Minnesota

[Ron_Artest 2,760]

4 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

smh

Can you try and sum up your point?

Is your point that he decided he was going to shoot her seconds before he did and he couldn't stop himself?

[dogcows 1,439]

Just now, Ron_Artest said:

Can you try and sum up your point?

Is your point that he decided he was going to shoot her seconds before he did and he couldn't stop himself?

I think the reaction time argument is a red herring.

This officer had zero reason to un-holster his weapon in the first place.

[MDC 8,264]

35 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I agree that, at a minimum, there should be internal reviews of the procedures followed (or not followed) and corrective actions taken in training, procedures, etc. as indicated.  The fact that this situation escalated to somebody's death indicates the need for such a review.  

 

[supermike80 2,187]

Still on this i see.  Goodness

[dogcows 1,439]

37 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I agree that, at a minimum, there should be internal reviews of the procedures followed (or not followed) and corrective actions taken in training, procedures, etc. as indicated.  The fact that this situation escalated to somebody's death indicates the need for such a review.  

 

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

4 minutes ago, dogcows said:

Then the training would be an abject failure. Good police know how to de-escalate. I’ve seen it work numerous times. This was very obviously a rapid and unnecessary escalation. Well-trained police would know that.

I've seen it numerous times where de-escalation doesn't work.  If they allow someone to take off in a manic state then they put other people's lives in danger.  What if that women wasn't shot, was able to speed off and ended up t-boning a family in another vehicle?  There are so many variables and officers need to keep that in mind.  It all happens in split seconds and mistakes are going to be made.  That's just the reality of it.

The truth is, this is all being blown up for political gain by everyone.  Just like everything else is.

[Ron_Artest 2,760]

39 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I agree that, at a minimum, there should be internal reviews of the procedures followed (or not followed) and corrective actions taken in training, procedures, etc. as indicated.  The fact that this situation escalated to somebody's death indicates the need for such a review.  

finally had a good post.

[dogcows 1,439]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I've seen it numerous times where de-escalation doesn't work.  If they allow someone to take off in a manic state then they put other people's lives in danger.  What if that women wasn't shot, was able to speed off and ended up t-boning a family in another vehicle?  There are so many variables and officers need to keep that in mind.  It all happens in split seconds and mistakes are going to be made.  That's just the reality of it.

The truth is, this is all being blown up for political gain by everyone.  Just like everything else is.

Shooting her created a far greater risk. The car sped out of control down the street. Its momentum was only stopped by another parked car. That could have been a child instead. Having the gun out is indefensible.

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

1 minute ago, dogcows said:

Having the gun out is indefensible.

You need to ask yourself why he was put in a position that made him feel the need to have his gun out.  It's the woman's fault.  She focked up.

Just because she's at fault doesn't mean I think she deserved to be killed.  It was a terrible result to bad decision making.

[dogcows 1,439]

20 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

You need to ask yourself why he was put in a position that made him feel the need to have his gun out.  It's the woman's fault.  She focked up.

Just because she's at fault doesn't mean I think she deserved to be killed.  It was a terrible result to bad decision making.

Agree to disagree. Nothing good was going to come out of pulling your gun in that situation.

I mean, it wasn’t even urgent. Cars were still getting by. They could have contacted local PD to have them handle that minor traffic issue. Nope. Decided to go Rambo in one hand and influencer in the other.

[jerryskids 7,269]

31 minutes ago, dogcows said:

I think the reaction time argument is a red herring.

This officer had zero reason to un-holster his weapon in the first place.

It's not a red herring, it's the discussion we are having, which is gutter's belief that gunshots occur instantaneously.

If you want to introduce a new discussion, feel free to.

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

1 minute ago, dogcows said:

Agree to disagree. Nothing good was going to come out of pulling your gun in that situation.

I mean, it wasn’t even urgent. Cars were still getting by. They could have contacted local PD to have them handle that minor traffic issue. Nope. Decided to go Rambo in one hand and influencer in the other.

She still put him in that situation.  It pisses me off how people can completely deny responsibility just because the resulting actions were worse.  People pull this crap all the time.  They escalate the situation until someone gets hurt or killed and then the public blames the opposite person.  It's stupid.

[easilyscan 1,116]

1: Identify root cause. Woman brazenly interfering with a federal investigation.

2: Take corrective action. Let people know they can protest, but they can't directly impede an investigation.

3: Follow up/monitor. 

[easilyscan 1,116]

4 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

She still put him in that situation.  It pisses me off how people can completely deny responsibility just because the resulting actions were worse.  People pull this crap all the time.  They escalate the situation until someone gets hurt or killed and then the public blames the opposite person.  It's stupid.

A+

[Hardcore troubadour 16,231]

Gutterboy flys off the handle and reacts wrongly on a message board, and he’s judging a guy out in the street in a hostile environment.

[seafoam1 3,586]

32 minutes ago, dogcows said:

 Nothing good was going to come out of not simply complying with ICE and then going on your way. 

She would be alive and unaffected in any way today if she did that. 

Liberals are so stupid.

[Hardcore troubadour 16,231]

Anyone catch her father’s interview on CNN? Pretty much said it was her fault.  

[dogcows 1,439]

Stories from Minnesotans affected by the ICE raids.

https://www.standwithminnesota.com/testimonies

[Mike Honcho 5,579]

43 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

She still put him in that situation.  It pisses me off how people can completely deny responsibility just because the resulting actions were worse.  People pull this crap all the time.  They escalate the situation until someone gets hurt or killed and then the public blames the opposite person.  It's stupid.

She didn't put him that situation, he did. I've posted twice how he didn't follow SOP by standing in front of the car.  Not only that, but the training states don't shoot into cars. It pisses me off more when people defend the actions of people who were trained to be better and ignore it. 

 

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

Just now, Mike Honcho said:

She didn't put him that situation, he did. I've posted twice how he didn't follow SOP by standing in front of the car.  Not only that, but the training states don't shoot into cars. It pisses me off more when people defend the actions of people who were trained to be better and ignore it. 

 

You just skipped over why he was there.  Why was he dealing with her?  How can you deny any of it being her fault?

[Fireballer 2,711]

1 minute ago, Mike Honcho said:

She didn't put him that situation, he did. I've posted twice how he didn't follow SOP by standing in front of the car.  Not only that, but the training states don't shoot into cars. It pisses me off more when people defend the actions of people who were trained to be better and ignore it. 

 

She literally reversed at an angle, placing him in front of the car.  
 

Also, there’s a big difference in firing at a car to disable it, which is mentioned in procedures, vs shooting a driver in a lethal force situation.  

[dogcows 1,439]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

You just skipped over why he was there.  Why was he dealing with her?  How can you deny any of it being her fault?

He didn’t have to do anything to her. None of it.

And the agents are only there because Crusty Gnome wanted to add new episodes to the ICE show.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/10/10/politics/ice-videos-dhs-noem-immigration-arrests-analysis

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

Just now, dogcows said:

He didn’t have to do anything to her. None of it.

And the agents are only there because Crusty Gnome wanted to add new episodes to the ICE show.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/10/10/politics/ice-videos-dhs-noem-immigration-arrests-analysis

She was interfering. She literally broke the law and you're defending her.  Why do you support not having accountability for your actions?

[seafoam1 3,586]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

She was interfering. She literally broke the law and you're defending her.  Why do you support not having accountability for your actions?

Because of TDS. They are all the same. They have zero logic and they will never change. 

They are the liberal collective.

[dogcows 1,439]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

She was interfering. She literally broke the law and you're defending her.  Why do you support not having accountability for your actions?

Accountability should have been a traffic ticket at worst. Instead, she is dead.

What they did was reckless senseless violence, and contrary to all LEO training.

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

Just now, seafoam1 said:

Because of TDS. They are all the same. They have zero logic and they will never change. 

They are the liberal collective.

I hope these people don't teach their kids this crap.  They're setting them up for a punch in the face from reality.

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

Just now, dogcows said:

Accountability should have been a traffic ticket at worst. Instead, she is dead.

What they did was reckless senseless violence, and contrary to all LEO training.

How could they give her a traffic ticket?  She was refusing to follow directions and then tried to flee.  She broke multiple laws.

Once again, how do you defend this?

[jerryskids 7,269]

2 minutes ago, dogcows said:

Accountability should have been a traffic ticket at worst. Instead, she is dead.

What they did was reckless senseless violence, and contrary to all LEO training.

ICE can't issue traffic tickets.

How exactly would you like to see situations like this, or the woman in the recent video who was ultimately pulled from her car, be handled?

[dogcows 1,439]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

How could they give her a traffic ticket? 

Good point, they should have called local PD whose job it is to handle people whose cars are partially blocking residential streets.

[seafoam1 3,586]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I hope these people don't teach their kids this crap.  They're setting them up for a punch in the face from reality.

You can only hope their kids ignore it and embroce logic. Kids quite often go opposite of their parents when they tur 15-21 years old. They will learn from school if these liberals can actually put their kids in good schools that don't fock with their minds.

[dogcows 1,439]

1 minute ago, jerryskids said:

ICE can't issue traffic tickets.

How exactly would you like to see situations like this, or the woman in the recent video who was ultimately pulled from her car, be handled?

Local PD. If somebody was blocking my driveway and refused to move, I’d call them. They know how to handle these situations; they do it every day.

[Sean Mooney 2,090]

12 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

She literally reversed at an angle, placing him in front of the car.  
 

Also, there’s a big difference in firing at a car to disable it, which is mentioned in procedures, vs shooting a driver in a lethal force situation.  

Because he was walking across the front of the car which is not standard procedure.

I wish we could all agree that both Good and Ross have culpability in this. It doesn't have to be- nor is it- that one side is right and the other is wrong

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

1 minute ago, dogcows said:

Good point, they should have called local PD whose job it is to handle people whose cars are partially blocking residential streets.

She was illegally interfering. They were legally within their right to detain her and she tried to flee, which is also illegal.  This is all on her.

[seafoam1 3,586]

1 minute ago, dogcows said:

Good point, they should have called local PD whose job it is to handle people whose cars are partially blocking residential streets.

You don't know what ICE is and what they CAN do. You are so ignorant of the situation. And yet you whine on about liberal whining points. 

[Hardcore troubadour 16,231]

Liberal men are such puzzies that they send women out to do their fighting for their cause. 

[seafoam1 3,586]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

She was illegally interfering. They were legally within their right to detain her and she tried to flee, which is also illegal.  This is all on her.

See? They do not care about truth. No changing that no matter what anyone says. 

[seafoam1 3,586]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Liberal men are such puzzies that they send women out to do their fighting for their cause. 

Truth. 

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

Just now, Sean Mooney said:

I wish we could all agree that both Good and Ross have culpability in this.

He absolutely shares culpability in this.  He made the wrong decision in a moment where he was forced to react.

[dogcows 1,439]

2 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

She was illegally interfering. They were legally within their right to detain her and she tried to flee, which is also illegal.  This is all on her.

 

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

He absolutely shares culpability in this.  He made the wrong decision in a moment where he was forced to react.

Which is it? All on her or both?

[Hawkeye21 2,464]

1 minute ago, dogcows said:

 

Which is it? All on her or both?

It all starts with her.  After that, he has responsibility for his actions.  Regardless, it all starts with her.