Several teams preparing to make Patriots a blockbuster offer for Jimmy Garoppolo

[vuduchile 1,941]

 

Eli?

Like Elway, he'd never played in the NFL before. Was he technically traded though? I don't recall the details, but he's not on the list in that link.

[vuduchile 1,941]

 

Eli?

 

it doesn't happen often that you have a QB suspended for the 1st 4 games of a season, allowing the backup to be seen

Not often enough when we're talking about the cheater.

[Brad GLuckman 518]

 

I don't know man. It would be nice to have a quality successor to Brady. If they truly think Brady can play at this level for another 5 years, then trade Jimmy. If not, why not keep him?

[edjr 5,567]

I don't know man. It would be nice to have a quality successor to Brady. If they truly think Brady can play at this level for another 5 years, then trade Jimmy. If not, why not keep him?

 

 

 

The Patriots cannot and will not franchise Garopollo or pay him and Brady at the same time.

 

They could keep him through next year, but that just seems stupid.

[Brad GLuckman 518]

 

 

 

The Patriots cannot and will not franchise Garopollo or pay him and Brady at the same time.

 

They could keep him through next year, but that just seems stupid.

Brady said be wants to play 5 more years, so that's where I got that number.

[edjr 5,567]

Not often enough when we're talking about the cheater.

 

the who? now you've lost me.

 

I know you're not one of those.

[GobbleDog 816]

I don't understand why my Dolphins aren't considering the plethora of QB free-agents.

 

'16 Ryan Tannehill (his FIFTH season in the NFL): 2,995 Yds ,19 TD, 12 INT

 

 

I'd honestly rather have Tim Tebow or Jay Cutler.

[edjr 5,567]

I don't understand why my Dolphins aren't considering the plethora of QB free-agents.

 

'16 Ryan Tannehill (his FIFTH season in the NFL): 2,995 Yds ,19 TD, 12 INT

 

 

I'd honestly rather have Tim Tebow or Jay Cutler.

 

Total stiff.

[Cruzer 1,992]

The Giants gave up a lot for Eli. It worked out.

Eli was the consensus #1 overall pick in the draft - big difference between that situation and dealing for somebody's backup.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

Eli was the consensus #1 overall pick in the draft - big difference between that situation and dealing for somebody's backup.

No he wasn't. He was the #1 rated QB . Lots of teams had Gallery#1 and Larry Fitz

[edjr 5,567]

Eli was the consensus #1 overall pick in the draft - big difference between that situation and dealing for somebody's backup.

 

Was Steve Young a backup? was Rodgers? Brett Favre?

[vuduchile 1,941]

 

the who? now you've lost me.

 

I know you're not one of those.

Your glossing over the fact that very few QBs traded for a 1st rounder have panned out. Going back to the 70's there have only been a few that worked out. Just like QBs drafted in the 1st round, only a few have done much.

 

Bottom line, it's a crap shoot either way.

[Cruzer 1,992]

No he wasn't. He was the #1 rated QB . Lots of teams had Gallery#1 and Larry Fitz

Some, hardly a lot.. And in fact - Eli was getting picked #1 regardless... If he hadn't thrown his fit - he'd be a Charger still prolly.

[Cruzer 1,992]

 

Was Steve Young a backup? was Rodgers? Brett Favre?

You really want to play that game, really? Go ahead and toss out all the busts while you at it - run the % and get back to me.

[Cruzer 1,992]

 

Was Steve Young a backup? was Rodgers? Brett Favre?

Also - how many of these were NE castoff backups?

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

Some, hardly a lot.. And in fact - Eli was getting picked #1 regardless... If he hadn't thrown his fit - he'd be a Charger still prolly.

You say fit, the Mannings say I told you so.

[Cruzer 1,992]

You say fit, the Mannings say I told you so.

Everyone not a NY homer calls it a cry baby fit - get over it.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

Everyone not a NY homer calls it a cry baby fit - get over it.

Smart decision. Can't disagree with that. The chargers are a mess.

[edjr 5,567]

Your glossing over the fact that very few QBs traded for a 1st rounder have panned out. Going back to the 70's there have only been a few that worked out. Just like QBs drafted in the 1st round, only a few have done much.

 

Bottom line, it's a crap shoot either way.

 

very few (none) QBs drafted by the Browns have worked out since 1999. Should they stop trying?

[vuduchile 1,941]

 

very few (none) QBs drafted by the Browns have worked out since 1999. Should they stop trying?

For everybody's sake, yes

[Cruzer 1,992]

Smart decision. Can't disagree with that. The chargers are a mess.

Hard to argue that - agreed.. It's a shame too - they've had some remarkable talent over the years.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

Hard to argue that - agreed.. It's a shame too - they've had some remarkable talent over the years.

And to think they let Brees just walk.

[edjr 5,567]

And to think they let Brees just walk.

 

I would have too. Who knew when that thing on his face was going to come to life and take over

[Cruzer 1,992]

And to think they let Brees just walk.

Omg, no kidding.... He's going to end up with the most all time passing yards in a year or so.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

 

I would have too. Who knew when that thing on his face was going to come to life and take over

Lol

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

Omg, no kidding.... He's going to end up with the most all time passing yards in a year or so.

Think about this: When that whole Eli/Rivers thing went down, The Giants had or were about to get Kurt Warner. and the Chargers had Drew Brees.

[mighty_thor 115]

I don't think the comparisons between Cassell and Garapollo are valid. Cassell was a 7th rounder and the Patriots traded him AND Mike Vrabel and got a 2nd rounder.

 

Garapollo was A 2nd round draft pick and you know the Patriots would not have wasted a 2nd round pick on a qb unless they thought he was a great value in the 2nd round. Trading a 1st round pick for a qb who was a 2nd round pick and who has been groomed behind the greatest coach and qb of all time is not much of a reach.

[edjr 5,567]

I don't think the comparisons between Cassell and Garapollo are valid. Cassell was a 7th rounder and the Patriots traded him AND Mike Vrabel and got a 2nd rounder.

 

Garapollo was A 2nd round draft pick and you know the Patriots would not have wasted a 2nd round pick on a qb unless they thought he was a great value in the 2nd round. Trading a 1st round pick for a qb who was a 2nd round pick and who has been groomed behind the greatest coach and qb of all time is not much of a reach.

 

Been said

[listen2me 23 1,544]

 

a team would NEVER trade a higher pick for a guy than where he was drafted. got it.

 

good solid logic by you.

 

I bet you think McCarthy is a good coach too

 

It isnt cut and dry. It is what you think of him as QB. Different GMs are going to view him in different ways. I dont watch film and study like a GM so I cant say. A few decent games in the Pats system isnt enough to say he will be a good QB for 10 years. But if you watch the tape and like what you see then sure pull the trigger. I wouldnt trade a top 10 pick for him. But if you like him then go ahead and trade a late 1st or very early 2nd.

 

The 3rd overall pick for a backup QB who wasnt a 1st rounder when he was drafted? No thanks. But the Bears are pretty stupid. Look how long they thought Cutler was good enough. Any idiot could tell you Cutler sucked a clear 7 years ago.

 

The Bears suck and always will.

 

Where did I say what you claim? Why make stuff up? Because you have no point and are trying to argue like a 10 year old?

 

The point is, why would a guy who no one drafted in the 1st or bothered to jump into the end of the first to draft, who was drafted at the end of the 2nd.....all of a sudden be worth a 1st rounder? Based off what? He has 63 pass attempts in his career in meaningless regular season appearances. So he is basically a 3rd round talent that wowed someone off 63 attempts? Enough to be worth a 1st rounder? I used 3rd overall directed towards Frozen and his Bears. Sure a GM can change his mind, or desperation is a valid reason. But to me that is no value. If Jimmy came in and won SBs like Tom then sure. But you don't understand the difference and seem to want to make stuff up for no real reason.

 

MM is above average from Monday to Friday. Below average on game day. That has been my stance on him for a while now.

[Cruzer 1,992]

I don't think the comparisons between Cassell and Garapollo are valid. Cassell was a 7th rounder and the Patriots traded him AND Mike Vrabel and got a 2nd rounder.

I do, reason being - leading a team to 11-5, a Division title and a playoff spot trumps any draft board pedigree.

[listen2me 23 1,544]

I think if BB was open to trade Jimmy to Denver, Hou, Jets, Bills then it would be a huge red flag that he doesn't think he is that great at all. But trading him to the Bears or 9ers? I don't think getting something for your backup automatically means you are behind some plot to dump off a lemon.

 

I think BB is willing to trade Jimmy because he is close to the end of his coaching career and you can't pay 2 QBs. If Tom wants to play another 2 or 3 years then you go all in to squeeze more rings out of what you have. BB, I doubt, is looking at this for the future. Why would he? His #1 QB albeit old is planning on playing more. Stack up on talent with picks.

 

As for teams who would try to get Jimmy, it is the perfect year to do it. The QB class is pretty average and not any real studs on paper. Ideally a Browns or Bears would trade back and get extra picks then trade the mid 1st rounder for him. I highly doubt BB trades him to Hou or Denver.

[DankNuggs 305]

 

 

Where did I say what you claim? Why make stuff up? Because you have no point and are trying to argue like a 10 year old?

 

The point is, why would a guy who no one drafted in the 1st or bothered to jump into the end of the first to draft, who was drafted at the end of the 2nd.....all of a sudden be worth a 1st rounder? Based off what? He has 63 pass attempts in his career in meaningless regular season appearances. So he is basically a 3rd round talent that wowed someone off 63 attempts? Enough to be worth a 1st rounder? I used 3rd overall directed towards Frozen and his Bears. Sure a GM can change his mind, or desperation is a valid reason. But to me that is no value. If Jimmy came in and won SBs like Tom then sure. But you don't understand the difference and seem to want to make stuff up for no real reason.

 

MM is above average from Monday to Friday. Below average on game day. That has been my stance on him for a while now.

Ask Brett Farve... Did Rodgers benefit and speed up his development being an understudy of a HoF QB?

 

Would teams trade a #1 for Dak Prescott? The draft process and scouting in general is a laughably imperfect science. Where he was drafted is meaningless.

[listen2me 23 1,544]

Ask Brett Farve... Did Rodgers benefit and speed up his development being an understudy of a HoF QB?

 

Would teams trade a #1 for Dak Prescott? The draft process and scouting in general is a laughably imperfect science. Where he was drafted is meaningless.

 

It is meaningless. But I don't see how he all of a sudden becomes worth a 1st when he wasn't worth a 2nd to anyone besides BB not that long ago. Like I said before if in the little tape you now have of him in the NFL wows you so much then go for it. GMs are all different. But you can't really quantify what learning behind Tom is worth...can you? So in that sense it is a stab in the dark.

 

Maybe I am missing something but I didn't feel like I said you can't trade a 1st for a guy who wasn't drafted in the 1st. All I said is what has Jimmy done to make him now worth a first? He has 63 pretty meaningless attempts. Sure he played Zona in the opening game, when he knows Brady will be back and they will easily win the division like every year. Pretty meaningless. Dak has a whole season getting thrown to the wolves as a rookie under his belt. A year worth of tape in the year he shouldn't be able to handle it. A whole year as starter vs 63 attempts after 3 years. I don't feel like you or Ed are very good with comparisons. Not the same in my opinion.

 

Dak has proven much more than Jimmy has. With better natural measurable to boot. That said throw Dak on the Browns and see how well he does.

 

My posts stem basically from Frozen saying his Bears should give up a 1st AND 2nd round pick for Jimmy. To me I don't understand why he would be worth that.

 

I have said in this thread a couple times, all GMs are different. 1 GM may turn on Jimmy's NFL tape and be able to gather nothing from it. Another may be like yes he will be good. If you (a gm) like what you see then go for it, especially a bad franchise. But desperation breeds overpaying.

 

How about Matt Flynn? Aaron Rodgers is 1 example. A guy who was supposed to go top 2 overall. Who was drafted in the 1st round. How many other backups failed after getting a job after being the understudy to a top QB? Flynn...Mallet....Countless others. You can't measure that what so ever.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,659]

The Wiffleball of football threads.

[DankNuggs 305]

 

It is meaningless. But I don't see how he all of a sudden becomes worth a 1st when he wasn't worth a 2nd to anyone besides BB not that long ago. Like I said before if in the little tape you now have of him in the NFL wows you so much then go for it. GMs are all different. But you can't really quantify what learning behind Tom is worth...can you? So in that sense it is a stab in the dark.

 

Maybe I am missing something but I didn't feel like I said you can't trade a 1st for a guy who wasn't drafted in the 1st. All I said is what has Jimmy done to make him now worth a first? He has 63 pretty meaningless attempts. Sure he played Zona in the opening game, when he knows Brady will be back and they will easily win the division like every year. Pretty meaningless. Dak has a whole season getting thrown to the wolves as a rookie under his belt. A year worth of tape in the year he shouldn't be able to handle it. A whole year as starter vs 63 attempts after 3 years. I don't feel like you or Ed are very good with comparisons. Not the same in my opinion.

 

Dak has proven much more than Jimmy has. With better natural measurable to boot. That said throw Dak on the Browns and see how well he does.

 

My posts stem basically from Frozen saying his Bears should give up a 1st AND 2nd round pick for Jimmy. To me I don't understand why he would be worth that.

 

I have said in this thread a couple times, all GMs are different. 1 GM may turn on Jimmy's NFL tape and be able to gather nothing from it. Another may be like yes he will be good. If you (a gm) like what you see then go for it, especially a bad franchise. But desperation breeds overpaying.

 

How about Matt Flynn? Aaron Rodgers is 1 example. A guy who was supposed to go top 2 overall. Who was drafted in the 1st round. How many other backups failed after getting a job after being the understudy to a top QB? Flynn...Mallet....Countless others. You can't measure that what so ever.

Teams would trade multiple #1's for Prescott... Pats will get a first for G...It only takes one team. Theres no sure thing in football, and people have recency bias.

[BufordT 371]

Ask Brett Farve... Did Rodgers benefit and speed up his development being an understudy of a HoF QB?

 

He learned that you shouldn't throw into double or triple coverage.

[MDC 5,895]

I normally think trading high picks for a QB with limited pro experience is dumb and in most cases it hasn't worked out, but this situation may be different because Garrapolo was a 2nd pick already with a lot of college tape. If you trade a first for Garrapolo you're hoping to get a QB who would be drafted within a round or so anyway if he were a rookie this year with the added benefit of two years experience practicing and learning from the best organization in the league. That is very different from drafting a guy with a limited college pedigree who looked good in limited time in a great situation.

 

The odds of Garrapolo busting are probably no higher than the odds of any other QB in the mid / late first you could draft with more potential upside. And because he's not a high first round pick or a rookie teams won't be obliged to wait 2-3 seasons to figure out whether he's "the guy." One of the biggest risks in drafting a QB in the high first is the potential that the team ends up wasting multiple seasons evaluating him.

 

I'd consider dealing a mid / low first for Garrapolo if I were an otherwise decent team that needs a QB. The Texans would be a great fit if they hadn't wasted so much $ on a castoff QB last year. Several other teams make at least some sense.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

I don't over value 1st round picks nearly as much as you over value NE backup qbs - not even in the same hemisphere.

 

For the record, you can never over value NFL 1st rounders - never. As a matter of - why don't take a swim thru some recent drafts. The guys in their prime, guys from say the 2010-2014 drafts - look at how lopsided the disparity is in Pro Bowlers from the 1st round to Pro Bowlers from all the other rounds - it's ridiculous.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_NFL_Draft

You used qbs as a plural. Name all the other New England qbs I said were good.

 

While 1st rounders become pro bowlers more often, there still is a 50% bust rate.

 

I thought we were going on trends here? BB gets his backups from the draft typically. So why wouldn't he get one from the draft? Plus they have Brisset on the team who they claim they like as much as Jimmy.

 

So if BB is the greatest coach ever and dupes every trade partner, why is every backup qb he has ever drafted so bad? Jimmy bucks that trend.

[kilroy69 994]

You used qbs as a plural. Name all the other New England qbs I said were good.

 

While 1st rounders become pro bowlers more often, there still is a 50% bust rate.

 

I thought we were going on trends here? BB gets his backups from the draft typically. So why wouldn't he get one from the draft? Plus they have Brisset on the team who they claim they like as much as Jimmy.

 

So if BB is the greatest coach ever and dupes every trade partner, why is every backup qb he has ever drafted so bad? Jimmy bucks that trend.

everyone gets all caught up in Jimmy g. The fact is he is expendable because of what brissett showed. If Brady is hurt they need to be a different team and he brings that.

[DankNuggs 305]

everyone gets all caught up in Jimmy g. The fact is he is expendable because of what brissett showed. If Brady is hurt they need to be a different team and he brings that.

He is expendable due to timing, nothing else. You can't pay 2 QBs starting money even with Brady's team friendly yearly restructuring