Obama executing American citizens without giving them a trial.

[MDC 7,737]

Well, I thought the Defacto Dictator was a different kind of politician and would end all things Bush did.

 

Obviously he's not and he lost my vote because of it, doesn't change the fact that Welchy only cares insofar as it gives him another reason to cry about Obummer!

 

Where were you super patriots from 2003-2008? You're getting exactly the president you deserve.

[gocolts 300]

Obviously he's not and he lost my vote because of it, doesn't change the fact that Welchy only cares insofar as it gives him another reason to cry about Obummer!

 

Where were you super patriots from 2003-2008? You're getting exactly the president you deserve.

I just wanted to use Defacto Dictator again. I have not weighed in on this issue at all.

[MDC 7,737]

I just wanted to use Defacto Dictator again. I have not weighed in on this issue at all.

 

Nicely done.

[nikki2200 4]

I just wanted to use Defacto Dictator again. I have not weighed in on this issue at all.

 

Because you can't bring yourself to give Obama props and publicly say you are glad he shoved a missile in this guy's rectum. Also you are probably smart enough to realize what a massive hypocrite you would look like if you criticized it, considering I'm assuming you supported Bush in his anti-terrorist endeavors. Again.

 

Are you ready to trade with me yet?

[gocolts 300]

Because you can't bring yourself to give Obama props and publicly say you are glad he shoved a missile in this guy's rectum. Also you are probably smart enough to realize what a massive hypocrite you would look like if you criticized it, considering I'm assuming you supported Bush in his anti-terrorist endeavors. Again.

 

Are you ready to trade with me yet?

Problem with this assumption is that I did give Obama major props on this type of sh1t before.

 

Trade??? i thought you were trying to rape me.

[Voltaire 5,429]

I'm sure that Yemen would have extradited al-Alwaki a few years ago if they had known where he was hiding.

 

I beg you to please show some tolerance towards the authorities over there for putting the search for him on hold. They have enough on their hands right now dealing with the full blown civil war in their country and the leader only recently returned to the country after being gone for four months when his home got blown up. I'm sure when they get done quelling the ongoing insurrection and the backlog of related problems, they would have gotten around to our reqest to extradite al-Awlaki again.

 

You could argue, I suppose, that we should wait for the Yemeni government to regain control of the country so we could ask them for this extradition. We would have given him the trial you desperately claim that he deserved. I know it breaks your heart that he didn't receive a trial. I know with how high esteem you hold the American legal system to provide him a fair trial and possible sentence for his alleged 'crimes'.

 

Unfortunately, those nasty evil brutes in our military who have no regard at all for the rights of US citizens, after a three- year manhunt, and hundreds of millions of dollars of surveillance and man-hours had finally located the fine gentleman on the road, they didn't share your concerns. They were more worried about trivial matters like inspiring domestic terrorists and plotting the death of countless civilians and worried about losing track of him before he went into hiding again. So they blew him away. Bad, evil military leaders. They should all be tried for murdering this fine man. It's so shameful.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

We don't live under one Constitution when a Rep is in the WH and another Constitution when a dem is in the WH.

 

 

So I take it if I did a search I would find a whole bunch of threads started by you in vehement opposition of the Patriot Act?

 

 

When a law is passed that contradicts the Constitution the Constitution supercedes the law.

 

I'm questioning whether the due process protections of the Constitution were violated. As I said earlier, pass a law to strip these fukktards of their citizenship and blow them away all day everyday. Giving the govt a free pass to kill Americans without question is not a good idea, IMO.

 

Enemy combatants from other countries should have zero Constitutional protections, yet this administration has been trying to give them these protections. Now they ignore the protections for US citizens.

 

I can't believe your Bush knob-slobbing ass would have the balls to b!tch about this. You who supported Gitmo, who supported the wiretapping, and would have cried yourself to sleep jerking off wrapped in the American flag if Bush had done the same damn thing.

 

The statute is legal UNTIL and unless the SCOTUS says it is unconstitutional. I notice your boy Bush didn't bother to wait for the legal niceties to be ironed out when he implemented the Patriot Act, started a blatantly illegal torture camp, and tapped citizen's phones in violation of the 4th Amendment.

 

(And yes, I know Obama has done an about face and continued many of these practices. That is why he won't get my vote ever again. This killing, however, I approve of. This dooshnozzle knew he was wanted... if he wanted to proceed under legal niceties, he should have submitted himself to an American court's jurisdiction. Instead he hid with terrorists. Fock him.)

[nikki2200 4]

OMG. I just read up on this guy. I don't make a habit of following the lives of Islamic terrorists so I have to admit I didn't know who he was, I just assumed the CIA knew what they were doing when they took him out. His terrorism resume is 4 miles long including, but not limited to, having direct ties and communications with the 9/11 attackers, the Fort Hood shooter, and the underwear bomber. He is a mentor and recruiter for members of al-Qaeda. He has openly declared jihad on the US and had an entire internet campaign where he would preach to and encourage radicals to join the jihad and perform violence against the US. OMG.

 

Also, for what it's worth, when he attended college in the US, he received a Yemeni scholarship claiming that he was born there and was a citizen of Yemen. Apparently he cared about his US citizenship a lot less than you do.

 

Really RP..... shame on you. This is the biggest reach I have ever seen you perform.

[IGotWorms 4,060]

Why am I not surprised that RP sides with the terrorists?

[donhaas 18]

I can't believe your Bush knob-slobbing ass would have the balls to b!tch about this. You who supported Gitmo, who supported the wiretapping, and would have cried yourself to sleep jerking off wrapped in the American flag if Bush had done the same damn thing.

 

The statute is legal UNTIL and unless the SCOTUS says it is unconstitutional. I notice your boy Bush didn't bother to wait for the legal niceties to be ironed out when he implemented the Patriot Act, started a blatantly illegal torture camp, and tapped citizen's phones in violation of the 4th Amendment.

 

(And yes, I know Obama has done an about face and continued many of these practices. That is why he won't get my vote ever again. This killing, however, I approve of. This dooshnozzle knew he was wanted... if he wanted to proceed under legal niceties, he should have submitted himself to an American court's jurisdiction. Instead he hid with terrorists. Fock him.)

 

 

 

I can't believe how many times Corky Pilot gets anally raped in a day here at FFToday...

[nikki2200 4]

It'll be interesting to see how the GOP candidates play this. On the one hand, Paul is the only one who honestly gives a sh1t about the constitution or the rule of law so you'd figure they're on board with the government sanctioned assassination of US citizens. On the other hand, they have no principles or morals and this is an opportunity to cry like a bunch of sobbing beetches about Obummer!

 

My guess is they mostly go the jellyfish / RP way and start crying. Either that or they continue to have no public foreign policy at all.

 

It appears the GOP is fully supportive of this assassination. At least they are standing their ground on this one.

 

And it appears they are using it as an opportunity to throw Ron Paul in the bucket with the likes of the ACLU.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Actually he's kinda doing exactly what he said he was going to on this matter while he was campaigning.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vpCBpTbEds

 

Take out al-Qaeda. Surge in Afghanistan. He was very clear about it, including going into Pakistan without their permission to kill terrorists if they had them in their sites.

 

This is one of the things you can't criticize him on swaying away from his campaign promises... he's doing it. And I think everyone should be not b!tching. Every one of them he takes out, takes us one step closer to safety from future attacks.

 

But I must admit I am getting a good at RP turning into a libtard right before our eyes. Talking about due process and fair trials for terrorists. It's giving me the giggles.

 

 

I'm consistant about the Constitution.

 

HTH.

[Big Blue 06 196]

This is such a stupid argument that I just assumed RP was fishing to make a point. However, it appears that he and Strike are being serious. The fact that I'm of the opposite opinions of those fellas makes me feel like I may be on to something.

[Mookz 1,363]

al-Awlaki?! More like Al All-Wacky, am I right?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Because he's wacky.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Why am I not surprised that RP sides with the terrorists?

I don't give two fukks about this asshat.

 

I just don't like the idea of giving the govt the OK to kill US citizens without due process. As I said a few times already, this clown should have had his US citizenship stripped years ago, and the it's open season on him as far as I'm concerned.

 

LMFAO at you libtard window lickers who can't grasp that concept.

[nikki2200 4]

LMFAO at you libtard window lickers who can't grasp that concept.

 

Actually RP, I think you are the libtard, considering the only people who seem to agree with you on this matter are the far left liberals and the ACLU.

 

Have fun in your new elitist club. Will you be promoting socialized health care next?

[Recliner Pilot 61]

I can't believe your Bush knob-slobbing ass would have the balls to b!tch about this. You who supported Gitmo, who supported the wiretapping, and would have cried yourself to sleep jerking off wrapped in the American flag if Bush had done the same damn thing.

 

The statute is legal UNTIL and unless the SCOTUS says it is unconstitutional. I notice your boy Bush didn't bother to wait for the legal niceties to be ironed out when he implemented the Patriot Act, started a blatantly illegal torture camp, and tapped citizen's phones in violation of the 4th Amendment.

 

(And yes, I know Obama has done an about face and continued many of these practices. That is why he won't get my vote ever again. This killing, however, I approve of. This dooshnozzle knew he was wanted... if he wanted to proceed under legal niceties, he should have submitted himself to an American court's jurisdiction. Instead he hid with terrorists. Fock him.)

 

 

It's wierd that all these blatantly illegal and unconstitutional things stood up to court challenges.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

 

 

I can't believe how many times Corky Pilot gets anally raped in a day here at FFToday...

You should try reading my posts on this thread to educate yourself on my actual position on this issue. Oh wait, you are famous for not reading my posts and jumping into my threads to make an ass of yourself.

 

Bwahahahahahaha!!!!

[nikki2200 4]

I'm consistant about the Constitution.

 

HTH.

 

So you are saying the legislation that Bush passed in 2001 that allows the President to unilaterally decide to use military force against terrorists is unconstitutional? I will anxiously await for you to post about your petition to the ACLU to bring this legislation to the SCOTUS to challenge it. Keep us informed on its status. TIA.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

Tell ya what, Meatflaps, you show me Constitutionsl Amendment overturning the right to due process and we'll talk. Last time I checked American citizens still had that right.

[nikki2200 4]

Tell ya what, Meatflaps, you show me Constitutionsl Amendment overturning the right to due process and we'll talk. Last time I checked American citizens still had that right.

 

And last time I checked, American citizens were still protected from illegal search and seizure under the Fourth Amendment. But somehow the Patriot Act is going strong.

 

I showed you a law that makes it very clear that the President legally assassinated this fockwad based on legislation that was passed by George W. Bush. So clearly you were diametrically opposed to this legislation when it came to be. I shall go in search of threads, but I think I know what I would find.

 

The whole focking point here is that you make an ass of yourself by starting threads like this because everyone on this focking bored knows that if Bush had done the same thing you would have creamed your jeans. And you will grasp at anything possible to spew your hatred for Obama, whether it makes any sense or not. You have no ideology. You have no belief system. You blindly follow or hate a politician based on what it says on your voter registration card. It's so obvious and it makes you look like a clown. And right now you are siding with the ACLU on this matter. Congrats. Your hatred for Obama has turned you into a libtard. It's sad really.

 

Also if you were really interested in the constitutionality or legality of this assassination, you probably would read some of the prominent news sources that have articles on this and have various legal experts explaining how this is perfectly legal. Including Fox News.

 

But you don't want to do that. You just want to continue to promote the caricature of the loyal Republican that you are by opposing anything the current administration does. The GOP doesn't even agree with you on this one. They think you are a fool, as is apparent by how they are opposing Ron Paul on this issue. Again congrats. I think you've officially hit rock bottom.

[nikki2200 4]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/09/30/cair-decries-killing-american-militant-without-due-process/

 

John Ashcroft, who was the attorney general in the Bush administration, told Fox News that he believes the operation was legal.

 

"The president goes through a significant process before he signs an order regarding these kinds of things," he said. "It would be based on evidence presented to him from the intelligence community, and I would expect that this evidence was not just of statements by al-Awlaki but that he was involved operationally not only in sighting but in carrying out terrorist attacks."

 

But Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, joined Rep. Paul in condemning the killing of al-Awlaki, saying the Obama administration had "crossed a dangerous divide and set a dangerous precedent for how the United States handle terrorism cases."

 

"Mr. al-Awlaki's allegedly violent rejection of America was not acceptable in any way," Kucinich said. "Neither is it acceptable to trample the Constitution through extrajudicial killings."

 

The majority of lawmakers on Capitol Hill and the leading Republican presidential contenders -- Texas Gov. Rick Perry and former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney -- praised the killing, and Obama touted the deadly attack as a "major blow to Al Qaeda."

 

The key is operationally. They had deemed that he became operational in his terrorist plots, and therefore it was perfectly legal for this US citizen to be placed on the kill list. But if you had read anything other than a headline on this topic you would already know this.

[Saint Elistan 106]

I find this video funny because I'm pretty sure Beck has ripped Ron Paul over this whole ordeal, but he and The Judge were on to something way back when Obama's Assassination List went public.

 

 

You should all read this:

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/9176-military-commissions-rights-of-accused-terrorists-under-bush-obama

 

* The U.S. Constitution, laws, and treaties signed by the United States guarantee everyone — even foreign terror suspects detained abroad — a trial.

* Trials are not given to defendants who “deserve” them; they are administered to everyone in order to sort the guilty from the innocent.

* The President’s war powers during wartime do not allow him to abolish trials.

* Everyone detained under the law of war is entitled to the presumption of innocence.

 

And that's not even factoring in Citizenship status. Once again I find myself arguing a point to people that will never change their mind because of the hysteria when we attach a label like "Terrorist". It's not so much about what it was used for in this instance - it's about the precedent it sets for future instances. McCarthyism isn't far away.

 

The precedent has been set and you didn't even blink.

 

Btw, Obama's Classified Assassination List reportedly contains "dozens" of American Citizens living abroad.

 

And don't give me any of that crap about not being able to detain him. If we wanted to catch him, we could have.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5g1u-88Ix2Gi9m93now-CR2AkFoDw?docId=ec26b4275eff4a37b7d65f64ef08bd3d

The [witness], who had sheltered the group in his home nearby, said the group had stopped for breakfast in the desert and were sitting on the ground eating when they saw the drone approaching. They rushed to their truck to drive off when the missiles hit, incinerating the vehicle, according to the tribal chief, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he did not want to be associated with the incident.

We didn't want him alive.

[nikki2200 4]

I find this video funny because I'm pretty sure Beck has ripped Ron Paul over this whole ordeal, but he and The Judge were on to something way back when Obama's Assassination List went public.

 

 

 

I just lost about 20 IQ points watching that video.

[nikki2200 4]

You should all read this:

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/9176-military-commissions-rights-of-accused-terrorists-under-bush-obama

 

* The U.S. Constitution, laws, and treaties signed by the United States guarantee everyone — even foreign terror suspects detained abroad — a trial.

* Trials are not given to defendants who “deserve” them; they are administered to everyone in order to sort the guilty from the innocent.

* The President’s war powers during wartime do not allow him to abolish trials.

* Everyone detained under the law of war is entitled to the presumption of innocence.

 

And that's not even factoring in Citizenship status. Once again I find myself arguing a point to people that will never change their mind because of the hysteria when we attach a label like "Terrorist". It's not so much about what it was used for in this instance - it's about the precedent it sets for future instances. McCarthyism isn't far away.

 

The precedent has been set and you didn't even blink.

 

Btw, Obama's Classified Assassination List reportedly contains "dozens" of American Citizens living abroad.

 

And don't give me any of that crap about not being able to detain him. If we wanted to catch him, we could have.

 

We didn't want him alive.

 

So do you think, beyond a reasonable doubt, that this al-Ahlwair guy or whatever the fock his name is was not an integral component to recruiting al-Qaeda operatives that were commissioned to kill American citizens in the name of jihad and were successful at it?

 

You think quote unquote hysteria led to this labeling of him? That he was an innocent American citizen and knew he was wanted but instead of turning himself in so he could undergo due process and prove his innocence he instead he hid with terrorists and continued his internet propaganda that his followers should vow themselves to a life of murdering American citizens and overthrowing Arab governments that were sympathetic to the western world. Did the 3000 people that died in 9/11 get trials before they were convicted under Muslim radical law of being infidels? Do they plan on trying the rest of the innocent civilians they plan on killing through terrorist plots to determine if they deserve to live or die?

 

Give me a focking break. Seriously. You want to talk about McCarthyism and conspiracy theories about the gubmint taking rights away and whatnot. These people gave up their rights the second they were a part of a plot that flew 747s into the World Trade Center. And you want to know what? They probably thought they could get away with it because the US would never stoop to their level and we had all these laws and regulations and shiit and due process... They thought we were poosays. And you want to know what now? They're focking shaking in their boots because they know we don't give a shiit anymore. We will hunt them down in their ratholes and caves and blow their asses to smithereens and show them that they are not allowed to fock with the US and get away with it.

 

Kudos to Bush for doing what needed to be done in enacting laws that allowed us to go after these mofos. Kudos to Obama for carrying it out and not backing down and sending missiles up these guys asses when 10 years of intelligence has given us we needed to find them.

 

Who gives a fock if we didn't want him alive? They don't afford the same courtesy to our innocent American civilians.

 

Whether you like it or not, this is war. And they declared war on us. Actually the guy that got blown up has consistently declared war on us for the past 10 years. They are organized enemies of the USA. Therefore, we get to blow them the fock up and not have to answer to anyone about it.

[Saint Elistan 106]

*whooosh*

 

Too bad I wont be able to bump this thread when it's time to say "I told you so".

 

It's not so much about what it was used for in this instance - it's about the precedent it sets for future instances. The precedent has been set and you didn't even blink.

[nikki2200 4]

*whooosh*

 

Too bad I wont be able to bump this thread when it's time to say "I told you so".

 

It's not so much about what it was used for in this instance - it's about the precedent it sets for future instances. The precedent has been set and you didn't even blink.

 

 

I get the impression that you are like a 20 year old idealogue that has a harsh reality awaiting him. I'll offer you some advice... the world is not the bright and rosy and let's all get along and hold hands place that you think it is. I thought that too when I was young. The laws were enacted 10 years ago and to date they haven't been taken advantage of when it comes to real American citizens that don't plot to fly planes into skyscrapers. We have much bigger concerns about a nanny state and such.... killing terrorists is not one of them.

[Voltaire 5,429]

 

Btw, Obama's Classified Assassination List reportedly contains "dozens" of American Citizens living abroad.

 

Another list I didn't make.

 

Wasn't anybody reading all those death threats I sent to George W. Bush five times every day for eight years? They must be in a pile next to Forrest Gump's war letters to Jenny.

[Mike Honcho 5,386]

I'm consistant about the Constitution.

 

HTH.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37OWL7AzvHo&feature=related

[Strike 5,917]

Another list I didn't make.

 

Wasn't anybody reading all those death threats I sent to George W. Bush five times every day for eight years? They must be in a pile next to Forrest Gump's war letters to Jenny.

 

How do you know you're not on the list? You won't know until the drone is about to hit you in the Ass.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

I just lost about 20 IQ points watching that video.

Impossible. That would put you in negative numbers.

[MedStudent 56]

Nope. You would find I supported it.

 

You would also find that it's Constitutionslity was challenged and it was upheld.

 

Next?

 

You would find out that the Patriot act was constitutionally challenged and parts were found to be unconstitutional:

 

Two provisions of the USA Patriot Act are unconstitutional because they allow search warrants to be issued without a showing of probable cause, a federal judge ruled Wednesday. U.S. District Judge Ann Aiken ruled that the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, as amended by the Patriot Act, "now permits the executive branch of government to conduct surveillance and searches of American citizens without satisfying the probable cause requirements of the Fourth Amendment."

 

Portland attorney Brandon Mayfield sought the ruling in a lawsuit against the federal government after he was mistakenly linked by the FBI to the Madrid train bombings that killed 191 people in 2004.

 

The federal government apologized and settled part of the lawsuit for $2 million after admitting a fingerprint was misread. But as part of the settlement, Mayfield retained the right to challenge parts of the Patriot Act, which greatly expanded the authority of law enforcers to investigate suspected acts of terrorism.

 

 

I agree with you that the US Government is wrong to kill its citizens without due process. But I was just pointing out your hypocrisy. The Patriot Act was the beginning of the Government overreaching. Its disapointing that Obama continued the trend started by the Bush administration. Both administrations were wrong.

[Recliner Pilot 61]

You would find out that the Patriot act was constitutionally challenged and parts were found to be unconstitutional:

 

 

 

I agree with you that the US Government is wrong to kill its citizens without due process. But I was just pointing out your hypocrisy. The Patriot Act was the beginning of the Government overreaching. Its disapointing that Obama continued the trend started by the Bush administration. Both administrations were wrong.

 

yes, parts of the PA were found unconstitutional. The vast majority of it held up. In that instance the system worked.

 

This blatant overeach needs to be challenged, or there is no turning back. IMO, giving any administration the ability to determine they can kill American citizens because they deem them a threat is giving them a blank check to corruption.

[jerryskids 6,998]

RP and Strike are card carrying members of the ACLU ... it's amazing.

 

Sometimes I'm glad the ACLU is there to look at things- because sometimes they actually raise a good point. But it's high profile cases such as this that make them too embarrassing to be around.

 

I actually like the "cleanness" of the ACLU's position on things -- they put a stake in the ground on civil liberties from a purely ideological perspective, and you have the opportunity to weigh your own position against it and see where you fall on the spectrum. I'm not saying you disagree; in fact I think you would agree.

 

While I see the "slippery slope" concerns of Elistan and others, I'm inclined to support the killing. The issue IMO is the muddiness of the definition of "war" in today's terrorist environment. To use an analogy, say that during WWII, a US citizen defected to Nazi Germany and led a significant battalion. If military intelligence located him and he was killed, that killing would be lauded. I see these recent actions as similar.

 

If instead the government started killing people who merely voiced disapproval, as at Kent State during Vietnam, then we have a problem.

 

It is a great thing for our country that groups like the ACLU constantly challenge such actions, because it makes us closely analyze them, and in doing so avoid the slipper slope. It does not however mean every single one is wrong.

[NewbieJr 541]

yes, parts of the PA were found unconstitutional.

Hmmm. That's funny. I don't seem to recall you being livid about the Bush administration when he was proposing these unconstitutional parts.

 

Maybe if you'd try just an ounce of consistancy, someone would take you seriously around here instead of considering you the biggest joke on the board. itsatip

[GobbleDog 1,009]

Obviously they wouldn't assassinate him if he was in the US, or any where he could be arrested. Apparently he was killed in "Northern Yemen" which I guess is considered a war zone and makes it ok?

 

 

So what's the law on this? Once a US citizen has been declared a terrorist (by who knows), they can be legally killed by order of the President?

[nikki2200 4]

How do you know you're not on the list? You won't know until the drone is about to hit you in the Ass.

 

 

Seriously?

[Saint Elistan 106]

So what's the law on this? Once a US citizen has been declared a terrorist (by who knows), they can be legally killed by order of the President?

 

That's the just of it. People defend it because of the target, but that's how this stuff usually works. "The People" are too busy celebrating to notice their securities slipping away.

[Strike 5,917]

Seriously?

 

Are you aware of how many innocent people are on the no fly lists in this country? Even congresspeople have been erroneously added to those lists.

[Strike 5,917]

America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.

— Abraham Lincoln