famousb 11 Posted July 26, 2006 regardles of Vick's inability to consistentlt throw a good pass, how do people actually expect him to succeed this year when the only two "veteran" WRs on the team ae Brian Finneran and Jerome Pathon - and neither of them are even starters... They're starting a 2nd year guy and a 3rd year guy - neither of whom have even had 40 receptions in a year in the NFL and the most yards either has had in a season is 508!! Plus, they've got two rookies on the roster for backups - between 6 WRs they have less than 20 years of experience, and almost 1/2 of those years are coming from the #4 guy on their depth chart... just due to the sh!tty WR situation I wouldn't come close to touching Vick this year. He's just set up for failure in the passing game.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RoadLizard 73 Posted July 26, 2006 Vick is a bum anyways.... he will never be a quality NFL QB. When your legs are your ONLY asset you tend to fizzle-out in the NFL. He is custom made for the college game where QB's run all the time and they do it against crappy college defenses that gat out of the way at the nearest sign of an offensive player. This is why there are so many busts in the NFL from the QB and even RB position.... the NFL defense is a different bird than college! Mike Vick = Media Darling that SUCKS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhostofMeanMachine99 1 Posted July 26, 2006 Does Vick know his WRs? They may have met once or twice, but that's about it, I think. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
harken34 0 Posted July 26, 2006 regardles of Vick's inability to consistentlt throw a good pass, how do people actually expect him to succeed this year when the only two "veteran" WRs on the team ae Brian Finneran and Jerome Pathon - and neither of them are even starters... They're starting a 2nd year guy and a 3rd year guy - neither of whom have even had 40 receptions in a year in the NFL and the most yards either has had in a season is 508!!Plus, they've got two rookies on the roster for backups - between 6 WRs they have less than 20 years of experience, and almost 1/2 of those years are coming from the #4 guy on their depth chart... just due to the sh!tty WR situation I wouldn't come close to touching Vick this year. He's just set up for failure in the passing game.... (how do people actually expect him to succeed this year) I don't. I expect him to do what he does every year. SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Game Time 0 Posted July 26, 2006 I think Jenkins will surprise this year. Don't ask me why, i'm just high on him! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PackYourNut 47 Posted July 26, 2006 Atlanta doesnt want to be a passing team... They want to run the ball and play defense. Vick will never be a good FF QB unless you get bonus points for rushing totals. As far as a good NFL QB, well that's up for debate. If he wins games, he good. If he doesnt, hes not. IMO Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jarvis Basnight 119 Posted July 26, 2006 regardles of Vick's inability to consistentlt throw a good pass, how do people actually expect him to succeed this year when the only two "veteran" WRs on the team ae Brian Finneran and Jerome Pathon - and neither of them are even starters... They're starting a 2nd year guy and a 3rd year guy - neither of whom have even had 40 receptions in a year in the NFL and the most yards either has had in a season is 508!!Plus, they've got two rookies on the roster for backups - between 6 WRs they have less than 20 years of experience, and almost 1/2 of those years are coming from the #4 guy on their depth chart... just due to the sh!tty WR situation I wouldn't come close to touching Vick this year. He's just set up for failure in the passing game.... A couple things here. - Who's taking Vick as their #1 QB anyway? This is a non-issue because Vick is usually taken now as a backup/project QB. - Vick's still got Crumpler and Dunn. - The young receivers have another year under the belt so they will either get better, or get replaced. I've heard good things about Roddy White lately so maybe he'll have a solid year. - You can get Atlanta receivers so late that they are also backup/projects. I'm seeing low risk/high reward here if any of them have a big year. You don't have to take him, but I will where I can get him (9th/10th round). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LOD01 195 Posted July 26, 2006 ATL WR's are zeros because Schaub is on the bench watching a demo on how to totally suck as a QB. Put Schaub in and the WR's have some value. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
famousb 11 Posted July 26, 2006 A couple things here. - Who's taking Vick as their #1 QB anyway? This is a non-issue because Vick is usually taken now as a backup/project QB. a VERY popular FF website (which remain nameless in order to not increment the powers-that-be ) happen to rank Vick #10 on their QB list - Vick's still got Crumpler and Dunn.- The young receivers have another year under the belt so they will either get better, or get replaced. I've heard good things about Roddy White lately so maybe he'll have a solid year. - You can get Atlanta receivers so late that they are also backup/projects. I'm seeing low risk/high reward here if any of them have a big year. You don't have to take him, but I will where I can get him (9th/10th round). in the 9th round, he'd easily be going as one of the first #2 QBs - which is where i think he should be, a #2. However it's not his ability to put up huge pts that bothers me - it's his propensity to put up horrible point totals in some weeks too... One of my leagues rewards QBs more for rushing yds & tds than it does passing yds & tds - that's about the only format i would value him in as a QB... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jarvis Basnight 119 Posted July 26, 2006 a VERY popular FF website (which remain nameless in order to not increment the powers-that-be ) happen to rank Vick #10 on their QB list Holy crap. He's in at #8 in the rankings. Worst ranking evah! Again, let me re-state, I would take Vick as my 2nd QB but that's not going to happen if sites are ranking him this high. That's a very poor ranking in my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
famousb 11 Posted July 26, 2006 Holy crap. He's in at #8 in the rankings. Worst ranking ehah! Again, let me re-state, I would take Vick as my 2nd QB but that's not going to happen if sites are ranking him this high. That's a very poor ranking in my opinion. yeah, 10th QB is the default, when i apply some other rankings he's at #8... granted, he has trended up, and this is his 3rd year w/ that coach and in that system (which is generally the make-or-break year for a QB in the WCO), but i just don't see how it happens... but the projected numbers for him are NOT all that outrageous... 2390yds, 15tds, 11ints. w/ 684yds & 5tds rushing... i guess it's more a lack of production by other QBs that puts him that high... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Youngblood 0 Posted July 26, 2006 Roddy White is getting all kinds of good press. Evidently he's been working out with Vick in the off season, but I still think the WRs on that team are the fourth pass option after Dunn, Crumpler, Vick throwing a pass to himself, and then the WRs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elon 0 Posted July 26, 2006 regardles of Vick's inability to consistentlt throw a good pass, how do people actually expect him to succeed this year when the only two "veteran" WRs on the team ae Brian Finneran and Jerome Pathon - and neither of them are even starters... They're starting a 2nd year guy and a 3rd year guy - neither of whom have even had 40 receptions in a year in the NFL and the most yards either has had in a season is 508!!Plus, they've got two rookies on the roster for backups - between 6 WRs they have less than 20 years of experience, and almost 1/2 of those years are coming from the #4 guy on their depth chart... just due to the sh!tty WR situation I wouldn't come close to touching Vick this year. He's just set up for failure in the passing game.... you can't be serious. have you ever watched a falcon's game. jenkins and white have real talent. dunn and crumpler are also strong weapons. if the problem isn't one of the guys i mentioned it must be vick. i think jim mora jr. stays up at night dreaming up ways to make matt schuab his qb. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
-jb- 0 Posted July 26, 2006 This is not an advocation of Vick, but why is it so difficult to see him in the top 10 when that's exactly where he was last year? He's supposedly in better health, his WRs have more experience, as does he in the WCO. No one's saying he's better than Peyton Manning. IMHO, he'll do no worse than #10. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,725 Posted July 26, 2006 One word for you. ALGECRUMPLER Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
famousb 11 Posted July 26, 2006 you can't be serious. have you ever watched a falcon's game. jenkins and white have real talent. dunn and crumpler are also strong weapons. if the problem isn't one of the guys i mentioned it must be vick. i think jim mora jr. stays up at night dreaming up ways to make matt schuab his qb. This is not an advocation of Vick, but why is it so difficult to see him in the top 10 when that's exactly where he was last year? He's supposedly in better health, his WRs have more experience, as does he in the WCO. No one's saying he's better than Peyton Manning. IMHO, he'll do no worse than #10. His starting WRs have a total of 3 years NFL experience going into this season! How could they have less experience?? Seriously, if everyone touts the 3 year rule for WRs to break-out, how can you rely on a second & third year WR duo as starters? I believe in Crumpler and Dunn, and i think White and Jenkins have FUTURE potential, but the ATL management is just not doing a good job of giving Vick a cast he can grow into - instead it's him having to work with them... i guess i would have just liked to see them get a veteran with some experience to give him some support so he could actually develop as a passer... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jarvis Basnight 119 Posted July 26, 2006 This is not an advocation of Vick, but why is it so difficult to see him in the top 10 when that's exactly where he was last year? He's supposedly in better health, his WRs have more experience, as does he in the WCO. No one's saying he's better than Peyton Manning. IMHO, he'll do no worse than #10. I do think he is very capable of top ten numbers, but I would never draft him as my #1 QB if that makes any sense. Would you draft him as your starter and feel comfortable? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
football_scooter 0 Posted July 26, 2006 I'll say this.... In the past, I've hated Vick from a FFB perspective because of the hype that makes him a top 3 round pick. Now that he's sliding to the 6th-7th rounds, he's actually starting to transition into a value pick. Especially in leagues where RuTDs are worth 6 and PaTDs are worth 4. (couch, WCOFF, cough) I would consider him as my #1 in a 6 pt RuTD league anywhere after the 6th round. No question. And if I recall, he scored favorably on mr Waldman's crank scores... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
burdsheet 0 Posted July 26, 2006 Does Vick know his WRs? They may have met once or twice, but that's about it, I think. If they have met, it definitely wasn't in the endzone ... where it counts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RamslovaMartzhata 3 Posted July 26, 2006 To paraphrase Snoop in Starsky and Hutch (and I mean this in all sincerity)... I think this is a year that Vick moves up a notch as a passer, that will put him at notch one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Young_Grasshopper 0 Posted July 26, 2006 I posted this a few weeks ago... and will keep posting it until people stop the pointless Vick bashing. As -jb- pointed out, no one expects him to be Peyton Manning, but people who think he belongs in the 11th round bargain bin are going to pay for that mistake this season. Let's look at the numbers: 1) Under a scoring system of 1 pt / 25 yards passing, 4 pt / passing TD, -2 pt / interception, 1 pt / 10 yards rushing, 1 pt / rushing TD; Vick was the number 5 overall fantasy QB last year. 2) Under Matt Waldman's 2005 Crank scores, Vick ranks 7th overall. 3) Using those Crank stats, his % of subpar games in 2005 is better than Peyton Manning and Kurt Warner, and about the same as Carson Palmer and Matt Hasselbeck. 3) His ADP for 12-team TE required league is 9th round, 1st pick, or 97th overall. This makes him the 13th QB picked overall. Which of the above stats seems out of place??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ras66not99 0 Posted July 26, 2006 I do think he is very capable of top ten numbers, but I would never draft him as my #1 QB if that makes any sense. Would you draft him as your starter and feel comfortable? I traded McNabb for Vick (and Moulds) in the off-season in my Dynasty League.... I was kind of hoping that he'd be singing Ludicris' hit song Welcome to Atlanta to Mr. Terrell Owens but I didn't get so lucky.... Anyway rushing is a big part of my league and rushing Td's are worth 6 and passing Td's are worth 3, so in leagues of this sort he's a nice commodity.... Even in regular leagues he's pretty solid and there is no reason to think he won't improve a smidge with his Wr's gaining a little more confidence..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr.shitty 0 Posted July 26, 2006 atlanta WRs are garbage with vick in there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ElvisMcCoy 0 Posted July 26, 2006 One word for you. ALGECRUMPLER Is anyone concerned with Alge after his shoulder surgery? Atlanta kept that pretty quiet. Alge Crumpler Probable for pre-season and practices. Just another downside to Vick's upcoming year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ExtremeFajita 0 Posted July 26, 2006 Don't buy into all the hype about Vick working out with Roddy White this offseason. He wants to run more this year and he will. The odds of him rushing for 100 yards or suffering a season ending injury are better than any Atlanta receiver going over 1000 yards. If he backs up his claim to be the Vick he wants to be then I certainly don't see WR numbers going up and last year they were at... Finneran - 611 yards, 2TD Jenkins - 508 yards, 3TD White - 446 yards, 3TD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titan20 0 Posted July 26, 2006 I expect him to finish in the 8-12 range. If you add up his rushing and passing stats its 3000 yards and 21 TDs last year. For his three full years in the league, all where he played 15 games, his averages are 3300 total yards and 20 Tds combined passing and rushing. i would take him as my backup in a second. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spinner 0 Posted July 26, 2006 Vick will be a steal in the 9th or 10th. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgcrawfish 232 Posted July 26, 2006 One word for you. ALGECRUMPLER Two words for you: Shoulder Surgery Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Raider 84 29 Posted July 26, 2006 I think Jenkins will surprise this year. Don't ask me why, i'm just high on him! Don't get your hopes too high. I think R White is a better wr. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lguero1 4 Posted July 26, 2006 with alge's shoulder, vick has established a rapport with his receivers this offseason and it will continue into training camp. i am moving him up to 15th on my QB list and jenkins up to 43 on my WR/TE list as the #2 option in ATL, and Roddy up to 68. atl goes run first, second, and throw to alge on third. in addition to not being a good QB, they play one of the hardest schedules to pass against. a qb2 to possibly use weeks 6 and 8. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kutulu 1,562 Posted July 27, 2006 Mike Vick smoking a blunt? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ilov80s 0 Posted July 27, 2006 I think the moronic WCO offense is to blame for Vick's lack of success. Ok, we have the the fastest and most elusive quarterback in the history of the NFL who also happens to have a cannon for an arm...he isn't very accurate, but he can throw the ball a mile. Whats the best offense for him? Option 1) Lots of short and intermediate routes that crowd the line of scrimmage and are dependant on high completion percentage. Option 2) Lots of deep routes that free up space around the line of scrimmage. I honestly believe if they got some respectable talent at WR to stretch the field, allowed Vick to work off the playaction and rollout, and tried to throw the ball downfield they would be a much better team and Vick wold be posting the kind of numbers fantasy owners dreamed about 3 years ago. With the great running game they have and Vick's threat to rollout and run, it would be very difficult for defenses to effectively take away the deep pass. Instead, Atlanta is caging Vick, playing to his weaknesses, and squandering an elite talent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
football_scooter 0 Posted July 27, 2006 with alge's shoulder, vick has established a rapport with his receivers this offseason and it will continue into training camp. i am moving him up to 15th on my QB list and jenkins up to 43 on my WR/TE list as the #2 option in ATL, and Roddy up to 68. atl goes run first, second, and throw to alge on third. in addition to not being a good QB, they play one of the hardest schedules to pass against. a qb2 to possibly use weeks 6 and 8. I have long been a "hater" so don't consider me an apologist for saying this, but what really matters is whether those teams can stop the run. Because Vick is a RB who throws the ball occasionally. If they can't stop the run, the Falcons can beat them, and Vick will have his big days. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eriadoc 4 Posted July 27, 2006 The WRs there have looked pretty good on the few occasions we've seen Schaub throwing the ball. If an unproven QB like Schaub can make those crappy WRs look good .... maybe they're not crappy. Or maybe Schaub is awesome. Or maybe Vick sucks. I dunno, it's all too much to keep track of. One thing's for certain ...... Vick's not a passing QB. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cmh6476 777 Posted August 21, 2006 Here's what I got: Michael Jenkins: 975/ 6 Roddy White: 650/ 4 Jerome Pathon: 310/ 3 and then Crumpler: 900/7 thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Voelk 0 Posted August 31, 2006 From what I've heard so far this preseason Roddy will end up with better numbers than Jenkins... but I think its a crap shoot. Does anyone know/think they'll try to get J.Norwood some receiving opp's out of the backfield or slot? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
famousb 11 Posted August 31, 2006 From what I've heard so far this preseason Roddy will end up with better numbers than Jenkins... but I think its a crap shoot. Does anyone know/think they'll try to get J.Norwood some receiving opp's out of the backfield or slot? wow, this was an old post... way to search instead of just posting something new... anyway, obviously the situation has changed slightly w/ Ashley Lelie in there to drop the long balls for them... but as for your question about Norwood getting rec's out of the backfield, I believe his career rec'ing number from college was something like 43 total rec's - and that is his career where he was at least a 2 year starter... So i'd just assume (and i know that is a dangerous thing to do), that he is probably not going to get too involved in the passing game right away - especially considering the "touch" passes that Vick throws... but i may be wrong, i just wouldn't expect it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
philmckracken 3 Posted August 31, 2006 Vick and his receivers have value to you when someone else drafts them. While another owner is wasting a pick on him as his #1 qb, you can be happy drafting someone productive. You should be able to draft a #1 and a #2 qb who are both more productive than Vick. You should be able to get a qb like Kitna as your #2 and be confident that he will produce better than Vick. Meanwhile, the Vick owner spends all season getting frustrated, saying to himself, "I thought this was the year that Vick puts it all together." That owner then begins to agonize every week about whether or not to bench Vick and then gets even more frustrated when Vick does have a couple of decent weeks while riding that owner's pine. It's better to just avoid that whole mess and let someone else deal with all that headache. There was some crazy stat last year like: Vick didn't throw a td pass to a wr all season or until the last few weeks of the season, something wacky like that but it was true. Any improvement on that still sucks. Forget about him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
