Ahmaud Arbery

[The Observer 641]

Just now, tanatastic said:

Are you saying he wasn’t? Did you watch the video? He absolutely was the aggressor in the moment that decided wether the men would shoot or not. The white guys drove up on him with guns with the intent to either scare him, question him, contain him, whatever. Then they had to shoot when he tried to take the gun from one of them. 

Two guys approached HIM. With a gun.  He was fighting for his life. What a focked up way of looking at things. Christ

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

8 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

I agree but after seeing the longer video, where Aubrey was on the left side of the road and clearly sees the guy holding a gun, then sprints around the truck and confronts him and struggles / fights with him I'm wondering.

I still think the two guys hold some culpability.  I'm just not down with armed citizens arrests unless somebodies life is in danger. 

If these two wanted to play cop then they can play by cop rules. Do you think cops should be drawing down on everyone they encounter, or when they have reason to believe that DPF could be used against them? That’s the standard. How can you articulate that when you were the one pursuing? The first thing the trespasser did was run form these guys. They chased. End of story. If he had emerged from newbie34’s fingerbang lair and immediately went after them , different story. He didn’t. He tried to run. Let him run. 

[tanatastic 2,062]

3 minutes ago, The Observer said:

Two guys approached HIM. With a gun.  He was fighting for his life. What a focked up way of looking at things. Christ

Jesus...Yes they had guns, no it wasn’t warranted. But when you are faced with the reality of men with guns drawn, YOU DONT ATTACK THEM! Maybe put your hands up! “Don’t shoot, I’m not armed!”. They would not have shot him if he didn’t attack. Watch the video again. He ran right at them! If that’s me I’m stopping dead in my tracks and putting my hands up.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

Also, like I’ve been saying, I bet the trespasser had mental health issues. If that’s being suppressed I’d love to know why.  Both sides could be hurt by that disclosure,  but they could also be helped. 

[Utilit99 4,099]

6 minutes ago, The Observer said:

Two guys approached HIM. With a gun.  He was fighting for his life. What a focked up way of looking at things. Christ

Wrong again Fingerbang. The guilty guy ran straight at the guy with the gun and attacked him. He made a bad decision because he was guilty of a lot of shlt. Too bad he wasn't carrying the gun he brought to school that time when he was running from the cops.

[tanatastic 2,062]

 

Here’s the video. 10 seconds in, he is running right at the stopped truck with armed gunmen. Smart? 18 seconds in he’s strategically running around the truck to get the jump on the gunmen with intent to disarm him. THEN, he gets shot when the buddy knows it’s either him or me if he gets that gun and doesn’t act. 

[The Observer 641]

7 minutes ago, tanatastic said:

Jesus...Yes they had guns, no it wasn’t warranted. But when you are faced with the reality of men with guns drawn, YOU DONT ATTACK THEM! Maybe put your hands up! “Don’t shoot, I’m not armed!”. They would not have shot him if he didn’t attack. Watch the video again. He ran right at them! If that’s me I’m stopping dead in my tracks and putting my hands up.

I'm not saying that he didn't make a mistake. I'm just saying that two rednecks hunted him down and confronted him. They didn't have a gun on the front seat 'just in case'. He had a gun in his hands. No one knows how they react if fearing for their life. His reaction was to fight for it. As would mine have been. It doesn't take one iota of culpability away from the rednecks. 

 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

3 minutes ago, tanatastic said:

 

Here’s the video. 10 seconds in, he is running right at the stopped truck with armed gunmen. Smart? 18 seconds in he’s strategically running around the truck to get the jump on the gunmen with intent to disarm him. THEN, he gets shot when the buddy knows it’s either him or me if he gets that gun and doesn’t act. 

He was running from the scene, right? How far away from Newbies fingerbang lair was that? 

[iam90sbaby 2,611]

10 minutes ago, tanatastic said:

 

Here’s the video. 10 seconds in, he is running right at the stopped truck with armed gunmen. Smart? 18 seconds in he’s strategically running around the truck to get the jump on the gunmen with intent to disarm him. THEN, he gets shot when the buddy knows it’s either him or me if he gets that gun and doesn’t act. 

Not guilty.

The insane mental gymnastics people are playing to defend the shady behavior before the incident cracks me up. All to score points with people who hate you. Someone in this thread even said "I know what they did wasn't illegal but I'd like to see them in prison.." Uh, what?

[Utilit99 4,099]

2 minutes ago, iam90sbaby said:

Not guilty.

The insane mental gymnastics people are playing to defend the shady behavior before the incident cracks me up. All to score points with people who hate you. Someone in this thread even said "I know what they did wasn't illegal but I'd like to see them in prison.." Uh, what?

This is why it's nice to have Fingerbang posting on this site again. To remind everyone there are a lot of him running around.

Trump 2020!!

[tanatastic 2,062]

5 minutes ago, The Observer said:

I'm not saying that he didn't make a mistake. I'm just saying that two rednecks hunted him down and confronted him. They didn't have a gun on the front seat 'just in case'. He had a gun in his hands. No one knows how they react if fearing for their life. His reaction was to fight for it. As would mine have been. It doesn't take one iota of culpability away from the rednecks. 

 

If your instinct when faced with men with guns in a favorable high ground and protected position is to try and take a gun, you have terrible instincts. This was a clear no win situation for him. They were just trying to be dicks, scare him, harass him, question him or whatever. They only shot when he went for the gun, putting them in a “him or me” situation.

[RLLD 4,230]

9 minutes ago, The Observer said:

I'm not saying that he didn't make a mistake. I'm just saying that two rednecks hunted him down and confronted him. They didn't have a gun on the front seat 'just in case'. He had a gun in his hands. No one knows how they react if fearing for their life. His reaction was to fight for it. As would mine have been. It doesn't take one iota of culpability away from the rednecks. 

 

Interesting.  I think your usage of the term "hunted" is purposeful in attempting to frame this event, and not warranted.

I am now left wondering why on earth this person decided to run down the road toward these two people in a vehicle if he was being <aherm> "hunted"? 

So perhaps then these two yahoos did or said something to piss this clown off, and he decided it was a good idea to come after them?   Looks like uncle Chuck may have stepped in here.

What an idiot for running at them to attack them, no wonder he ended up getting shot....

[peenie 1,915]

I watched the video and I do not agree that Ahmaud felt the home was someone's dwelling and that it was simply unoccupied. It looks like a new structure or one that is completed gutted. It does not look like they were putting in a new kitchen or expanding the house. It looks like an empty home that just has the outside up with the inside bare. It does not appear to have anything in it other than building material.

Therefore it seems to me that he was just looking. Even if he was not just looking he left empty handed. He had not stolen anything. It is just speculation that he was trying to burglarize the home.

[The Observer 641]

1 minute ago, tanatastic said:

If your instinct when faced with men with guns in a favorable high ground and protected position is to try and take a gun, you have terrible instincts. This was a clear no win situation for him. They were just trying to be dicks, scare him, harass him, question him or whatever. They only shot when he went for the gun, putting them in a “him or me” situation.

Like I said, it turned out to be the wrong choice, but there was a good chance they were going to kill him anyway. Why else have the gun in your hands?  His choice was bad for them too.  He lost his life. They became murderers. Hopefully the next time two rednecks decide to hunt down a black guy for kicks, they aren't stupid enough to have a gun in their hands.  If they're still scared with outnumbering him 2 to 1, perhaps they should have brought more white guys with them.

[The Observer 641]

1 minute ago, peenie said:

I watched the video and I do not agree that Ahmaud felt the home was someone's dwelling and that it was simply unoccupied. It looks like a new structure or one that is completed gutted. It does not look like they were putting in a new kitchen or expanding the house. It looks like an empty home that just has the outside up with the inside bare. It does not appear to have anything in it other than building material.

Therefore it seems to me that he was just looking. Even if he was not just looking he left empty handed. He had not stolen anything. It is just speculation that he was trying to burglarize the home.

It's murder even if he had stolen something. Which he didn't

[tanatastic 2,062]

1 minute ago, peenie said:

I watched the video and I do not agree that Ahmaud felt the home was someone's dwelling and that it was simply unoccupied. It looks like a new structure or one that is completed gutted. It does not look like they were putting in a new kitchen or expanding the house. It looks like an empty home that just has the outside up with the inside bare. It does not appear to have anything in it other than building material.

Therefore it seems to me that he was just looking. Even if he was not just looking he left empty handed. He had not stolen anything. It is just speculation that he was trying to burglarize the home.

Nothing he did before warranted getting shot, at all. Even if he was a burglar, that’s still not the right of the two men to shoot him. The reason he got shot, and I’ll say this 10 more times if need be in this thread, is because he attacked two men with guns and tried to take the gun. 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

1 minute ago, The Observer said:

Like I said, it turned out to be the wrong choice, but there was a good chance they were going to kill him anyway. Why else have the gun in your hands?  His choice was bad for them too.  He lost his life. They became murderers. Hopefully the next time two rednecks decide to hunt down a black guy for kicks, they aren't stupid enough to have a gun in their hands.  If they're still scared with outnumbering him 2 to 1, perhaps they should have brought more white guys with them.

You don’t help matters. You’re woke, we get it. No need to be over the top. 

[RLLD 4,230]

1 minute ago, The Observer said:

It's murder even if he had stolen something. Which he didn't

It might be.

Whether he understood what he was doing was legal or not is irrelevant really..  Everything I had been reading suggested these two redneck morons came swooping in and attempted to arrest the guy, which is wrong on their part; whether they should have had a gun or not is another topic.

Instead we see this moron running AT THEM, like.....what the fock dude are you hoping to die?  How focking stupid can you be?

So this moron assaults THEM, and ends up getting shot....yeah, that will happen.  Being stupid can be fatal.

[tanatastic 2,062]

2 minutes ago, The Observer said:

Like I said, it turned out to be the wrong choice, but there was a good chance they were going to kill him anyway. Why else have the gun in your hands?  His choice was bad for them too.  He lost his life. They became murderers. Hopefully the next time two rednecks decide to hunt down a black guy for kicks, they aren't stupid enough to have a gun in their hands.  If they're still scared with outnumbering him 2 to 1, perhaps they should have brought more white guys with them.

It’s definitely possible, but I’d call it very unlikely that they were just going to shoot him in cold blood. They shot when it became an altercation, which it shouldn’t have become considering you have two guys with guns vs 1 unarmed man.

[BiffTannen 954]

16 minutes ago, iam90sbaby said:

Not guilty.

The insane mental gymnastics people are playing to defend the shady behavior before the incident cracks me up. All to score points with people who hate you. Someone in this thread even said "I know what they did wasn't illegal but I'd like to see them in prison.." Uh, what?

I doubt it even goes to trial. Hopefully the McMichaels sue Reggie's family for defamation and take all $3.00 they have to their name. 

[The Observer 641]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You don’t help matters. You’re woke, we get it. No need to be over the top. 

It's murder because they chose to have the gun. On foot. That makes them the hunters.  Had they been man enough to approach him on foot, unarmed, he'd still be alive and they'd still be free men.  Biggest mistake was trying to be vigilantes in the first place. Guarantee you they never did this before with a white guy.  Second mistake was doing it scared. No gun, no murder. It shouldn't have depended on hos the black guy reacted. He was outnumbered 

[The Observer 641]

1 minute ago, tanatastic said:

It’s definitely possible, but I’d call it very unlikely that they were just going to shoot him in cold blood. They shot when it became an altercation, which it shouldn’t have become considering you have two guys with guns vs 1 unarmed man.

They were probably hoping to scare him by having the gun. When they found out he was a fighter, their miscalculation made the whole plan blow up in their faces

[peenie 1,915]

6 minutes ago, tanatastic said:

Nothing he did before warranted getting shot, at all. Even if he was a burglar, that’s still not the right of the two men to shoot him. The reason he got shot, and I’ll say this 10 more times if need be in this thread, is because he attacked two men with guns and tried to take the gun. 

But tanatastic (what the heck does that name even mean?) they followed him, why? If the home was empty and it didn't have graffiti spray painted on it (as that happens as well) why did they follow him with guns? What would prompt normal human beings to follow someone with guns who had not stolen anything?? It's not abnormal to look. He ran away after they yelled at him. I just don't understand why you can't see my point of view. The home was bare, he didn't take anything, he ran away and wasn't posing a threat to anyone. I feel that you all are really mean.

[KSB2424 3,148]

The part I cannot understand is the two men essentially set up a road block, both easily seen with guns. 

Why did this dude continue to jog at them and then whip around the corner and confront the one guy?

Weird.

[Utilit99 4,099]

7 minutes ago, peenie said:

I watched the video and I do not agree that Ahmaud felt the home was someone's dwelling and that it was simply unoccupied. It looks like a new structure or one that is completed gutted. It does not look like they were putting in a new kitchen or expanding the house. It looks like an empty home that just has the outside up with the inside bare. It does not appear to have anything in it other than building material.

Therefore it seems to me that he was just looking. Even if he was not just looking he left empty handed. He had not stolen anything. It is just speculation that he was trying to burglarize the home.

If I owned that building I would have been pissed that he was in there. And I would have chased after him. If he was soooo innocent, why did he quickly sprint into the house after he looked around to see if anyone was watching, then when someone saw him, why did he sprint away?

 

[tanatastic 2,062]

Just now, The Observer said:

They were probably hoping to scare him by having the gun. When they found out he was a fighter, their miscalculation made the whole plan blow up in their faces

Oh for sure I agree.  I have always said, never have a gun you aren’t prepared to use with deadly force. They did not expect to kill anyone that day but when a fight breaks out you panic and when you panic holding a gun, bad things can happen. If the gunman freezes up, Arbery takes the gun and kills both of them.

[KSB2424 3,148]

1 minute ago, peenie said:

 they followed him, why?

Looks to me they drove up further down the road from where he was running from and stopped in the middle of the road like a road block.  I don't see them running after him or chasing him down? 

 

[peenie 1,915]

Just now, KSB2424 said:

The part I cannot understand is the two men essentially set up a road block, both easily seen with guns. 

Why did this dude continue to jog at them and then whip around the corner and confront the one guy?

Weird.

But if he ran the other way that would prove he was guilty.

Also, he may have felt that if he stopped, he would be an easy target and would have been shot.

He also miscalculated his strength and agility.

[Utilit99 4,099]

13 minutes ago, The Observer said:

It's murder even if he had stolen something. Which he didn't

Maybe he was just fingerbanging himself. Ah the good ole days huh Newbs?

[peenie 1,915]

You know, though? There is one thing that makes me think they weren't trying to intentionally kill him and that they were truly trying to make a citizens arrest....

[RLLD 4,230]

1 minute ago, peenie said:

But tanatastic (what the heck does that name even mean?) they followed him, why? If the home was empty and it didn't have graffiti spray painted on it (as that happens as well) why did they follow him with guns? What would prompt normal human beings to follow someone with guns who had not stolen anything?? It's not abnormal to look. He ran away after they yelled at him. I just don't understand why you can't see my point of view. The home was bare, he didn't take anything, he ran away and wasn't posing a threat to anyone. I feel that you all are really mean.

Why they followed him is irrelevant.  People can walk and drive where they please, there was no issue until the dead guy decided it was time to fight and attacked them....in that instance, yes, shoot away. 

If you want to ask a question the right question is why did he attack them.   Did they say or do something that led to him deciding these guys needed to be assaulted to solve something?

Lief is hard enough, making stupid decisions can get one killed.

[Utilit99 4,099]

4 minutes ago, peenie said:

But tanatastic (what the heck does that name even mean?) they followed him, why? If the home was empty and it didn't have graffiti spray painted on it (as that happens as well) why did they follow him with guns? What would prompt normal human beings to follow someone with guns who had not stolen anything?? It's not abnormal to look. He ran away after they yelled at him. I just don't understand why you can't see my point of view. The home was bare, he didn't take anything, he ran away and wasn't posing a threat to anyone. I feel that you all are really mean.

What would prompt normal human beings to go into someone else's home without permission?

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

3 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

The part I cannot understand is the two men essentially set up a road block, both easily seen with guns. 

Why did this dude continue to jog at them and then whip around the corner and confront the one guy?

Weird.

It might be interesting to understand whether the guy who was recording the video also had a gun and was chasing him. I had heard that he was chasing as part of this group of vigilantes, but no one has reported as to what happened prior to the recording starting (beyond what was in the house).  

That and he could have mental issues.  

[tanatastic 2,062]

3 minutes ago, peenie said:

But tanatastic (what the heck does that name even mean?) they followed him, why? If the home was empty and it didn't have graffiti spray painted on it (as that happens as well) why did they follow him with guns? What would prompt normal human beings to follow someone with guns who had not stolen anything?? It's not abnormal to look. He ran away after they yelled at him. I just don't understand why you can't see my point of view. The home was bare, he didn't take anything, he ran away and wasn't posing a threat to anyone. I feel that you all are really mean.

You are too focused on what happened before. It doesn’t matter why they followed him. Cuz they are jerks? Cuz they are nosy jerks? That part is irrelevent. They are AHoles, thats why. Doesn’t matter. What matters is that he charged their truck and attacked an armed man. That will get you shot 99/100 times. 

[RLLD 4,230]

1 minute ago, peenie said:

But if he ran the other way that would prove he was guilty.

Also, he may have felt that if he stopped, he would be an easy target and would have been shot.

He also miscalculated his strength and agility.

So running AT them......and attacking them is.....in YOUR mind a good approach?  And running away was dumb, attempting to hold a conversation no good?  The notion that attacking should be on the table seems odd

 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

3 minutes ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

It might be interesting to understand whether the guy who was recording the video also had a gun and was chasing him. I had heard that he was chasing as part of this group of vigilantes, but no one has reported as to what happened prior to the recording starting (beyond what was in the house).  

That and he could have mental issues.  

No shite

[Utilit99 4,099]

4 minutes ago, RLLD said:

So running AT them......and attacking them is.....in YOUR mind a good approach?  And running away was dumb, attempting to hold a conversation no good?  The notion that attacking should be on the table seems odd

 

If it were me being chases by dudes with guns when I don't have one of my own, in that same situation, I'm looking to run in a direction where they can't drive. Then I hope to outrun them at that point. Or to find somewhere where they can't find me.

[RLLD 4,230]

3 minutes ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

It might be interesting to understand whether the guy who was recording the video also had a gun and was chasing him. I had heard that he was chasing as part of this group of vigilantes, but no one has reported as to what happened prior to the recording starting (beyond what was in the house).  

That and he could have mental issues.  

Great point.  Was he running AWAY from the person recording, and not AT the two yahoos in the truck?  And was something said as he ran down the road that compelled him to assault them?

[tanatastic 2,062]

1 minute ago, RLLD said:

Great point.  Was he running AWAY from the person recording, and not AT the two yahoos in the truck?  And was something said as he ran down the road that compelled him to assault them?

Nothing on earth could prompt a sane unarmed man to charge two men with guns. Even “these aren’t loaded”, cuz they are still holding blunt weapons.

[peenie 1,915]

7 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

What would prompt normal human beings to go into someone else's home without permission?

It did not look like a home that was lived in but rather a home that was being built and possibly for sale soon. Geez, I look in the window of homes that are for sale and look peek in the back yard. I sure hope no one shoots me.

It is illogical to me that you all think HE felt he did something wrong by looking in the house. That is not normally seen as a crime, especially since he was only in the house for 3 minutes. There was nothing in it but planks of wood!!!