Another school shooting. Houston

[Gladiators 1,904]

Yes. Btw, is your safe bolted to the floor joist?

Mine is anchored to the concrete floor.

[Alias Detective 1,179]

Mine is anchored to the concrete floor.

Great. I bet 95% aren't bolted to .

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

Access control. Inner city schools don't seem to have these problems, and there are plenty of guns in those neighborhoods. Who and where people enter those schools is controlled.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

Access control. Inner city schools don't seem to have these problems, and there are plenty of guns in those neighborhoods. Who and where people enter those schools is controlled.

Here is a bill Id like to see. A massive appropriation to hire security guards, install metal detectors, and other appropriate training and access control measures at every school, shopping mall, movie theatre, and concert venue in America.

 

It will be funded by a commensurately massive tax on guns, ammo, gun licenses of any kind, shooting range fees, etc.

 

Its your fault we need it. You pay for it.

 

Other countries do have this by the way. Every public school in china has at least two security guards on duty 24/7.

 

Every shopping mall in the Philippines has a metal detector and guards armed with shotguns.

 

Of course, those people cost less.

[wiffleball 4,642]

Yeah, works for me.

 

However bear in mind a couple things.

 

Sandy Hook had all the latest gizmos and was severely access-controlled. Until the shooter Shot Through the Glass next to the door and got in that way.

 

The biggest problem with something like you proposed above? And you see this a lot especially in the Middle East. Okay great, now people are queuing up outside to wait to get into the movie theater. Fantastic Target for a shooter or a bomber. In fact, that was the most common way to kill people in Iraq. The cops and other potential job Seekers would line up waiting to apply for a job and get blowed the hell up while they were lined up.

 

So, point being, not trashing your idea. Just saying that nothing's perfect. Israel is locked down tighter than pretty much any place on the earth and people continue to be shot up and blowed up despite that.

[naomi 343]

Access control. Inner city schools don't seem to have these problems, and there are plenty of guns in those neighborhoods. Who and where people enter those schools is controlled.

 

I think the experience of being an inner city student breeds this less. Different mindset, maybe they don't hold onto tension and let it simmer in the same manner because their daily challenges are different..that environment just doesn't incubate school shooter sociopaths as much.

[wiffleball 4,642]

Access control. Inner city schools don't seem to have these problems, and there are plenty of guns in those neighborhoods. Who and where people enter those schools is controlled.

Yeah, but you got to bear in mind that for every inner-city school, there's some white person who's willing to put on a leather jacket and go and Inspire these young geniuses.

 

Sure, at first you don't fit in. And then they make a little progress, and then somebody trashes their car. And then they get discouraged and they're just about to quit, but then all the kids in the class show up and sing Light rap songs to them. And the next thing you know there's a montage and pretty soon everybody's going to college and thanking that white person who turned out to be aaight.

 

You never see that in The Burbs.

 

like just once, Tracy Morgan would come in from the inner city, put on some khakis and let the students teach him Dave Matthews songs.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

 

I think the experience of being an inner city student somehow breeds this kind of stuff less. Different mindset, maybe they don't hold onto tension and let it simmer in the same manner because their daily challenges are different. There's no doubt strong negatives and danger inner city kids deal with, but I don't see that environment being incubator material for these school shooter sociopaths.

I agree with that. If I had to simplify it, I don't think a huge deal is made if a couple of kids get into a scuffle in the inner city, whereas if it happens in a suburban school, parents are called, suspension, the whole nine. Even if a kid is being bullied and he stands up for himself, he's going to get in trouble, even if he's in the right. Administrators are afraid to call out

the agressor, so they punish the victim as well. Suppression of rage results. Plus the psych drugs half these kids are on.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

Yeah, works for me.

 

However bear in mind a couple things.

 

Sandy Hook had all the latest gizmos and was severely access-controlled. Until the shooter Shot Through the Glass next to the door and got in that way.

 

The biggest problem with something like you proposed above? And you see this a lot especially in the Middle East. Okay great, now people are queuing up outside to wait to get into the movie theater. Fantastic Target for a shooter or a bomber. In fact, that was the most common way to kill people in Iraq. The cops and other potential job Seekers would line up waiting to apply for a job and get blowed the hell up while they were lined up.

 

So, point being, not trashing your idea. Just saying that nothing's perfect. Israel is locked down tighter than pretty much any place on the earth and people continue to be shot up and blowed up despite that.

Oh I completely agree. I think it is of much less utility than getting rid of the damn guns in the first place.

[naomi 343]

I agree with that. If I had to simplify it, I don't think a huge deal is made if a couple of kids get into a scuffle in the inner city, whereas if it happens in a suburban school, parents are called, suspension, the whole nine. Even if a kid is being bullied and he stands up for himself, he's going to get in trouble, even if he's in the right. Administrators are afraid to call out

the agressor, so they punish the victim as well. Suppression of rage results. Plus the psych drugs half these kids are on.

 

In my experience, and I checked this with someone in my same graduating class the other day, the culture at schools has changed in a progressive (didn't use that word with her) manner where there's a sense of virtuosity in super-catering to kids. It gets to be really tricky business when you have totally different socioeconomic worlds within one school's student population. But we both compared notes about how kids go and see counselors far far more, and the general feel is that sensitivity reigns supreme. I think our culture sort of power-of-suggests a lot of things to kids, makes them navel gaze, and makes them get inordinately wrapped up in what their identity is. Perhaps this is more a CA thing, but it seems to make sense out of the larger picture too. The complexes these school shooters, and others who express their issues in different ways, have is something that wouldn't have been fostered 30 years ago. Social media, everyone's increased selfishness, and I still think (pen and I explored this one a bit), yes, psych drugs come up far too much to not suspect it's part of the picture.

[wiffleball 4,642]

Yeah, one of the things that's her to flabbergast me is that back in my day, the last thing you want to be was different.

 

Now, apparently it's more of a survival skill. You've got to be a freak just so you're part of the group so you're protected. And so basically normalcy is discouraged. It doesn't receive the attention that others do. Very weird.

[naomi 343]

The breakdown of families made it so schools with hundreds, or thousands, of kids at them, have to parent more than educators used to need to. But of course the style of parenting has to be politically correct, so you have this weird situation where you're trying to contain what should be taken care of by better rearing. So the challenge is greater than it used to be, plus you're set up to be ineffective.

 

If a site doesn't have a homogeneous population, there can be all manner of problems under the sun on the burner at once. Student pop. diversity is great in some ways, I enjoy it, but again, if our families weren't as shot as they are, that would help a ton.

[tanatastic 2,061]

 

I dont remember the last time I heard of a killing in the name of Jesus

Im talking all time, like the crusades and stuff. Modern times its Allah with all the blood on his hands. All time, dont think anyone tops the J man.

 

My point was throughout history, religion has always been a source of killing...and molesting, fraud, brainwashing, its basically the worst thing ever imo.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

Im talking all time, like the crusades and stuff. Modern times its Allah with all the blood on his hands. All time, dont think anyone tops the J man.

 

My point was throughout history, religion has always been a source of killing...and molesting, fraud, brainwashing, its basically the worst thing ever imo.

So the Crudades were all the Christian's fault? Ok. Any other mass murders you want to blame on them? Did Genghis Khan say three Hail Mary's after battle? How about Stalin?

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

So the Crudades were all the Christian's fault? Ok. Any other mass murders you want to blame on them? Did Genghis Khan say three Hail Mary's after battle? How about Stalin?

The crusades pretty much yeah.

 

You can add the Spanish genocide in the new world to that too.

[naomi 343]

Something I heard recently..the crusades were known at the time, and for many, many eon later, to be political (pragmatic is probably a better word) first and foremost. The evolution of the papacy and sacralism in society (which faded in and out somewhat, over long expanses of time) gives people now the suggestion it was an holy war. I'm not pro-Catholic, so I don't tend to let the RC Church off the hook on fronts, so this was an interesting thought.

 

It's apparently a fairly modern notion, one that Islamists themselves hit out against for a while, until seeing an advantage in it, that the crusades were a theistic struggle.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

The crusades pretty much yeah.

 

You can add the Spanish genocide in the new world to that too.

Educate me. I must be reading the wrong stuff. That whole two wrongs not making it right stuff, two to tango and all that.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

Meanwhile the Romans and Greeks were on a worldwide killing spree well before JC came on the scene.

[tanatastic 2,061]

What the hell are you guys doing up at 4am? Titans ok, China is on who knows what time. But HT, whats up?

[wiffleball 4,642]

Well hell, if we're going to go there. I would bet that nobody knows this on this board except me.

 

Buddhists of all folks are engaging in violent cleansing against mostly muslim Rohinga.

 

I had no idea Buddhists were such a holes.

 

Man, when Buddhists hate you, you're doing something wrong.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

Something I heard recently..the crusades were known at the time, and for many, many eon later, to be political (pragmatic is probably a better word) first and foremost. The evolution of the papacy and sacralism in society (which faded in and out somewhat, over long expanses of time) gives people now the suggestion it was an holy war. I'm not pro-Catholic, so I don't tend to let the RC Church off the hook on fronts, so this was an interesting thought.

 

It's apparently a fairly modern notion, one that Islamists themselves hit out against for a while, until seeing an advantage in it, that the crusades were a theistic struggle.

Of course it was political. Religion always is.

 

But the pope clearly called for holy war and promised absolution.

[wiffleball 4,642]

And, I don't know whose selling that Cusades crap.

 

Go to Southern Spain. The Spanish built their castles right on top of giant Mosques.

 

Sure, there may have been geopolitical aspects to this, but don't let any body fool you into thinking that the Crusades weren't about religion as well. Especially back then, the two went hand-in-hand.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

What the hell are you guys doing up at 4am? Titans ok, China is on who knows what time. But HT, whats up?

I work midnights now

[wiffleball 4,642]

https://goo.gl/images/X9Xfvy

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

And, I don't know whose selling that Cusades crap.

 

Go to Southern Spain. The Spanish built their castles right on top of giant Mosques.

 

Sure, there may have been geopolitical aspects to this, but don't let any body fool you into thinking that the Crusades weren't about religion as well. Especially back then, the two went hand-in-hand.

Exactly. The church was the state. Everyone in power back then was in a constant state of attack or defense, regardless if religion was involved. And justifying anything, or condemning anyone around today based on what happened before running water was invented is kinda simple. The Muslims still do it. Who wants to emulate them?

[naomi 343]

I'll look into it more. The idea is there was not a base motivation of defeating the enemy because of religious ideology. That was a tool but not where the motivation sprung from. Apparently to the extent that it wasn't even until modern times that the holy war narrative was the lense it was approached from.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

The Incas were doing mass human sacrifice just 600 years ago. Is there even a plaque at Machu Piccu? I don't know why white people let their forefathers, and only their forefathers, be painted with the oppression and massacre and slavery brush, when everyone was doing it. Fock that. I point it out every chance I get.

[wiffleball 4,642]

Well hell, before 9/11 was culturally co-opted, it was a big thing for Mormons.

 

They got their slaughter on.

 

Google Mountain Shadows Massacre.

 

Hell, it's not like they can blame it on having too much caffeine.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

I'll look into it more. The idea is there was not a base motivation of defeating the enemy because of religious ideology. That was a tool but not where the motivation sprung from. Apparently to the extent that it wasn't even until modern times that the holy war narrative was the lense it was approached from.

Not true. The pope expressly called for holy war. Anyone who took up the cross received absolution, as well as pardon from civil crimes. It was absolutely a holy war to retrieve the holy land from the infidel.

 

Now in the case of Christianity, that required some creative doctrinal interpretation. The concept of a holy warrior was pretty much the opposite of the teachings of Christ. Whereas in Islam, its laid right out there in the big book.

 

And sure, that was all over 1,000 years ago. So hardly relevant to todays discussion.

 

The bottom line is the rulers in the Muslim war use holy war because its one of the few tools they have at their disposal to project power. Whether they actually believe their own bullshit is questionable. I think the Iranian Mullahs largely do. Other rulers, less so I think. I think the house of saud would largely like to be rid of their religious leaders, but have little choice in the matter.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

The Incas were doing mass human sacrifice just 600 years ago. Is there even a plaque at Machu Piccu? I don't know why white people let their forefathers, and only their forefathers, be painted with the oppression and massacre and slavery brush, when everyone was doing it. Fock that. I point it out every chance I get.

One of my best friends is from Malaysia. Which was, of course, a British colony. Some people there hate the western imperialists. He says Fock that. Hes all about them.

 

He says in Asia, you can directly link the present day success of a state to which country was their imperial occupier.

 

Portuguese was the worst. Then Spanish. Then Dutch (Indonesia). French was next. And the best was the British and Americans (Philippines). He says to the degree that there is culture there, and good governance, it was learned from Britain.

 

Burma would be the exception. Myanmar hasnt gone well.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,653]

One of my best friends is from Malaysia. Which was, of course, a British colony. Some people there hate the western imperialists. He says Fock that. Hes all about them.

 

He says in Asia, you can directly link the present day success of a state to which country was their imperial occupier.

 

Portuguese was the worst. Then Spanish. Then Dutch (Indonesia). French was next. And the best was the British and Americans (Philippines). He says to the degree that there is culture there, and good governance, it was learned from Britain.

 

Burma would be the exception. Myanmar hasnt gone well.

I once read an article or something about how the more oppressed a people were, the more joyous and hopeful their music was. It was said that the people oppressed by the French in Africa had especially joyous music.

[wiffleball 4,642]

The Portuguese did fine with Brazil though.

[penultimatestraw 473]

Here is a bill Id like to see. A massive appropriation to hire security guards, install metal detectors, and other appropriate training and access control measures at every school, shopping mall, movie theatre, and concert venue in America.

 

It will be funded by a commensurately massive tax on guns, ammo, gun licenses of any kind, shooting range fees, etc.

 

Its your fault we need it. You pay for it.

 

Other countries do have this by the way. Every public school in china has at least two security guards on duty 24/7.

 

Every shopping mall in the Philippines has a metal detector and guards armed with shotguns.

 

Of course, those people cost less.

Great suggestion. If we must live in a gawd damn police state because people are so enamored with their killing toys, they should pay for the damage control.

[cyclone24 1,814]

Great suggestion. If we must live in a gawd damn police state because people are so enamored with their killing toys, they should pay for the damage control.

Agreed.

 

And I'm sure there's a very valid reason but why can't people who carry a gun also have to have insurance on it?

I mean I'm sure the argument is those who wouldn't qualify would just get one illegally but isn't that their whole argument to everything? That bad people will just do it anyway.

[wiffleball 4,642]

25 plus a license and insurance to rent a car, but...

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

Agreed.

 

And I'm sure there's a very valid reason but why can't people who carry a gun also have to have insurance on it?

I mean I'm sure the argument is those who wouldn't qualify would just get one illegally but isn't that their whole argument to everything? That bad people will just do it anyway.

I like it. Treat guns just like cars. Own as many as you like. But you register them. each one. Pay a tax on each one. Carry insurance for any harm they cause on each one.

[DuckStupid 40]

Well at least we all agree there are too many weapons

 

Yeah, and the phenomenon of school shootings was absent then. What changed to make them all too common now?

[drobeski 3,061]

Yeah, and the phenomenon of school shootings was absent then. What changed to make them all too common now?

breakdown of the family structure and early on forced medicating in lue of adolescents.

The true common denominators.

[jerryskids 5,206]

breakdown of the family structure and early on forced medicating in lue of adolescents.

The true common denominators.

 

Cmon man, you know we can't bring up broken families. Hell, we are supposed to celebrate those I think. Besides, how is a working single parent supposed to keep little Johnny in line if she can't drug him up. It can't be increased social media pressure mixed with a society which doesn't teach kids how to cope with adversary anymore.

 

All that leaves is these new gun thingies.

[cyclone24 1,814]

Yeah I don't know if it's single family homes or medications but somewhere kids can't cope with anything.

 

This kid apparently targeted a girl that he was pursuing that rejected him..so he shot her.

 

Why couldn't he just awkwardly go down completely different halls the rest of his life never making eye contact with Jenny the rest of his days...maybe in the hopes shed see my sorror and know I was sincere and should date me... I mean it's one focking date Jenny...Jesus focking Christ..I mean we grew up together and you won't spend 30 minutes getting a Subway sandwich with me you focking bittch?!!

 

Ya know....like a mature high schooler.