Blacks Fleeing The Democratic Party

[Engorgeous George 2,161]

Just now, League Champion said:

They see illegal immigrants getting all the Democrat handouts now and are jealous. 

The impending demographic shift is now becoming apparent.  Blacks may be realizing they may not haver a seat at the big table.  They are being relegated to the Kids table at Thanksgiving and the new, favored guests, are getting their former seat.

[BuckSwope 654]

45 minutes ago, RLLD said:

Some that come to mind would be....

1. Improving Middle-Class family income 
2. Lowering the unemployment rate for Unemployment rates for women, African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Asian Americans, Native Americans, veterans, individuals with disabilities, and those without a high school diploma
3. Through economic emplowerment get people off of food stamps.
4. Lower poverty rates for African Americans and Hispanic Americans
5. Income inequality correction
6. African American homeownership increases
7. Incetivizing marriage and parenting through tax rebates
8. Cut the business tax rate, accutely for small to medium business, this inspires more hiring
9. Opportunity Zones 
10. Withdrawling from any trade partnerships that hurt domestic workers.

 

There are more, but these are just at the top of my mind

You are better than that.  That's promises and political speak, I'd guess you could find a similar "plan" on a Democrat's campaign page.  

Also, I've been told around here that all discrimination is bad, how is the GOP going to do 2, 4, and 6 without race being part of the equation? 

[RLLD 4,145]

1 minute ago, BuckSwope said:

You are better than that.  That's promises and political speak, I'd guess you could find a similar "plan" on a Democrat's campaign page.  

Also, I've been told around here that all discrimination is bad, how is the GOP going to do 2, 4, and 6 without race being part of the equation? 

Hmmm....but apparently, they are also real...

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/trump-administration-accomplishments/#:~:text=The unemployment rate reached 3.5,a nearly 50-year low.

 

[BuckSwope 654]

9 minutes ago, RLLD said:

Hmmm....but apparently, they are also real...

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/trump-administration-accomplishments/#:~:text=The unemployment rate reached 3.5,a nearly 50-year low.

 

Still doesn't give me GOP policies that caused those things listed.  It also doesn't break down by race, so for example #1.  7m new jobs is awesome - where were they and who got hired for those jobs? 

[The Real timschochet 6,468]

1 hour ago, RLLD said:

Some that come to mind would be....

1. Improving Middle-Class family income 
2. Lowering the unemployment rate for Unemployment rates for women, African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Asian Americans, Native Americans, veterans, individuals with disabilities, and those without a high school diploma
3. Through economic emplowerment get people off of food stamps.
4. Lower poverty rates for African Americans and Hispanic Americans
5. Income inequality correction
6. African American homeownership increases
7. Incetivizing marriage and parenting through tax rebates
8. Cut the business tax rate, accutely for small to medium business, this inspires more hiring
9. Opportunity Zones 
10. Withdrawling from any trade partnerships that hurt domestic workers.

 

There are more, but these are just at the top of my mind

Umm Jack Kemp has been dead for a while now. I love many of these ideas but most of them  are NO part of today’s Republican Party. #10 is, but that would be (and already is) a total disaster. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

Black people love their gas stoves. 

[RLLD 4,145]

11 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

Still doesn't give me GOP policies that caused those things listed.  It also doesn't break down by race, so for example #1.  7m new jobs is awesome - where were they and who got hired for those jobs? 

It really does, its not as complex as some might want to make it.  You foment job growth through common sense policies that empower small to medium businesses, in parallel you ensure education is not merely well-funded, but accountable as well.  

If we take a simple common-sense approach, the major issues plaguing the most economically disadvantaged are easily fixed.  It does require that we stop pretending its not the actions of individuals that create their own problems, and stop pretending the system is doing it.

We can easily get back to where we were during the Trump admin, lower prices, higher employment, more purchasing power....just better all around.  Just need to get back to those simple common-sense policies.

[RLLD 4,145]

9 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Umm Jack Kemp has been dead for a while now. I love many of these ideas but most of them  are NO part of today’s Republican Party. #10 is, but that would be (and already is) a total disaster. 

Incorrect.  These were core to the Trump policy approach.  They worked. Let's do them again. I do not care who does it, let Biden do it during a second term, hell.....he can even keep harveting payments from foreign adversaries....just get us back to what we had....

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

Liberals like to take credit for the crime reduction in blue areas since the 90’s, as if it were liberal policies that made it happen, when it was the opposite.  Now they want to know what republicans did to make the good things that occurred on their watch happen. Nothing. All the good stuff was liberal policy, all the bad was conservative. Yet the areas they have controlled forever suck. Like the schools.  

[Dizkneelande 1,086]

1 hour ago, RLLD said:

Incorrect.  These were core to the Trump policy approach.  They worked. Let's do them again. I do not care who does it, let Biden do it during a second term, hell.....he can even keep harveting payments from foreign adversaries....just get us back to what we had....

He did this before and we proved him wrong before.

“We now know that by the end of 2020, we had already hit that mark. By the end of 2020, 50% of all OZs in the country had seen investment, according to IRS and Treasury Department data. The amount of capital raised and deployed during that period was about $50 billion in equity alone, and equity is just one part of a capital stack. That means we’re safely talking about a $100 billion-plus range of investment into these communities, just in the first two years — and one of those was the pilot year without regulatory certainty, and the next was the COVID year of 2020.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sorensonimpact/2023/05/22/exploring-opportunity-zones-exciting-new-data-on-the-positive-impact-of-ozs-across-the-nation/?sh=1f1b0ff068f0

https://eig.org/opportunity-zones-brief-2023/

[jerryskids 6,577]

2 hours ago, BuckSwope said:

Just curious, you talking about the light skinned races or the ones that largely came after our civil rights struggle and are able to live in different areas and communities? 

Where are these communities which only let in certain types of blacks?

[listen2me 23 1,831]

2 hours ago, squistion said:

Blacks in Chicago are done with the Democratic Party? When pigs fly. 

Stockholm Syndrome is real.  

[League Champion 1,896]

3 hours ago, BuckSwope said:

Just curious, you talking about the light skinned races or the ones that largely came after our civil rights struggle and are able to live in different areas and communities? 

Amazing how people can't differentiate African American from Black.

Not all blacks are African American, and it's in insult to refer to them as. 

[BuckSwope 654]

14 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Where are these communities which only let in certain types of blacks?

Lol.  Come on. 

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

9 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Amazing how people can't differentiate African American from Black.

Not all blacks are African American, and it's in insult to refer to them as. 

Many of them don’t really know any black people, much less ones from various backgrounds. For instance e they have no clue what Caribbean and African blacks think of African Americans, and Vice versa. Same with Latinos.  These sheltered nerf balls think Puerto Ricans and Mexicans are aligned  some how. In reality there is no love lost between the two. 

[jerryskids 6,577]

20 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

Lol.  Come on. 

I'm serious.  To make sure I understand your differentiation, an immigrant Nigerian engineer can live in communities while a 4th generation American black engineer cannot?

[Sean Mooney 1,949]

"The Black Community of Chicago"....so every person apparently. 

 

People who get their info from Twitter/X should not be allowed to vote

[RLLD 4,145]

Just now, Sean Mooney said:

"The Black Community of Chicago"....so every person apparently. 

 

People who get their info from Twitter/X should not be allowed to vote

Joe Biden has declared those people not black I guess

[Sean Mooney 1,949]

18 hours ago, BuckSwope said:

Ah, this dumb go-to.   The fact is, you couldn't produce a single post of mine to back up your statement here, yet this board is exhibit A to my point.  You even had to trot out the "racist" label.  Right of the lefty playback.    

 

EternalShiny is not smart

[Sean Mooney 1,949]

2 minutes ago, RLLD said:

Joe Biden has declared those people not black I guess

I mean- the Tweet is idiotic.

[BuckSwope 654]

18 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I'm serious.  To make sure I understand your differentiation, an immigrant Nigerian engineer can live in communities while a 4th generation American black engineer cannot?

I am saying that Nigerian immigrant didn't move into the same troubled communities that the AAs were in.    The examples that we agree on are success stories of African immigrants, the facts you all seem to love to ignore is that they largely moved here from the 1970s on so the attitudes were shifting, they lived in different communities, and because of the cost of immigration they on average had more education and wealth.   It shouldn't surprise anybody that they or their kids succeeded vs the AA community.        

[BuckSwope 654]

2 hours ago, RLLD said:

It really does, its not as complex as some might want to make it.  You foment job growth through common sense policies that empower small to medium businesses, in parallel you ensure education is not merely well-funded, but accountable as well.  

If we take a simple common-sense approach, the major issues plaguing the most economically disadvantaged are easily fixed.  It does require that we stop pretending its not the actions of individuals that create their own problems, and stop pretending the system is doing it.

We can easily get back to where we were during the Trump admin, lower prices, higher employment, more purchasing power....just better all around.  Just need to get back to those simple common-sense policies.

It's not complex, I am just asking for specifics and proof.   I scanned that list, and there were some great things on there but this discussion started by you saying those things were helping the black community.   I saw a lot of stuff on there about the middle class and small businesses, but when the majority of them aren't in the middle class, how is that helping them?  I asked about the jobs in the Trump list - how many of those jobs were in the black community?   

[Dizkneelande 1,086]

30 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

I am saying that Nigerian immigrant didn't move into the same troubled communities that the AAs were in.    The examples that we agree on are success stories of African immigrants, the facts you all seem to love to ignore is that they largely moved here from the 1970s on so the attitudes were shifting, they lived in different communities, and because of the cost of immigration they on average had more education and wealth.   It shouldn't surprise anybody that they or their kids succeeded vs the AA community.        

Because they didn’t have the Democrat plantation holding them back?

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

50 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

I am saying that Nigerian immigrant didn't move into the same troubled communities that the AAs were in.    The examples that we agree on are success stories of African immigrants, the facts you all seem to love to ignore is that they largely moved here from the 1970s on so the attitudes were shifting, they lived in different communities, and because of the cost of immigration they on average had more education and wealth.   It shouldn't surprise anybody that they or their kids succeeded vs the AA community.        

So it’s not race holding people back. What is it then? Culture? We have schools here. I’d have to think they are as good as the ones in Nigeria. 

[League Champion 1,896]

7 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

So it’s not race holding people back. What is it then? Culture? We have schools here. I’d have to think they are as good as the ones in Nigeria. 

 

 

[jerryskids 6,577]

58 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

I am saying that Nigerian immigrant didn't move into the same troubled communities that the AAs were in.    The examples that we agree on are success stories of African immigrants, the facts you all seem to love to ignore is that they largely moved here from the 1970s on so the attitudes were shifting, they lived in different communities, and because of the cost of immigration they on average had more education and wealth.   It shouldn't surprise anybody that they or their kids succeeded vs the AA community.        

"We all" is not me, Mr. Holier Than Thou.  I responded to your specific comment:

Quote

Just curious, you talking about the light skinned races or the ones that largely came after our civil rights struggle and are able to live in different areas and communities?

Now you are moving the goalposts to say that it is a matter of education and wealth, not skin color.  Well, duh.  Those are indeed important factors, as are commitments to family and personal responsibility.  My point is there is nothing systemically preventing them from living in those communities, it is a matter of other factors.  Thanks for agreeing.   

[RLLD 4,145]

58 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

It's not complex, I am just asking for specifics and proof.   I scanned that list, and there were some great things on there but this discussion started by you saying those things were helping the black community.   I saw a lot of stuff on there about the middle class and small businesses, but when the majority of them aren't in the middle class, how is that helping them?  I asked about the jobs in the Trump list - how many of those jobs were in the black community?   

Absolutely. All those were core policies for which Trump delivered, notably for the AA community who was finally getting some help, getting jobs and progressing....because the right policies were in place. There is no magic wand, but when you get people employed, they progress....he funded HBCU's as well, opportunity zones....all of these things were pointedly beneficial to the AA community.

I want that back for them.

[BuckSwope 654]

1 minute ago, jerryskids said:

"We all" is not me, Mr. Holier Than Thou.  I responded to your specific comment:

Now you are moving the goalposts to say that it is a matter of education and wealth, not skin color.  Well, duh.  Those are indeed important factors, as are commitments to family and personal responsibility.  My point is there is nothing systemically preventing them from living in those communities, it is a matter of other factors.  Thanks for agreeing.   

I am also saying that there were policies and factors that created those communities and kept them there.  Then that changed and when it did is when the African immigrants came in.   Because of those changing policies and attitudes, yes - they were able to live in different communities.    So on average they had a higher starting point in this country because of the education and $ levels need to immigrate here and they also had different (better) schools and neighborhoods.      Of course it's about education/wealth/neighborhoods/schools.   You people are the ones that trot them out as an example and basically saying why can't the AAs do that with the same success??       To me it's common sense - they avoided a large portion of the truly racist crap by moving after the Civil Rights era, and they had a different base starting point.   

What you and others seem to be telling me is that you would expect the same outcome if those millions of Nigerians immigrated in 1900.  That there is just something wrong and broken about the AA community that keeps them from getting ahead.  

[BuckSwope 654]

31 minutes ago, RLLD said:

Absolutely. All those were core policies for which Trump delivered, notably for the AA community who was finally getting some help, getting jobs and progressing....because the right policies were in place. There is no magic wand, but when you get people employed, they progress....he funded HBCU's as well, opportunity zones....all of these things were pointedly beneficial to the AA community.

I want that back for them.

What else are they going to say on sites like those?   That doesn't make it real, which is why I keep asking you.    For example, I was curious so I looked at unemployment rates 2019 vs. 2020 by race.  6.1 vs. 11.4 in 2020 for blacks/AA.    The site you linked was talking as of January 2021.   So yeah, a line like The unemployment rate reached 3.5 percent, the lowest in a half-century  sounds great, but again I ask:  if the stat I listed is true, did this economy and policies really help the black community? What other stats should we look at?   And let's be real - that sentence could still be true if it reached 3.5% for 1 day and was 20% every day for the other 4 years.      

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

Buck Dope strikes again! Lol. Just want to thank you again for debunking the racism myth in America. Good work. Your best yet. 

[jerryskids 6,577]

42 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

I am also saying that there were policies and factors that created those communities and kept them there.  Then that changed and when it did is when the African immigrants came in.   Because of those changing policies and attitudes, yes - they were able to live in different communities.    So on average they had a higher starting point in this country because of the education and $ levels need to immigrate here and they also had different (better) schools and neighborhoods.      Of course it's about education/wealth/neighborhoods/schools.   You people are the ones that trot them out as an example and basically saying why can't the AAs do that with the same success??       To me it's common sense - they avoided a large portion of the truly racist crap by moving after the Civil Rights era, and they had a different base starting point.   

What you and others seem to be telling me is that you would expect the same outcome if those millions of Nigerians immigrated in 1900.  That there is just something wrong and broken about the AA community that keeps them from getting ahead.  

Again with the "you people."  Since you are lumping me in with your caricature of what a conservative thinks, I'll tell you that there were obviously systemic issues against the American black community for a long time.  I believe that those issues have by and large been eliminated, and in many cases are the opposite (favoring blacks).  But if items of systemic racism are found today they should be addressed.  I suspect they exist in sentencing statistics, for instance.

But working on the premise that they are largely eliminated, it's time to move on and identify the current problems.  I believe that the inner city black culture, and the soft bigotry of low expectations that come from the Left, are the worst fixable issues facing AAs today.

[jerryskids 6,577]

26 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

What else are they going to say on sites like those?   That doesn't make it real, which is why I keep asking you.    For example, I was curious so I looked at unemployment rates 2019 vs. 2020 by race.  6.1 vs. 11.4 in 2020 for blacks/AA.    The site you linked was talking as of January 2021.   So yeah, a line like The unemployment rate reached 3.5 percent, the lowest in a half-century  sounds great, but again I ask:  if the stat I listed is true, did this economy and policies really help the black community? What other stats should we look at?   And let's be real - that sentence could still be true if it reached 3.5% for 1 day and was 20% every day for the other 4 years.      

Wait, are you using 2020 employment statistics to make a point?  Did anything else happen in 2020 to impact employment?  

 

 

[BuckSwope 654]

12 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Wait, are you using 2020 employment statistics to make a point?  Did anything else happen in 2020 to impact employment?  

 

 

I was using the stats the site RLLD was using, which stated as of Jan 2021.   Why wouldn't we look at those stats if they are talking about them?    

See, I don't think either side gives a sh1t about AAs, and said as much.  Of course covid hit them hard, the pandemic hit the poor harder like just about everything else.    I am just trying to understand RLLD's position and where he is saying the black community was boosted under Trump and the right is good for them.   To me, it looked like the stuff he was posting pointed to the middle class and businesses getting a boost, which mostly is not the black community.  When looking at most stats, I would have expected them to be down - trending with poverty stats.  

[BuckSwope 654]

3 hours ago, jerryskids said:

I'm serious.  To make sure I understand your differentiation, an immigrant Nigerian engineer can live in communities while a 4th generation American black engineer cannot?

 

21 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Again with the "you people."  Since you are lumping me in with your caricature of what a conservative thinks, I'll tell you that there were obviously systemic issues against the American black community for a long time.  I believe that those issues have by and large been eliminated, and in many cases are the opposite (favoring blacks).  But if items of systemic racism are found today they should be addressed.  I suspect they exist in sentencing statistics, for instance.

But working on the premise that they are largely eliminated, it's time to move on and identify the current problems.  I believe that the inner city black culture, and the soft bigotry of low expectations that come from the Left, are the worst fixable issues facing AAs today.

Yes, "you people" because you just specifically brought up Nigerian immigrants as an example.     

Yes, we agree on all that in the second except for the fixable solutions.   I would end the war on drugs and focus on ways to improve the infrastructure in poor communities.    IMO their "culture" will come around, and blaming them and the left for everything is a great way for fock all to get done.  

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

16 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

 

Yes, "you people" because you just specifically brought up Nigerian immigrants as an example.     

Yes, we agree on all that in the second except for the fixable solutions.   I would end the war on drugs and focus on ways to improve the infrastructure in poor communities.    IMO their "culture" will come around, and blaming them and the left for everything is a great way for fock all to get done.  

Yeah, the war on drugs is the big problem! Zombies all over the Fockin place.  I think they won. Lol. 

[jerryskids 6,577]

53 minutes ago, BuckSwope said:

 

Yes, "you people" because you just specifically brought up Nigerian immigrants as an example.     

Yes, we agree on all that in the second except for the fixable solutions.   I would end the war on drugs and focus on ways to improve the infrastructure in poor communities.    IMO their "culture" will come around, and blaming them and the left for everything is a great way for fock all to get done.  

I explained that I brought up Nigerians because of your incorrect statement that AAs are not "able to" do stuff.  And then you said "you people" twice again.

Improve infrastructure like... put in grocery stores and other shops?  How is that going? 

In a way you are correct:  I don't really give a about them.  If we find an example of true systemic racism, let me know and we can address it.  Otherwise, the community can get their sh1t in order and prioritize family, education, and personal responsibility, none of which requires more stores to loot or drugs to do.

But that's my way of "caring."  I don't have the soft bigotry of low expectations like you do, and I treat them like adults in the greatest country in the world.   

[BuckSwope 654]

14 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I explained that I brought up Nigerians because of your incorrect statement that AAs are not "able to" do stuff.  And then you said "you people" twice again.

Improve infrastructure like... put in grocery stores and other shops?  How is that going? 

In a way you are correct:  I don't really give a about them.  If we find an example of true systemic racism, let me know and we can address it.  Otherwise, the community can get their sh1t in order and prioritize family, education, and personal responsibility, none of which requires more stores to loot or drugs to do.

But that's my way of "caring."  I don't have the soft bigotry of low expectations like you do, and I treat them like adults in the greatest country in the world.   

I never said the AAs are not able to do stuff.  You misunderstood that post and I explained further.    Infrastructure = schools/jobs/opportunities.  

And this is where I part from the right on this issue, because the bolded is what I encounter as a theme from the right as a whole.  (Can I use the "you all" here and not get you riled up?).    When I read this position, to me you are saying that you think if you swapped AAs with any other group, be it poor whites, Ethiopians, whatever you would get a different outcome.   Am I getting that wrong?  There is something about "their" culture that is making it so they can't succeed where others can.   Now can you explain to me how that stance isn't bigoted towards AAs?   Like I posed above you seem to be telling me that if you dropped the Nigerians here in the hood in the 70s you'd get the same outcome.  That if you flipped skin color in the inner city you'd expect a different outcome from the white kids.   

Me?  I think the AAs issues are largely poverty/education/jobs.   You see the exact same thing elsewhere where there is poverty, drugs, and jobs leaving - just with different music. You see divorce rates, lack of fathers, broken homes, welfare queens - all the sh1t you guys complain about the AAs.   A big thing that exacerbates the issue for the AA community is population density.    All completely predictable and in line with stats.   I would prefer policies that help the actual poor and uneducated of the country, which I believe is one of the best ways to help the AA community.    IMO, the right tells them to fix it themselves while taking a bigoted stance on AAs and the left f0cks it up by incorrectly making it about skin color and leaving other races in poverty behind - taking a racist position.   Again, IMO neither side cares about the poor/uneducated which unfortunately is a large portion of the AA community - they just each posture and talk while the wealth and education gap increases.

[Patented Phil 1,469]

On 12/5/2023 at 8:23 PM, The Real timschochet said:

Oh look! Blexit! 
 

I can’t believe you guys keep falling for the same story over and over again. Blacks will vote for Republicans when Republicans stop defending police who are racist to Blacks, when Republicans stop trying to take away voting rights for Blacks, and when Republicans stop trying to find ways around the Civil Rights Act. 

Not before. 

These Leftist talking points used to annoy me.  Now they just sound old and tired.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,964]

38 minutes ago, Patented Phil said:

These Leftist talking points used to annoy me.  Now they just sound old and tired.

They are conspiracy theories.  Blacks being denied the right to vote. Those people flip the Fock out if the sauce at a fast food joint isn’t free. Imagine if they tried to vote and were told no?

[The Real timschochet 6,468]

1 hour ago, Patented Phil said:

These Leftist talking points used to annoy me.  Now they just sound old and tired.

For conservatives everything is old and tired. Because most conservatives are old and tired.