Julius Thomas the next great TE?

[Bobbyn2022 53]

Gonzalez,Graham and Gates all basketball players who became great TEs. Watch the Seahawks game and the guy played very very well. Thinking about dropping Dwayne Allen for him would that be stupid!

[wizbang 10]

I think Dwayne Allen is extremely limited in his upside so if you like this Thomas guy I wouldn't hesitate making the transaction. I'm not sure Seattle has an offense that will turn a TE into a stud in the mold of the guys you listed though.

[kutulu 1,692]

He plays for Denver

[Frozenbeernuts 2,292]

I think Dwayne Allen is extremely limited in his upside so if you like this Thomas guy I wouldn't hesitate making the transaction. I'm not sure Seattle has an offense that will turn a TE into a stud in the mold of the guys you listed though.

He meant when Denver played Seattle

[tanatastic 2,062]

Meh hes aight. Playing with Peyton anyone can become a stud, he just needs playtime and trust.

[wizbang 10]

He plays for Denver

Ha. Just shows you I wasn't kidding when I used the 'this Thomas guy'. Not on my radar at all. My main point is Allen has minimal value.

[Bobbyn2022 53]

Why is he just alright he hasn't played at all and when he has he's done pretty good. I know everyone is saying Decker,Thomas and Welker will get all the looks but When manning played With Harrison,Wayne,Stokley Clark played pretty good. Guy was injuried but he's healthy now he's in his 3rd year and that's usually when WR/TE breakout. Basketball players to TEs usually equals success. Plus he does have manning and he won the starting job. The thing a out the NFL is that guys like Gronk and Graham come out of no where and become stars. So someone has to become a star but who. I think Thomas has the best chance?

[weepaws 3,252]

Gonzalez,Graham and Gates all basketball players who became great TEs. Watch the Seahawks game and the guy played very very well. Thinking about dropping Dwayne Allen for him would that be stupid!

i would make the move

[The Football Guru 224]

Why is he just alright he hasn't played at all and when he has he's done pretty good. I know everyone is saying Decker,Thomas and Welker will get all the looks but When manning played With Harrison,Wayne,Stokley Clark played pretty good. Guy was injuried but he's healthy now he's in his 3rd year and that's usually when WR/TE breakout. Basketball players to TEs usually equals success. Plus he does have manning and he won the starting job. The thing a out the NFL is that guys like Gronk and Graham come out of no where and become stars. So someone has to become a star but who. I think Thomas has the best chance?

Read my Bold Predictions piece tomorrow. I think you'll agree that he's worth a shot.

[DrMantisToboggan 5]

What about Tamme and Dreesen?

 

Anybody like him over jordan cameron?

[Criper 24]

I know everyone is saying Decker,Thomas and Welker will get all the looks but When manning played With Harrison,Wayne,Stokley Clark played pretty good.

The fact is, that one great season from Stokley was 2004 when all three Colts WRs went over 1k yards. In that same season, Clark only caught 25/423/5, not exactly lights out production. Stokley and Clark both played the slot, and they were never productive together. Clark was never fantasy worthy until 2007, which coincidently, is the year Stokley left for Denver, giving Clark slot duties all to himself.

 

However, Thomas doesn't play the slot because this guy named Welker does, so even though Thomas is the starter and he has Manning throwing him the ball, he's still at least 4th in the pecking order, AND Tamme and Dreessen are still on the team too. I posted this in the other Julius Thomas lovefest thread, and I'll just copy and post my opinion in this thread too, but there are at least 20-25 other TEs I would rather have for THIS season than Julius Thomas.

 

 

Posted 01 September 2013 - 10:31 PM

Color me skeptical, but I am not getting all the love for Julius Thomas. Yeah, Peyton is the QB, but I just don't see how Julius sees enough targets to be fantasy relevant. Tamme led all Bronco TEs last year with 52 catches, and that was with Tamme playing in the slot, a spot that Welker now occupies. Even if Julius Thomas becomes the redzone target that Dreessen was last year, he's still a TE2 without much upside in the Denver offense, despite his awesome intangibles. It's all about opportunity, and I just don't see much opportunity, say for a game here or there where the gameplan may call for more use from the TE position.

 

[Skinny_Bastard 158]

You can't be great unless you get the opportunities.

There's too many mouths to feed in Denver.

[IGotWorms 4,060]

Plays with a great QB, has some raw talent...if you like him, sure, take a shot on him. Only real downside is that Denver has an awesome WR corps but maybe somebody gets hurt or falls out of favor.

[Bobbyn2022 53]

Well in the Sehawks game he tore it up. He was in the field with all 3 WRs. You can't tell me if Sharpe,Gonzlaz or Gates is playing with studs they won't still have a great season. If the dude is open he's gonna get the ball. Not only that compair him to Dwayne Allen who has Fleener,Wayne,DHB and hilton to compete with. Denver had 30 plays in the first half cause if their high tempo offense.

[WR Guru 31]

It's just a numbers game in Denver. When you have 3 WRs likely to top 1,000 yards, that doesn't leave much for the tight end. An injury to one of those guys could open things up for him, but who knows if that will happen.

[Criper 24]

Well in the Sehawks game he tore it up. He was in the field with all 3 WRs. You can't tell me if Sharpe,Gonzlaz or Gates is playing with studs they won't still have a great season. If the dude is open he's gonna get the ball. Not only that compair him to Dwayne Allen who has Fleener,Wayne,DHB and hilton to compete with. Denver had 30 plays in the first half cause if their high tempo offense.

With respect, you said it yourself, it's preseason. The Broncos were forcing the ball to Julius to evaluate him with the 1's and to see what kind of progress he's made. He's going to be a starter and have a role due to Dreessen still being injured and Tamme getting older and not being effective. But, when was the last time Peyton Manning made an inline TE into a fantasy relevant TE? Maybe the days of Marcus Pollard who was mediocre at best. It doesn't matter if dude is open or not, if the play called is not designed to go to the TE. Nobody could cover DT and Decker last year. Do you think that is going to change now that Welker has been brought in? Hell, Welker is going to draw coverage too making it tough to double team DT as frequently. I can't imagine John Fox is gonna say, "hey, we got this unproven former basketball player at TE, and even though DT and Decker were outstanding last year, and even though we gave Welker $6mil this year, let's gameplan to get the ball into Julius Thomas' hands." That's just not going to happen. The difference with Sharpe, Gonzo, and Gates is those guys were the focal points of their offense with a game plan designed to get the ball in their hands. The only thing Thomas has in common with those guys is he played basketball too.

 

Don't get me wrong, he'll have a good game or two this year, but you are going to have to live with a lot of 2/23/0 games while your chasing those good games he may have from time to time. To me, Julius Thomas could be a redzone target like Dreessen was last year, when Dreessen had 5 TD grabs, but even so, he will be so inconsistent week to week, and I don't recall anyone jumping up and down to add Dreeseen to their teams last year despite the 5 TDs. (maybe they did jump up and down, I don't really remember, that was last year lol)

 

Comparing the Colts skill players to the Broncos is apples to oranges. Colts run a two TE base formation, which will favor more production from the TE's than the Broncos, and the Broncos run 3 wides favoring WR production. And we all know the Colts WRs are not in the same class as DT, Decker, and Welker. For these reason alone, I'd rather have Allen than Julius. Anyone counting on Julius Thomas to be your TE1 is chasing fools gold IMO. He's now in his 3rd year, has an injury history, and plays in an offense that features its' outside receivers and slot receivers, not the TE.

 

Curious, what kind of numbers are you expecting Julius Thomas to post this year? I saw a post where you mentioned he is in his 3rd year, and that's when a lot of receivers break out, which is true. However, typically they break out because after playing the first 2 years, the game slows down for them, they understand how to read coverage, etc. Thomas has played like 4 games in his career and has 1 catch, so he doesn't have the experience that most 3rd year players have.

[jaxjag 43]

With respect, you said it yourself, it's preseason. The Broncos were forcing the ball to Julius to evaluate him with the 1's and to see what kind of progress he's made. He's going to be a starter and have a role due to Dreessen still being injured and Tamme getting older and not being effective. But, when was the last time Peyton Manning made an inline TE into a fantasy relevant TE? Maybe the days of Marcus Pollard who was mediocre at best. It doesn't matter if dude is open or not, if the play called is not designed to go to the TE. Nobody could cover DT and Decker last year. Do you think that is going to change now that Welker has been brought in? Hell, Welker is going to draw coverage too making it tough to double team DT as frequently. I can't imagine John Fox is gonna say, "hey, we got this unproven former basketball player at TE, and even though DT and Decker were outstanding last year, and even though we gave Welker $6mil this year, let's gameplan to get the ball into Julius Thomas' hands." That's just not going to happen. The difference with Sharpe, Gonzo, and Gates is those guys were the focal points of their offense with a game plan designed to get the ball in their hands. The only thing Thomas has in common with those guys is he played basketball too.

 

Don't get me wrong, he'll have a good game or two this year, but you are going to have to live with a lot of 2/23/0 games while your chasing those good games he may have from time to time. To me, Julius Thomas could be a redzone target like Dreessen was last year, when Dreessen had 5 TD grabs, but even so, he will be so inconsistent week to week, and I don't recall anyone jumping up and down to add Dreeseen to their teams last year despite the 5 TDs. (maybe they did jump up and down, I don't really remember, that was last year lol)

 

Comparing the Colts skill players to the Broncos is apples to oranges. Colts run a two TE base formation, which will favor more production from the TE's than the Broncos, and the Broncos run 3 wides favoring WR production. And we all know the Colts WRs are not in the same class as DT, Decker, and Welker. For these reason alone, I'd rather have Allen than Julius. Anyone counting on Julius Thomas to be your TE1 is chasing fools gold IMO. He's now in his 3rd year, has an injury history, and plays in an offense that features its' outside receivers and slot receivers, not the TE.

 

Curious, what kind of numbers are you expecting Julius Thomas to post this year? I saw a post where you mentioned he is in his 3rd year, and that's when a lot of receivers break out, which is true. However, typically they break out because after playing the first 2 years, the game slows down for them, they understand how to read coverage, etc. Thomas has played like 4 games in his career and has 1 catch, so he doesn't have the experience that most 3rd year players have.

 

I like Allen but Fleener could cut into his production, hurting them both.

 

Are you sure the Denver WRs are in another class from the Colts WRs under Manning - Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Stokely, Clark? I'm not so sure.

 

The common thread is Manning and I can see him finding the "open" guy - regardless of who it its. As such, I think Thomas can be comparable to many TEs with lesser QBs.

 

I'm not counting on him to be my TE1... but I think the upside (and having a piece of the Bronco offense) is pretty appealing.

[famousb 11]

He's got talent, but he plays on a team with 3 better options at WR.

[Criper 24]

 

Are you sure the Denver WRs are in another class from the Colts WRs under Manning - Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Stokely, Clark? I'm not so sure.

 

 

No, I wasn't making that claim. I was referring to the current cast of Wayne, Hilton, and DHB as mentioned in the quote I was responding to.

 

Well in the Sehawks game he tore it up. He was in the field with all 3 WRs. You can't tell me if Sharpe,Gonzlaz or Gates is playing with studs they won't still have a great season. If the dude is open he's gonna get the ball. Not only that compair him to Dwayne Allen who has Fleener,Wayne,DHB and hilton to compete with. Denver had 30 plays in the first half cause if their high tempo offense.

[Antiramie 50]

You can't be great unless you get the opportunities.

There's too many mouths to feed in Denver.

So Jimmy Graham is useless in New Orleans then! Darnit!

[BingoBrown 8]

So Jimmy Graham is useless in New Orleans then! Darnit!

New Orleans' receiving corps is not nearly what Denver's is. Graham would definitely see less targets if he was in Denver.

[jgcrawfish 232]

Not even going to read thru this, there's no way. He's going to be up and down, mostly down. Too many mouths to feed in Denver for a newbie TE to get much love. Worth a late flyer or WW pick-up for for some dead weight, but not much more IMO.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

So Jimmy Graham is useless in New Orleans then! Darnit!

 

Jimmy is THE mouth to feed. Big difference, and comparing the 2 is ridiculous.

[Breesman32 11]

It's just a numbers game in Denver. When you have 3 WRs likely to top 1,000 yards, that doesn't leave much for the tight end. An injury to one of those guys could open things up for him, but who knows if that will happen.

In real football terms, this is what could come back to haunt Manning. You need to use your tightend to be a complete team. Tightend production helps a team get further.

[unclemercy 53]

In real football terms, this is what could come back to haunt Manning. You need to use your tightend to be a complete team. Tightend production helps a team get further.

translates to mannings gonna be hurting because thomas is my te and my feelings are.

 

i passed.

[McBain 13]

Looking at Peyton's tendencies at ProFootballFocus, tight ends tend to get 2nd most targets. The problem is last season, the targets were split between Dressen and Tamme.

 

If Thomas is full time starter ala Dallas Clark, he can finish the season as a top ten tight end.

[We Tigers 71]

Looking at Peyton's tendencies at ProFootballFocus, tight ends tend to get 2nd most targets. The problem is last season, the targets were split between Dressen and Tamme.

 

If Thomas is full time starter ala Dallas Clark, he can finish the season as a top ten tight end.

He totally could be a top ten TE, but I think he'd have to get there on touchdowns, like Rudolph last year. TE10-12 have caught around 52-60 balls each of the past five seasons topped 650 yards, and those might be tough marks to hit. The TE group in Denver had 143 targets last year, and many of those will go to Welker. Dreesen and Tamme will also play a bit. I could see a 40/450/8 type line happening since Manning has always made good use of right ends near the end zone, but with three stellar wide receivers I think Thomas will need an injury to get past 40-45 receptions. Even that might be a smidge generous.

[Turf CamelToe 1]

Nice start for JT

[Canadianfan 76]

Nice start for JT

 

looks big and fast...beast

[bigblue08 1]

He looking good.

[murf74 461]

Wow wish I had seen this guy play during preseason....after last year I didn't think Peyton digged his TEs anymore....well he is on waivers

[dcgangstas 41]

Antonio Gates V2.0!!

 

Loving that 18th round pick right about now.

[Reality 3,121]

Good call. Beast.

[saut 7]

Really kicking myself for not following through on my plan to take him with my last draft pick. Stupid Jordan Cameron just haaaad to fall to the 13th...

[Canadianfan 76]

 

The fact is, that one great season from Stokley was 2004 when all three Colts WRs went over 1k yards. In that same season, Clark only caught 25/423/5, not exactly lights out production. Stokley and Clark both played the slot, and they were never productive together. Clark was never fantasy worthy until 2007, which coincidently, is the year Stokley left for Denver, giving Clark slot duties all to himself.

 

However, Thomas doesn't play the slot because this guy named Welker does, so even though Thomas is the starter and he has Manning throwing him the ball, he's still at least 4th in the pecking order, AND Tamme and Dreessen are still on the team too. I posted this in the other Julius Thomas lovefest thread, and I'll just copy and post my opinion in this thread too, but there are at least 20-25 other TEs I would rather have for THIS season than Julius Thomas.

 

 

Posted 01 September 2013 - 10:31 PM

Color me skeptical, but I am not getting all the love for Julius Thomas. Yeah, Peyton is the QB, but I just don't see how Julius sees enough targets to be fantasy relevant. Tamme led all Bronco TEs last year with 52 catches, and that was with Tamme playing in the slot, a spot that Welker now occupies. Even if Julius Thomas becomes the redzone target that Dreessen was last year, he's still a TE2 without much upside in the Denver offense, despite his awesome intangibles. It's all about opportunity, and I just don't see much opportunity, say for a game here or there where the gameplan may call for more use from the TE position.

 

 

[We Tigers 71]

He totally could be a top ten TE, but I think he'd have to get there on touchdowns, like Rudolph last year. TE10-12 have caught around 52-60 balls each of the past five seasons topped 650 yards, and those might be tough marks to hit. The TE group in Denver had 143 targets last year, and many of those will go to Welker. Dreesen and Tamme will also play a bit. I could see a 40/450/8 type line happening since Manning has always made good use of right ends near the end zone, but with three stellar wide receivers I think Thomas will need an injury to get past 40-45 receptions. Even that might be a smidge generous.

 

Orrrr he could just catch half of Manning's completions and get all the touchdowns ever. Ridic.

[IGotWorms 4,060]

I may have picked the wrong sleeper TE

[5Year1 23]

Well tonight, HE IS ALL THAT!!!

[Canadianfan 76]

Orange Julius!

[WR Guru 31]

Well, he looks good so far, but it's the first half of the first game. Strange things happen in week 1. The Broncos won't have a lot of games where D.Thomas and Decker have no catches. Still believe he will be the 4th option in the passing game when all is said and done.