirming someone’s gender isn’t gender affirming care. Are you from New Jersey? 

You said men showering with women was gender affirming care. Under no definition of gender affirming care can you find that.