Possible progress in combating the Climate Change LIE ...

[Hardcore troubadour 15,508]

Liberals are on such a losing streak since Vietnam that it’s become instinctive to just think whatever they are pushing is a bad idea. 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,508]

Mercedes EQS that went for over 100k two years ago can be had for less than half of that. 

[jerryskids 6,829]

1 hour ago, Mike Honcho said:

Some is reflected back into space, but that's a small percentage of the total.  About 70% of the sun's energy that comes to earth reaches the surface, 30% is reflected back into space.  Of that amount that reaches earth, some is reflected back into the atmosphere, a small percent  that is absorbed into greenhouse gases. But when you take that small percentage and double it, say going from .5% to 1% that's a huge change.  Much bigger change than, even if it was even, going from 70% to 69.5

You initially said reflection, not absorption.  Looking just at reflection, if we have perfect reflection at both the atmosphere and the earth, that becomes a infinite geometric series:  The sum of x = 0 to infinity of 0.7*(0.3^x), the value of which is one.  So it's a wash.  Of course, the reflection of the earth is far from perfect, so the practical value would be <1, which is to say, less solar power reaches the earth.  For instance, if reflection is only 50%, the sum would be 14/17 of that without the gases.  Said another way, the initial reflection is never offset by the sum of all subsequent reflections.

Perhaps this is why scientists originally predicted global cooling 50 years ago?   

Anyway, there must be something to the absorption, but I don't feel like figuring out that more complex math.  But my instinct is that we'd end up in the same place, with a theoretical maximum of the same, and a practical overall reduction.

We need @MTSkiBumto come back and school me.  He's a petroleum engineer who has posted analyses showing increased temperature in the past.   

[RLLD 4,254]

4 hours ago, Fnord said:

How many credentials does one need to understand that dirty air + dirty water + dirty food = unhealthy humans? You guys keep talking about common sense, how about you display some?

Your strawman aside, never abandon your sense of curiosity or assume that credentialed people cannot be questioned or challenged.

[Fnord 2,293]

1 minute ago, RLLD said:

Your strawman aside, never abandon your sense of curiosity or assume that credentialed people cannot be questioned or challenged.

How is me making a statement that pollution is bad for human health a strawman? 

You might be the most obtuse poster here.

[RLLD 4,254]

1 minute ago, Fnord said:

How is me making a statement that pollution is bad for human health a strawman? 

You might be the most obtuse poster here.

Pretending away your strawman does not impress me, own it, you will undoubtedly use it again soon.  Always question any "authority". dont be so trusting

[Horseman 2,478]

Doesn't matter what we do. China is in complete control of improving the climate, no other country matters. And theyre building coal power plants as fast as they can. 

[Fnord 2,293]

1 minute ago, RLLD said:

Pretending away your strawman does not impress me, own it, you will undoubtedly use it again soon.  Always question any "authority". dont be so trusting

I'm beginning to wonder if you know what the term strawman means. Don't lecture me about trust when you're still convinced Biden is a giant crook but Trump is on the level. That makes me question if you also struggle with the term 'evidence.'

[RLLD 4,254]

1 minute ago, Fnord said:

I'm beginning to wonder if you know what the term strawman means. Don't lecture me about trust when you're still convinced Biden is a giant crook but Trump is on the level. That makes me question if you also struggle with the term 'evidence.'

I m sure you are.  Are you still wondering if inflation was real last year?  What about the laptop, was that real? Hey, was russian collusion real?  Are we in that recession yet?

If it should arise that I find your opinion is worthless, just understand that there are reasons....

[Hardcore troubadour 15,508]

3 minutes ago, Horseman said:

Doesn't matter what we do. China is in complete control of improving the climate, no other country matters. And theyre building coal power plants as fast as they can. 

Racist

[Horseman 2,478]

4 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I m sure you are.  Are you still wondering if inflation was real last year?  What about the laptop, was that real? Hey, was russian collusion real?  Are we in that recession yet?

If it should arise that I find your opinion is worthless, just understand that there are reasons....

[Fnord 2,293]

12 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I m sure you are.  Are you still wondering if inflation was real last year?  What about the laptop, was that real? Hey, was russian collusion real?  Are we in that recession yet?

If it should arise that I find your opinion is worthless, just understand that there are reasons....

LOL. All this because you refuse to admit that pollution is bad. 

Of all the nasty traits exemplified by their dear leader, MAGA's inability to admit to even the possibility of being wrong might be the most insidious. Hell, they can't even handle being a little scrutinized. But you will keep "questioning credentials" while insisting that your own cannot, while happily denying your own complicity.   

 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,508]

“The Ice Caps are melting! Melting!”

[RLLD 4,254]

1 minute ago, Fnord said:

LOL. All this because you refuse to admit that pollution is bad. 

Of all the nasty traits exemplified by their dear leader, MAGA's inability to admit to even the possibility of being wrong might be the most insidious. Hell, they can't even handle being a little scrutinized. But you will keep "questioning credentials" while insisting that your own cannot, while happily denying your own complicity.   

 

Another strawman, that sure didnt take long.   Of course pollution is bad. So that little tactic wont work, but then again trying to pretend I said something I did not, well, that is part and parce for you.

For someone like you, or really ay liberal, to lament someone else not being able to admit they are wrong is rather brash....more than projection its a serious lack of self awareness.

[seafoam1 3,080]

4 minutes ago, Fnord said:

LOL. All this because you refuse to admit that pollution is bad. 

Of all the nasty traits exemplified by their dear leader, MAGA's inability to admit to even the possibility of being wrong might be the most insidious. Hell, they can't even handle being a little scrutinized. But you will keep "questioning credentials" while insisting that your own cannot, while happily denying your own complicity.   

 

Poor fdorkLibtard. 

[Horseman 2,478]

Fnord's IQ is a good 30-40 points lower than RLLD's.  At least.  

[Fnord 2,293]

1 hour ago, RLLD said:

Another strawman, that sure didnt take long.   Of course pollution is bad. So that little tactic wont work, but then again trying to pretend I said something I did not, well, that is part and parce for you.

For someone like you, or really ay liberal, to lament someone else not being able to admit they are wrong is rather brash....more than projection its a serious lack of self awareness.

How fockin hard was that?!? Maybe you could've started off this whole sequence with that response and avoided this entire stupid exchange. And yes, I acknowledge my part in said stupidity. 

I admit when I'm shown to be wrong. I've changed my perspective on plenty of issues over the years. Your obtuse surmising is YOUR deflection tactic when you can't defend your own position. And you do it a LOT.

All after coaching me on not being too trusting, and accusing ME of lacking self awareness. Irony rules.

[RLLD 4,254]

4 hours ago, Fnord said:

How fockin hard was that?!? Maybe you could've started off this whole sequence with that response and avoided this entire stupid exchange. And yes, I acknowledge my part in said stupidity. 

I admit when I'm shown to be wrong. I've changed my perspective on plenty of issues over the years. Your obtuse surmising is YOUR deflection tactic when you can't defend your own position. And you do it a LOT.

All after coaching me on not being too trusting, and accusing ME of lacking self awareness. Irony rules.

It wasnt hard at all, since...its something I have already stated.

You do not admit when you are wrong, and that is your problem.

Pollution is bad.  Pretending that humans are THE cause of climate change is just inane.  Further, convincing yourself that human can control the climate is just narcissistic. 

But billionaires need to eat too, so suckle at the teat of those manipulating the markets to their advantage if you desire.  The world still needs mindless sycophants. 

[Fnord 2,293]

On 7/30/2025 at 9:52 AM, Fnord said:

You can claim climate change has nothing to do with human activities, fossil fuel use, farming practices, etc. I will disagree. Put that aside.

Rolling back these laws and protections WILL result in more pollution and less safe water, air, and food. This is not being denied or debated. How do you envision that somehow being a positive?

This was our first exchange. Note I say PUT ASIDE climate change to talk about pollution.

13 hours ago, RLLD said:

It wasnt hard at all, since...its something I have already stated.

You do not admit when you are wrong, and that is your problem.

Pollution is bad.  Pretending that humans are THE cause of climate change is just inane.  Further, convincing yourself that human can control the climate is just narcissistic. 

But billionaires need to eat too, so suckle at the teat of those manipulating the markets to their advantage if you desire.  The world still needs mindless sycophants. 

You stated it only after several ridiculous exchanges, and then pretended you admitted it right away. Everything else was made up from whole cloth by you based on your own biases, not what I posted. HTH.

[RLLD 4,254]

2 minutes ago, Fnord said:

This was our first exchange. Note I say PUT ASIDE climate change to talk about pollution.

You stated it only after several ridiculous exchanges, and then pretended you admitted it right away. Everything else was made up from whole cloth by you based on your own biases, not what I posted. HTH.

This is a lie, I was speaking toward climate change and you threw the gun and decided to switch it up to "pollution"......  and you got caught.....

[Fnord 2,293]

38 minutes ago, RLLD said:

This is a lie, I was speaking toward climate change and you threw the gun and decided to switch it up to "pollution"......  and you got caught.....

Nope. How did I get caught switching? I just reposted our first exchange, where I specifically said to put aside climate change. I'd post the whole thing but nobody wants to see another 20 posts of us slap-fighting.

Your are not seemingly capable of good faith discussions anymore. It's unfortunate, as I used to have you in high regard, but just another byproduct of our toxic political environment, I guess. Enjoy your continued attempts to gaslight, obfuscate, and argue fallacies with those that take your words at face value. You cannot be trusted anymore.

 

[RLLD 4,254]

11 minutes ago, Fnord said:

Nope. How did I get caught switching? I just reposted our first exchange, where I specifically said to put aside climate change. I'd post the whole thing but nobody wants to see another 20 posts of us slap-fighting.

Your are not seemingly capable of good faith discussions anymore. It's unfortunate, as I used to have you in high regard, but just another byproduct of our toxic political environment, I guess. Enjoy your continued attempts to gaslight, obfuscate, and argue fallacies with those that take your words at face value. You cannot be trusted anymore.

 

Again, I was rebutting the climate change lie about the impacts of humans, and then all the sudden you shifted to pollution.  I caught you.....

You are behaving as badly as that other specimen, the general or what ever. I try to have an honest dialectic and you twist it all around when it starts to not go your way....I am starting to think now that you also are unworthy of actual discussion.

[nobody 2,691]

On 7/30/2025 at 7:04 AM, RLLD said:

I think we need to accept that climate is not static and changes.  And I think it gets warmer and cooler, and has done so for the entire history of earth.

Setting that aside, I think there is an arrogance among humans that presumes they influence it to a significant degree, and can change it.  So we have those who presume themselves enlightened who have decided to motivate the weak minded with embellished notions of a threat.  This they do because there is a financial reward in scaring people.

People hear the word scientist, and think "They must really know their stuff!"

I work in the scientific community, and let me tell you scientists are just as dumb as the rest of society.  A few things people need to understand:

1. Everyone needs to listen to me when I say this.  ANYTHING BASED ON A MODEL SHOULDN'T BE TRUSTED.  You'd think people would have learned that when all the covid models turned out to be pure sh¡t (3 weeks to flatten the curve!), but they still trust them.
   1. Understand, these models can't be proven or disproven to be accurate.   Think of that meme of the glacier with the sign saying by 2020 it would be melted... which was still there in 2022 or whatever. It's just a best guess based on some model that someone made up.  Just because it comes from a computer doesn't mean it's good.
2. Climate science is like the chiropractics of the science field.  These aren't geniuses just because they have scientist in their title.  It's literally the smallest amount of education necessary to be considered science.
3. People we think are supposed to be smart get things wrong all the time.  Hell, I went to an urgent care doctor three weeks ago with an obvious ear infection exacerbated by a flight.  The first doctor I saw said it wasn't an ear infection.  I knew that was wrong based on the excruciating pain I was in so I went to the ER.  "Oh yeah.  I can see why you're in pain.  You ear drum is bulging out.  It's clearly infected."  A day later my ear drum perforated from the pressure.  Stupid first doctor couldn't diagnose a standard ear infection that was so bad my ear drum perforated, but we think doctors are smart right?
4. These are trillion dollar policy decisions.  We let the wokies lead us into a multi-trillion dollar covid mistake shutting down the economy for two years.  Maybe we should stop listening to the wokies for trillion dollar decisions.

 

[nobody 2,691]

17 minutes ago, nobody said:

Everyone needs to listen to me when I say this.  ANYTHING BASED ON A MODEL SHOULDN'T BE TRUSTED.  You'd think people would have learned that when all the covid models turned out to be pure sh¡t (3 weeks to flatten the curve!), but they still trust them.

1. Understand, these models can't be proven or disproven to be accurate.   Think of that meme of the glacier with the sign saying by 2020 it would be melted... which was still there in 2022 or whatever. It's just a best guess based on some model that someone made up.  Just because it comes from a computer doesn't mean it's good.

 

Let me touch on this more.  Think about your job.  SW programmer, IT professional, lawyer, fry cook like seafoam.  You're an expert at what you do right? 

Take SW programming or IT especially.  How often can you write some software or setup a network or change some network setting, etc., and not test that it works by verifying what you did is correct?  You need that fail/fix feedback loop to get stuff like this right.  And you are an expert!  I work with 100 SW experts.  And guess what?  Not a single one of them can write a simple calculator program and have it work on the first try without some sort of fail/fix loop.

Well, with these models, there is no fail/fix loop.  They predict something will happen in 10 or 20 years, and there is no feedback loop to say "yeah, that was right (or wrong)" because by the time 10 years rolls around, that model is abandoned for some new model, and no one is jumping up and down to talk about the flaws in their 10 year old model anyway.

And yeah I know they probably backtest their models, but that is notoriously the wrong way to do things.  All that does is say 1. what happened in the past was captured well, and 2. what happened in the past will happen in the future.  both of which are incorrect.

 

[Fnord 2,293]

@nobody last 2 posts are spectacular!

These are things I want to hear. Great info on the modeling which I had not heard or considered, and observations about experts being just as dumb as the rest of us are right on the money.

I would not extend that to the point where I'm willing to ignore experts like many seem to be inclined toward, but YMMV.

Thanks for sharing.

[The Elevator Killer 566]

On 7/30/2025 at 12:27 PM, seafoam1 said:

Here in reality, there is no climate crisis. 

All people hate mdpee.  

And look how much less space I took up on the page to say the truth. 

I like MDC. He's my friend. You, not so much. 

[Maximum Overkill 2,015]

It's hot as Fuk in South Carolina and it always has been hot as Fuk in South Carolina. Cows farting doesn't change that either does an Autistic Little Girl telling me the World was ending in 2021. 

[seafoam1 3,080]

3 minutes ago, The Elevator Killer said:

I like MDC. He's my friend. You, not so much. 

Anyone care that you and mdpee hook up? 

[MDC 7,492]

9 minutes ago, The Elevator Killer said:

I like MDC. He's my friend. You, not so much. 

Some people like me. Others, not so much.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But everybody hates Peefoam.  

[seafoam1 3,080]

14 minutes ago, MDC said:

Some people like me. Others, not so much.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But everybody hates Peefoam.  

Everybody hates mdpee. Even his barnyard wife..

[Alias Detective 1,408]

On 7/30/2025 at 8:55 AM, Fnord said:

Cool. Now we can choke on dirty air, get sick from dirty water, watch crop supplies dwindle, food insecurity increase, and really stick it to those stupid bastards that live within 30° of the equator.

Kids and grandkids? Fock those little freeloaders.

What pisses me off is I’m supposedly in a food desert and should, yes I  said should,  have food insecurity. But guess what?  I focking don’t.  Add food insecurity to the list of made up BS the libs use to pander to the weak.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,508]

I guess it’s part of getting older, but the heat waves never bothered me. I actually started looking forward to them when I got a pool. But I didn’t care for this last one. Maybe it was too long. 

[seafoam1 3,080]

5 hours ago, nobody said:

Let me touch on this more.  Think about your job.  SW programmer, IT professional, lawyer, fry cook like seafoam.  You're an expert at what you do right? 

Take SW programming or IT especially.  How often can you write some software or setup a network or change some network setting, etc., and not test that it works by verifying what you did is correct?  You need that fail/fix feedback loop to get stuff like this right.  And you are an expert!  I work with 100 SW experts.  And guess what?  Not a single one of them can write a simple calculator program and have it work on the first try without some sort of fail/fix loop.

Well, with these models, there is no fail/fix loop.  They predict something will happen in 10 or 20 years, and there is no feedback loop to say "yeah, that was right (or wrong)" because by the time 10 years rolls around, that model is abandoned for some new model, and no one is jumping up and down to talk about the flaws in their 10 year old model anyway.

And yeah I know they probably backtest their models, but that is notoriously the wrong way to do things.  All that does is say 1. what happened in the past was captured well, and 2. what happened in the past will happen in the future.  both of which are incorrect.

 

Poor nobody. He'll be working til he's 80 to be able afford his tuna salad and fritos. 

[SUXBNME 1,516]

Coldest July in Sacramento that I ever remember. 

Not a single 100+ degree day

[jonnyutah 293]

On 7/30/2025 at 7:41 AM, Mike Honcho said:

What about the arrogance of people who presume to know more about a subject than the people who have dedicated there lives to study it?  

Imagine dedicating your life to something and literally being wrong about everything over and over. Every prediction failing to come true.

But then also having the balls to still proclaim yourself an expert on the subject. 

Climate scientists are a crazy breed. 

[seafoam1 3,080]

41 minutes ago, jonnyutah said:

Imagine dedicating your life to something and literally being wrong about everything over and over. Every prediction failing to come true.

But then also having the balls to still proclaim yourself an expert on the subject. 

Climate scientists are a crazy breed. 

Honcho has TDS. BAD. He's not smart..

[Mike Honcho 5,295]

11 hours ago, jonnyutah said:

Imagine dedicating your life to something and literally being wrong about everything over and over. Every prediction failing to come true.

But then also having the balls to still proclaim yourself an expert on the subject. 

Climate scientists are a crazy breed. 

Image being naive enough to believe that was true.

[seafoam1 3,080]

1 minute ago, Mike Honcho said:

Image being naive enough to believe that was true.

 Poor honcho.

[The Elevator Killer 566]

15 hours ago, seafoam1 said:

Anyone care that you and mdpee hook up? 

Better than hooking up with something made of foam, like your hookup. 

[seafoam1 3,080]

3 minutes ago, The Elevator Killer said:

Better than hooking up with something made of foam, like your hookup. 

@MDC

Confirmed.

Poor mdpee. Outed!!