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Coronavirus - Doomsday

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"Wearing a mask is why flu cases are down."

But.

Wearing a mask - somehow covid cases keep rising.

Also a special kind of stupid would fall for this one. I mean you gotta be a fockin moron to believe that BS. BOTH should be down. You simply cannot have one rising and one falling.

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1 minute ago, lod001 said:

"Wearing a mask is why flu cases are down."

But.

Wearing a mask - somehow covid cases keep rising.

Also a special kind of stupid would fall for this one. I mean you gotta be a fockin moron to believe that BS. BOTH should be down. You simply cannot have one rising and one falling.

Because covid is more contagious than the flu...

And it’s not just masks, probably not even mainly masks.  It’s social distancing and many people working and going to school from home.

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And even if you want to believe that every flu case is being labeled as covid and the flu shouldn’t be down at all despite all the precautions people are taking, average yearly flu deaths are usually less than 50k. NBD that covid deaths are about 7x that.

And even if you say that it’s just recent winter flu cases being labeled as covid, we have still been averaging over 2k covid deaths per day since the beginning of December which would take less than a month to match the 50k flu deaths (on the high end) that we usually see in a year (and no, they’re not all dying of gunshots).

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8 hours ago, Utilit99 said:

Here's the thing. Nobody knows anything about all this. Even very expert doctors disagree. Why stall our economy because a whole bunch of people don't know what they are talking about? newsom and pelosi don't follow their own rules and get caught yet still close businesses and ruin lives because they are above it in their minds. This is not good. Leaders lead by example. The left are a bunch of retards that need to be called out and kicked out. 

Because a lot of people are dying.  But I agree, as I’ve said multiple times every business where social distancing is possible should be able to be open, and yes many of the democratic leaders are hypocrites.

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7 hours ago, nobody said:

We know they lie.  Why should we believe presymptomatic and asymptomatic people are spreading covid?  We know they don’t follow their own guidance.  

Also, when they had confirmed a few hundred cases, they knew that meant there were thousands of cases out there.  Unless they’re incompetent.  When they’re not being incompetent, they’re lying.  Why the fūck is anyone listening to these guys?

I agree, you don’t need to listen to Fauci or polciticians.  Listen to the studies, and common sense, like the idea that putting something over your face might result in less stuff getting out or in.

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1 hour ago, TimHauck said:

I agree, you don’t need to listen to Fauci or polciticians.  Listen to the studies, and common sense, like the idea that putting something over your face might result in less stuff getting out or in.

Yet the numbers rose...as mask wearing became more prevalent.  

How ? 

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1 hour ago, lod001 said:

"Wearing a mask is why flu cases are down."

But.

Wearing a mask - somehow covid cases keep rising.

Also a special kind of stupid would fall for this one. I mean you gotta be a fockin moron to believe that BS. BOTH should be down. You simply cannot have one rising and one falling.

Nailed it.. but don't worry,  Joe will get that PCR cycle rate down, which will make the cases go down and losers will credit Joe. 

It's beyond retarded, the whole show. 

 

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11 minutes ago, drobeski said:

Yet the numbers rose...as mask wearing became more prevalent.  

How ? 

Because masks don't stop the spread, but wearing them is better than not wearing them.    Most studies show that areas with better mask compliance fared better than those with worse compliance.

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5 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Because masks don't stop the spread, but wearing them is better than not wearing them.    Most studies show that areas with better mask compliance fared better than those with worse compliance.

Maybe they help the spread, that's why the numbers are rising.  :dunno:

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2 minutes ago, drobeski said:

Maybe they help the spread, that's why the numbers are rising.  :dunno:

It spread everywhere, but when comparing similar areas, cases and deaths rose more in areas that didn't have as much mask wearing.

(and of course this is still not getting into the fact that people don't wear them when they're around friends or family)

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7 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

It spread everywhere, but when comparing similar areas, cases and deaths rose more in areas that didn't have as much mask wearing.

(and of course this is still not getting into the fact that people don't wear them when they're around friends or family)

I call BS.  Links?

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11 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

It spread everywhere, but when comparing similar areas, cases and deaths rose more in areas that didn't have as much mask wearing.

(and of course this is still not getting into the fact that people don't wear them when they're around friends or family)

Link ? 

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2 hours ago, TimHauck said:

I agree, you don’t need to listen to Fauci or polciticians.  Listen to the studies, and common sense, like the idea that putting something over your face might result in less stuff getting out or in.

So I need to listen to the same incompetent people that made the models that were orders of magnitude off.  I got jokers to the left of me and liars to the right.  I'll just do what I want.

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15 minutes ago, Strike said:

I call BS.  Links?

 

12 minutes ago, drobeski said:

Link ? 

 

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12 minutes ago, nobody said:

So I need to listen to the same incompetent people that made the models that were orders of magnitude off.  I got jokers to the left of me and liars to the right.  I'll just do what I want.

Models aren't the same as studies

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3 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

 

 

Either you didn't understand what I was asking or something but I have no idea what this is supposed to show. 

Okay, looked again.  Next time don't post MULTIPLE links such that people can click on totally irrelevant links.  But whatever.  Your links don't say what you are suggesting they say but I do like the one about masks working with hamsters.  That's very relevant.  :rolleyes:

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2 minutes ago, Strike said:

Either you didn't understand what I was asking or something but I have no idea what this is supposed to show. 

That post has links to multiple studies backing up what I said

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9 minutes ago, Strike said:

Either you didn't understand what I was asking or something but I have no idea what this is supposed to show. 

Okay, looked again.  Next time don't post MULTIPLE links such that people can click on totally irrelevant links.  But whatever.  Your links don't say what you are suggesting they say but I do like the one about masks working with hamsters.  That's very relevant.  :rolleyes:

Nice, same comeback as eldub used, focus on the one about hamsters and ignore the others (although I don't see why a hamster study is that bad, things are studied on hamsters all the time).

Please expand on why you don't think those studies say what I was suggesting, thanks.

And I clearly put a quick summary before each link...

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1 minute ago, TimHauck said:

That post has links to multiple studies backing up what I said

Multiple different studies, multiple different findings, multiple different doctors, multiple different opinions. Let people run their businesses if they want to. Let people frequent those businesses if they want to. Let people hide in their basements if they want to. Keep the economy going is all I give a shlt about. I would be more afraid to walk around the west side of Chicago than to go grab a couple margaritas at On the Border during these times. 

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3 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Nice, same comeback as eldub used, focus on the one about hamsters and ignore the others (although I don't see why a hamster study is that bad - at least they listen if people tell them to wear masks).

Please expand on why you don't think those studies say what I was suggesting, thanks.

And I clearly put a quick summary before each link...

1)  It doesn't address the following statement:

Quote

It spread everywhere, but when comparing similar areas, cases and deaths rose more in areas that didn't have as much mask wearing.

2)  It doesn't explain something you keep avoiding, which is the FACT that cases are way up in areas with heavy mask wearing.  Los Angeles has the strictest mandates in the country yet they have the biggest outbreak.  Can you explain that?  A simple yes or no will suffice.  I don't need you continuing to avoid the question.

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10 minutes ago, Strike said:

1)  It doesn't address the following statement:

2)  It doesn't explain something you keep avoiding, which is the FACT that cases are way up in areas with heavy mask wearing.  Los Angeles has the strictest mandates in the country yet they have the biggest outbreak.  Can you explain that?  A simple yes or no will suffice.  I don't need you continuing to avoid the question.

1) I believe these 4 links in particularly backed up my statement:

Here's an interesting study which IMO actually also does a good job summarizing some of the prior studies and opinions, which studied areas with mask mandates vs. those without them, and found "The study provides evidence that US states mandating the use of face masks in public had a greater decline in daily COVID-19 growth rates after issuing these mandates compared with states that did not issue mandates" - https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/10.1377/hlthaff.2020.00818#:~:text=Between April 8 and May 15%2C governors of fifteen states,retail stores) where maintaining six

Here's another  that says "Mask mandates are associated with a 25 to 46 per cent average reduction in weekly COVID-19 cases across Canada" - https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/10/201007085638.htm

And another, "after implementation of mask mandates in 24 Kansas counties, the increasing trend in COVID-19 incidence reversed" - https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6947e2.htm

Another "duration of mask-wearing by the public was negatively associated with mortality" - https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.22.20109231v5

 

2) Cases are up in a lot of places.  Actually pending a huge surge of post-holiday case reporting, cases in California actually appear to have been trending down since 12/21.

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2 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

 

2) Cases are up in a lot of places.  Actually pending a huge surge of post-holiday case reporting, cases in California actually appear to have been trending down since 12/21.

So you refuse to honor a simple request, which was to give a yes or no answer to why LOS ANGELES is having a MAJOR outbreak despite the strictest mandates in the country.  I'll ask you to respond to that query again.  

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/05/us/los-angeles-county-california-human-disaster-covid/index.html

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8 minutes ago, Strike said:

So you refuse to honor a simple request, which was to give a yes or no answer to why LOS ANGELES is having a MAJOR outbreak despite the strictest mandates in the country.  I'll ask you to respond to that query again.  

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/05/us/los-angeles-county-california-human-disaster-covid/index.html

I don't know the specifics of LA's data, but looking at states (where the LA metro area makes up almost half of California's population), California actually has nowhere near the worst outbreak when factoring in population.  In terms of both cases and deaths per million population, California is actually better than average.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

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Just now, TimHauck said:

I don't know the specifics of LA's data, but looking at states (where the LA metro area makes up almost half of California's population), California actually has nowhere near the worst outbreak when factoring in population.  In terms of both cases and deaths per million population, California is actually better than average.

 

Outbreak? You mean less false positives ? 

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If anyone was curious, the Dakotas (99% mask compliance there I'm sure...) lead the way in terms of cases per million population, and they are #6 and 7 in deaths behind the 5 northeastern states that were hit hard early and had some stupid governors.

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4 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I don't know the specifics of LA's data, but looking at states (where the LA metro area makes up almost half of California's population), California actually has nowhere near the worst outbreak when factoring in population.  In terms of both cases and deaths per million population, California is actually better than average.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Too bad.

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11 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I don't know

You've made that painfully obvious. 

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27 minutes ago, Strike said:

So you refuse to honor a simple request, which was to give a yes or no answer to why LOS ANGELES is having a MAJOR outbreak despite the strictest mandates in the country.  I'll ask you to respond to that query again.  

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/05/us/los-angeles-county-california-human-disaster-covid/index.html

 

I am going to respond to this anecdotally. My wife's brother married a hispanic woman and according to them their side of the family is taking coronavirus very seriously. They do not eat out, they wear masks, and some of them even wipe down/wash groceries.

However, every weekend there are huge get togethers with cousins, cousins/cousins, etc and this is safe, because it is just family. My guess is that it is the Hispanic population's culture that is driving the outbreak in LA and previously in El Paso.

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18 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I don't know the specifics of LA's data, but looking at states (where the LA metro area makes up almost half of California's population), California actually has nowhere near the worst outbreak when factoring in population.  In terms of both cases and deaths per million population, California is actually better than average.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Jesus fock, you just can't honor a simple request.  I'm not comparing LA to OTHER places.  I'm comparing LA to LA.  If LA is doing so well why did they implement such draconian measures over the last couple of months?  Clearly they're not doing as well as they were a few months ago or they wouldn't have done that.  And the measures they've implemented don't seem to be helping.  I'm trying to make this simple but you just won't have that conversation.  I guess we're done then.

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18 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I don't know the specifics of LA's data, but looking at states (where the LA metro area makes up almost half of California's population), California actually has nowhere near the worst outbreak when factoring in population.  In terms of both cases and deaths per million population, California is actually better than average.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Sorry, California - the largest state full of sheeple that believe this crap with toughest restrictions in the country totally getting destroyed by Covid right now isn't helping your argument.

And who are all the rubes working from home?  Go to work you lazy fuks.

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Just now, MTSkiBum said:

 

I am going to respond to this anecdotally. My wife's brother married a hispanic woman and according to them their side of the family is taking coronavirus very seriously. They do not eat out, they wear masks, and some of them even wipe down/wash groceries.

However, every weekend there are huge get togethers with cousins, cousins/cousins, etc and this is safe, because it is just family. My guess is that it is the Hispanic population's culture that is driving the outbreak in LA and previously in El Paso.

First of all, I'm talking to Tim.  He's the one who says masks are great like Tony the Tiger.  He also said,

"  Listen to the studies, and common sense."

IOW, "trust the science." 

I'm not looking for "guesses" as to why things are the way they are.  I want Tim to explain, scientifically, why Los Angeles is doing so poorly despite having the most draconian restrictions in the nation.

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9 minutes ago, Strike said:

First of all, I'm talking to Tim.  He's the one who says masks are great like Tony the Tiger.  He also said,

"  Listen to the studies, and common sense."

IOW, "trust the science." 

I'm not looking for "guesses" as to why things are the way they are.  I want Tim to explain, scientifically, why Los Angeles is doing so poorly despite having the most draconian restrictions in the nation.

 

How in the world can 1 random schmuck on the internet explain that. This will be studied for years by epidemiologists and even then there will be a magnitude of error to their conclusions. Anyone who confidently states what LA is doing wrong is full of crap.

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Being a Californian (northern) I would LOVE the answers to the questions. 

We still have the strictest lockdowns, curfews, businesses are still closed (restaurants, hair/nails, etc). My daughter has not yet set foot in a classroom, and there are some kids who are pretty much MISSING an entire year of school, setting CA back even further in terms of education of kids. 

And....our Gov has hinted that there is no "green tier" because HE doesn't believe things will be open like they were for a LONG time, if EVER. 

I have pandemic fatigue. I am focking over this garbage. Every where I go (which is pretty much the grocery store once a week), EVERYONE has on a focking mask. Masks are NOT the issue and I really wish people would stop acting as if mask wearing will save us all. 

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1 minute ago, MTSkiBum said:

How in the world can 1 random schmuck on the internet explain that. This will be studied for years by epidemiologists and even then there will be a magnitude of error to their conclusions. Anyone who confidently states what LA is doing wrong is full of crap.

I'm not the one making the assertion that masks are so great.  He is.  Of course he can't explain it.  That's why he's avoiding and deflecting instead of answering.

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2 minutes ago, MTSkiBum said:

 

How in the world can 1 random schmuck on the internet explain that. This will be studied for years by epidemiologists and even then there will be a magnitude of error to their conclusions. Anyone who confidently states what LA is doing wrong is full of crap.

If you look at it in the basics of what's been happening: 

*Lock shite down

*Wear masks 

And this started MONTHS ago and cases are still going up...LA may not be "WRONG" but something ain't right. 

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4 minutes ago, Strike said:

Jesus fock, you just can't honor a simple request.  I'm not comparing LA to OTHER places.  I'm comparing LA to LA.  If LA is doing so well why did they implement such draconian measures over the last couple of months?  Clearly they're not doing as well as they were a few months ago or they wouldn't have done that.  And the measures they've implemented don't seem to be helping.  I'm trying to make this simple but you just won't have that conversation.  I guess we're done then.

Here is the link to LA County data - http://dashboard.publichealth.lacounty.gov/covid19_surveillance_dashboard/

Plotting the 7 day average in Excel, it looks like it plateaued around 12/18 and then started coming down (indicating maybe the measures are helping, again not saying I agree with the measures).  But as I said previously, we probably need to wait a few more days to get a better picture since there was likely less testing & reporting of testing over the holidays. 

I never said they were doing "well."  I said they're doing better than average in the US - as we've seen that doesn't really translate to "well."    But yes you need to factor in population to say how "well" or not any place is doing.   Just like more tests will probably lead to more cases, more people will probably lead to more cases too.    Not that difficult of a concept.    So while the stories of overwhelming hospitals make people think their outbreak is out of control, that's also partly due to the fact that California has some of the least hospital beds per capita in the country - https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/beds-by-ownership/?currentTimeframe=0&sortModel={"colId":"Total","sort":"desc"}

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Just now, TimHauck said:

Here is the link to LA County data - http://dashboard.publichealth.lacounty.gov/covid19_surveillance_dashboard/

Plotting the 7 day average in Excel, it looks like it plateaued around 12/18 and then started coming down (indicating maybe the measures are helping, again not saying I agree with the measures).  But as I said previously, we probably need to wait a few more days to get a better picture since there was likely less testing & reporting of testing over the holidays. 

I never said they were doing "well."  I said they're doing better than average in the US - as we've seen that doesn't really translate to "well."    But yes you need to factor in population to say how "well" or not any place is doing.   Just like more tests will probably lead to more cases, more people will probably lead to more cases too.    Not that difficult of a concept.    So while the stories of overwhelming hospitals make people think their outbreak is out of control, that's also partly due to the fact that California has some of the least hospital beds per capita in the country - https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/beds-by-ownership/?currentTimeframe=0&sortModel={"colId":"Total","sort":"desc"}

You know what leads to more cases. Higher cycle rates on the PCR test. 

Thats what. 

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3 minutes ago, Strike said:

I'm not the one making the assertion that masks are so great.  He is.  Of course he can't explain it.  That's why he's avoiding and deflecting instead of answering.

Nowhere did I say masks are great.  I said wearing one is better than not wearing one (in terms of covid spread).

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Just now, TimHauck said:

Here is the link to LA County data - http://dashboard.publichealth.lacounty.gov/covid19_surveillance_dashboard/

Plotting the 7 day average in Excel, it looks like it plateaued around 12/18 and then started coming down (indicating maybe the measures are helping, again not saying I agree with the measures).  But as I said previously, we probably need to wait a few more days to get a better picture since there was likely less testing & reporting of testing over the holidays. 

I never said they were doing "well."  I said they're doing better than average in the US - as we've seen that doesn't really translate to "well."    But yes you need to factor in population to say how "well" or not any place is doing.   Just like more tests will probably lead to more cases, more people will probably lead to more cases too.    Not that difficult of a concept.    So while the stories of overwhelming hospitals make people think their outbreak is out of control, that's also partly due to the fact that California has some of the least hospital beds per capita in the country - https://www.kff.org/other/state-indicator/beds-by-ownership/?currentTimeframe=0&sortModel={"colId":"Total","sort":"desc"}

ROFLMAO.  Dude, it's like you're not even reading the links I'm posting. 

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-01-05/la-county-residents-warned-covid-19-everywhere

I guess CNN and the LA Times are just lieing to people now. 

 

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1 minute ago, MTSkiBum said:

 

How in the world can 1 random schmuck on the internet explain that. This will be studied for years by epidemiologists and even then there will be a magnitude of error to their conclusions. Anyone who confidently states what LA is doing wrong is full of crap.

It's actually easy to start a list of wrongs we absolutely know already:

1 - Full of illegals by their sanctuary city declaration.  Come on in boys, covid?, no problem.

2 - They promote and allow homeless populations to congregate without consequence.  Covid?, no worries, you know what we need, more needles!

3 - They allow all kinds of peaceful protest gatherings.  Cough, cough, that's ok, they are outside!

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