Why would anyone become a teacher now?

[TimmySmith 2,782]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

Nope.  Not even close to suggesting it.  Not even sure how you came to that.

So you acknowledge that there is room between that and "ignoring it".

[Utilit99 4,099]

2 minutes ago, MDC said:

 

Job well done by me. The only reason I posted that was to get your panties in a bunch.

I'm so in your head you're going to take my words to the grave with you. Happy everlasting rest. 

[Strike 5,555]

2 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Maybe in Colorado it is slightly different but the school funding is not a set number here when it comes to funding money outwardly. Case in point for charter schools. If a student chooses to leave Public School A and their expenditure per pupil is (10,000) that money is given by the home district to the charter school essentially outsourcing their education. If a student chooses to leave Public School B and their expenditure per pupil is (13,000) that money is given by the home district to the charter school essentially outsourcing their education.

The obvious issues are- why does the charter school not have a number attached to it? In many cases those schools are one building of a significantly less portion of kids. A specialized high school might have one building with 4 grades and 400 kids. Their number per pupil is most assuredly not 10,000 and certainly not 13,000.  Furthermore, if they take in special education students they can the 10,000 (or 13,000) number plus a bonus on top. So in some cases the home district is being hamstrung by the lack of funding transparency. Additionally, because so many charter schools take on lower educated students, and those in need of more resources, they take more money in Title I funding and everything.

 

You're overcomplicating this, probably on purpose.  As I said before, please THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

Just now, Strike said:

No.  Why are you even suggesting this?  No one is suggesting we not teach our past.   Just stop.

As I said a few months ago- there are people that do this because they've conflated CRT with anything racist. They do exist and they are crazy. It's not all but it is some. 

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

1 minute ago, Utilit99 said:

No. I really don't care if people know about or not. But it should just be a chapter in a history book if anything. If a kid is interested in it then there is plenty of information out there to look into it further. Of course, there is a hell of a lot of misinformation out there as well. Especially from the loons running the streets these days. 

I agree but this bill looks to be trying to stop the discussion of it in school completely.  How do you teach history without discussing it?

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

1 minute ago, TimmySmith said:

So you acknowledge that there is room between that and "ignoring it".

I think it needs to be taught in history classes because it is a part of our history.

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

Just now, Strike said:

You're overcomplicating this, probably on purpose.  As I said before, please THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!

So you can't comment on the facts I see? People want paradise scenarios without recognizing that paradise doesn't exist 

[TimmySmith 2,782]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

I think it needs to be taught in history classes because it is a part of our history.

Did anyone here suggest otherwise?   

[Casual Observer 597]

50 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I don't think every parent is going to be doing it.  I think it's going to be enough to make it a nightmare for teachers.  I fear teachers are going to quit and fewer people are going to become teachers.  I think it would have long lasting negative effects on our education system.

Liberal squish.

The education system has a long-lasting negative effect on education.  If you've been alive long enough you've seen one stupid failing educational trend after another, with no improvement to show for it.

[Strike 5,555]

1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said:

So you can't comment on the facts I see? People want paradise scenarios without recognizing that paradise doesn't exist 

Why don't you care about the children? 

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

3 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

Did anyone here suggest otherwise?   

The senate bill

[TimmySmith 2,782]

Just now, Hawkeye21 said:

The senate bill

Says you.  I suggest you don't like it because it disarms the topic.  It's not philosophy. 

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

2 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

Says you.  I suggest you don't like it because it disarms the topic.  It's not philosophy. 

I don't like it because I'm afraid too many teachers are going to leave because of it and the division it's going to cause between them and parents.  That's my biggest concern.

[Fireballer 2,642]

6 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

So you can't comment on the facts I see? People want paradise scenarios without recognizing that paradise doesn't exist 

I have a few serious questions...I hope you will honestly answer them.

1.  Why are people even proposing school choice?  I have no charter schools, or whatever near me, so I've never given it much thought

2.  Is there a good reason, other than properly reporting safety issues in the home, that student survey results are not available to parents? This is specific to my district, but I can't seem to understand the reasoning.

3. How do you feel equity fits into public schooling? 

[TimmySmith 2,782]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I don't like it because I'm afraid too many teachers are going to leave because of it and the division it's going to cause between them and parents.  That's my biggest concern.

This bill actually protects kids against hate speech.  So it's obvious that you consider the current teaching of race to be hate speech. And because teachers cannot vilify a side and condemn the remnants, they will quit.  Good riddance!  You should be happy, your teachers are actually going to have to learn the subject and teach it well. 

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

4 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

I have a few serious questions...I hope you will honestly answer them.

1.  Why are people even proposing school choice?  I have no charter schools, or whatever near me, so I've never given it much thought

2.  Is there a good reason, other than properly reporting safety issues in the home, that student survey results are not available to parents? This is specific to my district, but I can't seem to understand the reasoning.

3. How do you feel equity fits into public schooling? 

I will answer them honestly but first one question on #3 before I respond. In what respect do you mean "equity?" Are we talking equity in funding, education, or in subject matter stuff i.e. race issues?

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

1 minute ago, TimmySmith said:

This bill actually protects kids against hate speech.  So it's obvious that you consider the current teaching of race to be hate speech. And because teachers cannot vilify a side and condemn the remnants, they will quit.  Good riddance!  You should be happy, your teachers are actually going to have to learn the subject and teach it well. 

Are you in favor of parents being able to opt their children out and force teachers to make a new lesson plan just for them?

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

4 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

This bill actually protects kids against hate speech.  So it's obvious that you consider the current teaching of race to be hate speech. And because teachers cannot vilify a side and condemn the remnants, they will quit.  Good riddance!  You should be happy, your teachers are actually going to have to learn the subject and teach it well. 

So much BS here

[Fireballer 2,642]

6 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

I will answer them honestly but first one question on #3 before I respond. In what respect do you mean "equity?" Are we talking equity in funding, education, or in subject matter stuff i.e. race issues?

Student outcomes. Thanks.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,450]

22 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

The senate bill

That has zero chance of seeing the light of day. Just stop. 

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

That has zero chance of seeing the light of day. Just stop. 

Here's a thought... Bye bye!

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

13 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

This bill actually protects kids against hate speech.  So it's obvious that you consider the current teaching of race to be hate speech. And because teachers cannot vilify a side and condemn the remnants, they will quit.  Good riddance!  You should be happy, your teachers are actually going to have to learn the subject and teach it well. 

Protects kids?  Sure it does.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

10 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

Are you in favor of parents being able to opt their children out and force teachers to make a new lesson plan just for them?

I am for a lesson plan without hate rhetoric in it.  Is it that hard?  

Also, I am curious as to what exact lines in the bill would frighten an enlightened centrist, such as you.

 

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

Just now, TimmySmith said:

I am for a lesson plan without hate rhetoric in it.  Is it that hard?  

Also, I am curious as to what exact lines in the bill would frighten an enlightened centrist, such as you.

 

I've voiced my concerns on here about the bill numerous times already.  My opinion has nothing to do with left, right or center here.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I've voiced my concerns on here about the bill numerous times already.  My opinion has nothing to do with left, right or center here.

"concerns"     I want you to address one of the lines exactly, so I can know exactly what's wrong with it.

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

Just now, TimmySmith said:

"concerns"     I want you to address one of the lines exactly, so I can know exactly what's wrong with it.

I already have.  Go back and look.

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

17 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

I have a few serious questions...I hope you will honestly answer them.

1.  Why are people even proposing school choice?  I have no charter schools, or whatever near me, so I've never given it much thought

2.  Is there a good reason, other than properly reporting safety issues in the home, that student survey results are not available to parents? This is specific to my district, but I can't seem to understand the reasoning.

3. How do you feel equity fits into public schooling? 

1.) Some students are not served well by the public education system. A lot of that is because of governmental overreach with years upon years of bad policy designed to equalize education. I mean at one point there was policy based on 100% of students showing proficiency in a topic. How would that ever work? But additionally, some special education students benefit more from smaller class sizes and smaller student to teacher ratios. Charter schools and things like that offer that. A more personalized approach to education. There is a belief that if we do that it will solve all the ills of the educational system and it won't. It will help some things, but also exacerbate some issues and create new ones. I worked in a cyber charter before I moved to a traditional public school. I see the value in them for some students and I don't begrudge them. However, I've also seen the waste in them. I also know that people thinking it would be free of political ties are fooling themselves. We regularly got e-mails to out teacher accounts from our CEO spinning bills in PA senate and telling us why we should support Bill ABC and how we should reach out to our local politicians. Charter schools are essentially businesses that happen to be schools. 

2.) I wouldn't think so. The district I work in regularly includes reports on these type of surveys on their website for the community and it does help us try to direct resources towards specific issues. Additionally there are SAP (Student Assistance Protocol) teams in the district to help remove barriers to learning like alcohol, drugs, problems at home, etc. My guess is if it isn't tucked away on the community portion of the website somewhere it is available at a school board meeting or by requesting the information from the district. I would also say, in some cases I don't know how valid some survey results are, because most kids to not take them seriously. 

3.) Equity in student outcomes is another case for me where I differ a little in what I believe versus what is projected. I get the theory of it all. We are asked to meet students at their ability level. So in some respects I create culminating assignments for students where it tests different ways of thinking. Some students are more mathematical in nature so I give them something to do that ties into that. Some are more musical so here is an assignment that ties into that. As long as I am assessing the same skill (I teach HS English) I think it works because comprehension and analysis is a basic skill that can be assessed in multiple manners. Where I differ some from others is that people want every single student to be given a personalized assignment and we should just let students do what they want and they make snappy sayings like "If , and we get told dumb things like "Failure is not an option." Well no, failure is an option. Students need to know you can fail in life and rebound from it. Students are living breathing human beings with different variables for many different reasons- defined success is different and grades are a portion of that

[Hardcore troubadour 15,450]

14 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

Here's a thought... Bye bye!

A fleeting thought. You know this 

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

12 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

I am for a lesson plan without hate rhetoric in it.  Is it that hard?  

Also, I am curious as to what exact lines in the bill would frighten an enlightened centrist, such as you.

 

What lesson plan do you know that has hate rhetoric in it?

[TimmySmith 2,782]

5 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I already have.  Go back and look.

No you didn't.  You people focked up and let the looneys take over your curriculum and are now scrambling because the government is getting involved. 

Hers' a story.  The War in Iraq started because the focking UN was supposed to be watching Iraq and weren't.  So when the claim of WMD came down, the UN couldn't show there weren't any because they were/are corrupt and derelict.  So Blix races around Iraq, trying to do years of inspections in weeks.  It was too late. Bush said fock you, we are going in. 

Moral:  Do your focking job and the government will stay away!

[RLLD 4,232]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I think parents have the power.  They can join their school boards.  They shouldn't have an individual effect on what is being taught in the classroom for just their child.

I do not see this as a "power", and certainly not when compared to the ability of people to speak with their money.

Just look at how companies cave to radical nonsense when their profits are imperiled....

[RLLD 4,232]

2 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

That's post-covid, not pre-covid.

A distinction without a difference

[Hawkeye21 2,399]

4 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

No you didn't.  You people focked up and let the looneys take over your curriculum and are now scrambling because the government is getting involved. 

Hers' a story.  The War in Iraq started because the focking UN was supposed to be watching Iraq and weren't.  So when the claim of WMD came down, the UN couldn't show there weren't any because they were/are corrupt and derelict.  So Blix races around Iraq, trying to do years of inspections in weeks.  It was too late. Bush said fock you, we are going in. 

Moral:  Do your focking job and the government will stay away!

What the hell are you talking about?

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

13 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

No you didn't.  You people focked up and let the looneys take over your curriculum and are now scrambling because the government is getting involved. 

Hers' a story.  The War in Iraq started because the focking UN was supposed to be watching Iraq and weren't.  So when the claim of WMD came down, the UN couldn't show there weren't any because they were/are corrupt and derelict.  So Blix races around Iraq, trying to do years of inspections in weeks.  It was too late. Bush said fock you, we are going in. 

Moral:  Do your focking job and the government will stay away!

 

Put down the pipe. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,547]

40 minutes ago, RLLD said:

A distinction without a difference

There most definitely is because it wouldn't be a coincidence if the drop happened at the time teachers had to go back into the classroom.

 

I can only speak on NJ, but just 3 years ago, you had a very hard time finding a teaching job here that wasn't a 1-year/short-term replacement job.

[Fireballer 2,642]

54 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

1.) Some students are not served well by the public education system. A lot of that is because of governmental overreach with years upon years of bad policy designed to equalize education. I mean at one point there was policy based on 100% of students showing proficiency in a topic. How would that ever work? But additionally, some special education students benefit more from smaller class sizes and smaller student to teacher ratios. Charter schools and things like that offer that. A more personalized approach to education. There is a belief that if we do that it will solve all the ills of the educational system and it won't. It will help some things, but also exacerbate some issues and create new ones. I worked in a cyber charter before I moved to a traditional public school. I see the value in them for some students and I don't begrudge them. However, I've also seen the waste in them. I also know that people thinking it would be free of political ties are fooling themselves. We regularly got e-mails to out teacher accounts from our CEO spinning bills in PA senate and telling us why we should support Bill ABC and how we should reach out to our local politicians. Charter schools are essentially businesses that happen to be schools. 

2.) I wouldn't think so. The district I work in regularly includes reports on these type of surveys on their website for the community and it does help us try to direct resources towards specific issues. Additionally there are SAP (Student Assistance Protocol) teams in the district to help remove barriers to learning like alcohol, drugs, problems at home, etc. My guess is if it isn't tucked away on the community portion of the website somewhere it is available at a school board meeting or by requesting the information from the district. I would also say, in some cases I don't know how valid some survey results are, because most kids to not take them seriously. 

3.) Equity in student outcomes is another case for me where I differ a little in what I believe versus what is projected. I get the theory of it all. We are asked to meet students at their ability level. So in some respects I create culminating assignments for students where it tests different ways of thinking. Some students are more mathematical in nature so I give them something to do that ties into that. Some are more musical so here is an assignment that ties into that. As long as I am assessing the same skill (I teach HS English) I think it works because comprehension and analysis is a basic skill that can be assessed in multiple manners. Where I differ some from others is that people want every single student to be given a personalized assignment and we should just let students do what they want and they make snappy sayings like "If , and we get told dumb things like "Failure is not an option." Well no, failure is an option. Students need to know you can fail in life and rebound from it. Students are living breathing human beings with different variables for many different reasons- defined success is different and grades are a portion of that

Thanks...as for #2, I wasn't specific enough.  My kids are scheduled to take a survey of how "safe" they feel in school and home and to promote "safety" for all persons in the school building.  I'm sure this will have some intimate questions kids' personal habits.  They have explicitly said that results from my kids will not be available to me. At this point, I have opted them out. 

[Sean Mooney 1,983]

13 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

Thanks...as for #2, I wasn't specific enough.  My kids are scheduled to take a survey of how "safe" they feel in school and home and to promote "safety" for all persons in the school building.  I'm sure this will have some intimate questions kids' personal habits.  They have explicitly said that results from my kids will not be available to me. At this point, I have opted them out. 

Ah..it is probably something similar to what we do here called the PAYS survey (Pennsylvania Youth Survey). They keep it anonymous to try to get students to answer openly and honestly but it doesn't work. Even the student's responses are anonymous as we don't see who said what. On the survey itself, from their website- First, the results provide school administrators, state agency directors, legislators and others with critical information concerning the changes in patterns of the use and abuse of these harmful substances and behaviors. Second, the survey assesses risk factors that are related to these behaviors and the protective factors that help guard against them. This information allows community leaders to direct prevention resources to areas where they are likely to have the greatest impact.

 

A handful of people opt out. I would say just opt out. 

[Cloaca du jour 2,150]

Lets focus a bit on the clientele for low income areas...the kids are totally dilligaf.   They are completely satisfied with a tv...cable..a gaming system and a cell phone...their perceived  needs are different...there is no value in education to them..they dont care about fancy houses, cars..etc.  their basic needs are met and when they are 3rd generation welfare...they have different goals

[kutulu 1,677]

The sex

[Fireballer 2,642]

This is why so many people have an issue with education right now.  We've gone too far left. I said in my first post in this thread that teachers have too often become activists. All this BS about race and gender theory, BLM, and the nutjob in Cali saying that parents should give up their kids to the state. Its all smoke and mirrors to divide us and to cloak the push for Socialism.  That's the end goal to all these precious efforts for equity. This is why Terry Mcauliffe isn't the Gov of Va right now. They've exposed themselves that they don't want to teach your kids, they want to raise your kids.  Parents don't want to write fuking ciriculum for schools.  But they do want a say as to whether their education system is built on a "Marxist framework".