Doug Martin vs Thomas Rawls How close are they?

[ouradu 0]

I'm torn on the values of Doug Martin and Thomas Rawls. Martin's 4 years have been up then down then back up. Rawls has the injury issue and christine michael hype, but he has a lot of potential. Doug Martin is the consensus pick between the two, but is he clearly the better pick? What do you think about these two? Is it crazy to take Rawls over Martin, or is Martin hands down a better pick?

[Kent 228]

I had Rawls last year and he carried my struggling team until he snapped his leg off. Martin may be great or pull another disappearing act. He scares me.

[Crystal Meth Tweekers 26]

I have had Martin. He's so inconsistent I don't want him on my team. He seems to get all his yards in chunks. I know his rookie year it was all in 3-4 games. He was so weak to start last year I actaully cut him on one team.

[Maulers1973 117]

What I like about Martin is that his OC became the HC. So, his QB and offensive system are the same as last year. I expect similar productivity so long as he stays healthy.

[giraldi02 470]

Doug Martin and it's not even close to me

[cousinal111 57]

I like Rawls...he's hungry. Martin just got paid.

[Kent 228]

Doug Martin and it's not even close to me

Watch some tape of Rawls and it will get real close.

[tanatastic 2,061]

Watch some tape of Rawls and it will get real close.

I said to myself last year after watching Rawls, "If lynch doesnt come back, Rawls is a 1st rounder.".

[weepaws 2,460]

Rawls would be the pick .

[Matt Mueller 146]

I think Rawls has more upside and downside.

[Matt Mueller 146]

I'm a decent fan of going 'team RB' if possible. I think both teams have pretty good offenses and capable backups to plug in.

 

I wouldn't mind nabbing Martin-Sims, Rawls-Michael (insert other SEA RB if you like)

[weepaws 2,460]

Like the combo of Rawls - Sims.

[TBayXXXVII 2,117]

Martin hands down.

 

Martin was hurt in those 2 years, last year he was healthy and with the current situation in Tampa improving, last year is most likely the norm for Martin. Will he get 1400 yards again? Maybe not... it may be 1200, 1250, or 1300... but he'll most likely get 10 TD's from a more improved offense. Lastly, there is no timeshare or a threat of one. He is the one and only workhorse in Tampa.

 

Rawls is coming off a season ending injury and Seattle just spent a lot of resources (draft picks/free agency), on deepening their stable of backs. Whether Rawls is in a timeshare or not, even though Seattle money spent says there will be, a slip here or there could mean him losing his job. Not in a sense where he fumbles and never plays again... but what if he gets dinged and misses a game and the next guy up rushes for 140 yards the next game? You can all but guarantee there'll be a timeshare then. That possibility doesn't exist in Tampa.

 

Another thing to consider is that Martin has had 2 full 16-game seasons where he's rushed for over 1400 yards, so it's not like last year was a fluke. Rawls has only 800 in his career and got hurt when he finally starter getting the heavy workload. The odds of hitting with Martin are much greater than they are with Rawls. ADP's seem to have Martin at the end of the 3rd and Rawls in the early 4th. I say, take them both.

[Squintz82 45]

Neither

[tanatastic 2,061]

Both

[Ray_T 591]

I think Rawls has more upside and downside.

This.

 

very true.

 

The value of both players is reasonably comparable. While I prefer Martin because he's not coming off an injury, Rawls certainly has some good potential himself.

[ouradu 0]

So, I'm in the situation of deciding to keep Rawls or Martin, without all the details Martin would cost me slightly, not a lot, but slightly more. It is a 1/2 ppr league. I'm torn between which to keep. Since Martin costs me more, I lean Rawls, but I might just be overhyping him just to convince myself to go with the "cheaper" guy.

[Ray_T 591]

So, I'm in the situation of deciding to keep Rawls or Martin, without all the details Martin would cost me slightly, not a lot, but slightly more. It is a 1/2 ppr league. I'm torn between which to keep. Since Martin costs me more, I lean Rawls, but I might just be overhyping him just to convince myself to go with the "cheaper" guy.

Well, Martin has more of a track record. Rawls has only started a handful of games before he got hurt.

 

the questions around Rawls is:

 

can he make it through a season without getting hurt?

will he perform at the same level as he did for that small sample size of games in which he played?

 

and now that Seattle has drafted not one, but two new RB's the question is 'can he keep the dogs at bay?'

 

Martin is not without risk either.

 

There is a young player trying to become the starter there too but I think his job is more secure than that of Rawls.

I think his track record is better (longer for sure)

 

the Rawls advantage is that he is playing for a team that often has the lead. This usually means more late game carries. There is something to be said for that.

 

My preference is for Martin.

 

also worth Noting, Tampa is not a winning team, but that could change this year or next. If tampa becomes a winning team, Martin is the overwhelming favourite in this race as he will also get late game carries to protect the lead.

 

This is why I pick Martin.

[weepaws 2,460]

Will the Seahawks are a winning team , and if healthy they will lean on Rawls to control the game .

 

And or to protect a lead , which I would think they will be doing more often than the Bucs will be doing

[Ray_T 591]

Will the Seahawks are a winning team , and if healthy they will lean on Rawls to control the game .

 

And or to protect a lead , which I would think they will be doing more often than the Bucs will be doing

I agree. this was one of the advantages of picking him (listed in my post)

 

I said IF the Bucs become a winning team this year, Martin is the clear selection. If they dont, it will be close.

[BobSanders_33 127]

It is a tough one but I'd go with Martin. I had Rawls last year and he was a BEAST but we don't know if he will be back 100% or if he is fragile. Seattle also picked up a few backs and there is always the chance that C-MIKE earns some carries. Part of what made Rawls so great last year is that he was the only man left standing and got all the work.

 

I like that Martin is on an up and coming offense. I think Winston could be on an elite QB career arch. The OL is young and should get better. Dirk Koeter is a good offensive coach. During his 5 years as OC with the Jags they were 3rd in the NFL during that time frame. If you look at Martin's numbers last year he had 4 100+ yard games but was close to having 3 or 4 more.

[jimaveli 119]

If Douglas is in shape again, give me Martin. I'll want to see it in action again. Ie: last preseason, he looked FAST and he was serious about not getting tackled. And I was all over it. And as a 5th or 6th rounder, it was an autodraft for me.

 

I love the idea of what Rawls could be and generally favor Seattle's offense to Tampa, but Rawls had ligament stuff with his broken ankle. There's no law that says he's back at the full 2015 neo-Beast Mode level he operated at. I don't love that he's not clearly back and ready right now. The risk of him not being the same is very real.

 

And I get it. Doug is scary because he's up and down AND Simms eats into his cheap/stabilizing production (3rd and long dump-offs, 3rd down passes in general), but Doug as a 2nd rb is $ if you pair him with a more stable weekly guy even if he's 'boring' aka Jonathan Stewart. A healthy Doug is gonna blow up for a month sometime in October/November and win you 2-4 weeks by himself. Draft that.

[Kent 228]

If Douglas is in shape again, give me Martin. I'll want to see it in action again. Ie: last preseason, he looked FAST and he was serious about not getting tackled. And I was all over it. And as a 5th or 6th rounder, it was an autodraft for me.

 

I love the idea of what Rawls could be and generally favor Seattle's offense to Tampa, but Rawls had ligament stuff with his broken ankle. There's no law that says he's back at the full 2015 neo-Beast Mode level he operated at. I don't love that he's not clearly back and ready right now. The risk of him not being the same is very real.

 

And I get it. Doug is scary because he's up and down AND Simms eats into his cheap/stabilizing production (3rd and long dump-offs, 3rd down passes in general), but Doug as a 2nd rb is $ if you pair him with a more stable weekly guy even if he's 'boring' aka Jonathan Stewart. A healthy Doug is gonna blow up for a month sometime in October/November and win you 2-4 weeks by himself. Draft that.

Rawls carried me for a month. He made defenses look like garbage.

[desertfire 4]

I like Rawls...he's hungry. Martin just got paid.

Do not overlook that statement. You are absolutely right. Seen it a thousand times, guys have one great year, get paid then they preserve themselves.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

Martin hands down.

 

Martin was hurt in those 2 years, last year he was healthy and with the current situation in Tampa improving, last year is most likely the norm for Martin. Will he get 1400 yards again? Maybe not... it may be 1200, 1250, or 1300... but he'll most likely get 10 TD's from a more improved offense. Lastly, there is no timeshare or a threat of one. He is the one and only workhorse in Tampa.

 

Rawls is coming off a season ending injury and Seattle just spent a lot of resources (draft picks/free agency), on deepening their stable of backs. Whether Rawls is in a timeshare or not, even though Seattle money spent says there will be, a slip here or there could mean him losing his job. Not in a sense where he fumbles and never plays again... but what if he gets dinged and misses a game and the next guy up rushes for 140 yards the next game? You can all but guarantee there'll be a timeshare then. That possibility doesn't exist in Tampa.

 

Another thing to consider is that Martin has had 2 full 16-game seasons where he's rushed for over 1400 yards, so it's not like last year was a fluke. Rawls has only 800 in his career and got hurt when he finally starter getting the heavy workload. The odds of hitting with Martin are much greater than they are with Rawls. ADP's seem to have Martin at the end of the 3rd and Rawls in the early 4th. I say, take them both.

Can you pump Tampa players any harder...in every thread. I understand you are a fan, but the Homer is strong with this one.

 

You say no chance of time share? You don't think Sims is going to play a role in that offense? I'd be shocked if he isn't getting consistent touches each week. He was over 1000 AP yds last year.

[tanatastic 2,061]

If I hesitate on Rawls that means CMike nation has won. Can't let that happen. I'm rolling the dice on Rawls as a backend RB1. Martin as well but he just got paid and Sims got wayyyy more work than I was comfortable with last year.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

If I hesitate on Rawls that means CMike nation has won. Can't let that happen. I'm rolling the dice on Rawls as a backend RB1. Martin as well but he just got paid and Sims got wayyyy more work than I was comfortable with last year.

Rawls will be great if anything happens to Michael. Until then it's a rbbc with two talented guys. Cmike has my vote as the better rb if he has his head on straight.

[Mr Neil 63]

Like the combo of Rawls - Sims.

I have that combo in keeper league as an 8th and 11th rounder and loving it

[Mr Neil 63]

Rawls will be great if anything happens to Michael. Until then it's a rbbc with two talented guys. Cmike has my vote as the better rb if he has his head on straight.

Every year the Michel hype train is full steam and nothing. Literally nothing has this guy produced

[Kent 228]

Every year the Michel hype train is full steam and nothing. Literally nothing has this guy produced

Plus, didn't Seattle cut him last year? Michael never works out.

[himmystyles 29]

Also seeing CJ Anderson available around this spot (end of 3rd). In PPR, would anyone consider him over both Rawls and Martin?

[Kent 228]

Also seeing CJ Anderson available around this spot (end of 3rd). In PPR, would anyone consider him over both Rawls and Martin?

I had Anderson last year too. Never again. If he gets slightly injured he's totally ineffective. They also have no problem making him a number two when Hillman or another back gets hot. That's what people may be overlooking with CJ. They have no problem demoting him. And he had no problem with it. Weird.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Every year the Michel hype train is full steam and nothing. Literally nothing has this guy produced

All I can react to is what I see. I see an insanely talented running back who has reportedly matured. It wasn't just a guy running through massive holes fooling people. He was cutting, reading the defense and running with purpose.

 

Good example is Charcandrick west running through a massive hole for 25 yards. While Ware did some serious work it looks on the surface like they both had equal success.

[Kent 228]

All I can react to is what I see. I see an insanely talented running back who has reportedly matured. It wasn't just a guy running through massive holes fooling people. He was cutting, reading the defense and running with purpose.

 

Good example is Charcandrick west running through a massive hole for 25 yards. While Ware did some serious work it looks on the surface like they both had equal success.

You can react to more than what you see. Preseason vanilla offenses are different than when he has to play a real game and the scheme gets more complicated. Word is he is the dumbest guy in the NFL. He misses all kinds of assignments and gets the hook. He's not reliable. We don't need to see that to know that.

[TBayXXXVII 2,117]

Can you pump Tampa players any harder...in every thread. I understand you are a fan, but the Homer is strong with this one.

 

You say no chance of time share? You don't think Sims is going to play a role in that offense? I'd be shocked if he isn't getting consistent touches each week. He was over 1000 AP yds last year.

 

I'm not a homer at all. I'm simply stating that people are foolishly overlooking them. I never said Winston, Evans, or Martin should be taken in the first round. I never said any would finish #1 at their positions. Outside of Winston, I never said that either Evans or Martin would even finish in the top 10. Now, I do think Martin will finish in the top 10... but considering that he finished in the top 5 last year, I hardly think that qualifies me as a homer on that front.

 

No, there is absolutely "NO" timeshare whatsoever. I say that because I know my team better than you and possibly others. Charles Sims was drafted and brought in for 1 reason, and 1 reason only... to be a receiving option out of the backfield, and NOT to take a legitimate workload of the rushing attack. Sims will get 5 to 10 carries a game (pending the circumstances)... Martin, about 20 and virtually all of the goal line attempts. Last year, Martin had 21 attempts inside the 10, Sims... 3. Tampa will try to run the ball about 350-400 times. I'll split the difference and say Martin will get about 300, Sims about 75.

 

I would be shocked if Sims didn't get a consistent workload as well, but one guy getting about 20 carries every week and the other getting about 5 isn't exactly what I call a time share. Sims' biggest contribution will be in the receiving game. I can see him having another 1000 AP season as well, but the bulk of that will be from receiving. Martin and Tampa proved last year (and 4 years ago), that Martin can run for over 1400 yards in a season. He also showed that he can catch passes. So, while Sims' major role will be pass catching, Martin will get his share as well.

 

In the end, Martin will probably replicate what he did last year... Sims too. There's absolutely no evidence that Rawls could replicate what he did in 8 games and extrapolate that through 16. Martin had a year like last year, twice now. As I said in my initial post, I'd still try to take both, but if I could take only 1, I'm taking Martin.

 

On a football note... last year, Tampa finished 5th in the NFL in yards... in the 2 subsequent seasons, they were 32nd and 30th. Clearly, the addition of Koetter and Winston were a big reason for that. Their offense should be more consistent this year, so while they may not finish much higher than 5th, they'll probably score more yards. To note, they finished 20th in scoring. That's where the bigger improvement will be. They have the talent to be in the top 10. If they are both in the top 5-10 in both categories, it's not unreasonable to think that all 3, Winston, Martin, and Evans could finish in the top 5 to 10 of their positions. That's not even a homer point of view, that's a rational one.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

 

I'm not a homer at all. I'm simply stating that people are foolishly overlooking them. I never said Winston, Evans, or Martin should be taken in the first round. I never said any would finish #1 at their positions. Outside of Winston, I never said that either Evans or Martin would even finish in the top 10. Now, I do think Martin will finish in the top 10... but considering that he finished in the top 5 last year, I hardly think that qualifies me as a homer on that front.

 

No, there is absolutely "NO" timeshare whatsoever. I say that because I know my team better than you and possibly others. Charles Sims was drafted and brought in for 1 reason, and 1 reason only... to be a receiving option out of the backfield, and NOT to take a legitimate workload of the rushing attack. Sims will get 5 to 10 carries a game (pending the circumstances)... Martin, about 20 and virtually all of the goal line attempts. Last year, Martin had 21 attempts inside the 10, Sims... 3. Tampa will try to run the ball about 350-400 times. I'll split the difference and say Martin will get about 300, Sims about 75.

 

I would be shocked if Sims didn't get a consistent workload as well, but one guy getting about 20 carries every week and the other getting about 5 isn't exactly what I call a time share. Sims' biggest contribution will be in the receiving game. I can see him having another 1000 AP season as well, but the bulk of that will be from receiving. Martin and Tampa proved last year (and 4 years ago), that Martin can run for over 1400 yards in a season. He also showed that he can catch passes. So, while Sims' major role will be pass catching, Martin will get his share as well.

 

In the end, Martin will probably replicate what he did last year... Sims too. There's absolutely no evidence that Rawls could replicate what he did in 8 games and extrapolate that through 16. Martin had a year like last year, twice now. As I said in my initial post, I'd still try to take both, but if I could take only 1, I'm taking Martin.

 

On a football note... last year, Tampa finished 5th in the NFL in yards... in the 2 subsequent seasons, they were 32nd and 30th. Clearly, the addition of Koetter and Winston were a big reason for that. Their offense should be more consistent this year, so while they may not finish much higher than 5th, they'll probably score more yards. To note, they finished 20th in scoring. That's where the bigger improvement will be. They have the talent to be in the top 10. If they are both in the top 5-10 in both categories, it's not unreasonable to think that all 3, Winston, Martin, and Evans could finish in the top 5 to 10 of their positions. That's not even a homer point of view, that's a rational one.

Martin averaged 20 touches a game. Sims averaged 10 touches a game. With no change that's a timeshare/role specific situation. I understand what you are saying, but Sims looked good last year and had success in his role. My point was that your original statement painting Martin as completely safe is likely just as safe as the role Rawls has in Seattle with his offense.

 

Touches are touches, and frankly receptions are generally more productive so I'm not sure why that is minimized in your assessment. I don't think we are disagreeing and I prefer Martin to Rawls in this discussion but Sims is and will be a factor going forward.

[Ray_T 591]

If I hesitate on Rawls that means CMike nation has won. Can't let that happen. I'm rolling the dice on Rawls as a backend RB1. Martin as well but he just got paid and Sims got wayyyy more work than I was comfortable with last year.

not necessarily. Seattle drafted two players in this years draft.

 

If Rawls cant play it is not a given that CMike will start all year.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

not necessarily. Seattle drafted two players in this years draft.

 

If Rawls cant play it is not a given that CMike will start all year.

Idk. They would be giving up a ton of talent at RB to start some rookies. I just don't get the point of drafting 3 rbs. Alex Collins is not on CMike level as far as athleticism. Prosise isn't an inside runner like cmike.

[weepaws 2,460]

Sims is used to much for me to pick Martin over Rawls .

 

Martin only scored a total of 7 tds last season and Rawls in limited work scored a total of 5 tds

 

Rawls can be a guy that will score 10 plus tds this season I'm taking him over Martin .

[stonewall 647]

Doug Martin vs Thomas Rawls How close are they?

 

Well, they get along fine, but they certainly aren't BFF's or anything.