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Ray_T

thoughts on Mahomes so far....

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17 minutes ago, polecatt said:

I don't know, Mahomes looks like he's as good as he's ever been through two weeks.

How he finishes up, I don't know, but I think he's as likely as any QB to be #1

he does look good. 

what doesnt look so good compared to last year is his #1 WR.

hes still an elite QB.   just not an elite Fantasy QB.   there is a difference.

 

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4 hours ago, Ray_T said:

to be clear, he is still startable.  still very good. 

thanks for clearing that up :thumbsup:

 

As far as Mahomes for fantasy, he torched a so-so secondary in week 1 and was ho-hum last night. He may still hold a slim lead as the top QB after this week plays out but I don't expect that to continue. As noted, he was not the top scoring QB WITH Tyreek Hill. That said he is a top tier QB capable of winning weeks. What more could you ask for?

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A Qb capable of winning weeks could be had in the double digit rounds also,, and one can stream a Qb capable of winning weeks, it happens all the time.  

When one drafts a Qb so early he should be in the top three, and Mahomes won’t be.  

 

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This receiving Corp is better than last year.   I said what I said

 

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3 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

This receiving Corp is better than last year.   I said what I said

 

Says the KC fan.  

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2 hours ago, kcBlitzkrieg said:

Some fun reading material…

 

From that thread, I'm still ok with this stance: 

 

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2 minutes ago, weepaws said:

A Qb capable of winning weeks could be had in the double digit rounds also,, and one can stream a Qb capable of winning weeks, it happens all the time.  

When one drafts a Qb so early he should be in the top three, and Mahomes won’t be.  

 

eh, not really. 

Matt Stafford was the QB5 last season, often drafted as one of the last starting QB's or as a high end QB2. He never had a single week over 30 fantasy points. Aaron Rodgers, last year, WITH Adams, never had a single fantasy week over 30 points. Russell Wilson, drafted this year in similar range to Rodgers, never had a single healthy week over 28 fantasy points in 2021. I could go on.

in 2021, despite not finishing as a top 3 fantasy QB, Mahomes had 4 weeks scoring over 30 fantasy points including 36 points in week 10. Josh Allen had 3 weeks of 36-37 points. Justin Herbert had a 36 point game and a 40 point game. Lamar Jackson is another guy you target because he can win you weeks. In 2021, despite injury and pretty poor play overall, he had weeks of 36, 40, 34. 

so yeah there is a difference between the guys who can win you weeks and the lower end / streaming QBs of the world. 

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7 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

This receiving Corp is better than last year.   I said what I said

 

I dont agree.  Tyreek is an irreplaceable player. 

but we dont have to agree.  you know why I feel how I do.  clearly you feel differently and would likely have more KC players on your various rosters than I do.

for the record I own zero shares of KC receivers this year.    I like Kelce but not at the price.

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14 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

eh, not really. 

Matt Stafford was the QB5 last season, often drafted as one of the last starting QB's or as a high end QB2. He never had a single week over 30 fantasy points. Aaron Rodgers, last year, WITH Adams, never had a single fantasy week over 30 points. Russell Wilson, drafted this year in similar range to Rodgers, never had a single healthy week over 28 fantasy points in 2021. I could go on.

in 2021, despite not finishing as a top 3 fantasy QB, Mahomes had 4 weeks scoring over 30 fantasy points including 36 points in week 10. Josh Allen had 3 weeks of 36-37 points. Justin Herbert had a 36 point game and a 40 point game. Lamar Jackson is another guy you target because he can win you weeks. In 2021, despite injury and pretty poor play overall, he had weeks of 36, 40, 34. 

so yeah there is a difference between the guys who can win you weeks and the lower end / streaming QBs of the world. 

No no, I don’t always need a 30 point day from my Qb to better my opponents Qb.  Right now I’m going against Mahomes in two leagues, he scored 18 points last night, both those leagues I have Cousins, all I need is 19 to beat his Mahomes. 

One can easily win with double digit round qbs, and or streaming.  

Thanks. 

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16 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

I dont agree.  Tyreek is an irreplaceable player. 

but we dont have to agree.  you know why I feel how I do.  clearly you feel differently and would likely have more KC players on your various rosters than I do.

for the record I own zero shares of KC receivers this year.    I like Kelce but not at the price.

JuJu and MVs both stink.  

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10 minutes ago, weepaws said:

No no, I don’t always need a 30 point day from my Qb to better my opponents Qb.  Right now I’m going against Mahomes in two leagues, he scored 18 points last night, both those leagues I have Cousins, all I need is 19 to beat his Mahomes. 

One can easily win with double digit round qbs, and or streaming.  

Thanks. 

Then you completely misunderstood my post, which is not at all surprising. 

I was talking about QB's who have the capability to win you s single fantasy week.  

Not talking about what you or anyone else needs individually to beat your opponents QB, or if you can win with a QB selected in the later rounds. :rolleyes:.  Matt Stafford again was a QB you could play and win with all season in 2021, drafted in the later rounds.

Again, I was talking about the types of players who have the capability of going OFF and almost carrying you to a weekly win.

 

Most people likely understand what I meant. 

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I'm not disagreeing that tyreek is a difference maker.   But on down the line, guys like Pringle and Robinson and so on aren't on the roster and the options for mahomes overall are better 

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1 hour ago, WhiteWonder said:

Again, I was talking about the types of players who have the capability of going OFF and almost carrying you to a weekly win.

 

Most people likely understand what I meant. 

Most people do, especially those who own Mahomes and probably won week 1 when he dropped a 40 spot. and was QB1

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2 hours ago, WhiteWonder said:

eh, not really. 

Matt Stafford was the QB5 last season, often drafted as one of the last starting QB's or as a high end QB2. He never had a single week over 30 fantasy points. Aaron Rodgers, last year, WITH Adams, never had a single fantasy week over 30 points. Russell Wilson, drafted this year in similar range to Rodgers, never had a single healthy week over 28 fantasy points in 2021. I could go on.

in 2021, despite not finishing as a top 3 fantasy QB, Mahomes had 4 weeks scoring over 30 fantasy points including 36 points in week 10. Josh Allen had 3 weeks of 36-37 points. Justin Herbert had a 36 point game and a 40 point game. Lamar Jackson is another guy you target because he can win you weeks. In 2021, despite injury and pretty poor play overall, he had weeks of 36, 40, 34. 

so yeah there is a difference between the guys who can win you weeks and the lower end / streaming QBs of the world. 

You said here, a difference between guys who can win you weeks , I understand what you said without all the other Stafford stuff, one can win weeks with the lower level guys also. Stafford and Cousins where my two qbs last season, Stafford avg one point less per game than Mahomes who had all those 30 point games , he also than must have had some not so good games.  Cousins avg 3 points less per game.  

One can win with these lower level guys. 

Thanks. 

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2 hours ago, cmh6476 said:

This receiving Corp is better than last year.   I said what I said

 

 

1 hour ago, cmh6476 said:

I'm not disagreeing that tyreek is a difference maker.   But in down the line, guys like Pringle and Robinson and so on aren't on the roster and the options for mahomes overall are better 

You’re saying more depth? Right now I’m not buying, JuJu stinks, MVS stinks.  Who else? 

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4 minutes ago, weepaws said:

You said here, a difference between guys who can win you weeks , I understand what you said without all the other Stafford stuff, one can win weeks with the lower level guys also. Stafford and Cousins where my two qbs last season, Stafford avg one point less per game than Mahomes who had all those 30 point games , he also than must have had some not so good games.  Cousins avg 3 points less per game.  

One can win with these lower level guys. 

Thanks. 

Yeah, you're not grasping what I meant. Obviously there are many QBs who can be part of a weekly winning team by putting up very good performances. It is obvious you don't understand because you are referencing average points.. which is a season long metric.

 

Once again, I was talking about the special ones (often because of their rushing ability ... see Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson)... who can prop up your team and single handedly win you a week.

 

Thanks

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21 minutes ago, weepaws said:

 

You’re saying more depth? Right now I’m not buying, JuJu stinks, MVS stinks.  Who else? 

Juju, mvs, Hardman, Moore and Watson are better than Hill, Robinson, Hardman, Pringle and Kemp.  Robinson was cut by the raiders and Pringle struggling to get pt with the bears.   I don't even know if Kemp is on a team right now.   Now we have 5 guys that are at least competent.   Still, just this guy's opinion. 

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12 minutes ago, Skinny_Bastard said:

Only 2 weeks.  My money says he won't finish in the top 5.  He sure did get hit a lot yesterday.

Not every team brings at you Joey Bosa and Khalil Mack, but I agree. 

Also remember the Chiefs failed to negotiate a new contract for Orlando Brown Jr, and he didn't help his cause yesterday.  If you want paid like a top 5 LT, play like one. 

 

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3 hours ago, cmh6476 said:

Juju, mvs, Hardman, Moore and Watson are better than Hill, Robinson, Hardman, Pringle and Kemp.  Robinson was cut by the raiders and Pringle struggling to get pt with the bears.   I don't even know if Kemp is on a team right now.   Now we have 5 guys that are at least competent.   Still, just this guy's opinion. 

Okay thanks. 

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Also Trey Smith played with a hurt ankle yesterday and fared well, considering.   Some didn't think he'd be ready to play on a short week.   Hopefully that heals and improves his mobility. 

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3 hours ago, WhiteWonder said:

Yeah, you're not grasping what I meant. Obviously there are many QBs who can be part of a weekly winning team by putting up very good performances. It is obvious you don't understand because you are referencing average points.. which is a season long metric.

 

Once again, I was talking about the special ones (often because of their rushing ability ... see Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson)... who can prop up your team and single handedly win you a week.

 

Thanks

So 30 points wins you a week? Not in my leagues, it takes usually 100 plus points.  So if my special Qb gets 30, and the rest of  my team gets me 65 I would lose, but if my Qb gets me 24 , and the rest of my team gets me 76 points I would win , and that’s made possible because I’m loading up on those rb/wr while everyone else is taking 30 point qbs , the special ones , that run.  

Thanks.  

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1 hour ago, weepaws said:

So 30 points wins you a week? Not in my leagues, it takes usually 100 plus points.  So if my special Qb gets 30, and the rest of  my team gets me 65 I would lose, but if my Qb gets me 24 , and the rest of my team gets me 76 points I would win , and that’s made possible because I’m loading up on those rb/wr while everyone else is taking 30 point qbs , the special ones , that run.  

Thanks.  

no one is saying not to load up on rb/wr. No one is saying a 30 point game alone will win your week (or a 35, 37, 40 points game). you're being too literal just for the sake of arguing. A QB that can play hero ball on any given week can mask a few poor performances elsewhere in your lineup and win you the week. It really very simple.

but also not worth trying to explain to clueless posters.

 

thanks.

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2 hours ago, WhiteWonder said:

no one is saying not to load up on rb/wr. No one is saying a 30 point game alone will win your week (or a 35, 37, 40 points game). you're being too literal just for the sake of arguing. A QB that can play hero ball on any given week can mask a few poor performances elsewhere in your lineup and win you the week. It really very simple.

but also not worth trying to explain to clueless posters.

 

thanks.

Hey you need to apologize to those you just called clueless posters.  

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18 hours ago, AxeElf said:

Um, the season already started, and Mahomes IS the QB1 in fantasy (and he was even before he played a second game).  In case you weren't scoring at home, "the best" is a notch ABOVE elite.

595 yards, 7 TDs, 0 INTs through 2 games...  on pace for 5,000 and 60.

Yeah, he might be startable, if you need a bye week fill-in...  lol

Remember when you complained because I used Week 1 as a rationale for something?

Now here you are....

 

Hypocrite. 

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15 hours ago, weepaws said:

No no, I don’t always need a 30 point day from my Qb to better my opponents Qb.  Right now I’m going against Mahomes in two leagues, he scored 18 points last night, both those leagues I have Cousins, all I need is 19 to beat his Mahomes. 

One can easily win with double digit round qbs, and or streaming.  

Thanks. 

Looking at an individual week is the wrong way to do analysis on this. You are looking over the course of a season. 

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4 hours ago, Sean Mooney said:

Looking at an individual week is the wrong way to do analysis on this. You are looking over the course of a season. 

 I’m looking at weekly, and so do you. 

Do you not adjust your lineup week to week based on matchups, one doesn’t just draft players and never rotate them. 

Do you? 

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6 hours ago, Sean Mooney said:

Remember when you complained because I used Week 1 as a rationale for something?

Now here you are....

 

Hypocrite. 

there are times when you can look at one week and figure some things out.   I find it especially useful when you see how a team uses a certain player (or doesnt use them)

the red flags I dont need to wait longer than a week for would be when a player isnt being used and we dont have a solid rationale as to why.   those situations can make a borderline player not worth hanging onto.

thats not the case here. we are looking at a clear cut starter.

he looked great in week 1.   mediocre in game 2.   he had some good moments, but WR who performed in game 1 seemed to disappear in week 2.   a little concerning to be sure.

chargers played a good game on defense.   but I think we will see a lot of this over the season.   I think Mahomes still tears apart weak defenses.  but the tough defenses will be more challenging for him now that one of his game breakers is now in Miami.

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9 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

there are times when you can look at one week and figure some things out.   I find it especially useful when you see how a team uses a certain player (or doesnt use them)

the red flags I dont need to wait longer than a week for would be when a player isnt being used and we dont have a solid rationale as to why.   those situations can make a borderline player not worth hanging onto.

thats not the case here. we are looking at a clear cut starter.

he looked great in week 1.   mediocre in game 2.   he had some good moments, but WR who performed in game 1 seemed to disappear in week 2.   a little concerning to be sure.

chargers played a good game on defense.   but I think we will see a lot of this over the season.   I think Mahomes still tears apart weak defenses.  but the tough defenses will be more challenging for him now that one of his game breakers is now in Miami.

Disagree.   

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14 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

there are times when you can look at one week and figure some things out.   I find it especially useful when you see how a team uses a certain player (or doesnt use them)

the red flags I dont need to wait longer than a week for would be when a player isnt being used and we dont have a solid rationale as to why.   those situations can make a borderline player not worth hanging onto.

thats not the case here. we are looking at a clear cut starter.

he looked great in week 1.   mediocre in game 2.   he had some good moments, but WR who performed in game 1 seemed to disappear in week 2.   a little concerning to be sure.

chargers played a good game on defense.   but I think we will see a lot of this over the season.   I think Mahomes still tears apart weak defenses.  but the tough defenses will be more challenging for him now that one of his game breakers is now in Miami.

Agreed 

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15 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

there are times when you can look at one week and figure some things out.   I find it especially useful when you see how a team uses a certain player (or doesnt use them)

the red flags I dont need to wait longer than a week for would be when a player isnt being used and we dont have a solid rationale as to why.   those situations can make a borderline player not worth hanging onto.

thats not the case here. we are looking at a clear cut starter.

he looked great in week 1.   mediocre in game 2.   he had some good moments, but WR who performed in game 1 seemed to disappear in week 2.   a little concerning to be sure.

chargers played a good game on defense.   but I think we will see a lot of this over the season.   I think Mahomes still tears apart weak defenses.  but the tough defenses will be more challenging for him now that one of his game breakers is now in Miami.

Top 3 Fantasy QB lock. Doing it the way you just described. Trouncing bad defenses and putting up average numbers against the toughest D’s like the bolts, who  picked off Derek Carr a bunch the week before. Points are points. How he achieves them is irrelevant…

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44 minutes ago, jrokh said:

Top 3 Fantasy QB lock. Doing it the way you just described. Trouncing bad defenses and putting up average numbers against the toughest D’s like the bolts, who  picked off Derek Carr a bunch the week before. Points are points. How he achieves them is irrelevant…

ok so if he puts up 50 points one week and 10 the next and repeats the pattern (on average for the season) half of his games are startable and half are not.    so even if hes averaging 30 points a week, hes not your ideal starter.

so how he gets the points does matter to some extent.   your number one QB should not have more than one or two dud games a year.

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39 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

your number one QB should not have more than one or two dud games a year

If a "dud game" for Mahomes is 18 points, which is the ppg average of a top 12 fantasy QB, and his other games are 40 burgers, I would even be willing to accept four or five dud games.

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1 hour ago, Ray_T said:

ok so if he puts up 50 points one week and 10 the next and repeats the pattern (on average for the season) half of his games are startable and half are not.    so even if hes averaging 30 points a week, hes not your ideal starter.

so how he gets the points does matter to some extent.   your number one QB should not have more than one or two dud games a year.

All I care about is top 3 QB points. How that is achieved is irrelevant. I’m not predicting nor concerned with how that is achieved. Merely if it does or does not occur.  Ya dig?

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All I need , and want is enough points to win weekly.  

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All i want is chiefs = 3-0

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6 hours ago, weepaws said:

 I’m looking at weekly, and so do you. 

Do you not adjust your lineup week to week based on matchups, one doesn’t just draft players and never rotate them. 

Do you? 

You used as a rationale though that you don't necessarily need a Mahomes and 30 a week because he only scored 18 this week and Cousins only needs 19. That is cherry picking weeks like crazy. How many weeks in a season do you anticipate Mahomes is outscored by Cousins?

I'm not necessarily saying the strategy of going for Cousins is wrong but I'm saying your rationale doesn't work and honestly you should be looking at points over the course of the season and not weekly when drafting. 

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5 hours ago, Ray_T said:

there are times when you can look at one week and figure some things out.   I find it especially useful when you see how a team uses a certain player (or doesnt use them)

the red flags I dont need to wait longer than a week for would be when a player isnt being used and we dont have a solid rationale as to why.   those situations can make a borderline player not worth hanging onto.

thats not the case here. we are looking at a clear cut starter.

he looked great in week 1.   mediocre in game 2.   he had some good moments, but WR who performed in game 1 seemed to disappear in week 2.   a little concerning to be sure.

chargers played a good game on defense.   but I think we will see a lot of this over the season.   I think Mahomes still tears apart weak defenses.  but the tough defenses will be more challenging for him now that one of his game breakers is now in Miami.

In my other thread I mentioned how AxeElf named Derrick Henry as the #1 RB in fantasy and he would outperform Jonathan Taylor. I said "Taylor is ahead for now." AxeElf said "One week in and you are trying to call it over."  Then he did it here. 

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1 hour ago, Sean Mooney said:

You used as a rationale though that you don't necessarily need a Mahomes and 30 a week because he only scored 18 this week and Cousins only needs 19. That is cherry picking weeks like crazy. How many weeks in a season do you anticipate Mahomes is outscored by Cousins?

I'm not necessarily saying the strategy of going for Cousins is wrong but I'm saying your rationale doesn't work and honestly you should be looking at points over the course of the season and not weekly when drafting. 

Never said I don’t need 30 points from my Qb, but I don’t need Mahomes or any Qb before the double digit rounds, now if they fell that far I would take them, but I wouldn’t be in that league but for one ff season, I don’t do rookie leagues.  

Of course I’m cherry picking weeks like crazy, I draft Qb,Te,kickers,def last.  Then I stream or wait for someone to drop a Qb, Te, that I feel I can cherry pick to win my weekly matchup.  

Only two slots I’m concerned about  points over the season are the rb/wr slot.  How many times do I need Cousins to out score Mahomes, once maybe twice based on league size and schedule, in a 14 team league might need once.  In both my leagues that I own Cousins it just so happens the other two owners have Mahomes, maybe Cousins out scores him maybe not, wish me luck would you.  

All I need is  to out score my opponent by one point, and I get the win. 

Thanks.  

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55 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

In my other thread I mentioned how AxeElf named Derrick Henry as the #1 RB in fantasy and he would outperform Jonathan Taylor. I said "Taylor is ahead for now." AxeElf said "One week in and you are trying to call it over."  Then he did it here. 

I would move pass it.  

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