Now that the transcripts have been released for deflategate.....

[edjr 5,567]

 

The balls in the last Super Bowl were of the right PSI (which was covered quite a bit during the broadcast). How'd that turn out?

 

4 Passing TD's against the #1 defense in the league.

 

I'm glad they stopped them from that whole cheating thing.

 

considering the defense he was going against, the greatest 4th quarter in Super Bowl history.

[redtodd 7]

 

considering the defense he was going against, the greatest 4th quarter in Super Bowl history.

 

Can you imagine if those balls were deflated by 0.10 PSI? Brady would have thrown like 8 TD's.

[edjr 5,567]

 

Can you imagine if those balls were deflated by 0.10 PSI? Brady would have thrown like 8 TD's.

 

in the 1st half

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

considering the defense he was going against, the greatest 4th quarter in Super Bowl history.

He like them deflated in bad weather. That's been established. Makes sense too.

[NewbieJr 540]

 

The balls in the last Super Bowl were of the right PSI (which was covered quite a bit during the broadcast). How'd that turn out?

 

4 Passing TD's against the #1 defense in the league.

 

I'm glad they stopped them from that whole cheating thing.

hey moron,, if they'd been doing that all year, maybe they don't even make the playoffs. Or it changes seeding. Perhaps their cheating is the only reason they were even in a position to allow Pete Carroll to give them that game. Hth

[edjr 5,567]

hey moron,, if they'd been doing that all year, maybe they don't even make the playoffs.\

 

 

Are there even any straws left for you to grasp at?

[cbfalcon 824]

Interesting....So Goodell lies repeatedly about what happened in the appeal because he knows the transcripts are sealed. The NFLPA wins and the transcripts are unsealed..........and suddenly 85% of the new articles out there (from non NFL entities) are calling Goodell's leadership into question, calling for his job, and even now we are hearing rumblings that the owners aren't liking the way this is looking.

 

The general public may not care for this as more info comes out. The one thinking working against the NFLPA though is the lack of sensational "Brady destroys phone!!!!!" type of headlines that settle cases for people like Newbie....and even if there was a sensational headline, he would miss it because ESPN would tone that story down under direct orders.

[Sho Nuff 719]

 

 

Are there even any straws left for you to grasp at?

 

A bit...though, Pats fans that continue to ignore the possiblity of any wrongdoing...ignore Brady's (and agent's) lies...but just whine about Goodell are grasping pretty hard too.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Interesting....So Goodell lies repeatedly about what happened in the appeal because he knows the transcripts are sealed. The NFLPA wins and the transcripts are unsealed..........and suddenly 85% of the new articles out there (from non NFL entities) are calling Goodell's leadership into question, calling for his job, and even now we are hearing rumblings that the owners aren't liking the way this is looking.

 

The general public may not care for this as more info comes out. The one thinking working against the NFLPA though is the lack of sensational "Brady destroys phone!!!!!" type of headlines that settle cases for people like Newbie....and even if there was a sensational headline, he would miss it because ESPN would tone that story down under direct orders.

 

Seems some anonymous source is the only one claiming owners are not liking the way its looking.

 

BTW...why are you all only concerned about Goodell's supposed lies and supposed fabrication (that when asked directly about...you come up only with the leak to Mort).

 

I mean...its a pretty sensational headline if you actually have Goodell lying as repeatedly as you say about what happened in the appeal.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

Interesting....So Goodell lies repeatedly about what happened in the appeal because he knows the transcripts are sealed. The NFLPA wins and the transcripts are unsealed..........and suddenly 85% of the new articles out there (from non NFL entities) are calling Goodell's leadership into question, calling for his job, and even now we are hearing rumblings that the owners aren't liking the way this is looking.

 

The general public may not care for this as more info comes out. The one thinking working against the NFLPA though is the lack of sensational "Brady destroys phone!!!!!" type of headlines that settle cases for people like Newbie....and even if there was a sensational headline, he would miss it because ESPN would tone that story down under direct orders.

 

Please explain to me how Brady destroying his phone is somehow irrelevant?

[Sho Nuff 719]

Please explain to me how Brady destroying his phone is somehow irrelevant?

 

Let me break down the logic of Pats fans.

Goodell lies = bad.

Brady lies = no big deal.

[edjr 5,567]

 

A bit...though, Pats fans that continue to ignore the possiblity of any wrongdoing...ignore Brady's (and agent's) lies...but just whine about Goodell are grasping pretty hard too.

 

Not me.

 

The punishment was so far out of bounds and the lies to get to said punishment have left that on the back burner.

 

What is the penalty for messing with equipment? Oh right, 25k fine.

[cbfalcon 824]

Please explain to me how Brady destroying his phone is somehow irrelevant?

We've talked about it ad nauseam. Legally speaking, it's illogical that people here claim Brady was never going to be asked to hand over his phone, yet also claim that his not having his phone to hand over is proof of guilt. It makes less than zero sense to argue both points and it demonstrates a total lack of ability to think on any larger scale than one sound bite at a time......But moving on, I'll just address the phone issue from a perspective of common sense....

 

It's not irrelevant. Obviously it's more a negative than a positive for him in terms of perception....But the reasons it's not "proof" of guilt are many. Some of those reasons being:

• The league had access to every text on the phone if they actually wanted them. People act like 10,000 texts means the league would have to hire hundreds of investigators to go to 10,000 people and get the texts. Realistically, the league and it's billions of dollars in resources were probably looking at about 30 people he had exchanged texts with. They quickly could have determined that 25 were irrelevant, and contacted 5 people or so......But this would presume the league actually wanted to see the texts more than they wanted to play "gotcha".
• Brady didn't want an orginazation known for being immoral and full of leaks to media having access to his personal life....As one article pointed out this weekend for example, would anyone pay money for super private photos/videos of the most famous supermodel of the past 10 years? Hell, what if there had been a sex video on there. How many millions of dollars would pornhub offer up? That's an extreme scenario, but considering I read an article about how well Tom Brady and Bridget Moynahan are coparenting based on their private emails, what makes anyone think a cell phone leak wouldn't result in a 100x invasion of his personal life.

And that's just the common sense of it......The truth is at the time he probably thought this case would be based on evidence, and he likely thought all that was at risk really was a $50k fine anyhow....And as a real human being that has a famous ex, a superfamous wife, and 3 kids, he likely weighed it out and accurately determined the hell he would go through when his phone content got leaked was 50x worse than this silly investigation into whether a game ball was aired up properly.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

Not me.

 

The punishment was so far out of bounds and the lies to get to said punishment have left that on the back burner.

 

What is the penalty for messing with equipment? Oh right, 25k fine.

It is not a maximum 25k fine. Look it up. Besides, it's the integrity of the game he's being punished for also, not just an equipment violation. Pats fans: Stop bringing knifes to gunfights. Get your facts straight.

[edjr 5,567]

It is not a maximum 25k fine. Look it up. Besides, it's the integrity of the game he's being punished for also, not just an equipment violation. Pats fans: Stop bringing knifes to gunfights. Get your facts straight.

 

Where did I say max?

 

pick your game up son.

 

because warming balls up during a freezing game is DEFINITELY not an integrity issue, right?

[cbfalcon 824]

 

Let me break down the logic of Pats fans.

Goodell lies = bad.

Brady lies = no big deal.

 

What has Brady lied about? When you make your list, I'll need former evidence than "It's just so obvious! They are cheaters! And look at how he has acted!".

 

Now if you need a list of Goodell's lies, I can point you to articles detailing very specific lies that have been proven as such.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

We've talked about it ad nauseam. Legally speaking, it's illogical that people here claim Brady was never going to be asked to hand over his phone, yet also claim that his not having his phone to hand over is proof of guilt. It makes less than zero sense to argue both points and it demonstrates a total lack of ability to think on any larger scale than one sound bite at a time......But moving on, I'll just address the phone issue from a perspective of common sense....

 

It's not irrelevant. Obviously it's more a negative than a positive for him in terms of perception....But the reasons it's not "proof" of guilt are many. Some of those reasons being:

• The league had access to every text on the phone if they actually wanted them. People act like 10,000 texts means the league would have to hire hundreds of investigators to go to 10,000 people and get the texts. Realistically, the league and it's billions of dollars in resources were probably looking at about 30 people he had exchanged texts with. They quickly could have determined that 25 were irrelevant, and contacted 5 people or so......But this would presume the league actually wanted to see the texts more than they wanted to play "gotcha".
• Brady didn't want an orginazation known for being immoral and full of leaks to media having access to his personal life....As one article pointed out this weekend for example, would anyone pay money for super private videos of the most famous supermodel of the past 10 years? Hell, what if there had been a sex video on there. How many millions of dollars would pornhub offer up? That's an extreme scenario, but considering I read an article about how well Tom Brady and Bridget Moynahan are coparenting based on their private emails, what makes anyone think a cell phone leak wouldn't result in a 100x invasion of his personal life.

And that's just the common sense of it......The truth is at the time he probably thought this case would be based on evidence, and he likely thought all that was at risk really was a $50k fine anyhow....And as a real human being that has a famous ex, a superfamous wife, and 3 kids, he likely weighed it out and accurately determined the hell he would go through when his phone content got leaked was 50x worse than this silly investigation into whether a game ball was aired up properly.

Well, you just said it's not irrelevant. Good. And once again, the point is lost on you that they wanted a transcript of the texts, not the phone. Moving on, if they asked Brady for the relevant TRANSCRIPTS of the texts that we all know exist, the ones with the ball boys, and he was unable to produce them from HIS phone, because he deleted them, possibly the same day he got them, do you not think that would look suspicious? Why delete them, but not the other 9,900? The phone could only hurt, not help. So he whacked it.

[redtodd 7]

hey moron,, if they'd been doing that all year, maybe they don't even make the playoffs. Or it changes seeding. Perhaps their cheating is the only reason they were even in a position to allow Pete Carroll to give them that game. Hth

 

Makes sense. Considering they played 6 quarters with the "right" footballs and this happened:

 

- 4 TD's in a half against the Colts

- 4 TD's against the #1 defense in the biggest game of the year.

 

I could see them struggling to beat the Jets, Bills, etc. with those balls.......

[cbfalcon 824]

Well, you just said it's not irrelevant. Good. And once again, the point is lost on you that they wanted a transcript of the texts, not the phone. Moving on, if they asked Brady for the relevant TRANSCRIPTS of the texts that we all know exist, the ones with the ball boys, and he was unable to produce them from HIS phone, because he deleted them, possibly the same day he got them, do you not think that would look suspicious? Why delete them, but not the other 9,900? The phone could only hurt, not help. So he whacked it.

 

In the post you quoted, I didn't say it was irrelevant. I made fun of the sensational headline that suckered the suckers in. Yes, destroying the phone is a relevant note that needs to be made. It should not have been the front page headline that proved Brady deflated footballs, when there were very good legal reasons that his destroying of the phone didn't matter, and even better logical reasons that he was wise to destroy his phone.

 

As for transcripts of relevant texts......Brady turned those over. Just so happened there were zero in his opinion. And frankly, if he was in fact innocent, wouldn't that probably be the truth? Daydream for a minute and imagine that you didn't commit a crime. It would likely be difficult for you to hand over evidence related to the crime.

[redtodd 7]

It is not a maximum 25k fine. Look it up. Besides, it's the integrity of the game he's being punished for also, not just an equipment violation. Pats fans: Stop bringing knifes to gunfights. Get your facts straight.

 

It's actually a fine of between $5,787 to $17,363, depending on whether it is first or 2nd offense and whether you consider this in line with "foreign substance on uniform" or "other equipment violations."

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/07/27/nfl-2015-fine-schedule/

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

Where did I say max?

 

pick your game up son.

 

because warming balls up during a freezing game is DEFINITELY not an integrity issue, right?

If you want me to say that the NFL discipline system is unfair, biased and unprofessional, I concur. Doesn't mean the Pats didn't go out of their way to gain an unfair advantage. You can point out that the Patriots are being scrutinized more than other teams because of their success, I also agree that is part of it, along with their past convictions of cheating being an added factor to them being scrutinized more. Look at it like this: If I used inside info on a stock purchase and still lost money, I wouldn't be looked at as closely if I had made a ton of money using inside info. It comes with the territory, deal with it.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

It's actually a fine of between $5,787 to $17,363, depending on whether it is first or 2nd offense and whether you consider this in line with "foreign substance on uniform" or "other equipment violations."

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/07/27/nfl-2015-fine-schedule/

 

Great. But he's being punished for being uncooperative. The Vikings. Falcons and Browns all cooperated in their cases. Brady didn't.

[cbfalcon 824]

Great. But he's being punished for being uncooperative. The Vikings. Falcons and Browns all cooperated in their cases. Brady didn't.

 

How was he uncooperative? The league may not have liked that his answers didn't prove guilt, but he cooperated reasonably well as far as I can tell.

[edjr 5,567]

Great. But he's being punished for being uncooperative.

 

Link?

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

How was he uncooperative? The league may not have liked that his answers didn't prove guilt, but he cooperated reasonably well as far as I can tell.

He didn't hand over any transcripts of the texts and then he destroyed his phone. Does that sound like cooperation?

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Great. But he's being punished for being uncooperative. The Vikings. Falcons and Browns all cooperated in their cases. Brady didn't.

Vikings, Falcons and Browns all dealt with club personnel and not players. Totally different set of rules, which is the crux of the NFLPA's case.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

Link?

You need a link to know he's not being punished for an equipment violation? Here's a link: The Patriots don't have a first round pick and paid a million dollar fine. I think that goes a little bit further than an equipment violation. Nice try

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

Vikings, Falcons and Browns all dealt with club personnel and not players. Totally different set of rules, which is the crux of the NFLPA's case.

No players were accused in those cases. Next.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

No players were accused in those cases. Next.

I know. That is why your mentioning of them is irrelevant. Should we talk about punishing hockey players now?

[edjr 5,567]

He didn't hand over any transcripts of the texts and then he destroyed his phone. Does that sound like cooperation?

 

 

You're dumb.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

 

You're dumb.

Oh, so he handed over the requested transcripts and he didn't destroy his phone? Link?

[cbfalcon 824]

He didn't hand over any transcripts of the texts and then he destroyed his phone. Does that sound like cooperation?

 

If you were asked for relevant texts about a robbery at the convenience store last night, and you weren't involved in any way, what texts would you hand over? I'm guessing none.

 

They asked for transcripts of relevant texts. Brady swears there weren't any. He did what was asked. Cooperated fully.

[Djgb13 2,338]

You need a link to know he's not being punished for an equipment violation? Here's a link: The Patriots don't have a first round pick and paid a million dollar fine. I think that goes a little bit further than an equipment violation. Nice try

Sorry that's not a link. The fact is Brady was fully cooperative but wasn't handing his phone over. Nfl didn't like that so they punished him. That's the fact. Transcripts have proven he was fully cooperative.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

If you were asked for relevant texts about a robbery at the convenience store last night, and you weren't involved in any way, what texts would you hand over? I'm guessing none.

 

They asked for transcripts of relevant texts. Brady swears there weren't any. He did what was asked. Cooperated fully.

But there were relevant texts. He did text with the ball boys, right? That's relevant and we know they happened. Why didn't he turn them over?

[cbfalcon 824]

But there were relevant texts. He did text with the ball boys, right? That's relevant and we know they happened. Why didn't he turn them over?

 

How do we know the texts with the ball boys were relevant to deflategate? Could have been about anything.

[TD Ryan2 314]

The New England Patriots own your asses.

 

Red Sox fans didn't even go on about the Yankees this much.

 

When "A Football Life - New England Patriots The 20 Year Dynasty" airs, the commentary will be like this:

 

"It was a salary cap era, parity was built into the system - nobody was supposed to win as much as they did"

 

"Everyone got all lathered up over New England... EVERYTHING they did made headlines - love or hate 'em, they were Americas Team because they SOLD - write something about New England and the internet blew up"

 

"Opponents just could't accept that New England was simply better - the conspiracy theories were unbelievable, 'they filmed', 'they let air out of the balls', 'they tampered with headphones', 'they secretly filmed walk thrus'... I mean... it was crazy how obsessed and paranoid everyone was of them"

 

"I don't know... I don't know if the NFL will ever be as popular as it was back in the first decades of the 2000s... but during its most popular era ever, New England ran the show - on the field, off the field - The Patriots WERE the NFL back then"

[redtodd 7]

Great. But he's being punished for being uncooperative. The Vikings. Falcons and Browns all cooperated in their cases. Brady didn't.

 

Brett Favre was punished for being uncooperative and it was a $50K fine....

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/29/leagues-punishment-of-favre-falls-short/

 

“The commissioner notified Favre that he has been fined $50,000 for his failure to cooperate with the investigation in a forthcoming manner.

[RLLD 3,455]

Anyone else thinking that when he eventually returns that T*mmy is going to play with a grudge and go apesnot? The onyl real question being how far over the line he may ever step again.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

 

Brett Favre was punished for being uncooperative and it was a $50K fine....

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/29/leagues-punishment-of-favre-falls-short/

 

And that was a dik pic investigation. The NFL obviously takes cheating more serious. The Patriots previous conviction for cheating would be the relevant example, not a dik pic.

[Magnificent Bastard 190]

The New England Patriots own your asses.

 

Red Sox fans didn't even go on about the Yankees this much.

 

When "A Football Life - New England Patriots The 20 Year Dynasty" airs, the commentary will be like this:

 

"It was a salary cap era, parity was built into the system - nobody was supposed to win as much as they did"

 

"Everyone got all lathered up over New England... EVERYTHING they did made headlines - love or hate 'em, they were Americas Team because they SOLD - write something about New England and the internet blew up"

 

"Opponents just could't accept that New England was simply better - the conspiracy theories were unbelievable, 'they filmed', 'they let air out of the balls', 'they tampered with headphones', 'they secretly filmed walk thrus'... I mean... it was crazy how obsessed and paranoid everyone was of them"

 

"I don't know... I don't know if the NFL will ever be as popular as it was back in the first decades of the 2000s... but during its most popular era ever, New England ran the show - on the field, off the field - The Patriots WERE the NFL back then"

Except when the Giants were on the field.