Hostess: Twinkies, Ding Dongs, Wonder Bread maker going out of business

[Recliner Pilot 61]

I just sold all my gold and bought Ding Dongs. :bigbrain:

How are you gonna eat them after you traded off your teef to get them?

[Frozenbeernuts 2,332]

I just sold all my gold and bought Ding Dongs. :bigbrain:

You are the thinkerest poster in this thread. :rubsbigbraininnongayway:

[parrot 789]

How are you gonna eat them after you traded off your teef to get them?

 

 

Oh, they're not for eatin' they're for spec-a-latin'.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,433]

This is a pretty good article from July that basically said both sides of the deal had a nuclear bomb that they could use in this war. The union used theirs (strike), so now the hedge funds are using theirs (liquidation).

 

http://management.fortune.cnn.com/2012/07/26/hostess-twinkies-bankrupt/

[Recliner Pilot 61]

I wonder what the union rep is saying to all those unemployed workers now. That has to be an awkward situation.

He's telling them Romney outsourced their jobs to China.

[Bruce Benedict 0]

And here's one showing how Hostess has been running a bogus organization as little more than a vehicle to milk brand equity for the benefit of the corporate elites, all while passing off blame onto the workers for the illegal financial scheme-horse the whole crappy organization has become. They lied to, stole from, and endangered the workers to fatten their pocketbooks before the whole thing inevitably came tumbling down. They hoped to use negative press angled toward unions at a moment when republitard talking points are popular, in order to throw the public off the trail.

 

Happily, as we can see in this thread, the sucker brigade is gobbling it all up greedily.

 

But the truth will out, mother humpers.

 

http://www.sacbee.com/2012/11/13/4983174/hostess-continues-pattern-of-misinformation.html

[TimmySmith 2,783]

This is a pretty good article from July that basically said both sides of the deal had a nuclear bomb that they could use in this war. The union used theirs (strike), so now the hedge funds are using theirs (liquidation).

 

http://management.fortune.cnn.com/2012/07/26/hostess-twinkies-bankrupt/

Was interesting. The bottom line is the Teamsters appear unwilling to cave in because they are afraid of the ripple it might send to other workplaces.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,433]

Was interesting. The bottom line is the Teamsters appear unwilling to cave in because they are afraid of the ripple it might send to other workplaces.

I thought that the Teamsters gave concessions recently, but it was the other union that decided to strike.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,433]

And here's one showing how Hostess has been running a bogus organization as little more than a vehicle to milk brand equity for the benefit of the corporate elites, all while passing off blame onto the workers for the illegal financial scheme-horse the whole crappy organization has become. They lied to, stole from, and endangered the workers to fatten their pocketbooks before the whole thing inevitably came tumbling down. They hoped to use negative press angled toward unions at a moment when republitard talking points are popular, in order to throw the public off the trail.

 

Happily, as we can see in this thread, the sucker brigade is gobbling it all up greedily.

 

But the truth will out, mother humpers.

 

http://www.sacbee.com/2012/11/13/4983174/hostess-continues-pattern-of-misinformation.html

 

 

That is a press release from the union that went on strike. Who is gobbling now? You cannot possibly be this stupid. Oh... wait.

 

This section contains unedited press releases distributed by PR Newswire. These releases reflect the views of the issuing entity and are not reviewed or edited by the Sacramento Bee staff. More information on PR Newswire can be found on their web site. You can contact the service with questions or concerns here.

 

...

 

Hostess Continues Pattern Of Misinformation

 

 

By Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco Workers and Grain Millers International Union

 

Published: Tuesday, Nov. 13, 2012 - 2:12 pm

 

[TimmySmith 2,783]

I thought that the Teamsters gave concessions recently, but it was the other union that decided to strike.

Everything seems to hinge on MEPPs. Another pyramid scheme coming to an end. The teamsters need companies to keep contributing to these old pension plans, so unless Hostess agrees to continue to do this (and they say they cannot), there is no point in continuing the negotiation. The Teamsters are really hurting from these pension plans and need a bailout.

[shovelheadt 71]

Even though I'm diabetic, just hit our snack store for some Zingers.

[DankNuggs 305]

And here's one showing how Hostess has been running a bogus organization as little more than a vehicle to milk brand equity for the benefit of the corporate elites, all while passing off blame onto the workers for the illegal financial scheme-horse the whole crappy organization has become. They lied to, stole from, and endangered the workers to fatten their pocketbooks before the whole thing inevitably came tumbling down. They hoped to use negative press angled toward unions at a moment when republitard talking points are popular, in order to throw the public off the trail.

 

Happily, as we can see in this thread, the sucker brigade is gobbling it all up greedily.

 

But the truth will out, mother humpers.

 

http://www.sacbee.com/2012/11/13/4983174/hostess-continues-pattern-of-misinformation.html

Or you subscribe to reality, and the unions eventually toppled the place

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324556304578122632560842670.html

[DankNuggs 305]

I thought that the Teamsters gave concessions recently, but it was the other union that decided to strike.

They did, it was the bakers union that put the nail in the coffin. I guess they won their 99 week vacations...

 

Gotta love Obama's america, where getting laid off is a better deal than working.

[Little Rusty 19]

I didn't like Obummer much before but now that I see how butthurt you ladies are about the election, I think they should put his face on Mt. Rushmore.

They couldn't carve a head that big

[Recliner Pilot 61]

They couldn't carve a head that big

The hard part would be the ears. I'm not sure granite can cantilever that far out.

[wiffleball 4,797]

Seriously guys, how does a disccussion about the loss of a national icon turn into an O' Bummer conversation?

 

Hehehehe - Sorry, haven't been here in a while.

 

Let's be clear - Twinkies are getting the here, but what about that national food icon - "little chocolate donuts"? Or that classic chocolate covered twinkie - the Chocodile?

 

Anybody else think there's a correlation between the fact that our nations kids are the most over-medicated, psychotropic drug - addicted generation in the history of the world and the fact that these poor kids can't get a wholesome coke and sugary food breakfast? Anybody else remember that classic John Belushi skit? Why are our role models all gone?

 

You know who's behind this, that insidious, nefarious, phony little c unit - "Little Debbie". Never trusted her.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

 

 

You know who's behind this, that insidious, nefarious, phony little c unit - "Little Debbie". Never trusted her.

We now know who Lil Rusty is. :banana:

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

Actually is has everything to do with the employees. IN 2004 the company was heavily burdened with pension obligations, labor rules in addition to debt and declining sales. In 2009 they came out of bankruptcy under the ownership of Ripplewood. The company came out of it after both lenders and the Teamsters allowed some concessions. The public recognition of health and food role has led to the continued decline in sales.

 

Ultimately in a show down between Silver Point and the unions, with both players having ample skin in the outcome. The unions essentially said fock you to the hedge funds, mistakenly thinking that they were dealing with the typical board room goons. That blew up right in their face as the hedge fund people are typically ruthless, and are far more inclined to cut the company to pieces than try to save it anyway.

 

So you have the union morons acting like petulant children who think they can force their way, meanwhile the hedge's are already deciding to can them all the cut the thing up since they know it will likely save them money on a company who's product has fallen from favor; think buggy whips.

 

The unions had a small sliver of hope to save their jobs in this industry, and blew it on their arrogance.

 

I love how when it comes time for people to pay money they promised to pay to a large corporation, it is a sacred obligation, whether they have it or not, and they must do whatever they can to make it happen.

 

But when it comes time for a large corporation to honor obligations IT made, it is suddenly a fluid situation, and the workers are stupid greedy asswholes for insisting that they get paid what they bargained for.

 

You KNOW that the company managed to meet its obligations to meet the CEO's stock options, and gas up his private jet.

[MDC 7,887]

Why does Obummer hate Twinkies?

[Frozenbeernuts 2,332]

I love how when it comes time for people to pay money they promised to pay to a large corporation, it is a sacred obligation, whether they have it or not, and they must do whatever they can to make it happen.

 

But when it comes time for a large corporation to honor obligations IT made, it is suddenly a fluid situation, and the workers are stupid greedy asswholes for insisting that they get paid what they bargained for.

 

You KNOW that the company managed to meet its obligations to meet the CEO's stock options, and gas up his private jet.

Tomorrow when i have free time i am going to research this company to see how much these evil union bakers were making. A coworker said the average baker made around 45k a year. I did not look this up myself yet so i will wait to see what i find.

 

I am not sure if the people in here ridiculing the union workers without looking into the situation are being serious, or if they just bash unions for the hell of it regardless if they are right or wrong to get a rise out of others.

[Blitzen 1]

Hostess and the rest of the snack cake cartel have been foisting carcinogens upon the American public for generations, strongarming the FDA into compliance along the way.

 

Any time the voice of the unions can decree that cancer mongers will fall short of operating capital, it's regulation by public decree. It's a win for the people, and a win for Obama.

 

Together, our vocies will be heard.

 

ONE MORE STEP TOWARD SOCIALIST UTOPIA!

 

DRUG STORES THAT REALLY ARE DRUG STORES!!!

[pimptastic69 0]

Tomorrow when i have free time i am going to research this company to see how much these evil union bakers were making. A coworker said the average baker made around 45k a year. I did not look this up myself yet so i will wait to see what i find.

 

I am not sure if the people in here ridiculing the union workers without looking into the situation are being serious, or if they just bash unions for the hell of it regardless if they are right or wrong to get a rise out of others.

 

I can save you a little time since I work for a company that is represented by this same union. Not Hostess.

 

Roughly $25/hr straight time, time and a half after 8 hrs.

 

Time and a half on Saturday, doubletime on Sunday

 

14-18 paid holidays (depending on which day of the week the holiday falls on)

 

2-6 weeks paid vacation, based on longevity

 

12 excused or unexcused, unpaid absences per calendar year

 

10 tardy/early outs per calendar year

 

Absolutely free healthcare

 

Pension is good, I guess - like 90k per year (doubt I'll ever see it though)

 

With a standard effort (show up on time), I'd expect to make about $55k per year. On average with a fair amount of OT I make about $75k. If I really worked my arse off (every weekend, every holiday and whatnot) I could make as much as $150k.

[Little Rusty 19]

The hard part would be the ears. I'm not sure granite can cantilever that far out.

[Little Rusty 19]

Why does Obummer hate Twinkies?

Because Bloomberg told him to

[wiffleball 4,797]

I wonder what the union rep is saying to all those unemployed workers now. That has to be an awkward situation.

 

 

Not at all. Who the fawk do you think he's blaming? All the while getting paid great bucks by the union. freaking hate unions.

[IGotWorms 4,063]

Why does Obummer hate Twinkies?

 

I thought he loves twinks?

[hoytdwow 202]

As a Republican, I can't figure out where to concentrate my rage, at this president's un-American, socialist agenda that has created a toxic business climate, or the pinko commie unions who ruined this American icon.

[Voltaire 5,491]

As a Republican, I can't figure out where to concentrate my rage, at this president's un-American, socialist agenda that has created a toxic business climate, or the pinko commie unions who ruined this American icon.

I mostly blame the doctors and fitness gurus who tell people not to buy Hostess' products.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,433]

Tomorrow when i have free time i am going to research this company to see how much these evil union bakers were making. A coworker said the average baker made around 45k a year. I did not look this up myself yet so i will wait to see what i find.

 

I am not sure if the people in here ridiculing the union workers without looking into the situation are being serious, or if they just bash unions for the hell of it regardless if they are right or wrong to get a rise out of others.

 

No one is ridiculing how much the workers make. However, when a union faced with the question of concessions or liquidation chooses strike,then you have think they made the wrong call.

[Thornton Melon 648]

Nevermind the workers, I feel terrible for these people. What are they gonna eat? How are they gonna survive?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gtzY7HZx3gc

[TheBlade 3]

:whispers: Who's gonna tell Heavy-set?

He's not fat, he's just big boned.

 

Just ask him.

[Frozenbeernuts 2,332]

Well so far what I am seeing is that every site I go to either supports the union or Hostess. I am not seeing very much information that seems to be unbiased on the issue. I seem to find this true with many subjects I search for. I don't know why someone can't just post the damn facts with out an interjection of "the evil Hostess company" or "strongarm tactics of the unions..." I do know more than a few people on here who get their rocks off by people who agree with their preconceived notions though.

 

From what I can gather, and again this was from biased sources on both sides, Hostess isn't giving any specific details of what the problems were with the negotiations. I have seen a general statement that the unions were using typical tactics to try and disrupt a company and force them to bow to their demands

 

From the union side the workers made concessions (I have not seen how much, usually described as "crippling." I don't buy that) in 2004. These concessions did happen but to what extent I am not sure. I did not dig REALLY deep so maybe I will still come across it.

 

The cost of living goes up every year. These workers took a pay cut in 2004. How are they supposed to keep up with the cost of living if they do not get pay raises but actually give up pay in the process?

 

link

 

BCTGM members are well aware that as the company was preparing to file for bankruptcy earlier this year, the then CEO of Hostess was awarded a 300 percent raise (from approximately $750,000 to $2,550,000) and at least nine other top executives of the company received massive pay raises. One such executive received a pay increase from $500,000 to $900,000 and another received one taking his salary from $375,000 to $656,256.

 

Unless this is a blatant lie, it seems the execs had no problem taking a pay increase.

 

It did seem that these workers were able to make a decent wage and they did not want to concede anything more. Those of you who just throw the "I hate unions!" out there probably have no focking clue what you are talking about. Give me some facts why unions are the bane on society that you say they are.

 

God forbid workers are represented by an organization that stands up to their rights. Of course it is not always going to be perfect. There are situations where unions do take advantage, but large corporations are too business savy and experienced to let a union get so powerful as to ruin an entire business structure. Unless you are part of the top 5% of earners in this country I don't see why you would have a problem with unions. I guess maybe you think people who make Hostess brand products should be at minimum wage?

[Phurfur 70]

Judge puts Hostess liquidation on hold, orders talks

[DankNuggs 305]

Well so far what I am seeing is that every site I go to either supports the union or Hostess. I am not seeing very much information that seems to be unbiased on the issue. I seem to find this true with many subjects I search for. I don't know why someone can't just post the damn facts with out an interjection of "the evil Hostess company" or "strongarm tactics of the unions..." I do know more than a few people on here who get their rocks off by people who agree with their preconceived notions though.

 

From what I can gather, and again this was from biased sources on both sides, Hostess isn't giving any specific details of what the problems were with the negotiations. I have seen a general statement that the unions were using typical tactics to try and disrupt a company and force them to bow to their demands

 

From the union side the workers made concessions (I have not seen how much, usually described as "crippling." I don't buy that) in 2004. These concessions did happen but to what extent I am not sure. I did not dig REALLY deep so maybe I will still come across it.

 

The cost of living goes up every year. These workers took a pay cut in 2004. How are they supposed to keep up with the cost of living if they do not get pay raises but actually give up pay in the process?

 

link

 

 

 

Unless this is a blatant lie, it seems the execs had no problem taking a pay increase.

 

It did seem that these workers were able to make a decent wage and they did not want to concede anything more. Those of you who just throw the "I hate unions!" out there probably have no focking clue what you are talking about. Give me some facts why unions are the bane on society that you say they are.

 

God forbid workers are represented by an organization that stands up to their rights. Of course it is not always going to be perfect. There are situations where unions do take advantage, but large corporations are too business savy and experienced to let a union get so powerful as to ruin an entire business structure. Unless you are part of the top 5% of earners in this country I don't see why you would have a problem with unions. I guess maybe you think people who make Hostess brand products should be at minimum wage?

The minutia is typical union ridiculousness.... Bread and Cakes can not be put into the same truck. The workers who load the bread can't touch the cakes. There is a different guy who handles stocking the store from the trucks... 80 different bloated pension plans, 40 different HC plans...

 

They thought they could have their cake and eat it too, and made a HUGE miscalculation. They were under the assumption if they forced Hostess into bankruptcy that another operator would swoop in and continue operating the bakeries, and they'd have the leverage to get all their demands...

 

In reality the brands will be purchased (owner of Pabst is in talks) and they will simply subcontract the baking into some non union state, or out of the country.

 

The union made a stupid gamble and lost. Funny, all the election rhetoric was talk of a zero sum game between employers and employees... Here the employer lost, AND the workers lost... Funny... The new buyer will gain, as they'll purchase for pennies on the dollar and be free of the union BS....

 

Its like what would have happened if Obama didn't bail out the auto unions (and GM)

[DankNuggs 305]

Judge puts Hostess liquidation on hold, orders talks

Liquid Twinkies?

 

 

 

Mmmmmmmm

 

 

 

on an aside, these job losses total 10% of all the private sector job gains this entire year... [Newbie] LOLOL [/Newbie]

[Frozenbeernuts 2,332]

The minutia is typical union ridiculousness.... Bread and Cakes can not be put into the same truck. The workers who load the bread can't touch the cakes. There is a different guy who handles stocking the store from the trucks... 80 different bloated pension plans, 40 different HC plans...

 

They thought they could have their cake and eat it too, and made a HUGE miscalculation. They were under the assumption if they forced Hostess into bankruptcy that another operator would swoop in and continue operating the bakeries, and they'd have the leverage to get all their demands...

 

In reality the brands will be purchased (owner of Pabst is in talks) and they will simply subcontract the baking into some non union state, or out of the country.

 

The union made a stupid gamble and lost. Funny, all the election rhetoric was talk of a zero sum game between employers and employees... Here the employer lost, AND the workers lost... Funny... The new buyer will gain, as they'll purchase for pennies on the dollar and be free of the union BS....

 

Its like what would have happened if Obama didn't bail out the auto unions (and GM)

Yeah I guess whenever an employer asks that you take a pay you should oblige, even if you had already taken one eight years prior. I make a good wage per hour but if my company tells me I have to go down to minimum wage or else they will go bankrupt I guess I am just going to roll over and take it. Even if they were already in bankruptcy and did not adjust their business practices to stay away from it a second time, including the pay cuts, and the raises all the top execs got...

[DankNuggs 305]

Yeah I guess whenever an employer asks that you take a pay you should oblige, even if you had already taken one eight years prior. I make a good wage per hour but if my company tells me I have to go down to minimum wage or else they will go bankrupt I guess I am just going to roll over and take it. Even if they were already in bankruptcy and did not adjust their business practices to stay away from it a second time, including the pay cuts, and the raises all the top execs got...

You miss the fact that the devil is in the details... Their business practices are dictated by these union deals, situations where you could operate more efficiently and streamline things, but are held hostage by union protocols... Their deals make it incredibly difficult to compete as operationally your hands are tied behind your backs...

 

 

Let the bread guy load both cake and bread trucks, hell allow the trucks to carry whatever is most efficent for the company. This is the type of ridiculousness that kills companies...

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,433]

Let the bread guy load both cake and bread trucks, hell allow the trucks to carry whatever is most efficent for the company. This is the type of ridiculousness that kills companies...

 

What? Are you kidding? Talk about dangerous. If the cake and bread are in the same truck, it will be total anarchy. Bread guys don't know cakes and cake guys don't know bread. Unless you have a union cake delivery guy, who knows what will happen. The guy might stop for coffee at the wrong time or deliver things 5 minutes after 4pm, when the union guys have long since left.

[Frozenbeernuts 2,332]

You miss the fact that the devil is in the details... Their business practices are dictated by these union deals, situations where you could operate more efficiently and streamline things, but are held hostage by union protocols... Their deals make it incredibly difficult to compete as operationally your hands are tied behind your backs...

 

 

Let the bread guy load both cake and bread trucks, hell allow the trucks to carry whatever is most efficent for the company. This is the type of ridiculousness that kills companies...

I don't disagree I guess. There are many things that unions do to keep each job separate. Unfortunately this does make a company less efficient and less competitive. I just can't argue with those facts as many are true.

 

It is the entire.. I don't know what to call it.. THING. It is the entire business model and direction that our mindset/economy is headed. Every company is trying to become more "streamlined" "competitive" "whatever." We are competing with China, Korea, Brazil, India, whoever is cheaper than the US... EVERYONE. We can't compete with them when you are thinking in terms of cost.

 

Where does it stop though? I mean even if we payed all of our workers minimum wage it would probably still be cheaper to go with China or some other nation. Where does it stop? Where do we put our foot down and decide that we will not reduce our work force to barely scrapping by. It is headed in the direction where a person working for a company like Hostess cannot support their family. I am not saying they should all make 100K a year but we are headed toward an economy where the majority of jobs cannot support the basic needs of a family.

 

So yes, if that is your goal to reduce the cost of everything so we can compete with China, well it isn't going to happen, but the closest we can get is going to be the downfall of this country.

 

We were a once thriving nation on the cutting edge of everything with prevailing wages to boot. The only way, seriously the only way to avoid a class war, I mean a real class war... one where blood is spilled, is to put our foot down. Stop buying goods not made in another country where possible.

 

The status of each country is evening out. The main beneficiary of this is going to be China. They have a government that makes all of the decisions for the entire country in regards to business. They do what is best for China as a whole. Well "best for China" is a relative term. It is going to depend on whether the people in China let the leaders of their country keep them in the dark, keep them at bay while a select few determine what each individual should and should not do, see, hear, say.

 

Unions were brought about by people who were sick of corporations taking advantage, taking advantage more than anyone of us has any idea, unless you are from a country like China and have seen how they try to manipulate the populous. Blood was spilled to equal the playing field, to let the common man earn a wage that allowed him to live a life in relative comfort.

 

Not that long ago, at least in relative terms of time, damn near everyone was a "slave" to their job. They broke their backs and worked tirelessly just to get by. I am not saying it will get that bad, but as far as the wages are concerned... Unless the price of everyone falls in tandem with how wages fall there will be a huge upset in our market system.

 

You could cut every single person's wage in half in the country besides the top 5 percent thinking it would streamline all business and make everyone more competitive. There would be such a drastic change in purchasing that the economy would collapse. In time it may correct itself, and this is a large overexageration, at least time frame wise, but the market looks at what is being bought. When people buy less regardless of factors the market reacts in a very sharp and negative way.

 

I just hope markets can react with rationality once we get to a point where the people of this country can no longer purchase the world into prosperity. :endrant:

[Savage Beast 1]

Good. Hopefully there will be a few less fat asses in America now.

 

They will just switch to Little Debbie instead.