Smoking Bans

[FranksTanks 0]

Phillybear just mentioned in another thread about a smoking ban in Philly, and starting July 1 in Colorado, a law goes into effect to ban smoking here. The Colorado law "bans smoking in most indoor public places except on casino floors and at cigar bars, smoke shops, small businesses, family farms and Denver International Airport's smoking lounge." http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_3943170

 

What do you guys think about it? I used to live in Boulder, Colorado and I smoked and loved it. The bars were still packed and it wasn't the end of the world to have to step out front with other smokers and have a cigarette. Now that I live in Denver and I quit smoking (kinda sorta) I can't wait for the whole state to go smoke free. I think everyone will be fine and the businesses will survive, and everyone complaining about it will forget about it in before long. So I give it two thumbs up!

[[zombie] 0]

I think everyone will be fine and the businesses will survive, and everyone complaining about it will forget about it in before long. So I give it two thumbs up

 

this has been the story for every place i've lived since bans started popping up...

 

BANNED!!!

 

[Toro 1]

I don't mind having to step outside for a cigarette.

 

The issue isn't with smoking vs. non-smoking. I think this is more to do with freedoms. If there is a bar that wants to let people smoke in it, then they should be able to allow it. If you, as a non-smoker, choose not to go into a place where they allow smoking, then don't go.

[brinett9 0]

I'm okay with indoor bans. I don't mind stepping outside.

[wiffleball 4,654]

For all the hand-wringing that smokers do whenever one of these is proposed or passed ("bars will go out of business! My God! The Humanity!), the truth is, people adapt pretty quickly. Smokers huddle outside like little yellow-toofed vagrants, then come back inside & drink.

 

I personnally love not having to come home smelling like smoke. Houston has a pretty reasonable ban. They ban smoking in places where 51% or more of the revenue is from food. (Basically, if you're a restaurant, no smoking. If you're a bar, smoke away). I like the compromise. And, despite threats from combined bar/restaurant owners to fire all their kitchen employees so they wouldn't lose ciggy loving bar bidness, I haven't seen a single instance where that's occured.

 

 

Reality over Rhetoric - what a concept.

[FranksTanks 0]

I don't mind having to step outside for a cigarette.

 

The issue isn't with smoking vs. non-smoking. I think this is more to do with freedoms. If there is a bar that wants to let people smoke in it, then they should be able to allow it. If you, as a non-smoker, choose not to go into a place where they allow smoking, then don't go.

 

I hear you. I don't own a business so I can't speak for them and would understand feeling like I was getting stepped on if the government told me what to do. At the same time, if I owned a restaurant, I could serve uncooked chicken to someone just because i thought it was ok to do that. They already have to follow other heath code rules, so I would assume it should be lumped in with that, and it's just another rule.

 

For all the hand-wringing that smokers do whenever one of these is proposed or passed ("bars will go out of business! My God! The Humanity!), the truth is, people adapt pretty quickly. Smokers huddle outside like little yellow-toofed vagrants, then come back inside & drink.

 

I personnally love not having to come home smelling like smoke. Houston has a pretty reasonable ban. They ban smoking in places where 51% or more of the revenue is from food. (Basically, if you're a restaurant, no smoking. If you're a bar, smoke away). I like the compromise. And, despite threats from combined bar/restaurant owners to fire all their kitchen employees so they wouldn't lose ciggy loving bar bidness, I haven't seen a single instance where that's occured.

Reality over Rhetoric - what a concept.

 

I like the Colorado ban because it's state wide. Now if someone protests they can't just go one town over to a different bowling alley and smoke. I think that's when you see business losing out.

[sawilson 1]

In Wa state a law went into effect a while ago that banned indoor smoking in ALL public facilities. The only exception are the casinos on the indian reservations.

 

It's hurt some smaller casino's business but I haven't seen them go out of business yet so thats a good thing.

[Red White and Blue 0]

I'd have rather seen smoking bans go into effect as the result of public pressure, not a handful of politicians who think they know better than everyone else. Philadelpia does not have a single non-smoking bar - if there was such a market for smoke-free venues, why wouldn't some enterprising business owner open one?

[FranksTanks 0]

I'd have rather seen smoking bans go into effect as the result of public pressure, not a handful of politicians who think they know better than everyone else. Philadelpia does not have a single non-smoking bar - if there was such a market for smoke-free venues, why wouldn't some enterprising business owner open one?

 

Yeah, I could see how a public vote couldn't hurt.

[edjr 5,591]

I don't mind having to step outside for a cigarette.

 

The issue isn't with smoking vs. non-smoking. I think this is more to do with freedoms. If there is a bar that wants to let people smoke in it, then they should be able to allow it. If you, as a non-smoker, choose not to go into a place where they allow smoking, then don't go.

 

 

 

workers must be protected as well. Don't give me the "they should work somewhere else"

 

that's like saying if someone at work is harassing you, you should leave and work somewhere else.

[phillybear 365]

I'd have rather seen smoking bans go into effect as the result of public pressure, not a handful of politicians who think they know better than everyone else. Philadelpia does not have a single non-smoking bar - if there was such a market for smoke-free venues, why wouldn't some enterprising business owner open one?

 

The majority of patrons in every single bar, big or small, I have been inside of in Philadelphia smoke. The majority of bar workers/owners smoke too. It's a big smoking town.

 

I don't think this ban will lead to good things.

[brinett9 0]

workers must be protected as well. Don't give me the "they should work somewhere else"

See the EPA's fraudulent study on passive tobacco smoke.

[Red White and Blue 0]

The majority of patrons in every single bar, big or small, I have been inside of in Philadelphia smoke. The majority of bar workers/owners smoke too. It's a big smoking town.

 

I don't think this ban will lead to good things.

 

People will change their habits. Even without the ban, many restaurants in Philly don't allow smoking and they're even banning it from a few clubs (the Trocodero) except for outside areas. I'm not sure it would ever be banned completely without a law, but I'm sure that within the next ten years or so there'd be nonsmoking bars in Philadelphia. I just wish our elected officials trusted people enough to make these decisions.

 

At any rate, six months after they ban smoking in Philly no one will remember what it was like to smoke indoors anyway and it won't seem strange to go outside for a butt. I spend a lot of time in NYC and it's really no big deal. And the crap about how businesses will close down is bull. Nobody stays home because they can't smoke at a bar.

[phillybear 365]

I do also want to point out that the only 3 Republicans on the City Council voted against the ban. This was a Democratic bill through and through.

 

IMO, the lesson here is that both parties are interested in running your lives by taking away certain freedoms. Not just conservative right wingers.

[brinett9 0]

IMO, the lesson here is that both parties are interested in running your lives by taking away certain freedoms. Not just conservative right wingers.

 

Screw The Man!

[wiffleball 4,654]

In a bit of irony, Europe banned smoking just about everywhere indoors. So, they erected little beer garden - type patios out front of many bars. Well, it's gets a little chilly outdoors, so they all added those big propane heaters that most of us have seen.

 

...Now the enviros in Europe are saying those heaters have completely counteracted all the advances in pollution control in Europe.

 

- Cracked me up for some reason.

[hoytdwow 202]

I quit smoking last September. Ban it everywhere!

 

[Red White and Blue 0]

I do also want to point out that the only 3 Republicans on the City Council voted against the ban. This was a Democratic bill through and through.

 

IMO, the lesson here is that both parties are interested in running your lives by taking away certain freedoms. Not just conservative right wingers.

 

Agree with you in spirit, but being allowed to smoke in public places ranks a lot lower on my list of freedoms than things like being able to marry who you want, have access to emergency contraception, etc.

[FranksTanks 0]

The majority of patrons in every single bar, big or small, I have been inside of in Philadelphia smoke. The majority of bar workers/owners smoke too. It's a big smoking town.

 

I don't think this ban will lead to good things.

 

Maybe that's a reputation the city is trying to move away from.

[Toro 1]

 

workers must be protected as well. Don't give me the "they should work somewhere else"

 

that's like saying if someone at work is harassing you, you should leave and work somewhere else.

 

I understand your argument but at the same time, this is like becoming an asbestos removal guy and then complaining that you work with asbestos all day.

[phillybear 365]

People will change their habits. Even without the ban, many restaurants in Philly don't allow smoking and they're even banning it from a few clubs (the Trocodero) except for outside areas. I'm not sure it would ever be banned completely without a law, but I'm sure that within the next ten years or so there'd be nonsmoking bars in Philadelphia. I just wish our elected officials trusted people enough to make these decisions.

 

At any rate, six months after they ban smoking in Philly no one will remember what it was like to smoke indoors anyway and it won't seem strange to go outside for a butt. I spend a lot of time in NYC and it's really no big deal. And the crap about how businesses will close down is bull. Nobody stays home because they can't smoke at a bar.

 

One of the problems will be neighbors complaining about noisy, loitering. littering people outside smoking at 1:30AM. People will not go to bars in the same numbers when it is raining, or cold, etc. It's just common sense.

 

Whatever. Polls showed that more people were against the ban. Bar owners didn't want this. But it happened.

 

I know that I will be spending much less time in bars when this goes into full effect. Rat's Ass.

[DuckStupid 40]

I know that I will be spending much less time in bars when this goes into full effect. Rat's Ass.

 

I think we found the reason for the ban

[phillybear 365]

I think we found the reason for the ban

[Red White and Blue 0]

One of the problems will be neighbors complaining about noisy, loitering. littering people outside smoking at 1:30AM. People will not go to bars in the same numbers when it is raining, or cold, etc. It's just common sense.

 

Whatever. Polls showed that more people were against the ban. Bar owners didn't want this. But it happened.

 

I know that I will be spending much less time in bars when this goes into full effect. Rat's Ass.

 

About a year ago I was sitting in Fergie's when the waitress saw me smoking and asked me to sign a petition to halt the impending ban (which finally got passed). She said that because of the ban in NY, 50% of bar employees were laid off. I told her I'm in NYC at least once a month and that's total bullshit - there has been no change whatsoever from what I can tell. People either go a few hours without smoking or stand outside in the cold or rain, whatever. Once all the b1tching and moaning dies down, you will be amazed at how quickly people become acclimated to smoke-free bars and how little effect it has on business. It's been the same way everywhere they've enacted a ban.

[biscuitman357 0]

Its a money issue.

 

If restaurants and bars allowed people to smoke, then the people who work there or regular patrons who end up with cancer - even if its from their own tobacco/dip consumption - are gonna sue.

 

Tobacco lobbyists haven't been coughing up enough money to protect themselves. The gun industry and the alcohol industry have covered their asses pretty well for a long time. Its not cheap and big tobacco just hasn't forked over enough of the big dollars in political contributions and graft to buy protection

 

The tobacco industry is a safe target for politicians who needed an issue to grandstand on.

[hoffdaddy 1]

Smoking ban = good for non-smokers. Don't spread your filth smokey people.

[TerrySilver 0]

i'm a smoker, used to live in philly, and phillybear is right, its seems like everyone smokes in philly.

 

then i moved up to new york where smoking is banned, and i initially hated the rule (i'm a pretty heavy smoker) but honestly, after a month or so, i got used to it, then after a few more months, i preferred non smoking bars.

 

if anything, non smoking bars gives you a good reason to go outside with a chick you meet and have a decent conversation with her, instead of screaming at the top of your lungs at her at a bar and not going anywhere with a conversation

[phillybear 365]

if anything, non smoking bars gives you a good reason to go outside with a chick you meet and have a decent conversation with her, instead of screaming at the top of your lungs at her at a bar and not going anywhere with a conversation

 

Best argument I have heard on this topic in years.

[dcOne 2]

your lungs

 

[GobbleDog 822]

If there was such a demand for no-smoking establishments, then why weren't there more no-smoking establishments? And if there wasn't much demand, then why did we need a law?

 

Before the ban, I could chose which type of establishment I wanted to go to.

Before the ban, I could chose which type of establishment I wanted to open.

 

Fewer choices is better? Why not let the free market decide?

[edjr 5,591]

I understand your argument but at the same time, this is like becoming an asbestos removal guy and then complaining that you work with asbestos all day.

 

How so?

 

People become baretenders to make drinks, not inhale smoke for 8 hours.

 

Everyone that works in a bar doesn't smoke. Everyone that works with asbestos works with asbestos.

[wiffleball 4,654]

Sounds like this thread is going to drift into the same old theoretical "it's my RIGHT to smoke in a bar" "it's a bar owner's right to allow smoking" nonsense.

 

The bans are in effect and spreading. The reality is - as many have stated - whether you like 'em or not - whether you smoke or not - in the end, the bans aren't that big of a deal. Personally, I like to eat peanuts when I drink beer. But I'm not going to go out of my way to find a bar that serves them - it's a habit - nothing more. Some smokers have developed a HABIT that when they drink, they smoke. Great, it's a habit, but not a requirement or a right. People used to smoke in offices 30 years ago. Now, that's virtually non-existent. Back then, many of the same arguments were made, but eventually, these bans became the norm and life goes on.

 

Those that crave a ciggy can step outside, fire one up and get back into the bar. It hasn't impacted bar owners, employees or customers in any of the wild-eyed hand-wringing ways that people have whined about - period.

[donhaas 18]

We have had the ban in Madison for a year now.

 

Nobody is drinking any alcohol anywhere in the city now

[Michael Sieger 0]

Yeah, I could see how a public vote couldn't hurt.

 

I agree - people can and should vote with their patronage. The government should not interfere where the market can provide a perfectly reasonable and efficient solution.

[phillybear 365]

I look forward to the day when alcohol is banned from bars.

[Michael Sieger 0]

We have had the ban in Madison for a year now.

 

Nobody is drinking any alcohol anywhere in the city now

 

I bartended for eight years at the Crystal Corner on Willie street in the '80's and was a frequent patron at Mickey's down the street. I really could not fathom either place smoke free, but returned last fall and had a good night of drinking at both. Mickey's especially is a totally different place without the ever-present cloud of smoke.

[donhaas 18]

I bartended for eight years at the Crystal Corner on Willie street in the '80's and was a frequent patron at Mickey's down the street. I really could not fathom either place smoke free, but returned last fall and had a good night of drinking at both. Mickey's especially is a totally different place without the ever-present cloud of smoke.

 

I love Mickey's. It's four blocks from my house. Hasn't lost any of its charm without the smoke

Crystal Corner's got some outdoor seating now.

Ended up at Mr. Roberts last night for a night cap.

[IAMWood 6]

As a non- cigarette smoker. I really don't care if people smoke around me or not. What I do care about is all the smoking losers who throw their butts on the ground. Like it's okay to do that. I feel that people should be able to do what they want, because of the butt trashers, I am for the ban. I am tired of the litter, in my yard, on the golf course, everywhere. Not all smokers are trashers but the bad apples sure do spoil the bunch. I have no sympathy for people put out by smoking bans. When my 1 year old at the time picked up a butt, it made my decision for me.

 

Ban it all. Tax the ###### out of them.

[Toro 1]

How so?

 

People become baretenders to make drinks, not inhale smoke for 8 hours.

 

Everyone that works in a bar doesn't smoke. Everyone that works with asbestos works with asbestos.

 

 

That is like saying that a chick is wanting to be a stripper, but doesn't want any creepy guys watching her. It comes with the territory. You work in a bar that allows smoking, and guess what happens. You don't like it, go work at Crappleby's!

[edjr 5,591]

That is like saying that a chick is wanting to be a stripper, but doesn't want any creepy guys watching her. It comes with the territory. You work in a bar that allows smoking, and guess what happens. You don't like it, go work at Crappleby's!

 

 

That's why it's Being BANNED.

 

Why didn't you stay logged in under your new alias to answer?