Officiating in the Packers - Cardinals game

[MDC 5,893]

I didn't really have a rooting interest in this game, but the officiating was just wretched in overtime - obvious helmet-to-helmet hit on Rodgers during the last drive and the final play ended with a fumble during about the most obvious facemask of a QB I've seen. The worst part is the ref is clearly in the shot on the replay looking right at Rodgers when it happened. The Cardinals were the better team and deserved to win, but I hate watching hideously missed calls affect the outcome of a game.

[robertd52 0]

I didn't really have a rooting interest in this game, but the officiating was just wretched in overtime - obvious helmet-to-helmet hit on Rodgers during the last drive and the final play ended with a fumble during about the most obvious facemask of a QB I've seen. The worst part is the ref is clearly in the shot on the replay looking right at Rodgers when it happened. The Cardinals were the better team and deserved to win, but I hate watching hideously missed calls affect the outcome of a game.

 

Yea, I wondered about that...is there any chance that maybe cause the ball was out first the facemask isnt really applicable? I dont believe so, just playing devils advocate...

[Foghorn Leghorn 0]

I thought I was the only one to see the facemask on Rodgers. Yes, the ball was loose first, but it was still a facemask. Question is, would the penalty be enforced after the change of possession?

[MDC 5,893]

I thought I was the only one to see the facemask on Rodgers. Yes, the ball was loose first, but it was still a facemask. Question is, would the penalty be enforced after the change of possession?

 

I don't know, but my guess is that the Packers would've maintained possession. The facemask may have occurred after the fumble but it definitely occurred before the fumble recovery.

 

Just bugs me to see such an obvious missed call at such a huge moment.

[Saint Elistan 106]

Question is, would the penalty be enforced after the change of possession?

 

I honestly have no idea how the officiating crew could have handled that. The game can't end on a defensive penalty, right? Or is it different with Sudden Death rules? That play had so much wrong with it that they probably didn't have any idea how to interpret the rules.

[Foghorn Leghorn 0]

I don't know, but my guess is that the Packers would've maintained possession. The facemask may have occurred after the fumble but it definitely occurred before the fumble recovery.

 

Just bugs me to see such an obvious missed call at such a huge moment.

 

I honestly have no idea how the officiating crew could have handled that. The game can't end on a defensive penalty, right? Or is it different with Sudden Death rules? That play had so much wrong with it that they probably didn't have any idea how to interpret the rules.

 

My guess is it would go one of two ways:

 

1) Before change of possession - 15 yard penalty from the original line of scrimmage, first down and 10 for the Packers

2) After change of possession - 15 yard penalty from the spot of the foul, first down and 10 for the Cardinals

 

But if #2 is dependent on where the play concludes, then what? First and 10 for the Cards at the Packer 15?

[Reality 2,710]

I've seen the play 10 times. The ball is out, after that I could really care less about the face mask. Maybe give the ball to Arizona with a penalty, but I dont really even see that.

 

RB's rip defenders down by the face mask all day long, once you drop the ball you are no longer the mythical protected QB.

[donhaas 18]

I think these penalties were pretty obvious....

Not as obvious as, say, the AZ offensive lineman holding Jenkins on the TD pass and throwing him into Warner (getting a roughing the passer penalty on Jenkins in the process..HAHAHAHA)..

Not as obvious as both of Fitz's TD passes where he threw Woodson down to the ground and was therefore wide open....

 

But pretty obvious, nonetheless!

[FeelingMN 273]

I think these penalties were pretty obvious....

Not as obvious as, say, the AZ offensive lineman holding Jenkins on the TD pass and throwing him into Warner (getting a roughing the passer penalty on Jenkins in the process..HAHAHAHA)..

Not as obvious as both of Fitz's TD passes where he threw Woodson down to the ground and was therefore wide open....

 

But pretty obvious, nonetheless!

 

Disagree with you and Troy about the Jenkins penalty. It's a hands to the face call, and that has been called in every game this year.

 

But everything else, you're right about. Fitz did push off, but only on 1 TD....the other one he and Woodson just got tangled up.....and Rodgers took a helmet to helmet hit which was never called.

 

Yeah, there were some missed calls...but no more than any other NFL game. The bigger travesty was the number of missed tackles. How can the #2 defense not know how to tackle? Or cover anyone? yuck....

[Gepetto 988]

What bothered me was the over officiating in the Cowboys Eagles game. Ed Hocoli calls every ticky tack thing he can find. His over analyzing and throwing flag after flag after flag really messed up the flow of the game.

[Franknbeans 46]

I think these penalties were pretty obvious....

Not as obvious as, say, the AZ offensive lineman holding Jenkins on the TD pass and throwing him into Warner (getting a roughing the passer penalty on Jenkins in the process..HAHAHAHA)..

Not as obvious as both of Fitz's TD passes where he threw Woodson down to the ground and was therefore wide open....

 

But pretty obvious, nonetheless!

stay classy Packer fans

[donhaas 18]

stay classy Packer fans

 

Yes... you would surely never mention game-changing calls against your team.... HAHAHAHA

Especially obvious ones on the last two plays of the game.... HAHAHA

 

Why is that a matter of class especially looking at the thread title (started by a non-Packer fan) and especially because I included the caveat "The Packers didn't deserve to win with the way their defense played anyways"...

 

Props to the Cardinals for winning what turned out to be a very great game to watch....

But, unfortunately, they had the benefit of some terrible calls -- one being that awful and obvious helmet-to-helmet shot on Rodgers (15 yards) and the other being a hands to face/face mask (the defenders hands were oh is facemask for what seemed like an eternity) on the very next play.

 

HTH!

[Bert 1,091]

Not as obvious as, say, the AZ offensive lineman holding Jenkins on the TD pass and throwing him into Warner (getting a roughing the passer penalty on Jenkins in the process..HAHAHAHA)..

 

Speaking of obvious face masks. I guess you and that idiot Aikman missed the part of the play where Jenkins grabbed Warners face mask and drug him to the ground as he was falling.

[Franknbeans 46]

Yes... you would surely never mention game-changing calls against your team.... HAHAHAHA

Especially obvious ones on the last two plays of the game.... HAHAHA

 

Why is that a matter of class especially looking at the thread title (started by a non-Packer fan) and especially because I included the caveat "The Packers didn't deserve to win with the way their defense played anyways"...

 

Props to the Cardinals for winning what turned out to be a very great game to watch....

But, unfortunately, they had the benefit of some terrible calls -- one being that awful and obvious helmet-to-helmet shot on Rodgers (15 yards) and the other being a hands to face/face mask (the defenders hands were oh is facemask for what seemed like an eternity) on the very next play.

 

HTH!

because I'm f'in with you?

[donhaas 18]

because I'm f'in with you?

 

I'm a little sensitive today...

[KSB2424 3,083]

As a fan of neither team I gotta agree with the OP. The ref's sucked. For all the reasons stated. But it happens. They cannot see every single thing. Tough break Packer fan.

 

With that said the Cardinals played well enough to win and in my opinion was the better team (by a hair) so....whatever.

[surferskin 30]

Would you guys really rather have a game like this get decided on a ticky tack penalty? Seriously?

 

He touched the QB's facemask.

[KSB2424 3,083]

Would you guys really rather have a game like this get decided on a ticky tack penalty? Seriously?

 

He touched the QB's facemask.

I don't really care who won but that is not the point though. Like you, I think the rules in regards to protecting the QB are to strict. I don't like the rule. HOWEVER that is the rule. That is how they called it all season. If you breathed on Tom Brady you got a 15 yard penalty. If you jammed a QB's head/face mask in all 284 games this season there was a flag thrown.

 

I don't like the rule either, but it is the rule and should be enforced as such. Or else you are not being consistent as an official. If you are gonna call it in the 1rst quarter of the game you should also call it in OT. You don't change the rules on the fly.

[donhaas 18]

Would you guys really rather have a game like this get decided on a ticky tack penalty? Seriously?

 

He touched the QB's facemask.

 

Because it's the rules, dipsh!t...

 

That's like saying, who cares if there was a little illegal motion on that game winning play, a little offsides, a little pass interference...

 

If your Washington Lions had more than 3 wins and were in the playoffs and lost a very tight overtime game because of it (and because of the helmet-to-helmet on the play before) you would be squawking as loud as anybody...

 

Don't be silly, Surferskin!

[surferskin 30]

I don't really care who won but that is not the point though. Like you, I think the rules in regards to protecting the QB are to strict. I don't like the rule. HOWEVER that is the rule. That is how they called it all season. If you breathed on Tom Brady you got a 15 yard penalty. If you jammed a QB's head/face mask in all 284 games this season there was a flag thrown.

 

I don't like the rule either, but it is the rule and should be enforced as such. Or else you are not being consistent as an official. If you are gonna call it in the 1rst quarter of the game you should also call it in OT. You don't chanbe the rules on the fly.

Since when are they ever consistent? If anything, I'd rather them err on the side of letting them play. Any roughing of Rogers was irrelevant to the actual play. It had nothing to do with the turnover. This is the playoffs. Let em play.

[donhaas 18]

I don't really care who won but that is not the point though. Like you, I think the rules in regards to protecting the QB are to strict. I don't like the rule. HOWEVER that is the rule. That is how they called it all season. If you breathed on Tom Brady you got a 15 yard penalty. If you jammed a QB's head/face mask in all 284 games this season there was a flag thrown.

 

I don't like the rule either, but it is the rule and should be enforced as such. Or else you are not being consistent as an official. If you are gonna call it in the 1rst quarter of the game you should also call it in OT. You don't chanbe the rules on the fly.

 

+1

 

 

and he didn't touch the facemask.... his hand was all up in there for a good while

[surferskin 30]

Wahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!

There there, little guy. :consol:

[FlaHawker 24]

The NFL has problems with its officials? Really?

[KSB2424 3,083]

Since when are they ever consistent? If anything, I'd rather them err on the side of letting them play. Any roughing of Rogers was irrelevant to the actual play. It had nothing to do with the turnover. This is the playoffs. Let em play.

I more or less agree with you.

 

But if I'm Packer fan and I see where my team was called for a roughing the QB penalty earlier in the game. Then a head to head hit happens on my QB, then a play later they pop him in the face mask. I am a little pissed. I can understand the frustration.

[donhaas 18]

There there, little guy. :consol:

 

 

I get your point.... but you know you'd be the first person crying if it happened to you....

 

Don't pretend if the Washington Redskins season ended on a penalty that wasn't called, you'd be cool with it....

 

HAHAHAHA!

[surferskin 30]

I more or less agree with you.

 

But if I'm Packer fan and I see where my team was called for a roughing the QB penalty earlier in the game. Then a head to head hit happens on my QB, then a play later they pop him in the face mask. I am a little pissed. I can understand the frustration.

Sure as a Peckers fan, I could see that. You live in a frozen shithole. The average woman around is 250 and hairier than Robin Williams. You can't afford to replace your Fav-ruh traitor jersey because of the recession. The only thing you've got left is some moldy cheese and beast light. Of course you're going to look for a scapegoat.

[donhaas 18]

Sure as a Peckers fan, I could see that. You live in a frozen shithole. The average woman around is 250 and hairier than Robin Williams. You can't afford to replace your Fav-ruh traitor jersey because of the recession. The only thing you've got left is some moldy cheese and beast light. Of course you're going to look for a scapegoat.

 

C-

 

"Favre traitor jersey because of the recession" bumped it up from a "D"

 

 

More food for thought for you.....

 

A penalty is a penalty. As I said, it's hard to fault the referee for missing the facemask. I do believe he made a big mistake by averting his eyes from the quarterback on the first no-call. On the possible facemask, if anything, this further illustrates an opinion I've had in the past that more calls should be reviewable. If that was the case, the final play would have been taken to the replay process and they would have called facemask.

 

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/01/10/packers...ing-controversy

[enis_44 0]

On the final play, there should have been a facemask call. It should have been applied however the rule works on a loose ball facemask.

It was 100% obvious. I noticed it real-time before the replay.

In fact, it took the replay for me to see that the facemask didn't actually cause the fumble.

[Walter34 3]

C-

 

"Favre traitor jersey because of the recession" bumped it up from a "D"

More food for thought for you.....

 

A penalty is a penalty. As I said, it's hard to fault the referee for missing the facemask. I do believe he made a big mistake by averting his eyes from the quarterback on the first no-call. On the possible facemask, if anything, this further illustrates an opinion I've had in the past that more calls should be reviewable. If that was the case, the final play would have been taken to the replay process and they would have called facemask.

 

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/01/10/packers...ing-controversy

 

While I dont disagree that the reffing was shoddy, you always just focus on one side of the coin. There was a ton of missed calls and blunders going both ways. It's hard to take your points seriously when you only focus on GB the victim.

 

I'm not arguing that the calls you mentioned were not blown, just that ommision of others taints the case.

[donhaas 18]

While I dont disagree that the reffing was shoddy, you always just focus on one side of the coin. There was a ton of missed calls and blunders going both ways. It's hard to take your points seriously when you only focus on GB the victim.

 

I'm not arguing that the calls you mentioned were not blown, just that ommision of others taints the case.

 

Oh... are you talking about the two times Fitz pushed Woodson down to the ground and then scored wide-open touchdown passes?

 

I guess we can mention that, but I really think what MDC was focusing on was the two gigantic calls missed at the end of the game that ultimately determined the outcome of the game....

 

 

Feel better now?

[Cruzer 1,992]

There were some blown calls for sure.......And maybe they change the out come of the game, maybe not.......My take: make a stop, play some kind of defense, keep the other team from scoring 45 points and don't leave it in an officials hands.

[FeelingMN 273]

the two gigantic calls missed at the end of the game that ultimately determined the outcome of the game....

 

Ultimately, the Packers lost because they couldn't stop Warner.....and maybe because Rodgers overthrew a wide open Jennings the first play of overtime......and maybe because Early Doucet looked like Jerry Rice.....and maybe because Rodgers turned the ball over twice in his own territory.

 

But keep blaming the refs if it makes it easier for you.

 

[Sho Nuff 719]

There were some blown calls for sure.......And maybe they change the out come of the game, maybe not.......My take: make a stop, play some kind of defense, keep the other team from scoring 45 points and don't leave it in an officials hands.

 

I agree with you. Which is why you won't find a post by me blaming the refs.

The D was bad...and Rodgers made 2 big mistakes turning the ball over (and another on missing Jennings in OT).

[Thre3Deep 0]

I rather have a game like this decided on a defensive play! I do believe it was the head refs 2nd playoff game. None the less, with a wide open game like this, there were enough blown calls that could of went either way if you watch it again.

 

As for the facemask, TS, happened after the ball was out, the refs focus turns to the ball and what is transpiring around it. The QB is just another Defensive player at that Point.

 

Good no call.

 

 

Hopefully another shoot out in NO next week. And a highly entertaining game to say the least.

[Walter34 3]

Oh... are you talking about the two times Fitz pushed Woodson down to the ground and then scored wide-open touchdown passes?

 

I guess we can mention that, but I really think what MDC was focusing on was the two gigantic calls missed at the end of the game that ultimately determined the outcome of the game....

Feel better now?

 

helmet on helmet missed call - agree. Call it 15 yards moving the pack out to around the 25 yard line.

 

face mask - sure, but it was clearly after the fumble. Arizona ball at the spot of the foul and 15 yards back.

 

Arizona ball at the GB 35 or 40.

 

Despite rackers earlier miss, that still would have meant a probable Ari win.

 

Another less important gaffe was when Fitz caught the key pass on the sidelines in the last minute. He is knowcked out of bounds, yet the clock continues to tick down. The lost time forced Ari into an FG earlier than they may have.

 

Anyway, dont turn into a seahawk fan and piss and moan about ref screw jobs for years after the game. It's unbecoming.

[donhaas 18]

Ultimately, the Packers lost because they couldn't stop Warner.....and maybe because Rodgers overthrew a wide open Jennings the first play of overtime......and maybe because Early Doucet looked like Jerry Rice.....and maybe because Rodgers turned the ball over twice in his own territory.

 

But keep blaming the refs if it makes it easier for you.

 

 

Ultimately the 1972 USA basketball team lost because they didn't score more points than the Russians....

 

Bunch of poosay whiners they all are

 

 

 

I've already said that the Packers lost because their defense was atrocious....

But that doesn't make the bad calls that determined the end of this game any less egregious....

[FeelingMN 273]

I've already said that the Packers lost because their defense was atrocious....

But that doesn't make the bad calls that determined the end of this game any less egregious....

 

Trying to have it both ways, aren't you? Sure, there were some no calls. The helmet to helmet hit should have been flagged. The NFL obviously wants to protect QBs...and for good reason....but there is so much variability in the rule it's sickening. If that's Favre or Manning or Brady....there'd be 12 flags on the field. And if they make that call, it negates the holding penalty, and you replay the down....2nd and 10 is different than 2nd and 20....which affects how the Pack approach that situation.

 

But that was the only true blown call in my opinion. Rodgers fumbled, then had his facemask grabbed. At worst, Arizona ball at the 35....and you have to rely on your #2 defense to make a stop.....

 

So quit saying the refs determined the game.....they didn't. Yes....there were blown calls.....there always are in every game.....but the game was determined....ultimately....by the players on the field.

 

Quit crying.

[donhaas 18]

Quit crying.

 

Who's crying?

 

I'm just trying to have an interesting discussion (as is the author of this thread -- an Eagles fan who doesn't particularly like the Packers)...

....and you can bet any money in the world that if the Colts or the Bears or the Vikings or whatever team your rooting for right now got jobbed at the end of an overtime game, you would be mentioning it, too!

 

[Cruzer 1,992]

I agree with you. Which is why you won't find a post by me blaming the refs.

The D was bad...and Rodgers made 2 big mistakes turning the ball over (and another on missing Jennings in OT).

Props for that.

[Dashow28 6]

I don't know...when a team scores 45 points (before the last TD) I find it hard to blame the officials, myself. Packers had the #2 defense and they got friggen WORKED!!! Warner missed 4 passes, can't blame that on the refs, that's on Warner being on, and of course the Packers defense getting owned. Whocet, I mean Doucet, looked like Boldin on those broken tackles out there. Don't blame the refs, don't even blame Rodgers for the turnovers, blame the defense that gave up so many points and yards. I mean, they were the #2 defense in the NFL, right? Play like it.