9/11

[Chronic Husker 85]

I saw a good chunk of this for the first time this morning while I was laying on the couch with stc's dog. Interesting, for sure.

[Riddlen 1]

[Big_Pete 0]

I take everything that propaganda websites/books/people say with a grain of salt

[Let Da Big Dog Eat 37]

Looked like that exceeded my 28 second attention span.

[Mrsteak21 0]

I saw a good chunk of this for the first time this morning while I was laying on the couch with stc's dog. Interesting, for sure.

 

It is definetly interesting, makes you think a lot about stuff....I for one think the Govt. had a big hand in 9/11

[Giants Fan 85]

I don't buy all the conspiracy theory crap. That's just my opinion. I was talking to a guy today about the whole Pentagon thing, "Where's the wreckage?" and I was like, "Well, it didn't fall on a busy street, like it did in New York. There's no busy street there." But they carted that stuff off, pretty quick ... even in lower Manhattan. Before the towers fell. And he was like, "But the hole is not the same span as a 747 ..." and I was like, "Actually, I think it was a 757 ... but you know, those are pretty thick walls. It's not like your standard brick walls. And plus, the government finally released the security camera video of the plane hitting it." and he was like, "Oh they did? Yeah ... but you know how easy it is to fake a video." and it's my professional opinion the video is legit.

[Sho Nuff 720]

It is definetly interesting, makes you think a lot about stuff....I for one think the Govt. had a big hand in 9/11

 

Oh boy...not again....

[Cyber Gandalf 0]

Oh boy...not again....

 

The conspiracy crowd ain't as crazy as you think...in fact...one can make the argument that you're the crazy ones!

[Big_Pete 0]

The conspiracy crowd ain't as crazy as you think...in fact...one can make the argument that you're the crazy ones!

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J

fixxxed

[redtodd 7]

:tinfoilhat:

[itsbigmoni 1]

I don't dismiss the conspiracy, but i wouldn't say i'm convinced there was a big cover up and stuff. There are some shady things that happened and i have questions, but not enough for me to be a full fledged conspiracy believer. My biggest question is why won't they release the video from the hotel roof. The 4 frame clip they released shows nothing. They also have the video from the gas station.

 

The way the holes are pretty clean circles and go like 3 levels in is kinda weird, but then again i'm not a specialist and have no knowledge of how plane crashes work. Something does seem off but yea, who knows what happened. I won't be convinced until they release those two videos.

[OakHeadFootball 1]

They released the gas station video quite some time ago. It doesn't show anything to interesting because it is pointed at the gas pumps.

 

Citgo Video

 

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Longsoug...ttack_0915.html

 

"Conspiracy theorists also talked about security footage that was taken from a nearby hotel, believing that the hotel in question is the Sheraton. The Sheraton hotel is situated behind other buildings, which largely obstruct the line of sight between the hotel and the part of the Pentagon that was hit. As viewed from the Pentagon, the roof of the Sheraton is barely visible, peaking up from behind other buildings. Questions about the line of sight from the Sheraton are pointless anyway, as the Sheraton never had any security video on 9/11."

http://www.debunk911myths.org/topics/index...?title=Pentagon

 

Another popular myth is that the Pentagon has all kinds of cameras pointed at the building, it doesn't. They were using live security for the most part when this happened.

 

But what you do have at the Pentagon is quite a large number of eyewitnesses.

 

http://www.geocities.com/someguyyoudontknow33/witnesses.htm

 

Debris that has been positively identified as AA77

 

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/757debris.html

http://www.911myths.com/html/757_wreckage.html

 

And all but 1 of the 64 bodies positively identified. I wont link to it, but yes, you can find picture of the bodies in the Pentagon also.

 

As someone who has spent quite a bit of time looking into claims that dispute the NIST report and the 9/11 commission I can honestly say that there has not been a single conspiracy theory or claim that has stood up to scrutiny. Period. The guys at the JREF forums ( James Randi Educational Foundation ) have made quite a name for themselves shredding the vast majority of conspiracy theories. These guys are good. They investigate very thoroughly, they have professionals in respective fields as well as amateurs and have exposed massive holes in pretty much every claim the conspiracy theorists come out with. They have so thoroughly debunked some of the claims that some of the theorists are off on wild tangents.

 

For example there is a thread on the Pentagon in the "Loose Change" forums where the last remaining viable theory they have is that the plane actually flew over the Pentagon and engaged a active camouflage system while simultaneously detonating pre planted explosives with all the planted wreckage parts already inside the building.

 

 

The JREFers, among others, have taken great pride in destroying "Loose Change" and exposing Dylan Avery and his crew for a bunch of hacks that they are. Nearly the entire film is misused quotes, half-truths, complete misinformation and wild speculation.

 

If you have watched and taken to heart the crap in "Loose Change" understand that it it severely misleading and it does not represent things as they actually happened.

 

As for towers 1,2 and 7, there is absolutely zero evidence of controlled demolition. Not a single credible architectural, demolition or civil/structural engineering firm has publicly disputed that it was anything but a structural collapse due to impact and the resulting fire.

 

http://www.debunking911.com/index.html

http://www.debunk911myths.org/ ( 2 good sites that addresses the most common conspiracy claims )

 

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-65...76&hl=en-CA (Very long, addresses all of "Loose Change" piece by piece)

 

http://www.loosechangeguide.com/LooseChangeGuide.html (Text version of a guide that addresses "Loose Changes" claims.)

 

 

I don't have a problem questioning 9/11 but it kills me how much pure bullshit has been mass propagated and is taken as fact on the subject.

 

Questions? Fire Away.

[OakHeadFootball 1]

I don't buy all the conspiracy theory crap. That's just my opinion. I was talking to a guy today about the whole Pentagon thing, "Where's the wreckage?" and I was like, "Well, it didn't fall on a busy street, like it did in New York. There's no busy street there." But they carted that stuff off, pretty quick ... even in lower Manhattan. Before the towers fell. And he was like, "But the hole is not the same span as a 747 ..." and I was like, "Actually, I think it was a 757 ... but you know, those are pretty thick walls. It's not like your standard brick walls. And plus, the government finally released the security camera video of the plane hitting it." and he was like, "Oh they did? Yeah ... but you know how easy it is to fake a video." and it's my professional opinion the video is legit.

 

Here is a video of a Jet that had its gas tanks filled with water and was put on rails to crash into a concrete wall at 500 mph. They were testing to see what kind of damage it could do to a nuclear facility. Although it does not exactly represent what happened at the Pentagon it gives you an idea of how AA77 ended up in such small pieces.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9cNf73cQ8s

[Giants Fan 85]

I still don't know anybody that was there ... wherever you mean by THERE ... that believes any of this conspiracy crap. And yeah ... I did have contact with a guy in the Pentagon ... before that. No lie. He liked my Bush cartoons. Apparently it made the rounds there, so I heard.

 

Whole world changed ... that day.

[Boz/BoFan 0]

I saw a good chunk of this for the first time this morning while I was laying on the couch with stc's dog. Interesting, for sure.

 

Nothing you say from here on out will have any merit. You are done. Yes. Just because you have even attempted to entertain a different opinion of what happened on 9/11. Do you have any idea how many people would have to be involved for this to go down as you nut jobs are preaching? And with that many people, no one has come forward.

 

If any single one of these desperate and universally insane yearnings of you wack jobs had one shred of truth dont you think it would be picked up by maybe one or two major news organizations around the world?

 

A loser is a loser is a loser. And you, for being the "sucker" of the saying "there's a sucker born every minute" of which these people base their entire marketing strategy on, are a loser. Its to make money you focking amoeba and you bottom feeders will always make unscrupulous people like this money. Sucker.

[Giants Fan 85]

I still don't know anybody that was there ... wherever you mean by THERE ... that believes any of this conspiracy crap. And yeah ... I did have contact with a guy in the Pentagon ... before that. No lie. He liked my Bush cartoons. Apparently it made the rounds there, so I heard.

 

Whole world changed ... that day.

 

 

Oh ... and I think there WAS debris .... even if it was a missile, I guarantee there WAS debris collected. I'm certain the entire area was sectioned off ... and gone over with a fine tooth comb, but the details are on a need to know basis. It was an airplane. The security video is a blur, but it was an airplaine. You know ... 2 people I worked with were on one of those planes .... what did they go into the witness protection program? It's an insult, to the people that died to suggest such a thing.

 

God Speed

[Guest Davaco]

anyone got a link to giants fan's story?

[supermike80 1,317]

[Giants Fan 85]

anyone got a link to giants fan's story?

 

Yeah .. I got it ... you mean what I wrote ... THAT DAY?

 

It's not accurate ... I was a little flipped out ... but I got it. THE ORIGINAL STORY:

 

I took this picture a couple days later from my balcony. It took me a few days before I felt I could take a photo in respect.

 

"My God."

 

Those were the first words out of my mouth September 11th, 2001.

 

As I neared the PATH Station in Hoboken that morning, I saw people running. One woman with a rather large camera ran past me and around the corner. There was commotion in Sinatra Park that overlooks the Hudson River towards downtown Manhattan. I could clearly see the park and thought it was some kind of political protest. As I cleared the corner and reached the PATH station at about 9 AM, I saw World Trade Center #1 on fire.

 

"My God." I said.

 

I asked someone what happened and heard "A plane hit it." And I thought, they meant a small plane. An accident. There was a cop nearby and I heard him say "I don't know what kind of plane it was. It might have been a military jet." when someone else asked. Someone ran past me on a cell phone, saying "There's a second plane! There's a second plane!" The WTC line was already down, but the 33rd Street train was still running so I went into downtown Manhattan. I prayed on that train ride, and I'm not a religious person. I remember thinking, "Well, if this is how I'm gonna go, this is how I'm gonna go."

 

As I exited the PATH station on 14th Street and 6th Ave, I looked back and saw the smoke. I only remember seeing Tower #1 on fire from Hoboken and I think I caught the last train from Jersey into the city. I bet my train left just as the second plane hit because I never heard an explosion.

 

I walked up 6th Ave to work, seeing all these people on the streets amazed at the view. I had to stop and look a few times myself. At one point I ran into a coworker and at that moment I saw that both towers were on fire. He confirmed 2 planes had crashed and now I knew I was in a city under terrorist attack. I continued my walk to work and got into the office about 9:30. The three main people I work with were not in the office. I ran around the building seeing coworkers gathered around TVs or looking out windows at the WTC burning. I knew it was going to be a busy week, so I tried to remain at my desk but there was no news from my coworkers. I emailed my father in Arizona to let him know I was ok, and I loved him, and called my mother, a few blocks away, to tell her and my stepfather to turn on the TV. Soon I learned one tower had collapsed, and soon after that that they were both gone. I was in disbelief.

 

As soon as the office gave us clearance to leave, I walked. I said to one coworker, "If I'm going to die today, I want to be with my family." I walked against the grain of people trekking North from the disaster, to my Mother and my stepfather who were on 12th street. 5 blocks south of my office.

 

I have never seen an NYC sidewalk more crowded, and also so civil. Here these people were walking away from a war zone, but made room for me to walk the other way. I can't begin to tell you how easily I walked against that crowd. They understood I had someplace to go and got out of my way. New Yorkers are the greatest people in the world to strangers. I'm forever convinced of that.

 

My Mother and stepfather were not home when I got there, but I let myself in and watched the news. We soon after went to Saint Vincent's Hospital to try and help. My mother and stepfather had already been there and seen the dead and the injured first hand. They had asked if they could give blood, but at that time there was no blood drive ready. The three of us went back to Saint Vincent's at about 11 AM and a blood drive had just started. I walked as fast as I could to get in that line and let my parents cut in with me. People were giving out free food for those that had not eaten recently. Mostly bananas. But by the time I got to the end of that line it ran from Saint Vincent's on 6th Ave. to just near 5th Ave. It was an entire New York City block. We decided to go make some food of our own and return later.

 

After lunch I went back to work to check in and found a coworker who also lives in Hoboken and found a way back, perhaps. I decided at this time to go with him and try and get out of Manhattan. We met up with some others that live in Jersey and walked towards the Hudson River. Some people were saying there was no way out. We got on a line for a free ferry ride to Weehawken, NJ from Chelsea Piers. So nice of the owners of these boats to help get commuters home. We were very lucky to have found it when we did because we only waited for one full boat to leave before we were loaded on and we got seats right next to the exit. There were a few people that we met on line and some that sat near us and we all started talking about things. 2 people at the table had been in the WTC and escaped from the 10th floor. As we pulled away from the island I looked back and the smoke looked as if it had engulfed most of lower Manhattan and that's when I first broke down. I knew my Mother and step-father were still in the apartment on 12th street. It looked to me as the fire had spread at least that far. Cell phones didn't go through, but after we de-boated in Weehawken I got through, to voice mail.

 

One image I will never forget, was as I walked in that crowd of people by the Weehawken docks, was one boat that was covered in wet soot, and had papers from the Trade Center stuck to it as well. I looked up and saw these guys that ran this boat and I said, "Thank you guys! You are good people!" and they responded in typical New York fashion. "Yeah...yer welcome, now get yer ass home!"

 

You gotta love this town.

[edjr 5,618]

Wasn't it 9/1/1

[PackerAttacker 0]

I think its funny that the same people that accuse Bush of not being able to tell his A$$ from a hole in the ground......... think he was able to orchestrate the most elaborate hoax in American History. Oh yeah, in the course of about 6 months.

 

Nice.....

[Giants Fan 85]

Today, I think ... I was later to work than I realized. The screaming people I saw/heard at Sinatra Park ... were actually witnessing the SECOND plane hit. 9:08 AM or whatever it was. I had a prety good idea ... but it was when I exited the PATH station at 6th and 14th ... that I really had a straight view ... and saw both towers hit .... that's when I REALLY knew. Not an accident. Still thought ... like pretty much everyone else .... the towers would stand for awhile, still.

 

I did not see either impact ... and I did not see the towers fall ... live. And I'm glad. IMO ... I've seen it too many times on TV to remind me, forever, of how horrific it was.

 

I was a little too busy ... to stand there and just watch, like a dumbfock, that morning.

[MLCKAA 415]

anyone got a link to giants fan's story?

 

 

This is the first I ever heard him claim that 2 of his co-workers were on one of the doomed planes. Maybe i just don't remember it.

 

I know he posted his official OFFICIAL totally official account of the day about a month or so ago. You ought to dredge that up and see if the 2 dead co-workers are in there. Quick-- do it before he can edit.

 

The government covers up all kinds of stuff every day. I have NO DOUBT that there is plenty of info they've suppressed about 911, but I don't believe for a second that the gov't set it up. Come on.

[Giants Fan 85]

FWIW .... when the security guard in my building told me the first tower fell .... my reponse was, "No way!"

 

I did not think they would fall ... but it makes sense ... now. It's a lot of weight, up there, with a structural failure below it ... that's it. End of tower.

 

There was a glass atrium at the WTC ... they used to have like a "Winter Garden" there. They might still ... because it AMAZINGLY was hardly damaged on 9/11.

 

Luck of the draw ... or a secret government program ... to promote atriums!

 

Also ... theres an old church there ... almost untouched. Covered in WTC dust ... but almost undamaged.

 

God's will? Or something else?

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Watch the South Park episode on this and it will clear things up for you

[Giants Fan 85]

This is the first I ever heard him claim that 2 of his co-workers were on one of the doomed planes. Maybe i just don't remember it.

 

I know he posted his official OFFICIAL totally official account of the day about a month or so ago. You ought to dredge that up and see if the 2 dead co-workers are in there. Quick-- do it before he can edit.

 

The government covers up all kinds of stuff every day. I have NO DOUBT that there is plenty of info they've suppressed about 911, but I don't believe for a second that the gov't set it up. Come on.

 

Well ... I didn't know, right away. Also ... never really felt like I should drag their names into this argument .... but if you want PROOF ... go to your library and look in a 1999/2000 issue of Broadcasting and Cable magazine .... Cahners Publishing ... you'll find my name on the mast-head as the Assistant Art Director.

 

I wouldn't make this shiat up. My story ... was off a little at first .... but it's clear now.

[Guest Davaco]

Yeah .. I got it ... you mean what I wrote ... THAT DAY?

 

It's not accurate ... I was a little flipped out ... but I got it. THE ORIGINAL STORY:

 

I took this picture a couple days later from my balcony. It took me a few days before I felt I could take a photo in respect.

 

"My God."

 

Those were the first words out of my mouth September 11th, 2001.

 

As I neared the PATH Station in Hoboken that morning, I saw people running. One woman with a rather large camera ran past me and around the corner. There was commotion in Sinatra Park that overlooks the Hudson River towards downtown Manhattan. I could clearly see the park and thought it was some kind of political protest. As I cleared the corner and reached the PATH station at about 9 AM, I saw World Trade Center #1 on fire.

 

"My God." I said.

 

I asked someone what happened and heard "A plane hit it." And I thought, they meant a small plane. An accident. There was a cop nearby and I heard him say "I don't know what kind of plane it was. It might have been a military jet." when someone else asked. Someone ran past me on a cell phone, saying "There's a second plane! There's a second plane!" The WTC line was already down, but the 33rd Street train was still running so I went into downtown Manhattan. I prayed on that train ride, and I'm not a religious person. I remember thinking, "Well, if this is how I'm gonna go, this is how I'm gonna go."

 

As I exited the PATH station on 14th Street and 6th Ave, I looked back and saw the smoke. I only remember seeing Tower #1 on fire from Hoboken and I think I caught the last train from Jersey into the city. I bet my train left just as the second plane hit because I never heard an explosion.

 

I walked up 6th Ave to work, seeing all these people on the streets amazed at the view. I had to stop and look a few times myself. At one point I ran into a coworker and at that moment I saw that both towers were on fire. He confirmed 2 planes had crashed and now I knew I was in a city under terrorist attack. I continued my walk to work and got into the office about 9:30. The three main people I work with were not in the office. I ran around the building seeing coworkers gathered around TVs or looking out windows at the WTC burning. I knew it was going to be a busy week, so I tried to remain at my desk but there was no news from my coworkers. I emailed my father in Arizona to let him know I was ok, and I loved him, and called my mother, a few blocks away, to tell her and my stepfather to turn on the TV. Soon I learned one tower had collapsed, and soon after that that they were both gone. I was in disbelief.

 

As soon as the office gave us clearance to leave, I walked. I said to one coworker, "If I'm going to die today, I want to be with my family." I walked against the grain of people trekking North from the disaster, to my Mother and my stepfather who were on 12th street. 5 blocks south of my office.

 

I have never seen an NYC sidewalk more crowded, and also so civil. Here these people were walking away from a war zone, but made room for me to walk the other way. I can't begin to tell you how easily I walked against that crowd. They understood I had someplace to go and got out of my way. New Yorkers are the greatest people in the world to strangers. I'm forever convinced of that.

 

My Mother and stepfather were not home when I got there, but I let myself in and watched the news. We soon after went to Saint Vincent's Hospital to try and help. My mother and stepfather had already been there and seen the dead and the injured first hand. They had asked if they could give blood, but at that time there was no blood drive ready. The three of us went back to Saint Vincent's at about 11 AM and a blood drive had just started. I walked as fast as I could to get in that line and let my parents cut in with me. People were giving out free food for those that had not eaten recently. Mostly bananas. But by the time I got to the end of that line it ran from Saint Vincent's on 6th Ave. to just near 5th Ave. It was an entire New York City block. We decided to go make some food of our own and return later.

 

After lunch I went back to work to check in and found a coworker who also lives in Hoboken and found a way back, perhaps. I decided at this time to go with him and try and get out of Manhattan. We met up with some others that live in Jersey and walked towards the Hudson River. Some people were saying there was no way out. We got on a line for a free ferry ride to Weehawken, NJ from Chelsea Piers. So nice of the owners of these boats to help get commuters home. We were very lucky to have found it when we did because we only waited for one full boat to leave before we were loaded on and we got seats right next to the exit. There were a few people that we met on line and some that sat near us and we all started talking about things. 2 people at the table had been in the WTC and escaped from the 10th floor. As we pulled away from the island I looked back and the smoke looked as if it had engulfed most of lower Manhattan and that's when I first broke down. I knew my Mother and step-father were still in the apartment on 12th street. It looked to me as the fire had spread at least that far. Cell phones didn't go through, but after we de-boated in Weehawken I got through, to voice mail.

 

One image I will never forget, was as I walked in that crowd of people by the Weehawken docks, was one boat that was covered in wet soot, and had papers from the Trade Center stuck to it as well. I looked up and saw these guys that ran this boat and I said, "Thank you guys! You are good people!" and they responded in typical New York fashion. "Yeah...yer welcome, now get yer ass home!"

 

You gotta love this town.

 

 

what a tool

[Giants Fan 85]

what a tool

 

EXPLAIN ... or STFU ...

 

Thanks, I'd appreciate that.

[Guest Davaco]

EXPLAIN ... or STFU ...

 

Thanks, I'd appreciate that.

 

me requestiong your 9/11 story was sarcasm and then you posted it as if I was really interested.

 

 

HTH

[Giants Fan 85]

me requestiong your 9/11 story was sarcasm and then you posted it as if I was really interested.

HTH

 

Oh .... well SCUSE THE FOCK OUTTA ME THEN! I didn't realize you were MAKING A JOKE!

 

 

Whatever you call yourself ... please don't pretend to be a patriot. Mkay? Thanks.

[edjr 5,618]

Watch the South Park episode on this and it will clear things up for you

 

yeah I saw that.

 

South Park and Family Guy are the best 2 shows on TV.

[Giants Fan 85]

Stewie to Brian: How you uh, how you comin' on that novel you're working on? Huh? Gotta a big, uh, big stack of papers there? Gotta, gotta nice litte story you're working on there? Your big novel you've been working on for 3 years? Huh? Gotta, gotta compelling protaganist? Yeah? Gotta obstacle for him to overcome? Huh? Gotta story brewing there? Working on, working on that for quite some time? Huh? Yea, talking about that 3 years ago. Been working on that the whole time? Nice little narrative? Beginning, middle, and end? Some friends become enemies, some enemies become friends? At the end your main character is richer from the experience? Yeah? Yeah? No, no, you deserve some time off.

 

[Guest Davaco]

Oh .... well SCUSE THE FOCK OUTTA ME THEN! I didn't realize you were MAKING A JOKE!

 

 

Whatever you call yourself ... please don't pretend to be a patriot. Mkay? Thanks.

 

a patriot, like your quitter of a grandfather?

[D_House 0]

why won't people open their minds and listen to the other side?

[Sho Nuff 720]

why won't people open their minds and listen to the other side?

 

If the other side is the conspiracy side....the answer is simple.

Because the other side has been debunked at nearly every turn...yet they keep coming back for more...with more ridiculous assertions they cannot prove and are inevitably proven wrong. Yet they never admit to being wrong or full of it...they just move on to a new theory and pretend as if they never made the first bogus claims.

[Giants Fan 85]

a patriot, like your quitter of a grandfather?

 

That doesn't even make any sense. First of all ... WHICH ONE? The one that's still alive? He was a WW2 Photographer ... I don't think he ever saw a battle, but he was put on a ship and sent overseas. The other one, was in the Army ... and he RESIGNED, after 19 years. He was a Lt. Col. He never saw battle either, and that's why he resigned, months before making his pension. Resigned, because they were not gonna send him overseas ... ever ... he was too smart. Didn't "quit" anything ... boy that was a different generation alltogether, wasn't it?

 

How about yours? You should also have TWO of them. Got some war stories, hmm? Little ... adventurous soldier, hmmm? Little, storming the beaches maybe? Hmm? Yeah? Maybe ... fighting for this country, yeah? Maybe youd like to share with us .. ohh... no? I didn't think so.

 

Got any other questions? My great-great-grandfather (Dad's side) fought for the Union in the Civil War. Elgin Battery ... Light Artillery. My father, was also in the Navy ... for a very short period of time.

[Guest Davaco]

That doesn't even make any sense. First of all ... WHICH ONE? The one that's still alive? He was a WW2 Photographer ... I don't think he ever saw a battle, but he was put on a ship and sent overseas. The other one, was in the Army ... and he RESIGNED, after 19 years. He was a Lt. Col. He never saw battle either, and that's why he resigned, months before making his pension. Resigned, because they were not gonna send him overseas ... ever ... he was too smart. Didn't "quit" anything ... boy that was a different generation alltogether, wasn't it?

 

How about yours? You should also have TWO of them. Got some war stories, hmm? Little ... adventurous soldier, hmmm? Little, storming the beaches maybe? Hmm? Yeah? Maybe ... fighting for this country, yeah? Maybe youd like to share with us .. ohh... no? I didn't think so.

 

Got any other questions? My great-great-grandfather (Dad's side) fought for the Union in the Civil War. Elgin Battery ... Light Artillery. My father, was also in the Navy ... for a very short period of time.

 

i got a grandfather, he dodged the wars and is still alive. He does purchase medals of honor off ebay, but he still wears them proudly

[Mungwater 588]

The other one, was in the Army ... and he RESIGNED, after 19 years. He was a Lt. Col. He never saw battle either, and that's why he resigned, months before making his pension. Resigned, because they were not gonna send him overseas ... ever ... he was too smart. Didn't "quit" anything

 

Nobody is that stupid to throw away a pension and medical a year before. Also, considering that your retirement date is locked in at 18, I call BS.

 

That dude is a moron, and I hope his seed isn't on the planet.

[Guest Davaco]

Nobody is that stupid to throw away a pension and medical a year before. Also, considering that your retirement date is locked in at 18, I call BS.

 

That dude is a moron

 

and a quitter

[wiffleball 4,659]

Not that idiots that believe in this shiit will bother to do any of their own research, - for whatever bizarre psychological reason, they have to believe this crap, but we had this discussion Ad Naseum about 10 months ago on this bored. Popular Mechanics did a whole thing on this -and debunked every conspiracy theory out there. They don't have an agenda, - except maybe sceince. Google it, read it, and get over this stupid shiit.