edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 Wow, Rams fans were extremely outnumbered by Patriots fans at the Super Bowl The Patriots basically played a home game, and it made a difference. https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/2/3/18209695/super-bowl-2019-rams-patriots-home-game-fans Bigly. Rams have no fans. lowest scoring game ever,. 3 years in a row for pats did you hear that place last night? Pathetic. Was like a home game for the Pats. They have 2 teams in LA you don't say?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Baker Boy 1,485 Posted February 4, 2019 The story should read Team averaging 32 points a game held to 3 points! Football fans really don’t understand or appreciate the game anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 The story should read Team averaging 32 points a game held to 3 points! Football fans really don’t understand or appreciate the game anymore. 1st thing you've ever said that has some merit. :slowclap: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Doesn't have to be helmet to helmet. This is the one that I think they based it on. When did the league make this rules innovation? I dont doubt that it was a penalty according to the evolving rules of the game. I just think the new rules are stupid and hurt the sport. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,657 Posted February 4, 2019 Libtards triggered by Patriots win. Love it. Now they hate all of Boston Sports because racism and Trump. Lol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 When did the league make this rules innovation? I dont doubt that it was a penalty according to the evolving rules of the game. I just think the new rules are stupid and hurt the sport. The defenseless player stuff went into effect in 2011 or 2012, but it has been adjusted over the years. They will have to continue to prevent hitting with the head and getting hit in the head. Otherwise, these guys are going to end up like vegetables and the game will end up dying out. Participation in youth football is down predominantly due to concerns about concussions. We can say we don't like it, but we aren't the ones getting drilled on a regular basis. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,657 Posted February 4, 2019 The New England Patriots- The Real Americans Team. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
porkbutt 861 Posted February 4, 2019 The story should read Team averaging 32 points a game held to 3 points! Football fans really don’t understand or appreciate the game anymore. yep i don't understand how this is a penalty https://thebiglead.com/2019/01/20/video-chiefs-egregiously-flagged-for-roughing-the-passer-on-tom-brady/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 The defenseless player stuff went into effect in 2011 or 2012, but it has been adjusted over the years. They will have to continue to prevent hitting with the head and getting hit in the head. Otherwise, these guys are going to end up like vegetables and the game will end up dying out. Participation in youth football is down predominantly due to concerns about concussions. We can say we don't like it, but we aren't the ones getting drilled on a regular basis. Incidental contact to the ball carriers head is still legal. The only difference in this case seems to be that he was also a defenseless receiver, even though he had already clearly caught the ball, which is stupid. If a receiver 10 yards downfield gets hit as the ball arrives we dont call him defenseless. The league is becoming a joke with this stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 When did the league make this rules innovation? I dont doubt that it was a penalty according to the evolving rules of the game. I just think the new rules are stupid and hurt the sport. Much like the tuck rule (which was called correctly at the time) and the holding of Receivers off the line (which was allowed at the time) the NFL will make more changes because the patriots won Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Much like the tuck rule (which was called correctly at the time) and the holding of Receivers off the line (which was allowed at the time) the NFL will make more changes because the patriots won The tuck rule was a bad call on the field. Every time the NFL makes changes they make the league worse. The NFL should stop making changes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 yep i don't understand how this is a penalty https://thebiglead.com/2019/01/20/video-chiefs-egregiously-flagged-for-roughing-the-passer-on-tom-brady/ if not for the missed call in the rams/saints game, this was the worst call in a long time Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 The tuck rule was a bad call on the field. Every time the NFL makes changes they make the league worse. The NFL should stop making changes. It was nice to see the ticky tack hits on the QB not called for once. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vuduchile 1,941 Posted February 4, 2019 The defenseless player stuff went into effect in 2011 or 2012, but it has been adjusted over the years. They will have to continue to prevent hitting with the head and getting hit in the head. Otherwise, these guys are going to end up like vegetables and the game will end up dying out. Participation in youth football is down predominantly due to concerns about concussions. We can say we don't like it, but we aren't the ones getting drilled on a regular basis. The inconsistency in how some rules are applied is what bothers me. Not just from play to play but from position to position. There are a ton of rules in place to protect QBs but none about hitting them while they're defenseless. I'd argue that a QB is more defenseless during his throwing motion than a receiver is during a catch. But QBs have to stand in there and take the rib shots like a man. Dumb Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 The inconsistency in how some rules are applied is what bothers me. Not just from play to play but from position to position. There are a ton of rules in place to protect QBs but none about hitting them while they're defenseless. I'd argue that a QB is more defenseless during his throwing motion than a receiver is during a catch. But QBs have to stand in there and take the rib shots like a man. Dumb Not Brady. he just turtles and falls back Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
porkbutt 861 Posted February 4, 2019 if not for the missed call in the rams/saints game, this was the worst call in a long time yeah it got overshadowed by the saints call. both were horrendous. you just sit and wait for the flag after every focking play. starting to really suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 The inconsistency in how some rules are applied is what bothers me. Not just from play to play but from position to position. There are a ton of rules in place to protect QBs but none about hitting them while they're defenseless. I'd argue that a QB is more defenseless during his throwing motion than a receiver is during a catch. But QBs have to stand in there and take the rib shots like a man. Dumb Ok. You guys still are not getting this. If Burkhead had been hit at the waist or the chest, as the ball arrived or shortly thereafter, it would have been a legal hit. The tackler wrapped him up around the neck and their helmets made contact. They ruled him to be defenseless and the contact was illegal under RULE 12 SECTION 2 ARTICLE 7. If you hit a QB in the head/neck or you hit him at the knees while he is throwing, then that is illegal as well. Hit him in the chest and it is football. No problem. Now, I agree that the refs are not consistent, but that is one of the reasons that they try to have fewer judgment calls for the refs. An example was the force out rule on the sidelines. It used to be that the receiver could be ruled in bounds if the defender was determined to have forced the receiver out of bounds before he could get both feet down. They got rid of that rule so that it would not be a judgment call anymore. Either you get your feet down in bounds or it is not a catch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Ok. You guys still are not getting this. If Burkhead had been hit at the waist or the chest, as the ball arrived or shortly thereafter, it would have been a legal hit. The tackler wrapped him up around the neck and their helmets made contact. They ruled him to be defenseless and the contact was illegal under RULE 12 SECTION 2 ARTICLE 7. Incidental contact to the helmet of a receiver / ball carrier is not a penalty. The difference in this case is that it was a supposedly defenseless receiver. What I dont understand is what makes him defenseless? Receivers get hit all the time right as the ball arrives without a flag. In this case he had already fully caught the ball. So the way I see it: 1. Incidental contact to the head / neck is okay. 2. Hitting the receiver before he makes a football move is okay. 3. 1+2 = a 15-yard penalty. Pats would have won either way. Just saying it was an atrocious call and you cant watch a single game today without at least one head slapper. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 Incidental contact to the helmet of a receiver / ball carrier is not a penalty. The difference in this case is that it was a supposedly defenseless receiver. What I dont understand is what makes him defenseless? Receivers get hit all the time right as the ball arrives without a flag. In this case he had already fully caught the ball. So the way I see it: 1. Incidental contact to the head / neck is okay. 2. Hitting the receiver before he makes a football move is okay. 3. 1+2 = a 15-yard penalty. Pats would have won either way. Just saying it was an atrocious call and you cant watch a single game today without at least one head slapper. Did you read the rule? Let me point out the exact reason. https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-video-rulebook/defenseless-player/ First, you must have a defenseless player. This is how Burkhead is defenseless PLAYERS IN A DEFENSELESS POSTURE It is a foul if a player initiates unnecessary contact against a player who is in a defenseless posture. 1. Players in a defenseless posture are: 2. A receiver attempting to catch a pass who has not had time to clearly become a runner. If the player is capable of avoiding or warding off the impending contact of an opponent, he is no longer a defenseless player Now, the contact must be illegal. 2. Prohibited contact against a player who is in a defenseless posture is: 1. forcibly hitting the defenseless player’s head or neck area with the helmet, facemask, forearm, or shoulder, even if the initial contact is lower than the player’s neck, and regardless of whether the defensive player also uses his arms to tackle the defenseless player by encircling or grasping him The referee believed that both of those conditions were met and made the call. It is not as atrocious when you watch the replay after reading the actual rule. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 Incidental contact to the helmet of a receiver / ball carrier is not a penalty. The difference in this case is that it was a supposedly defenseless receiver. What I dont understand is what makes him defenseless? Receivers get hit all the time right as the ball arrives without a flag. In this case he had already fully caught the ball. So the way I see it: 1. Incidental contact to the head / neck is okay. 2. Hitting the receiver before he makes a football move is okay. 3. 1+2 = a 15-yard penalty. Pats would have won either way. Just saying it was an atrocious call and you cant watch a single game today without at least one head slapper. Who was in the booth, Gene Steratore? he said it was the right call. said it was the right call on the hit as Goff was running OOB Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
parrot 789 Posted February 4, 2019 Three series of highlight clips? Thanks for posting; I'm at work but can look for a video of the game if you'd like. Also the first play of the last clip is a great example of my other point -- the Pats are extremely well-trained at PI which inexplicably doesn't get called. Those links are all to the same video, which is the highlight video for the game for both teams. There are lots of Patriot plays on there too. I'm just asking you to link to some of these picks the Pats run "every. Single. Play.", because I can't seem to find them right off hand. At least not any that are as or more blatant than those of the Rams I linked to. Seems like a pretty simple request. That hand-fighting probably could have been called but it frequently doesn't get called, and that's not at all unique to the Patriots. That's just your confirmation-bias focking with you again. Even if that had been called, in a perfect world it's nullified by the obvious OPI aka "pick play" that went uncalled, and it doesn't really change anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vuduchile 1,941 Posted February 4, 2019 Ok. You guys still are not getting this. If Burkhead had been hit at the waist or the chest, as the ball arrived or shortly thereafter, it would have been a legal hit. The tackler wrapped him up around the neck and their helmets made contact. They ruled him to be defenseless and the contact was illegal under RULE 12 SECTION 2 ARTICLE 7. If you hit a QB in the head/neck or you hit him at the knees while he is throwing, then that is illegal as well. Hit him in the chest and it is football. No problem. Now, I agree that the refs are not consistent, but that is one of the reasons that they try to have fewer judgment calls for the refs. An example was the force out rule on the sidelines. It used to be that the receiver could be ruled in bounds if the defender was determined to have forced the receiver out of bounds before he could get both feet down. They got rid of that rule so that it would not be a judgment call anymore. Either you get your feet down in bounds or it is not a catch. Im not arguing the definition of the rule. Im saying its not a good rule and is not applied consistently. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,657 Posted February 4, 2019 Nerds Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 yeah it got overshadowed by the saints call. both were horrendous. you just sit and wait for the flag after every focking play. starting to really suck. I don't really want to go down this rabbit hole, but last years super bowl was marred by 2 replays that were not over-turned, that would have been over-turned during the regular season. Can't we just watch a focking game anymore? waiting for a flag, waiting for a bad call, waiting for replay to suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 Im not arguing the definition of the rule. Im saying its not a good rule and is not applied consistently. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posty 2,296 Posted February 4, 2019 Imagine the sense of loss for Bill Cowher. He was set up for true greatness as coach of the Steelers and with multiple super bowls coming in the 21st century. Then came Brady and Belichick and his super bowl caliber teams kept getting bounced early by them, and eventually he winds up spending his prime coaching years hiding in the studio. It should have been him and Big Ben. Cowher only won one Super Bowl... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,567 Posted February 4, 2019 Cowher only won one Super Bowl... Correct. Tomlin won also Grassy Knoll - 4 Chinny - 1 coach trippy - 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,206 Posted February 4, 2019 wait. wait... so... they're so well trained at committing penalties that the refs don't even know they're committing penalties? that's what you're going with here? No, I think they see it more often than not. My guess is that there is a sense of "eh we don't want to throw a flag on that" or else they would have to do it every. Single. Play. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Did you read the rule? Let me point out the exact reason. https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-video-rulebook/defenseless-player/ First, you must have a defenseless player. This is how Burkhead is defenseless Now, the contact must be illegal. The referee believed that both of those conditions were met and made the call. It is not as atrocious when you watch the replay after reading the actual rule. The refs NEVER make that call on a defenseless player when its a downfield pass. Receivers constantly get hit right as the ball arrives without a flag. Again I dont doubt that the rule is in the rule book. I think its a dumb rule applies inconsistently. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 The refs NEVER make that call on a defenseless player when its a downfield pass. Receivers constantly get hit right as the ball arrives without a flag. Again I dont doubt that the rule is in the rule book. I think its a dumb rule applies inconsistently. You can hit the receiver downfield as the ball arrives and thereafter. You just can't hit them in the head/neck. Are you being obtuse or trolling? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 You can hit the receiver downfield as the ball arrives and thereafter. You just can't hit them in the head/neck. Are you being obtuse or trolling? But you can make incidental contact to the receivers head / neck without drawing a flag, correct? That was my understanding of the rule and I see incidental contact with the helmet that doesnt draw a flag all the time. Maybe I am wrong though, I cant keep up with the NFLs rules innovations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,657 Posted February 4, 2019 I hope that's not Gronks last game. I really enjoy watching that guy play. And I think he's a big meathead, but a funny one. Probably made the biggest offensive play of the game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mighty_thor 115 Posted February 4, 2019 Part of why I don't like the Pats is because they run a WR pick on every. Single. Play. They've been doing it for 15 years. Why do the refs never call it? The Rams had way more pick plays in this game just like KC had more pick plays in the AFC Championship game. On the final drive of the game it was just about impossible for the Pats to have a pick play as they were playing with an extra blocking tight end and and 2 running backs (1 full back) with just one wide receiver. Gronk was triple covered on the big catch. Edelman is a magician at getting open without any help by a pick. Pats really missed Josh Gordon in this game. Against the Chargers, they were able to pound the ball consistently but the Rams presented a tougher d line. Chris Hogan is good when they line up 3 wide receivers but he can't get any separation on any decent corner when they line up 2 wideouts. He was ok when playing with Edelman and Gordon and in previous years when the Pats had Cooks, Amendola or Edelman. Pats need some speed at receiver next year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 But you can make incidental contact to the receivers head / neck without drawing a flag, correct? That was my understanding of the rule and I see incidental contact with the helmet that doesnt draw a flag all the time. Maybe I am wrong though, I cant keep up with the NFLs rules innovations. Yes, incidental contact is not a penalty. The contact on Burkhead was not incidental contact. His head snapped back. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bier Meister 1,514 Posted February 4, 2019 Congrats my pats fans imaginary friends! Great game plans and defensive schemes throughout the playoffs. Cheers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Yes, incidental contact is not a penalty. The contact on Burkhead was not incidental contact. His head snapped back. Sure looked incidental to me. Looked face mask to face mask as they collided at the chest. 15 yard penalty for footballing. Next time give the guy a chance to run and dont hit him so hard I guess. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 Sure looked incidental to me. Looked face mask to face mask as they collided at the chest. 15 yard penalty for footballing. Next time give the guy a chance to run and dont hit him so hard I guess. 1 more time. Hit him lower!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 1 more time. Hit him lower!!!!!! I thought the issue was Burkhead was defenseless since he didnt turn around, survey his surroundings and get a running start? Joke of a call in an awful game. The Pats truly are great but the NFL is in a true low period. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Patriotsfatboy1 1,432 Posted February 4, 2019 I thought the issue was Burkhead was defenseless since he didnt turn around, survey his surroundings and get a running start? Joke of a call in an awful game. The Pats truly are great but the NFL is in a true low period. Now you are trolling. Again, if he had been hit in the chest or lower with a shoulder, it would not have been a penalty. The defenseless player can be hit, just not in the head or neck area. This is tackling 101 right now in football. Look up Seahawk Tackling on youtube. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted February 4, 2019 Now you are trolling. Again, if he had been hit in the chest or lower with a shoulder, it would not have been a penalty. The defenseless player can be hit, just not in the head or neck area. This is tackling 101 right now in football. Look up Seahawk Tackling on youtube. For the millionth time I am not doubting its on the books, Im saying a version of football where that sh1t is a penalty is not the sport I grew up watching and playing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites