Green Bay Coach and GM

[donhaas 18]

My point is not that it was the right or wrong decision. We will never know what Favre could have done with those Packers so need to speculate. My point is that people coming out 2 years after the trade, ranting about how the Packers were clearly right because Aaron Rodgers is a stronger fantasy player now, or because his team squeeked a semi-controversial win out over the Vikings in week 7 is completely irrational.

 

 

Why are you saying "fantasy player"?

Everybody watched that game last night.... Favre clearly had a much better running back, better wide receivers, a better tight end and, because the Packers were decimated by injuries, was playing against a much worse defense...

 

Despite all this, he was owned incredibly....

Rodgers on his worst day right now is that much better than Favre in all aspects of the game

 

If the Packers would have caved, Rodgers would no longer be here.... and the Packers would have been completely focked for the present and the future (much like the Vikings and Bears are now)...

 

If you want to see irrational, check out the OP.... or any of the other trolls who cam through this thread (and there were many)...

 

This thread is hilarious to me...

 

If you don't like where your ill-thought-out argument has led you, feel free to quietly exit this thread....

 

TIA!

[Walter34 3]

My point is not that it was the right or wrong decision. We will never know what Favre could have done with those Packers so need to speculate. My point is that people coming out 2 years after the trade, ranting about how the Packers were clearly right because Aaron Rodgers is a stronger fantasy player now, or because his team squeeked a semi-controversial win out over the Vikings in week 7 is completely irrational.

 

Over the past 10 years, Favre has ended "most" important games with a game losing interception. What more is there to consider really?

[Puddleglum 0]

My point is not that it was the right or wrong decision. We will never know what Favre could have done with those Packers so need to speculate. My point is that people coming out 2 years after the trade, ranting about how the Packers were clearly right because Aaron Rodgers is a stronger fantasy player now, or because his team squeeked a semi-controversial win out over the Vikings in week 7 is completely irrational.

 

The Packers clearly made the right decision, and it has nothing to do with fantasy football. Yes, maybe the 2008 and 2009 seasons could have gone differently if Favre was the QB. Who knows. But Rodgers had fantastic season both years, and QB play was never the Packers problem. In 2008 Favre was ineffective down the stretch. Favre had a career year in 2009, but Rodgers played just as well in GB. Farve's 2009 playoffs ended the same way as in 2007, tossing a game-ending pick. Why would it be any different if he was playing for the Packers? Now the year is 2010, and nobody in their right mind would rather have Favre on thier roster. Meanwhile, the Packers get to look forward to another 10 years of excellent play from their franchise QB.

[Sho Nuff 720]

The Packers clearly made the right decision, and it has nothing to do with fantasy football. Yes, maybe the 2008 and 2009 seasons could have gone differently if Favre was the QB. Who knows. But Rodgers had fantastic season both years, and QB play was never the Packers problem. In 2008 Favre was ineffective down the stretch. Favre had a career year in 2009, but Rodgers played just as well in GB. Farve's 2009 playoffs ended the same way as in 2007, tossing a game-ending pick. Why would it be any different if he was playing for the Packers? Now the year is 2010, and nobody in their right mind would rather have Favre on thier roster. Meanwhile, the Packers get to look forward to another 10 years of excellent play from their franchise QB.

Exactly...and who is to say Favre would have come back in 2009 had he been hurt like he was in 2008 and still in Green Bay. He wouldn't have have to prove anything or try to stick it to TT, so his motivation for coming back would have been a bit less. He would have likely given way to Rodgers late in 2008 when his injury started hampering him.

And another crapstorm would have commenced if McCarthy would have had the nuts to bench him.

[Flejszon 0]

How many close games have the packers won over the past 2.5 years? Rodgers is a good QB, but he is the Jarome Iginla (hockey player) of the NFL. He racks up stats vs bad teams in blowouts, but in crunch time he may not throw the pick, but he does throw the incomplete pass or the 4 yard pass short of the goal line. Even last night, the guy tossed two picks in the redzone and failed to get the big TD to close out the game. Favre on the other hand had a TD taken away because the ref in his little booth is handicapped, and was also half a foot away from tossing that clutch game winning TD that rodgera still has never done.

[Sho Nuff 720]

How many close games have the packers won over the past 2.5 years? Rodgers is a good QB, but he is the Jarome Iginla (hockey player) of the NFL. He racks up stats vs bad teams in blowouts, but in crunch time he may not throw the pick, but he does throw the incomplete pass or the 4 yard pass short of the goal line. Even last night, the guy tossed two picks in the redzone and failed to get the big TD to close out the game. Favre on the other hand had a TD taken away because the ref in his little booth is handicapped, and was also half a foot away from tossing that clutch game winning TD that rodgera still has never done.

 

Ahh...going with that huh?

How many of those games were lost just because of QB play?

Now you are going for the he racks up stats vs. bad teams in blowouts?

So his stats against AZ in the playoffs, Minny last year, Pitt...those were against bad teams in blowouts right?

Yes, the guy had those picks last night...nobody is denying that, nobody is denying Rodgers did not have the best game and mostly 2nd half last night.

Nobody is even arguing that Rodgers is having a great season.

Do you just want to base things on one night...or 2.5 years...or what?

 

As for the ref that overturned it. Watch the replay again. I thought they screwed it up last night...watched it several times today. When he hits the ground, the ball hits, and moves further up into his chest. Once that ball moves, the ref will call incomplete.

 

Rodgers has not tossed a game winning TD?

Did you miss the Chicago game to start last season off?

[Puddleglum 0]

How many close games have the packers won over the past 2.5 years? Rodgers is a good QB, but he is the Jarome Iginla (hockey player) of the NFL. He racks up stats vs bad teams in blowouts, but in crunch time he may not throw the pick, but he does throw the incomplete pass or the 4 yard pass short of the goal line. Even last night, the guy tossed two picks in the redzone and failed to get the big TD to close out the game. Favre on the other hand had a TD taken away because the ref in his little booth is handicapped, and was also half a foot away from tossing that clutch game winning TD that rodgera still has never done.

Because clearly Favre has been so clutch in close games this year. Losses by 5, 4, 9 and 4 points.

 

And are you really aruging that Rodgers got his 4000+ yards and 29+ TDs over the past two seasons just by picking on bad teams? He had 3 TD games against Baltimore, Minnesota, and Pittsburg last year.

 

Yeah, we'd all like to see more wins in the close games, but if the best criticisim you can come up with is "Well, he's lost a lot of close games . . ." then I don't really think you have much to talk about.

[Sho Nuff 720]

Because clearly Favre has been so clutch in close games this year. Losses by 5, 4, 9 and 4 points.

 

And are you really aruging that Rodgers got his 4000+ yards and 29+ TDs over the past two seasons just by picking on bad teams? He had 3 TD games against Baltimore, Minnesota, and Pittsburg last year.

 

Yeah, we'd all like to see more wins in the close games, but if the best criticisim you can come up with is "Well, he's lost a lot of close games . . ." then I don't really think you have much to talk about.

Rodgers was supposed to be out there defending on that TD against Pitt last year.

Also he was supposed to kick the FG against Washington.

[mambokings 0]

I rode Aaron Rodgers to a FF championship last season. He throws a mean spiral and is deadly accurate. Green Bay made the right move.

[IMMensaMind 462]

My point is not that it was the right or wrong decision. We will never know what Favre could have done with those Packers so need to speculate.

 

We don't need to speculate; it doesn't matter. What matters is that the decision was made to ensure the best chance of a continuation of Packer relevance.

 

My point is that people coming out 2 years after the trade, ranting about how the Packers were clearly right because Aaron Rodgers is a stronger fantasy player now, or because his team squeeked a semi-controversial win out over the Vikings in week 7 is completely irrational.

 

Are you sure you're not making up an isolated argument here? That is hardly the majority position of those who think that the move was the correct one. I've stated already why the move was the correct one, and I believe subsequent circumstances have borne out that position as proper - and I didn't just recently conclude this: I've had this position since the minute they made the announcement.

[IMMensaMind 462]

How many close games have the packers won over the past 2.5 years? Rodgers is a good QB, but he is the Jarome Iginla (hockey player) of the NFL. He racks up stats vs bad teams in blowouts, but in crunch time he may not throw the pick, but he does throw the incomplete pass or the 4 yard pass short of the goal line. Even last night, the guy tossed two picks in the redzone and failed to get the big TD to close out the game. Favre on the other hand had a TD taken away because the ref in his little booth is handicapped, and was also half a foot away from tossing that clutch game winning TD that rodgera still has never done.

 

This point with which I am at least sympathetic. Rodgers isn't fully commandeering the circumstances - yet - of crunch time situations. The situation is dictating to him, and he's playing a bit tense; afraid to make a mistake. You definitely have to have a bit of "give a sh:t" in you to play loose enough to throw a ball to the endzone - into triple coverage - like Favre did to Harvin last night. I've told him this; he's working up to it. I coined the phrase "play with wild focus" with him; he seemed to like the term.

 

I believe that Rodgers will get there eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if it happens this year yet; I wouldn't be surprised if it happens this weekend against the Jets.

 

He's that close to breaking through that crust of fear (as I call it). I just believe I have a very good sense of where he is mentally, which is likely a huge reason why he and I hit it off so well. He talks to me pretty damn frankly about this stuff.

[Flejszon 0]

The argument the OP made was at the time, they were giving up possibly two years of actual superbowl contention, for a QB that may/or may not be a superstar for years to come. Yes, Rodgers put up good stats the past couple years, but he has not been able to convert those stats to a large amount of W's. Over the past three years, Brett has averaged 11.76 wins per season on 3 separate teams. (And that includes losing 4 out of the final 5 in NY with the injured arm)

 

What I'm trying to say is that because even if for arguments sake we conclude that Aaron Rodgers is definitively better than Brett Favre today, that doesn't automatically assume that Brett couldn't have won a couple Superbowls in the past two years with the Packers. It also doesn't mean he would have automatically have won those Superbowls either, but you can't argue that he possesses the intangibles that Rodgers may possibly have, but hasn't proven yet.

 

For arguments sake, had TT kept Brett, had they won atleast 1 Superbowl and had another competitive season in the past two years, and then Brett had either retired this year, or struggled as he has, and they lost Aaron Rodgers to free agency, would the fans of GB be yelling and screaming? I don't believe they would. To automatically assume that Brett COULDN'T have won with Green Bay the past couple years is absurd because of those intangibles + his individual statistics weren't too shabby either. Again, my point is that we will never know what could have happened had the decision been different, therefore you can't just assume GB is better off because their QB has had more yardage the past couple years. Its an argument that both sides have validity, and neither side will ever be able to prove.

[Flejszon 0]

This point with which I am at least sympathetic. Rodgers isn't fully commandeering the circumstances - yet - of crunch time situations. The situation is dictating to him, and he's playing a bit tense; afraid to make a mistake. You definitely have to have a bit of "give a sh:t" in you to play loose enough to throw a ball to the endzone - into triple coverage - like Favre did to Harvin last night. I've told him this; he's working up to it. I coined the phrase "play with wild focus" with him; he seemed to like the term.

 

I believe that Rodgers will get there eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if it happens this year yet; I wouldn't be surprised if it happens this weekend against the Jets.

 

He's that close to breaking through that crust of fear (as I call it). I just believe I have a very good sense of where he is mentally, which is likely a huge reason why he and I hit it off so well. He talks to me pretty damn frankly about this stuff.

 

What he said. I actually like Rodgers. In fact, he is my fantasy QB, and I do see a bit of young Brett in him. The one thing he has however not shown me is that intangible to pull a rabbit out of your ass that Brett seems to do quite often (nearly did last night). I don't know what you know, but until he proves it onto the field, I don't believe the Packers could even compete for a Superbowl. The team isn't THAT good that they dominate every game, and don't need some "magic". The argument can always be made that had they had some "magic" the past couple of seasons, the Packers were a good enough team to atleast legitametely contend for a Superbowl.

[Sho Nuff 720]

The OP is a packer hating, bear homer troll without a clue about the game of football.

He is the only one who is less credible than swamp dog when it comes to discussing the Packers.

[WhiteWonder 2,757]

 

I forgot who was dumb and who was dumber in all this

 

 

maybe the person who bumped this after Rodgers finally beat the Vikings?

 

i actually think the Packers made the clear, correct decision back then but i do find it funny that you guys want to bump this now

[Sho Nuff 720]

maybe the person who bumped this after Rodgers finally beat the Vikings?

 

His very first game as a starter was a win over the Vikings.

[donhaas 18]

maybe the person who bumped this after Rodgers finally beat the Vikings?

 

i actually think the Packers made the clear, correct decision back then but i do find it funny that you guys want to bump this now

 

 

This thread has been bumped by me and Packer fans about 37 times before this last bump

 

It will probably get bumped again until the OP owns up

 

HTH

[Puddleglum 0]

Rodgers was supposed to be out there defending on that TD against Pitt last year.

Also he was supposed to kick the FG against Washington.

Right, and I think he was supposed to recover the James Jones fumble against Chicago as well.

[Sho Nuff 720]

The argument the OP made was at the time, they were giving up possibly two years of actual superbowl contention, for a QB that may/or may not be a superstar for years to come. Yes, Rodgers put up good stats the past couple years, but he has not been able to convert those stats to a large amount of W's. Over the past three years, Brett has averaged 11.76 wins per season on 3 separate teams. (And that includes losing 4 out of the final 5 in NY with the injured arm)

 

What I'm trying to say is that because even if for arguments sake we conclude that Aaron Rodgers is definitively better than Brett Favre today, that doesn't automatically assume that Brett couldn't have won a couple Superbowls in the past two years with the Packers. It also doesn't mean he would have automatically have won those Superbowls either, but you can't argue that he possesses the intangibles that Rodgers may possibly have, but hasn't proven yet.

 

For arguments sake, had TT kept Brett, had they won atleast 1 Superbowl and had another competitive season in the past two years, and then Brett had either retired this year, or struggled as he has, and they lost Aaron Rodgers to free agency, would the fans of GB be yelling and screaming? I don't believe they would. To automatically assume that Brett COULDN'T have won with Green Bay the past couple years is absurd because of those intangibles + his individual statistics weren't too shabby either. Again, my point is that we will never know what could have happened had the decision been different, therefore you can't just assume GB is better off because their QB has had more yardage the past couple years. Its an argument that both sides have validity, and neither side will ever be able to prove.

 

So now Brett could have won a couple of Super Bowls in 2008 and 2009 or this year?

Seriously?

How about for arguments sake you realize the liklihood they would have won a super bowl in any of the last 2 seasons with Brett was a complete and total long shot. And they would be sitting without possibly having Rodgers and nowhere to turn at QB at this point.

From a long term standpoint, the GM made the correct decision.

Things went down in a terrible way by both sides, but the correct decision for the Packers was made.

[Sho Nuff 720]

So Favre comes back and beats them 2 more times next year, then you will say uncle?

 

Just for another fun bump...

[donhaas 18]

Just for another fun bump...

 

I think what does make the Vikings win so special as this thread goes is not that Rodgers beat Favre.... One team will often beat another team and then Remote Controller/Sweetness/BMoney will go off without actually breaking down the game to see what happens....

 

But in this game and especially with the Packer injuries to Grant, Finley, Tauscher, Driver, Jenkins, Pickett, Neal, Barrett, Poppinga, Burnett, Bigby, Harris (and more).... the Vikings were clearly better than the Packers at just about every position of the 22 positions....

 

 

Except one...

 

And even though Rodgers did not have a particularly good game, he was so much better than the Favre that the Packers could overcome all of that adversity and injuries.

 

 

So, yes.... Favre on the Packers right now would be atrocious....it would be a sad, pathetic, hopeless scene... And Rodgers would be gone; Flynn would be our future

And that's just on the football side.... On the life side, the Packers would have no respect for being pushovers to Favre's drama queen ways and be embarrassed by the cackshotfiasco

 

That stuff is all fine for a third-rate franchise like the Vikings.... but for the Packers? That stuff doesn't fly... we are a classy, storied franchise..

[FlaHawker 24]

Sweetness getting Pwned is classic. This slob is now over at football gays riding Kitna's cack hard!

[FlaHawker 24]

bump for sweetness

 

More pearls of wisdom from Sweetness over at Football Gays:

 

Why not? Yes Cutler threw for 4 picks. Yet, the refs and his coach let him down with an obvious TD which if called correctly, the game is over at 21-10. AT least 4 different experts (NFL Network guys; Aikman etc) said Knox had a lot to blame for 2 of the ints. YET Cutler said in the presser that all 4 TDs were his fault. That is being a stand up guy. Cutler does not fake injuries. Favre is a drama queen who has been doing this for years. I remember in his prime too, when Favre would lose a game (for eg I remember the MNF game against Panthers very well where Hoover ran all over the packers) and he would not even shake anyones hands after the loss....so much for someone who just loves to play the game). He is a fraud and he is being exposed now because packer fans finally are willing to admit this too now that they see threw his BS.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=566058&st=100&p=12483792entry12483792

 

[FlaHawker 24]

Pearls of Wisdom from Sweetness:

 

I love the fire everyone after one game crowd. This is why the person who said fans are dumb and should stick to drinking beer and eating their wings was correct.

 

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=566174&st=0&p=12483815entry12483815

 

[FlaHawker 24]

Pearls of Wisdom from Sweetness:

 

If you have bye week/injury issues, get Jon Kitna. He had 187 yards and 2 TDs today without much 1st team reps. Now he gets the Jax pass D at home. Absolutely a must start if you can get him. Thank me later

 

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=566273&st=0&p=12486881entry12486881

 

 

Yeah thank Capt Obvious later

[varga20 0]

The argument the OP made was at the time, they were giving up possibly two years of actual superbowl contention, for a QB that may/or may not be a superstar for years to come. Yes, Rodgers put up good stats the past couple years, but he has not been able to convert those stats to a large amount of W's. Over the past three years, Brett has averaged 11.76 wins per season on 3 separate teams. (And that includes losing 4 out of the final 5 in NY with the injured arm)

 

What I'm trying to say is that because even if for arguments sake we conclude that Aaron Rodgers is definitively better than Brett Favre today, that doesn't automatically assume that Brett couldn't have won a couple Superbowls in the past two years with the Packers. It also doesn't mean he would have automatically have won those Superbowls either, but you can't argue that he possesses the intangibles that Rodgers may possibly have, but hasn't proven yet.

 

For arguments sake, had TT kept Brett, had they won atleast 1 Superbowl and had another competitive season in the past two years, and then Brett had either retired this year, or struggled as he has, and they lost Aaron Rodgers to free agency, would the fans of GB be yelling and screaming? I don't believe they would. To automatically assume that Brett COULDN'T have won with Green Bay the past couple years is absurd because of those intangibles + his individual statistics weren't too shabby either. Again, my point is that we will never know what could have happened had the decision been different, therefore you can't just assume GB is better off because their QB has had more yardage the past couple years. Its an argument that both sides have validity, and neither side will ever be able to prove.

 

I think you have to remember this a team sport and everyone has to be on the same page for the team to win! The 6-10 season Rodgers had, does anyone talk about all the close games the defense lost, or how bad our o-line was that year making the so called injury prone Rodgers run for his life?? How would an immobile Favre done behind that line?? The Packers offense put up some points that year despite a struggling o-line, but the D gave up that much more! Again this is a team sport and SBs are won with great players on all sides of the ball! The argument shouldn't be who was better or is better now, but was this best for our franchise given the situation. Every angle leads to yes! Favre had arguably one of the best teams he has played on with the Vikings last year and he didn't make it all the way. As a Fan of the Pack, I was happy to see Thompson stand firm on Favres retirement, I just wished we would have had the guts to trade him to the Vikings directly and gotten a #1 pick out of them instead of a 3rd from the Jets.

[IMMensaMind 462]

I think you have to remember this a team sport and everyone has to be on the same page for the team to win! The 6-10 season Rodgers had, does anyone talk about all the close games the defense lost, or how bad our o-line was that year making the so called injury prone Rodgers run for his life?? How would an immobile Favre done behind that line?? The Packers offense put up some points that year despite a struggling o-line, but the D gave up that much more! Again this is a team sport and SBs are won with great players on all sides of the ball! The argument shouldn't be who was better or is better now, but was this best for our franchise given the situation. Every angle leads to yes! Favre had arguably one of the best teams he has played on with the Vikings last year and he didn't make it all the way. As a Fan of the Pack, I was happy to see Thompson stand firm on Favres retirement, I just wished we would have had the guts to trade him to the Vikings directly and gotten a #1 pick out of them instead of a 3rd from the Jets.

 

 

^^^this.

 

Just like the Eagles did with the Redskins.

[Sho Nuff 720]

Coach and GM are so bad that with 10 or 11 now on the IR, they still have enough depth to be 4-3 and their 3 losses are by a total of 9 points.

[donhaas 18]

Favre 10 TDs; 16 INTs.... 72 rating

 

Just chucked 3 INTs to single-handedly lose another game

 

 

 

Packers focked up bigtime :banana:

[IneedTD's 0]

Wow donhass? wait 2 years and 4 months from original post? Really went out on a limb there!

[Sho Nuff 720]

Favre 10 TDs; 16 INTs.... 72 rating

 

Just chucked 3 INTs to single-handedly lose another game

 

 

 

Packers focked up bigtime :banana:

 

You forgot his fumble too.

Also add in that many of the whiners thought so much of Moss and now look at him too.

Perhaps Teddy knew something when he didn't push as hard for Moss and traded Favre (oh, and used the pick they got for Favre to package and move up to take Clay Matthews).

 

IneedTDs...2 years? don and I have been killing sweetness about this from the start.

 

The Packers have proven their coach and GM know what they are doing (eventhough I still don't think that much of McCarthy overall).

[donhaas 18]

Poor Sweetness/Swampdog/DallasEmpire-PyschoBelicheck/BMoney are all tied up and gagged in somebody's basement somewhere!

 

 

954,930 posts in this thread

0 this year....

 

what happened??

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

[donhaas 18]

 

I don't even know how anyone could debate this? I'm really at a loss. So far it was a terrible pick. It hasn't panned out. It might have been a great extension, he might have great years going on, but they wasted the pick and they let one of the best QB's of all time go to their rival.

 

 

Add BBBO to the list of dumbasses I just posted, please

[donhaas 18]

 

If I were a Packer fan, I'd be seriously pissed about the 3-4 switch over. They've effectively neutralized their own best defensive player (Kampman). Another case of a coach bringing in his own system, regardless of if he has the personnel to run it or not.

 

This thread is completely full of all kinds of great quotes...

 

 

This is probably the greatest thread in the history of FFToday....

[FeelingMN 273]

This is probably the greatest thread in the history of FFToday....

 

I had to jump in pretty strong here....you started a GFIAFP streak....3 straight posts....4 out of the last 6. You're talking to yourself man.

 

[donhaas 18]

I had to jump in pretty strong here....you started a GFIAFP streak....3 straight posts....4 out of the last 6. You're talking to yourself man.

 

 

Is it wrong to ask for a little accountability from the blowhards (you included ) who found time to post in this thread 564,983 times?

 

All I'm asking for is just a little bit of accountability and responsibility in this gratification-now Obama Entitlement Society "where is my handout?" world

 

If there is no accountability, what's to keep you from running your limousine liberal month time and time again?

How do we keep these threads from recurring (and hogging precious bandwidth) if nobody learns from them and if all of the nonsense spewers run away and hide like little girlies...?

 

 

I weep for America

[donhaas 18]

LOL!

 

Just saw your avatar.... That's funny

[Sho Nuff 720]

And Favre apparently hurt his shoulder Saturday putting on a t-shirt and needed an injection to deal with the pain Sunday.

Yeah...terrible decision by TT.

[Sho Nuff 720]

And lets see, another decision people whined about TT (and I criticized him for it too) was Marshawn Lynch.

But, since the trade:

74 carries

217 yards

2.93 per carry

 

Saying its just because Seattle sucks and can't block?

Justin Forsett

34 carries

180 yards

5.29 per carry.

[devius 4]

It's a great time to be a Packers Fan! I've always been in a wierd place in regards to this situation as i've always been and always will be a huge Favre fan. That being said I place my priorities with the Pack first and foremost. I think those of us that followed Green Bay closely realized that we had a talent sitting on the bench and may miss an opportunity for future long term success. I've lived and died by the decisions of the ol' gunslinger and will still take all the bad that came with the good. But I supported fully that the change had to be made and that it was the right time. There was a time when a certain multiple Superbowl winner had to be replaced by a "Young" talented QB and that ended up being pretty good too.