Obama: I can't answer that question, it's "above my pay grade".

[supermike80 1,352]

wow, you are not witty or funny, so why keep trying?

You fail at life.

 

See here is where you are confused kid.........

Caring about being witty or funny on a message bored and using that to determine a level of suckyness is a major part of the problem.

[kpbuckeye 2]

See here is where you are confused kid.........

Caring about being witty or funny on a message bored and using that to determine a level of suckyness is a major part of the problem.

 

you seem to be trying pretty hard at it, but another fail.

 

 

superfail80

[wiffleball 4,696]

Recliner Pilot 8

supermike80 8

kpbuckeye 6

--------------------

Total Posts: 22

 

 

Out of 41.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Recliner Pilot 8

supermike80 8

kpbuckeye 6

--------------------

Total Posts: 22

Out of 41.

 

Number of posts adequately defending Obama's dismal performance the other night = 0.

 

 

[thetxstang 0]

Number of posts adequately defending Obama's dismal performance the other night = 0.

 

Number of wholly right-wing biased political threads initiated by Redundant Pissant = 7,851

 

Number of times Redundant Pissant has accused someone of straying off topic while systematically doing the same = 8,493

 

Number of times Redundant Pilot has acknowledged ANY questionable act by his side of the aisle = 0

 

Number of worthless posts by Redundant Pissant since he joined FFT = 12,509

 

Number of people on the bored who take Redundant Pissant seriously = 8 (including his 5 aliases)

 

As a reminder, It's been five days or so since your last new GW thread. You = teh fail

 

[DAVID RUFFIN 1]

yet you keep coming to read them and leaving moronic comments.

Thank god we have white trash like you to make the rest of us feel better about ourselves.

 

 

The INTERNET tough guy is back to name calling. Apparently you just can't help yourself. Do you even realize how ignorant you come across?

[gocolts 300]

The INTERNET tough guy is back to name calling. Apparently you just can't help yourself. Do you even realize how ignorant you come across?

Dude, give it a rest already. We get it. Your are obsessed with kpbuckeye. You don't have to drive it home so damn hard every focking day with the same weak azz line of "Internet Tough guy."

[gocolts 300]

yes

and it sure beats, I like pudding.

No shait. That is one of the dumbest focking things posted here on a regular basis. We all know why he likes pudding.

[gocolts 300]

Now you right wing fascists think the President is not only the sole authority of the government but is a authority of heaven as well? Im not surprised of course. You already shown that you respect no law that a Republican President has to follow.

 

I guess it was only a matter of time before the President's authority superceded the lord's authority.

 

Obama is extremely well written on this subject and he was honest that he is pro-choice. You guys just have to make up stuff to not realize your going to get your azzes kicked.

 

No mention that McCain cheated and didn't follow the rules? No mention that McCain cross story turns out to BE SOMEONE ELSES? No mention that McCains opinion on Georgia was inappropriate to state in front of the president and was based on the fact that his policy expert LOBBIES for Georgia and not on what the actual situation was?

 

McCain is a senile old man. However, this is a good strategy against Obama. Pretend that its OBAMA that doesn't have solid positions, in spite of the massive documentation and not McCain. Might work with the other morons that buy your crap.

Can someone really be this focked in the head??? Seriously. I guess since McCain was well prepared and Obama didn't have the teleprompter in front of him to guide him, the only possible answer is McCain had to cheat. Never mind that this guy flat out told McCain and Obama what kind of question to expect. Forget about the fact that Obama knew this was a pastor who was going to be asking questions. WTF?? Did Obama and his handlers actually think that an abortion question would not come up?? Or the evil question??? Give me a break.

 

You don't have to be a genius to see that McCain DESTROYED Obama in this forearm. Just turn on the news and you can see the liberal media is going ape shait over this. They are trying everything they can think of to try and make excuses why Obama failed miserably that night, including this cheating BS.

 

Fact is, Obama is a classic empty suit. He was embarrassed. It has to humiliating to be an Obama supporter at this point. The guy is flat out an embarrassment. I can't wait till the debates. Lets not forget this is John McCain that destroyed Obama the other night. John focking McCain. The guy who couldn't even get passed Bush.

[DAVID RUFFIN 1]

Dude, give it a rest already. We get it. Your are obsessed with kpbuckeye. You don't have to drive it home so damn hard every focking day with the same weak azz line of "Internet Tough guy."

 

 

Point well taken. I'll lay off and leave it to others.

[gocolts 300]

Point well taken. I'll lay off and leave it to others.

You mean the ONE other poster who says that lame line??

[DAVID RUFFIN 1]

You mean the ONE other poster who says that lame line??

 

 

How about I just lay off...Work with me here.

[gocolts 300]

How about I just lay off...Work with me here.

Just busting your balls dude. Don't take it personally.

[DAVID RUFFIN 1]

Just busting your balls dude. Don't take it personally.

[Korben Dallas 0]

Can someone really be this focked in the head??? Seriously. I guess since McCain was well prepared and Obama didn't have the teleprompter in front of him to guide him, the only possible answer is McCain had to cheat. Never mind that this guy flat out told McCain and Obama what kind of question to expect. Forget about the fact that Obama knew this was a pastor who was going to be asking questions. WTF?? Did Obama and his handlers actually think that an abortion question would not come up?? Or the evil question??? Give me a break.

 

You don't have to be a genius to see that McCain DESTROYED Obama in this forearm. Just turn on the news and you can see the liberal media is going ape shait over this. They are trying everything they can think of to try and make excuses why Obama failed miserably that night, including this cheating BS.

 

Fact is, Obama is a classic empty suit. He was embarrassed. It has to humiliating to be an Obama supporter at this point. The guy is flat out an embarrassment. I can't wait till the debates. Lets not forget this is John McCain that destroyed Obama the other night. John focking McCain. The guy who couldn't even get passed Bush.

 

McCain was busted for not following the rules. He was supposed to be in a room without access to both the questions and Obama's answers, he chose to disobey and is accused of listening to the questions-to which he has backtracked his denial.

 

Obama knew the question and he answered it EXACTLY the way he always has. It is not for him to decide when life begins, that's for god to decide.

 

McCain destroyed??? get real. Only a blind McCain supporter would believe that. Here was some of the evangelical responses.

 

As for other Christian groups, I think Obama came out ahead because of his aforementioned ability to speak about faith in an intimate, dynamic way. Obama talks like a Christian. McCain talks like a politician being made to talk about Jesus. Not a disaster, but not much help either.

 

CBN

The fact that Barack Obama would show up at an Evangelical Church and take the tough questions is a credit to him. I mean he knew he was the visiting team so to speak yet he handled these questions like he has in the past: with relative ease [...]

 

Overall the night was a success for Obama. He didn’t get put on the spot too much with the abortion questions. He handled the "Jesus" question about his faith with ease and maybe most important he looked comfortable up there.

 

 

Besides the fact that McCain's sound bite for people that are rich is $5 MILLION dollars and that he falsified his POW story. You don't think that Obama and his 5 to 1 cash advantage isn't writing up ad's and press releases on this right now. That MSM aren't looking back at his well documented POW experience and wondering where this brand new story came from?

 

Fact is that people don't agree with you. Obama is never going to win your vote. You are a disabled man in the bottom of the income bracket, someone that has used the state for support and you plan on voting for someone that wants to punish you for it. I can't help you on this. Vote for someone that wants to f&*k you in every way possible. Good luck with that.

[BLS 313]

McCain was busted for not following the rules. He was supposed to be in a room without access to both the questions and Obama's answers, he chose to disobey and is accused of listening to the questions-to which he has backtracked his denial.

 

Obama knew the question and he answered it EXACTLY the way he always has. It is not for him to decide when life begins, that's for god to decide.

 

McCain destroyed??? get real. Only a blind McCain supporter would believe that. Here was some of the evangelical responses.

 

As for other Christian groups, I think Obama came out ahead because of his aforementioned ability to speak about faith in an intimate, dynamic way. Obama talks like a Christian. McCain talks like a politician being made to talk about Jesus. Not a disaster, but not much help either.

 

CBN

The fact that Barack Obama would show up at an Evangelical Church and take the tough questions is a credit to him. I mean he knew he was the visiting team so to speak yet he handled these questions like he has in the past: with relative ease [...]

 

Overall the night was a success for Obama. He didn't get put on the spot too much with the abortion questions. He handled the "Jesus" question about his faith with ease and maybe most important he looked comfortable up there.

 

 

Besides the fact that McCain's sound bite for people that are rich is $5 MILLION dollars and that he falsified his POW story. You don't think that Obama and his 5 to 1 cash advantage isn't writing up ad's and press releases on this right now. That MSM aren't looking back at his well documented POW experience and wondering where this brand new story came from?

 

Fact is that people don't agree with you. Obama is never going to win your vote. You are a disabled man in the bottom of the income bracket, someone that has used the state for support and you plan on voting for someone that wants to punish you for it. I can't help you on this. Vote for someone that wants to f&*k you in every way possible. Good luck with that.

 

 

Right here...this argument between colts and dallas is why I'll never understand partisan politics.

I personally beileve you've both been duped by the system. You're not even capable of thinking outside the lines...just like you've been trained to.

 

Colts' bias is clear in his response. He claims McCain owned BHO, yet qualifies it with 'I don't even like McCain'.

To me, it just says "I don't like McCain, but I hate Obama".

Maybe that's true...I don't care at all for Obama's political philosophy. But I always try to put myself in the others shoes.

 

Dallas is clearly biased to the left, and will also follow right down the party line, including going to the abortion issue.

 

Look...if we're waiting for God to rule on whether abortion is ok or not, we're gonna be waiting a long fuckin time, because when/if he does judge on this issue...most of us will likely burn in savage's lake of fire. (which won't ever happen because there is no god)

 

BUT...if you do beleive there is a god...Right or Left...I cannot imagine you can honestly believe that God is down with abortion.

I mean...I'd love to hear this argument.

 

Regardless, the constitution clearly states, every person has a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

I don't see where it gets any clearer on abortion...RIGHT TO LIFE....

 

Oh...I know...the argument gets busted down to science and semantics.

Whatever....

 

My personal belief? I believe abortion is a sad, sad, necessary evil of our planet.

But I certainly don't believe it's a womans choice with her body...it's not like removing a tumor.

 

But I also believe in the Constitution wholeheartedly.

And if the Constitution says everybody has a right to life...it is what it is...IMO.

 

This whole example is only a like sprinkle of why I can't seem to find a way to discsuss politics with most politically educated people.

They're a bunch of sheep IMO...and to even consider listening to a rational thought only drives their pavlovian reaction to refute anything that doesn't 'jive' with their political philosophy.

 

I mean seriously....how do you tie Global Warming into a Right vs. Left issue?

 

It has NOTHING to do with a politcal idealology, yet every leftist buys it, and every rightist doesn't.

How is that??

 

Maybe we've all been duped, and it's time to think for ourselves?

[jerryskids 5,461]

Right here...this argument between colts and dallas is why I'll never understand partisan politics.

I personally beileve you've both been duped by the system. You're not even capable of thinking outside the lines...just like you've been trained to.

My sentiments exactly. While I definitely lean right/conservative/libertarian, I like to think I acknowledge when something walks like a duck, talks like a duck... it is a duck. Obama made a major gaff here, I'd rather the discussion center around that and the impact. korben, we've discussed in the past that I like you (in a manly, Miller High Life sharing sorta way), but for you to come in here with "BUT#@!@#!@ McCain did THIS stuff so he sucks WORSE@#!#!@!# is beneath you, and I think you know that.

[gocolts 300]

Right here...this argument between colts and dallas is why I'll never understand partisan politics.

I personally beileve you've both been duped by the system. You're not even capable of thinking outside the lines...just like you've been trained to.

 

Colts' bias is clear in his response. He claims McCain owned BHO, yet qualifies it with 'I don't even like McCain'.

To me, it just says "I don't like McCain, but I hate Obama".

Maybe that's true...I don't care at all for Obama's political philosophy. But I always try to put myself in the others shoes.

I have said it many times. I have been against McCain from the start. I even voted for focking Hillary Clinton in the primary for Big_Pete's sake. And no, I didn't do it for Hush Bimbo. I know KD is just dying to claim that one. McCain was my last choice of all who ran on the GOP side. I flat out do NOT want to vote for him and was pretty sure I would be voting D this time around after 8 years of Bush abandoning conservative values. But nooooooooooooooo. The democrats have to nominate the worst possible candidate, other than Dennis K. It is unbelievable to me that the dems could actually blow this thing. The Clinton's have done more for the democratic party than practically anybody else in the last 15 years. And they threw them under the bus for the flavor of the month that can read real good.

 

To top it off, my father is a die hard democrat. Voted D every election of his life. I was raised to believe in democrats and unions. I was a democrat. The family hated Reagan and Bush senior. Due to all this stuff I heard over the years growing up and into my 20s, I considered myself a democrat. I obviously would personally do much better under Obama given my situation. So to come to the conclusion I can't see outside the lines seems like a leap to me. I am a conservative for the most part. However(1 quick example), I also do not believe in the death penalty anymore. The liberal folks here at the geek club brought information to my attention that made me rethink and eventually change my stance on the death penalty. Does that stuff sound like I am this blind partisan GOP guy??? What am I missing here BLS?? TIA.

[Savage Beast 1]

McCain is a senile old man.

 

What the HELL have you ever done for your country @ss nuts?

 

McCain was in a Vietnamese prison camp, and since he was the son of an Admiral, they were going to let him go free. But instead of accepting freedom, McCain said he would like to remain in the prison camp with his fellow soldiers, and he was tortured for 3 and a half years in that prison camp alongside his fellow soldiers. McCain is a real man, and not a coward like yourself.

 

McCain is an American Hero, and he's a better man then you are, or I am, or for sure Obama is.

 

Obama is not worthy to eat one of McCain's turds.

[peenie 1,703]

gocolts

tell me what democratic principle do you think obama will not uphold?

what issues are different than hillary clinton's that makes him a weaker candidate?

what do you see mccain doing differently than obama that will lead our country in a more positive direction?

[phillybear 365]

gocolts

tell me what democratic principle do you think obama will not uphold?

what issues are different than hillary clinton's that makes him a weaker candidate?

what do you see mccain doing differently than obama that will lead our country in a more positive direction?

 

I'll chime in.

 

1. Obama hates poor people with religion and guns. Ignores Constitutional principles. Wants to limit the rights of American citizens.

2. Obama has no opinion on any issue, so it's hard to compare this wet bar of soap to anybody. On the other hand, Barack is an unapologetic racist.

3. Not raise everybody's taxes. Not increase free cash handouts to other countries. Actually work with the other party to get things done. Gridlock with a Democratic Congress prevents a mandate of one party's ability to crush this country.

[BLS 313]

I'll chime in.

 

1. Obama hates poor people with religion and guns. Ignores Constitutional principles. Wants to limit the rights of American citizens.

2. Obama has no opinion on any issue, so it's hard to compare this wet bar of soap to anybody. On the other hand, Barack is an unapologetic racist.

3. Not raise everybody's taxes. Not increase free cash handouts to other countries. Actually work with the other party to get things done. Gridlock with a Democratic Congress prevents a mandate of one party's ability to crush this country.

 

 

3. Your assuming McCain will actually do anything other than grant amensty and start war with Iran.

[phillybear 365]

3. Your assuming McCain will actually do anything other than grant amensty and start war with Iran.

 

A war with Iran wouldn't make a lot of sense right now, so I am assuming there won't be one.

 

Overall, McCain probably won't do much. Which is fine with me. The economy and finances are cyclical, the war will start to wind down a bit, etc. Just don't go into office trying to overhaul stuff. It just doesn't work like that. McCain has no ideas, while Obama is full of bad ideas.

[BLS 313]

A war with Iran wouldn't make a lot of sense right now, so I am assuming there won't be one.

 

Overall, McCain probably won't do much. Which is fine with me. The economy and finances are cyclical, the war will start to wind down a bit, etc. Just don't go into office trying to overhaul stuff. It just doesn't work like that. McCain has no ideas, while Obama is full of bad ideas.

 

 

I agree...McCain is less of a threat to us because he won't do much.

And I agree Obama's plans border the insane.

 

I would however, like to see someone actually ADDRESS the MOUNTAIN of debt this country owes. SOMEBODY has to pay this.......one way or another.

We simply need to drastically cut government spending.

[The Moz 69]

This comment has nothing on Obama

 

What is doing him in is - without SOMEONE TELLING WHAT TO SAY HE IS AN IDIOT! He had no idea how to respond to the Russia / Georgia thing - AT ALL.. He was destroyed in his first debate - came off like he knew nothing.

 

Seriously da Dems really screwed up again. Hillary would have won - Obama IMO is gonna lose and if he doesn't get on track it might even be close.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Obama knew the question and he answered it EXACTLY the way he always has. It is not for him to decide when life begins, that's for god to decide.

 

 

Typical Korben Bullshit. He wasn't asked to decide when life begins, he was asked when does a baby get human rights, in your view.

 

If you would have been honest he would have said after the baby is born (or if he would have been really honest he would have said after the baby is born and he eludes an abortionist with a pair of scissors).

 

Instead he pussed out.

 

Hell, he has no problem telling us when Terrorists are supposed to get their constitutional rights.

[gocolts 300]

gocolts

tell me what democratic principle do you think obama will not uphold?

what issues are different than hillary clinton's that makes him a weaker candidate?

what do you see mccain doing differently than obama that will lead our country in a more positive direction?

1. Free market. Keeping our nation safe. Honest government.

2. Foreign policy. Obama said he would meet unconditionally with terrorist who happen to be in charge of certain countries. Unconditionally being the key word. Hillary is much stronger on foreign policy and defense.

3. I see McCain putting good judges on the SCOTUS. The folks Obama would put on the bench would be disastrous. These folks on the SCOTUS are there for life. All you have to do is look at the damage Ruth Bader Ginsberg has done to the court to see where I am coming from.

 

For several years, I could never see myself voting for a Clinton again. Noway nohow. After 8 years of Bush abandoning everything conservative trying to be liked, there was no doubt in my mind I would vote for the democrat nominee in 2008, even if it was Hillary. That was how pissed I was about the Bush administration. Bush did do a couple of things I liked, but for the most part, I didn't agree with most of what he was doing. Then it started to look like McCain was going to get the nod and I was in disbelief and even more certain I would be voting democrat since my last choice of the GOP was getting the nod. Then the democrats did what they have been doing for the past few elections. Nominate the worst possible candidate other than Dennis Kucinich.

 

When you think about this election, it is shocking that McCain even has a shot POTUS after 8 years of the most hated POTUS in my lifetime. The left and the right hate Bush. Look at his approval numbers and you can see what I mean. Plus, we all know a lot of right wingers do not like McCain either. It is unbelievable.

 

The reason McCain looked so good and Obama so bad talking with this pastor is simple. Obama waffled all over the place and danced around issues. McCain gave straight forward answers. Like the when does a baby get rights question. Obama wouldn't take a stand on this issue and wishy washed his way through it. McCain flat out said at conception. Now some folks may not agree with McCain's position on this issue. But it least had had enough courage to take a stand.

 

I will answer more if asked.

[Snoopy1 0]

1. Free market. Keeping our nation safe. Honest government.

2. Foreign policy. Obama said he would meet unconditionally with terrorist who happen to be in charge of certain countries. Unconditionally being the key word. Hillary is much stronger on foreign policy and defense.

3. I see McCain putting good judges on the SCOTUS. The folks Obama would put on the bench would be disastrous. These folks on the SCOTUS are there for life. All you have to do is look at the damage Ruth Bader Ginsberg has done to the court to see where I am coming from.

 

 

Yeah, the GOP has been outstanding at honest goverment in the last 40 years.

[Strike 4,131]

Yeah, the GOP has been outstanding at honest goverment in the last 40 years.

 

Well, that depends on the meaning of the word "is"......

[gocolts 300]

Yeah, the GOP has been outstanding at honest goverment in the last 40 years.

I wasn't asked about the GOP. I was asked "What democratic principle do you think obama will not uphold?"

 

As you can see, the question had nothing whatsoever to do with the lousy GOP. HTH.

[Voice_Of_Reason 0]

Right here...this argument between colts and dallas is why I'll never understand partisan politics.

I personally beileve you've both been duped by the system. You're not even capable of thinking outside the lines...just like you've been trained to.

 

Colts' bias is clear in his response. He claims McCain owned BHO, yet qualifies it with 'I don't even like McCain'.

To me, it just says "I don't like McCain, but I hate Obama".

Maybe that's true...I don't care at all for Obama's political philosophy. But I always try to put myself in the others shoes.

 

Dallas is clearly biased to the left, and will also follow right down the party line, including going to the abortion issue.

 

Look...if we're waiting for God to rule on whether abortion is ok or not, we're gonna be waiting a long fuckin time, because when/if he does judge on this issue...most of us will likely burn in savage's lake of fire. (which won't ever happen because there is no god)

 

BUT...if you do beleive there is a god...Right or Left...I cannot imagine you can honestly believe that God is down with abortion.

I mean...I'd love to hear this argument.

 

Regardless, the constitution clearly states, every person has a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

I don't see where it gets any clearer on abortion...RIGHT TO LIFE....

 

Oh...I know...the argument gets busted down to science and semantics.

Whatever....

 

My personal belief? I believe abortion is a sad, sad, necessary evil of our planet.

But I certainly don't believe it's a womans choice with her body...it's not like removing a tumor.

 

But I also believe in the Constitution wholeheartedly.

And if the Constitution says everybody has a right to life...it is what it is...IMO.

 

This whole example is only a like sprinkle of why I can't seem to find a way to discsuss politics with most politically educated people.

They're a bunch of sheep IMO...and to even consider listening to a rational thought only drives their pavlovian reaction to refute anything that doesn't 'jive' with their political philosophy.

 

I mean seriously....how do you tie Global Warming into a Right vs. Left issue?

 

It has NOTHING to do with a politcal idealology, yet every leftist buys it, and every rightist doesn't.

How is that??

 

Maybe we've all been duped, and it's time to think for ourselves?

I'm writing in BLS.

[BLS 313]

I wasn't asked about the GOP. I was asked "What democratic principle do you think obama will not uphold?"

 

As you can see, the question had nothing whatsoever to do with the lousy GOP. HTH.

 

 

Colts is getting fired up!

[BLS 313]

I'm writing in BLS.

 

 

[gocolts 300]

Colts is getting fired up!

You are the one who did it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Korben Dallas 0]

Right here...this argument between colts and dallas is why I'll never understand partisan politics.

I personally beileve you've both been duped by the system. You're not even capable of thinking outside the lines...just like you've been trained to.

 

I think you seriously misunderstand me. And I easily admit that I am gulled into the lowest common denominator conversations with the clusterfock of retards that are Coltsjetshugepilot on this message board. I really need to step back and feel sorry for them. But I admit that I get just pissed with the constant slander and dishonesty that they unconditionally display and their constant imaginary strawman assumptions. I need to do better about this and I will try...

 

Colts' bias is clear in his response. He claims McCain owned BHO, yet qualifies it with 'I don't even like McCain'.

To me, it just says "I don't like McCain, but I hate Obama".

Maybe that's true...I don't care at all for Obama's political philosophy. But I always try to put myself in the others shoes.

The deal is that I call bs on this. Colts and the rest of them were never going to vote for a Dem. If you are planning on voting for McCain, then you were NEVER going to leave the armpit of the GOP. McCain is one of the dirtiest politicians in Senate history. He's morally repugnant. I would rather vote for a George Jr. / Ted Kennedy term with Cheney as the guarenteed SC nominee that McCain. I do see the other side, and it's loaded with corruption, lobbyist, moronic foreign policy and a nasty old man that says anything to anyone.

 

 

Dallas is clearly biased to the left, and will also follow right down the party line, including going to the abortion issue

 

Of course I'm left biased. I'm a unapologetic liberal on most issues. I believe in Social Justice, Education, science and progressive government. That's just me. But don't be confused that I'm a party line tool. I have been involved in politics my whole life. I worked for David Karnes and Kay Orr (Sen-NE, I worked at a foreign policy instititute under a GOP administration), I know Chuck Hagel and my parents closest friends are the Heineman's - our current governor. He is a fantastic governor and I can't wait to vote for him again. I voted GOP in the house until the total dimwit Fortenberry came waltzing in funded by the same corrupt losers that supported Bush. However, the national GOP stands for total unbiased and upfront corruption, and has since Ginrich and the new order came along. I admit that when any GOP or conservative says they want or are for something, I immediately am suspicious. But that is a learned behavior.

 

Look...if we're waiting for God to rule on whether abortion is ok or not, we're gonna be waiting a long fuckin time, because when/if he does judge on this issue...most of us will likely burn in savage's lake of fire. (which won't ever happen because there is no god)

 

I totally agree. I am pro-choice for three pragmatic reasons. 1. I'm not a big enough ahole to assume that I understand other peoples condition and life. 2. My grandparents were a doctor and a nurse. Big conservatives and big pro-choice people. My grandfather lost multiple young girl patients to home abortions. They always were disgusted by pro-life idiots that think a law stops abortion. the best place for that to happen is in a medical facility, not done in hiding. 3. Anyone that has worked social services and see's the horrible neglect cases and the abuse, knows that some people shouldn't complete the pregnancy.

 

BUT...if you do beleive there is a god...Right or Left...I cannot imagine you can honestly believe that God is down with abortion.

I mean...I'd love to hear this argument.

 

Thats just it and exactly how Obama said it, we don't know.

 

Regardless, the constitution clearly states, every person has a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

I don't see where it gets any clearer on abortion...RIGHT TO LIFE....

 

Oh...I know...the argument gets busted down to science and semantics.

Whatever....

 

That's right it does come down to science and semantics, and neither side is the authority. I prefer the same path I have for guns. Let people choose on their own, but make rules to limit the extreme.

 

My personal belief? I believe abortion is a sad, sad, necessary evil of our planet.

But I certainly don't believe it's a womans choice with her body...it's not like removing a tumor.

 

Thats your opinion and you are welcome to it. Don't have an abortion

 

But I also believe in the Constitution wholeheartedly.

And if the Constitution says everybody has a right to life...it is what it is...IMO.

 

But is a fetus is not a man, how about the zygote. How about the new right wing position that CONDOMS represent abortion. So then what?

 

In my head, I would be much more willing to accept a pro-life argument if they weren't the same people that want to gut social services, limit federal involvement in adoption, deny already live citizens rights and for capital punishment. (Which I'm for btw)

Its totally hypocritical. You must have the baby, then f off. What kind of compelling argument is that???

 

This whole example is only a like sprinkle of why I can't seem to find a way to discsuss politics with most politically educated people.

They're a bunch of sheep IMO...and to even consider listening to a rational thought only drives their pavlovian reaction to refute anything that doesn't 'jive' with their political philosophy.

 

Granted. I'm the same way some times. I would like to have a legitimate discussion once in a while, instead of all the inuendo and made up tabloid crap.

 

I mean seriously....how do you tie Global Warming into a Right vs. Left issue?

 

It has NOTHING to do with a politcal idealology, yet every leftist buys it, and every rightist doesn't.

How is that??

Amen brotherI totally agree. You help me figure out why 99.9999% of science believes and accepts it, but uneducated people buy oil company rhetoric? I don't get it at all. Why does the right automatically despise science now, I've been confused on this. I don't think it was always like this.

 

Maybe we've all been duped, and it's time to think for ourselves?

I try by reading constantly, on all sides. I swear everyone on here goes to the NatReview online and Savages webpage and just parrots all day. It only takes 10 minutes to realize its total bs. But maybe Chomsky's right. Maybe both sides are actually like fighting over the same crumb of fascism on both the Dem and GOP side. Or maybe Heidegger and Malthus is right and we need a little anti-technology mass death to clear our heads. Tough call.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Regardless, the constitution clearly states, every person has a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

I don't see where it gets any clearer on abortion...RIGHT TO LIFE....

 

So, you want to consider yourself a Constitutionalist, but you don't even know what it says?

 

The Declaration of Independence states that "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness". Let's not confuse documents when you want to talk about issues such as this and don't forget that those men did not want all men to be treated as equals and certainly not women.

 

The Constitution is completely different and if you think that it is that clear on abortion, then perhaps you should inform all of the folks on the Supreme Court over the last 30+ years.

[Rattlesnake 0]

What the HELL have you ever done for your country @ss nuts?

 

McCain was in a Vietnamese prison camp, and since he was the son of an Admiral, they were going to let him go free. But instead of accepting freedom, McCain said he would like to remain in the prison camp with his fellow soldiers, and he was tortured for 3 and a half years in that prison camp alongside his fellow soldiers. McCain is a real man, and not a coward like yourself.

 

McCain is an American Hero, and he's a better man then you are, or I am, or for sure Obama is.

 

Obama is not worthy to eat one of McCain's turds.

 

I respect what McCain what he did and what he went through in that camp......but I guess that my definition of what makes a "real man" and an "American hero" are a tad more involved. Maybe my standards are too high.

[BLS 313]

I think you seriously misunderstand me. And I easily admit that I am gulled into the lowest common denominator conversations with the clusterfock of retards that are Coltsjetshugepilot on this message board. I really need to step back and feel sorry for them. But I admit that I get just pissed with the constant slander and dishonesty that they unconditionally display and their constant imaginary strawman assumptions. I need to do better about this and I will try...

 

Colts' bias is clear in his response. He claims McCain owned BHO, yet qualifies it with 'I don't even like McCain'.

To me, it just says "I don't like McCain, but I hate Obama".

Maybe that's true...I don't care at all for Obama's political philosophy. But I always try to put myself in the others shoes.

 

The deal is that I call bs on this. Colts and the rest of them were never going to vote for a Dem. If you are planning on voting for McCain, then you were NEVER going to leave the armpit of the GOP. McCain is one of the dirtiest politicians in Senate history. He's morally repugnant. I would rather vote for a George Jr. / Ted Kennedy term with Cheney as the guarenteed SC nominee that McCain. I do see the other side, and it's loaded with corruption, lobbyist, moronic foreign policy and a nasty old man that says anything to anyone.

 

I have to completely disagree with you. I seriously doubt I'll vote for McCain. The only reason there's even a crack on the door is my principle.

I cannot swallow today's Liberal pill. That being said, you have no way of knowing really what Colts would do. Colts WAS a pretty staunch GOPer, but I've been paying attention, and he's been trying to think outside the box. I give him ALOT of credit for that. But at times, yes, he will revert to what is 'safe' to him. (as do I, and almost all people)

McCain is dirty. He's also a RINO if there ever was one. But to Colts, the alternative is what he (and many others, myself inlcuded) perceive to be socialism. He'd rather go with a known flip-flopping, dirty, establishment GOPer than have socialsim. Here's the kicker...even though Obama would CLEARLY benefit HIM PERSONALLY (because of his disability status)he continues to carry within him his personal beliefs of right and wrong, and won't waver. For that..he deserves anyones respect (even if you don't agree with his political views)IMO.

 

I wouldn't go throwing around accusations about a particular party. Both sides have their share of slimeballs.

The GOP just happens to have one of it's worst running the whole show.

 

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Dallas is clearly biased to the left, and will also follow right down the party line, including going to the abortion issue

 

Of course I'm left biased. I'm a unapologetic liberal on most issues. I believe in Social Justice, Education, science and progressive government. That's just me. But don't be confused that I'm a party line tool. I have been involved in politics my whole life. I worked for David Karnes and Kay Orr (Sen-NE, I worked at a foreign policy instititute under a GOP administration), I know Chuck Hagel and my parents closest friends are the Heineman's - our current governor. He is a fantastic governor and I can't wait to vote for him again. I voted GOP in the house until the total dimwit Fortenberry came waltzing in funded by the same corrupt losers that supported Bush. However, the national GOP stands for total unbiased and upfront corruption, and has since Ginrich and the new order came along. I admit that when any GOP or conservative says they want or are for something, I immediately am suspicious. But that is a learned behavior.

 

I didn't question your political affiliations. I knew you were involved. I just find that alot of posting here by ALL people is so divided that I basically accused most folks here of towing the line.

 

I feel you on the whole aspect of dirty politicians. I hate the lot of them.

Which I guess is the reason I am so enamored with Ron Paul. He's not dirty and is the antithesis of today's GOP.

 

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Look...if we're waiting for God to rule on whether abortion is ok or not, we're gonna be waiting a long fuckin time, because when/if he does judge on this issue...most of us will likely burn in savage's lake of fire. (which won't ever happen because there is no god)

 

I totally agree. I am pro-choice for three pragmatic reasons. 1. I'm not a big enough ahole to assume that I understand other peoples condition and life. 2. My grandparents were a doctor and a nurse. Big conservatives and big pro-choice people. My grandfather lost multiple young girl patients to home abortions. They always were disgusted by pro-life idiots that think a law stops abortion. the best place for that to happen is in a medical facility, not done in hiding. 3. Anyone that has worked social services and see's the horrible neglect cases and the abuse, knows that some people shouldn't complete the pregnancy.

 

I agree that it's terrible that people were performing home abortions. But I also beleive you are responsible for your own actions.

Although people will mutilate and kill not only a fetus, but themselves by performing a home abortion does not garner any empathy with me.

Your experience with people like this is social services. My experiences are living with people who make up those clientel for the majority of my life.

While I do agree there are kids who are seemingly doomed to a poor childhood, I don't know I agree that 'disposal' is the answer.

 

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BUT...if you do beleive there is a god...Right or Left...I cannot imagine you can honestly believe that God is down with abortion.

I mean...I'd love to hear this argument.

 

Thats just it and exactly how Obama said it, we don't know.

What I took from his statement wasn't what most from the right took from it, rather that he can't answer because he doesn't know what god would think.

Which is what I think you're corraborating.

My point is I don't find anyway anyone can think God would be kosher with it. I don't read the bible, so I ain't going there.

 

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Regardless, the constitution clearly states, every person has a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

I don't see where it gets any clearer on abortion...RIGHT TO LIFE....

 

Oh...I know...the argument gets busted down to science and semantics.

Whatever....

 

That's right it does come down to science and semantics, and neither side is the authority. I prefer the same path I have for guns. Let people choose on their own, but make rules to limit the extreme.

 

What constitutes an 'extreme' when it comes to gun ownership?

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My personal belief? I believe abortion is a sad, sad, necessary evil of our planet.

But I certainly don't believe it's a womans choice with her body...it's not like removing a tumor.

 

Thats your opinion and you are welcome to it. Don't have an abortion.

 

is really all I can say.

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[/color]But I also believe in the Constitution wholeheartedly.

And if the Constitution says everybody has a right to life...it is what it is...IMO.

 

But is a fetus is not a man, how about the zygote. How about the new right wing position that CONDOMS represent abortion. So then what?

 

In my head, I would be much more willing to accept a pro-life argument if they weren't the same people that want to gut social services, limit federal involvement in adoption, deny already live citizens rights and for capital punishment. (Which I'm for btw)

Its totally hypocritical. You must have the baby, then f off. What kind of compelling argument is that???

 

Anyone who thinks that condoms constitute some sort of proactive abortion is a moron. Nuff said.

The argument has been (and still should be) that government should NOT be a player here at all. Matter of fact, many people in politics believe abortion should be a states-right issue, not a federal issue.

But herein lies the major reason why these two philosophies differ greatly. Democrats believe we should provide social services, federal involvement in adoption, etc. Conservatives don't. And I'm speaking for myself when I say there's no way I want to just throw people out on the streets. But to TAKE from me, to give to another who has done nothing to deserve my earnings is wrong. If I want to help those people I will vounteer my time and/or money where I see fit.

Capital punishment? I don't ever recall a baby coming out being a convicted rapist or murderer.

Big difference don't you think?

 

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This whole example is only a like sprinkle of why I can't seem to find a way to discsuss politics with most politically educated people.

They're a bunch of sheep IMO...and to even consider listening to a rational thought only drives their pavlovian reaction to refute anything that doesn't 'jive' with their political philosophy.

 

Granted. I'm the same way some times. I would like to have a legitimate discussion once in a while, instead of all the inuendo and made up tabloid crap.

Ditto.

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I mean seriously....how do you tie Global Warming into a Right vs. Left issue?

 

It has NOTHING to do with a politcal idealology, yet every leftist buys it, and every rightist doesn't.

How is that??

 

Amen brother I totally agree. You help me figure out why 99.9999% of science believes and accepts it, but uneducated people buy oil company rhetoric? I don't get it at all. Why does the right automatically despise science now, I've been confused on this. I don't think it was always like this.

 

I will say this, and leave it here. I'm not well versed on the issue. I haven't read much on it.

But I have no doubts you'll get blasted for saying 99.999% of scientists buy it. And while I may agree that we do have global warming, the big argument will be "WHY".

 

However....because we are talking about why folks can't seem to discern from one party to the other, and bypass the party lines and let reason and logic become the primary drivers in the decision-making process, I don't think you're doing yourself a favor by basically saying you and Liberals are right, and the dumbass Conservatives are uneducated and wrong. This is exactly what I'm walking about in my original post.

 

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Maybe we've all been duped, and it's time to think for ourselves?

 

I try by reading constantly, on all sides. I swear everyone on here goes to the NatReview online and Savages webpage and just parrots all day. It only takes 10 minutes to realize its total bs. But maybe Chomsky's right. Maybe both sides are actually like fighting over the same crumb of fascism on both the Dem and GOP side. Or maybe Heidegger and Malthus is right and we need a little anti-technology mass death to clear our heads. Tough call.

 

Gotta admit...Never read anything about it. Suggested book(s)?

I tend to use my brain and logic. It got me through college. (well..that and my peemus)

 

Good talk.

[BLS 313]

So, you want to consider yourself a Constitutionalist, but you don't even know what it says?

 

The Declaration of Independence states that "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness". Let's not confuse documents when you want to talk about issues such as this and don't forget that those men did not want all men to be treated as equals and certainly not women.

 

The Constitution is completely different and if you think that it is that clear on abortion, then perhaps you should inform all of the folks on the Supreme Court over the last 30+ years.

 

Forgive me oh great one. I should have cut n pasted it.

 

Seriously PFB.....

 

I have my interpretation...you have yours. But to use nothing but a minor grammatical error to chop down what I am getting at is extremely thin.

And especially thin coming from you. I apparently respect you more than you do me.

[Korben Dallas 0]

Getting so darn long and I’m too lazy to add in yet another color….

 

Perhaps I will try to give Colt yet another chance. I have yet to see him do much more than mouth extreme right wing positions, no matter how ridiculous they might be. Calling Obama a Muslim and every other petty and false attack and that bothers me. In addition, Colts accused me of being a pedophile because I’m not a Republican- and I’m never going to be overly OK with him ever again for that. Its hard to respect someone after that...ever.

 

On the Socialism argument. I keep on hearing you'all say this, but I have yet to see some unique argument that Obama makes that labels him any more a socialist than anyone else. I find the “socialism” comment to be one of those generalize attacks that have little to no basis, except as a code word for “not like us”. We live in a Republic with a government infrastructure that requires laws and rules. Providing a safety net isn’t socialism. Creating laws that check the abuses of capitalism isn’t socialism. Socialism is when we create a public ownership of the means of production. I just haven’t seen Obama proposing nationalizing the oil industry or Walmart, so I’m a bit confused about this.

 

Obama

I make no illusions that Obama is my candidate. I’ve liked him for years and I’m very pleased that he is the candidate. I have a completely different perception of his positions and views because I’ve been reading them long before he was a candidate and I didn’t have them filtered through the GOP attack talking points. Which is exactly what I think when I hear “empty suit” rhetoric. As soon as I hear that, I know they haven’t bothered to actually read Obama’s positions, his editorials, or followed his actions over the years. Some of his writing is brilliant work. He ‘s an easy target because he often writes what he thinks is right, not the latest talking point. Which might be why people think that he isn’t polished in impromptu speaking. He’s actually thinking, its quite rare and why I like him.

 

McCain…ughhh. I want to vomit every time someone says he’s bi-partisan. He might be the most hated Senator left of the aisle. Its all an illusion, he’s not a maverick or a independent. He’s a total shill and a corrupt one at that. He pretends to deliberate, but he never crosses the aisle. And every time something comes up; the fact that he was one of the focking Keating 5, that he sold out Boeing while taking money from Airbus, that his economic expert likely caused both of our economic crises now, that he changes his mind every 18 seconds, on and on and on and on and on. The first thing I hear is, "he sacrificed for his country as a POW. " OK, I get it. So did thousands of hero’s. That doesn’t make him the slightest bit qualified to lead our country. And it rings hollow when he gets an F rated by the veterans groups. He always votes against the troops and he always votes against veteran interest, unless it’s a photo op that is.

I’d vote for Bob Dole and David Duke over McCain.

 

 

I wouldn't go throwing around accusations about a particular party. Both sides have their share of slimeballs.

The GOP just happens to have one of it's worst running the whole show.

 

Personally, I don’t think there is a comparison at this point. It’s like comparing 3rd graders cheating at jacks to fixing NFL games over the past 8 years. They've robbed us blind since day one of the Bush era. Hopefully it will change, but its current GOP policy to be corrupt and its from top to bottom. Sorry, but its true.

 

 

Ron Paul - Which I guess is the reason I am so enamored with Ron Paul. He's not dirty and is the antithesis of today's GOP.

I totally give you this. This is the one thing that I really like about Ron Paul. He might be a bit crazy, but at least he’s honest about it.

 

 

Abortion is flat out too divisive. No one is ever going to convince anyone of any other positions on it. I’d just rather we left it to the individual with rules – 3rd trimester, etc.

 

 

What I took from his statement wasn't what most from the right took from it, rather that he can't answer because he doesn't know what god would think.

 

Good example of the tabloid crap. Of course that’s how he meant it and its how everyone took it until Hannity and the crew twisted it and told everyone it was something “evil”..

 

 

 

What constitutes an 'extreme' when it comes to gun ownership?

 

We need rules on guns. The NRA’s position is that 5 year olds should be able to walk into the local Handy Market and buy an Uzi that is loaded next to the candy without any taxation. If you think, "no one wants that!" Then welcome to the gun control side, we’ll be expecting your donation soon.

 

 

Anyone who thinks that condoms constitute some sort of proactive abortion is a moron. Nuff said.

 

That is not a very nice way to talk about the sitting president, the religous right and the head of health and human services. I totally agree of course.

 

 

Democrats believe we should provide social services, federal involvement in adoption, etc. Conservatives don't. And I'm speaking for myself when I say there's no way I want to just throw people out on the streets. But to TAKE from me, to give to another who has done nothing to deserve my earnings is wrong. If I want to help those people I will vounteer my time and/or money where I see fit.

 

What about roads and police and fire, what about the FDA? What about the CDC or foster care. Would you rather have small children just starve to death? Hoping you’ll have a kind heart and throw them a nickel when you walk by? The reality is that social cooperation is the cornerstone of a civil 1st world society. All of these are social services that have value. I'd much rather give the 1% of my tax dollars to help my fellow citizens, than the 3% to fraudulent and unaccounted for payments to Halliburton, ie Cheney's retirement fund.

 

Capital punishment? I don't ever recall a baby coming out being a convicted rapist or murderer.

Big difference don't you think?

 

Depends, is life sacred? Or is it conditional? Once you make the conditionality argument, then life can be terminated with conditions and that’s the slippery slope. Personally, I don't think its a baby until its viable, which is at about 22 weeks with today technology.

 

I will say this, and leave it here. I'm not well versed on the issue. I haven't read much on it.

But I have no doubts you'll get blasted for saying 99.999% of scientists buy it. And while I may agree that we do have global warming, the big argument will be "WHY".

 

OK, I’ll go with 100% of climate scientists that aren’t on the payroll of Exxon. I will give Exxon credit though, they’ve done an amazing job on this. People seriously think there is a doubt. Every time some doubter shows up, it turns out that they are on the payroll of some shell group funded by Exxon. Did you know that marketing consultant for Exxon is the exact same guy that said that smoking causes cancer isn’t sound science either. Exact same model. Just brilliant. You right on the why or the amount of human impact. But there’s the rub, people without politics as the focus will discuss that. Hacks start with, the earth isn’t warming….

 

The liberals aren’t right, its not a liberal argument, it’s the argument of the science community. The conservative movement labels it as liberal as a means of belittling it.

 

 

Gotta admit...Never read anything about it. Suggested book(s)?

I tend to use my brain and logic. It got me through college. (well..that and my peemus)

 

Ah crap, all day. If you haven’t read Manufacturing Consent by Chomsky, it’s a real eye opener and a fascinating read. And his later stuff will make you think, "Crap, what I thought was liberal is actually moderate by comparison." There’s an entire left that is ignored, unlike the extreme right, which has there own 24/7 news channel. I don't agree with Chomsky on his political views. His arguments are flawless, but you have to agree that Hegemony and US military might is bad and I just don't.

 

But For day to day reading, I suggest the Christian Science Monitor. Wonderfully objective and exceptional writing.