Critical Race Theory

[dogcows 1,030]

A summer school class about contributions of black people to the field of mathematics causes white parents to lose their minds. They’re just calling everything CRT now because they never knew what CRT was in the first place.

https://www.theroot.com/white-fragility-strikes-back-west-virginia-school-paus-1847260541

[Fireballer 2,642]

6 minutes ago, dogcows said:

A summer school class about contributions of black people to the field of mathematics causes white parents to lose their minds. They’re just calling everything CRT now because they never knew what CRT was in the first place.

https://www.theroot.com/white-fragility-strikes-back-west-virginia-school-paus-1847260541

What a dumba$$ article.  The author says that one reason the people are taking it is because of only 25% proficiency by black students.  But, the class is advanced and is studying bitcoin and algorithms. 

[DonS 3,292]

But but but it's just anti-racism!  How can that be a bad thing?  Just like antifa stands for anti-fascism. To be against either is to actively embrace racism and fascism!!! 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

1 hour ago, dogcows said:

A summer school class about contributions of black people to the field of mathematics causes white parents to lose their minds. They’re just calling everything CRT now because they never knew what CRT was in the first place.

https://www.theroot.com/white-fragility-strikes-back-west-virginia-school-paus-1847260541

Yeah, that’s what it is. Nailed it. 

[dogcows 1,030]

6 hours ago, DonS said:

But but but it's just anti-racism!  How can that be a bad thing?  Just like antifa stands for anti-fascism. To be against either is to actively embrace racism and fascism!!! 

 

Clearly there are some jerkwads who dress up in black and commit violence in the name of Antifa. But I’m aware of no such group associated with anti-racism. Shouldn’t we all be against racism?

[jerryskids 6,797]

1 hour ago, dogcows said:

Clearly there are some jerkwads who dress up in black and commit violence in the name of Antifa. But I’m aware of no such group associated with anti-racism. Shouldn’t we all be against racism?

By the beard of Zeus, will you educate yourself?!  “Anti-racism” is not being against racism, that’s what the media tells sheeple like you.  Anti-racism is acknowledging that all of our systems are racist, and being an activist to change them.  If you are just “against racism,” you are a racist and need more, umm… education I guess.  The second definition below is the Kendi version being discussed, not whether we should be against racism.

Quote

antiracism

or anti-racism

[ an-tee-rey-siz-uhm, an-tahy‐ ]SHOW IPA

 

---

noun

a belief or doctrine that rejects the supremacy of one racial group over another and promotes racial equality in society.

a belief or practice that recognizes pervasive racism in society, and actively combats racial prejudice and discrimination in order to promote racial justice and equality: Most people are proud if they are not racist, but antiracism establishes a higher bar—what are you doing to dismantle racism?

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/antiracism

[Voltaire 5,316]

3 hours ago, dogcows said:

Clearly there are some jerkwads who dress up in black and commit violence in the name of Antifa. But I’m aware of no such group associated with anti-racism. Shouldn’t we all be against racism?

Dear God, this is ignorant. Anti-racism is Orwellian doublespeak. The opposite of anti-racist isn’t racist, it’s color blindness, equal access and equal opportunity. (Nearly) everyone is against racism EXCEPT the “anti-racists” themselves.

The anti-racists are the real racists and they acknowledged and embrace it. They’re mostly found in upper middle class uber-white liberal communities with lots of indoctrination left wing education, low self esteem, and low IQs. The only minorities they interact with are the ones who clean their house.  “I struggle with racism. I must learn to do better. I must acknowledge my white privilege. I must listen to the lived experience of minorities.” Thus, they rid themselves of guilt and sin and are free to condescend on other white people, who actually live in proximity to minorities, have minority friends, are colorblind, and treat minorities as equals.

[dogcows 1,030]

2 hours ago, jerryskids said:

By the beard of Zeus, will you educate yourself?!  “Anti-racism” is not being against racism, that’s what the media tells sheeple like you.  Anti-racism is acknowledging that all of our systems are racist, and being an activist to change them.  If you are just “against racism,” you are a racist and need more, umm… education I guess.  The second definition below is the Kendi version being discussed, not whether we should be against racism.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/antiracism

I’m not uneducated, especially on this topic. If we want to discuss the term itself, then let us.

You’ve listed 2 definitions. Do you see any problem with the first? I don’t think anybody should.

As for the second, IMHO only those who feel the system is flawless as it is would be offended by such a belief. If one doesn’t think that pervasive racism exists in America, perhaps they’ve never been black nor actually talked to black friends or neighbors about it. Driving while black is unquestionably a real thing. Banks are regularly cited for showing racial bias in lending. Hiring and promotion are affected by race too.

Here’s a very concrete example of a recent anti-racist action. The Army has always included pictures of soldiers in the promotion process. They recently finished a study where they ran promotion boards with pictures and without pictures of the soldiers. In the board with pictures, the black soldiers were selected for promotion at a lower rate than the board without pictures. So the Army took photos out of the promotion process for all ranks going forward. That is an anti-racist action by the definition above. They found actual racism in the system and rooted it out. Why would anybody have a problem with that?

So far, the people most concerned about anti-racism are racists and people who (IMHO) have been tricked into thinking it’s accusing all white people of being racist. It’s actually much more boring, and the example above is a perfect example of this.

[dogcows 1,030]

1 hour ago, Voltaire said:

Dear God, this is ignorant. Anti-racism is Orwellian doublespeak. The opposite of anti-racist isn’t racist, it’s color blindness, equal access and equal opportunity. (Nearly) everyone is against racism EXCEPT the “anti-racists” themselves.

The anti-racists are the real racists and they acknowledged and embrace it. They’re mostly found in upper middle class uber-white liberal communities with lots of indoctrination left wing education, low self esteem, and low IQs. The only minorities they interact with are the ones who clean their house.  “I struggle with racism. I must learn to do better. I must acknowledge my white privilege. I must listen to the lived experience of minorities.” Thus, they rid themselves of guilt and sin and are free to condescend on other white people, who actually live in proximity to minorities, have minority friends, are colorblind, and treat minorities as equals.

While there might be fake “woke” white people out there, that has nothing to do with anti-racism. @jerryskids posted the definition above, and I gave an example of the concept in action. I’m also very skeptical of anybody who claims to have minority friends and doesn’t seem to believe driving while black and other casual racism exist in our society.

[Voltaire 5,316]

25 minutes ago, dogcows said:

I’m not uneducated, especially on this topic. If we want to discuss the term itself, then let us.

You’ve listed 2 definitions. Do you see any problem with the first? I don’t think anybody should.

As for the second, IMHO only those who feel the system is flawless as it is would be offended by such a belief. If one doesn’t think that pervasive racism exists in America, perhaps they’ve never been black nor actually talked to black friends or neighbors about it. Driving while black is unquestionably a real thing. Banks are regularly cited for showing racial bias in lending. Hiring and promotion are affected by race too.

Here’s a very concrete example of a recent anti-racist action. The Army has always included pictures of soldiers in the promotion process. They recently finished a study where they ran promotion boards with pictures and without pictures of the soldiers. In the board with pictures, the black soldiers were selected for promotion at a lower rate than the board without pictures. So the Army took photos out of the promotion process for all ranks going forward. That is an anti-racist action by the definition above. They found actual racism in the system and rooted it out. Why would anybody have a problem with that?

So far, the people most concerned about anti-racism are racists and people who (IMHO) have been tricked into thinking it’s accusing all white people of being racist. It’s actually much more boring, and the example above is a perfect example of this.

This is not anti-racism. It's the opposite. Colorblindness and equal opportunity, which is what the true good guys on race advocate for, not the 'anti-racists.' 

I assure you, if the study found the opposite, if it were black soldiers being promoted at a higher rate than whites, then the 'anti-racists' would have no problem with this. That's why, when the imput criteria is different, say the prevalant discrimination against white and asian applicants to selective schools, the prioritization of covid vaccines to minorites, the targeting of farm relief loans to minority farmers, they advocate for anti-white/asian discriminaton.

Suggest taking the photos and racial identity out of college applications and see if the anti-racists like those ideas.

Your point about 'driving while black' may be releveant, although i've had plenty of bullsh*t tickets come my way over the years that defy logic or reality. If I were black, I'd be d@mn sure that was the reason for most all of my tickets.

[dogcows 1,030]

15 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

This is not anti-racism. It's the opposite. Colorblindness and equal opportunity, which is what the true good guys on race advocate for, not the 'anti-racists.' 

I assure you, if the study found the opposite, if it were black soldiers being promoted at a higher rate than whites, then the 'anti-racists' would have no problem with this. That's why, when the imput criteria is different, say the prevalant discrimination against white and asian applicants to selective schools, the prioritization of covid vaccines to minorites, the targeting of farm relief loans to minority farmers, they advocate for anti-white/asian discriminaton. Now systemic discrimination is real. Your point about 'driving while black' may be releveant, although i've had plenty of bullsh*t tickets come my way over the years that defy logic or reality.

Suggest taking the photos and racial identity out of college applications and see if the anti-racists like those ideas.

Are we going to discuss the definition of the term or your mischaracterization of it? And you are throwing hypotheticals vs what actually happened in the Army.

You seem to want the term “anti-racist” to apply to anybody that disagrees with you instead of taking it at its definition, which is clearly laid out in this thread with a very good example of it in real life given.

Now, if we want to discuss targeting relief towards people based on their race, that’s a different discussion, and it would be unfair to exclude the history of such things like black students not being allowed in white schools or black farmers not being eligible for government handouts in the past when having that discussion.

To me, the justification of affirmative action is simple. Imagine you have a class with equal number of boys and girls. Every day in class, you have enough cookies for half the class. On Monday thru Thursday, the teacher gives all the cookies to the boys. On Friday, she gives all the cookies to the girls. The boys then complain “that’s not fair, give them out equally, so half the boys get a cookie and half the girls get one!” They immediately forget about the previous 4 days where they got all the cookies and suddenly want everything to be equal. That’s what the complaining about affirmative action is like, IMHO.

[Fireballer 2,642]

I guess slavery and Jim Crowe forced Ontario  into this woke curriculum.  

 

[Alias Detective 1,400]

Asians are in on this now

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/07/09/illinois-mandates-asian-american-history-public-schools-teaach-act/7472690002/

 

[5-Points 3,528]

10 hours ago, dogcows said:

To me, the justification of affirmative action is simple. Imagine you have a class with equal number of boys and girls. Every day in class, you have enough cookies for half the class. On Monday thru Thursday, the teacher gives all the cookies to the boys. On Friday, she gives all the cookies to the girls. The boys then complain “that’s not fair, give them out equally, so half the boys get a cookie and half the girls get one!” They immediately forget about the previous 4 days where they got all the cookies and suddenly want everything to be equal. That’s what the complaining about affirmative action is like, IMHO.

Your analogy stinks. Just say you think we had policies in our past that resulted in unfair treatment of minorities and to make up for that you think we need to adopt those same policies today but direct them towards whites. 

In your eyes it was unfair then but totally fair now. There's a word for that. 

[dogcows 1,030]

35 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

Your analogy stinks. Just say you think we had policies in our past that resulted in unfair treatment of minorities and to make up for that you think we need to adopt those same policies today but direct them towards whites. 

In your eyes it was unfair then but totally fair now. There's a word for that. 

If a person is wrongly imprisoned through misconduct by the state, they are entitled to financial compensation for the time spent in prison. But when millions of people were enslaved, they were never compensated. When Jim Crow laws ended, did they compensate black people for refusing to let them live in certain neighborhoods, have certain jobs, go to better schools, etc? Nope.

We need to move forward, but it’s absurd when people think everything has been “equal” since the repeal of many segregation laws in the 1960s. Take the 2020 example of the Army changing its promotion rules. Everybody in the Army was subject to the old rules until that date. So we know for a fact that black people are under-promoted in the Army right now. It will take about 20-30 years for this policy to be reflected in the makeup of the Army. And Army careers are relatively short (about 20-30 years). There are still MANY people alive today who were born before 1965. If they are black, they were subjected to state-sponsored discrimination against them and never compensated for it.

When it comes to the right, I believe this statement is true: It’s always too late to talk about reparations and too soon to talk about gun laws after a mass shooting.

By the way, I have never advocated for enslaving white people or prohibiting them from going to good schools or getting loans or moving into certain neighborhoods. That is how black people were treated, and no people should be treated like that.

[DonS 3,292]

2 hours ago, Fireballer said:

I guess slavery and Jim Crowe forced Ontario  into this woke curriculum.  

 

That focking cracker Pythagoras and his raciss theorem!

 

[RLLD 4,230]

1 hour ago, Alias Detective said:

Asians are in on this now

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/07/09/illinois-mandates-asian-american-history-public-schools-teaach-act/7472690002/

 

What is the measure of "privilege" if not success?  Even though success itself is a simple measure of effort and talent.

Asians are wildly successful, because they do not whine like some others, they simply work, and because they work and strive they find success.  Not sure they are being underrepresented....

[Fireballer 2,642]

Just now, RLLD said:

What is the measure of "privilege" if not success?  Even though success itself is a simple measure of effort and talent.

Asians are wildly successful, because they do not whine like some others, they simply work, and because they work and strive they find success.  Not sure they are being underrepresented....

It's fuking hilarious that all the stop Asian hate stuff popped up this year, but (I think) every Dem senator voted against an amendment that would pull federal funds from a college that refuse an Asian college admission based on race.

[5-Points 3,528]

53 minutes ago, dogcows said:

If a person is wrongly imprisoned through misconduct by the state, they are entitled to financial compensation for the time spent in prison. But when millions of people were enslaved, they were never compensated. When Jim Crow laws ended, did they compensate black people for refusing to let them live in certain neighborhoods, have certain jobs, go to better schools, etc? Nope.

We need to move forward, but it’s absurd when people think everything has been “equal” since the repeal of many segregation laws in the 1960s. Take the 2020 example of the Army changing its promotion rules. Everybody in the Army was subject to the old rules until that date. So we know for a fact that black people are under-promoted in the Army right now. It will take about 20-30 years for this policy to be reflected in the makeup of the Army. And Army careers are relatively short (about 20-30 years). There are still MANY people alive today who were born before 1965. If they are black, they were subjected to state-sponsored discrimination against them and never compensated for it.

When it comes to the right, I believe this statement is true: It’s always too late to talk about reparations and too soon to talk about gun laws after a mass shooting.

By the way, I have never advocated for enslaving white people or prohibiting them from going to good schools or getting loans or moving into certain neighborhoods. That is how black people were treated, and no people should be treated like that.

You advocate for discrimination against whites today to make up for discrimination against minorities in the past. Whites today, who had absolutely nothing to do with the injustices of the past btw, are being denied college admissions, employment opportunities and promotions simply for the sake of diversity and you're perfectly fine with that. In fact, you encourage it. 

So are we going to "compensate" the next generation of whites to make up for the injustices we impose on them today? If not, why not? If yes, when do we stop the cycle of discrimination-compensation-discrimimation-compensation...?

Best to just level the playing field and GTFO of the way. Let success find those who earn it without tipping the scales in one direction or the other. The only reason to give one demographic preferential treatment on a level playing field is if you think that demo is incapable of succeeding on a level playing field. There's a word for that as well. 

 

[dogcows 1,030]

16 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

You advocate for discrimination against whites today to make up for discrimination against minorities in the past. Whites today, who had absolutely nothing to do with the injustices of the past btw, are being denied college admissions, employment opportunities and promotions simply for the sake of diversity and you're perfectly fine with that. In fact, you encourage it. 

So are we going to "compensate" the next generation of whites to make up for the injustices we impose on them today? If not, why not? If yes, when do we stop the cycle of discrimination-compensation-discrimimation-compensation...?

Best to just level the playing field and GTFO of the way. Let success find those who earn it without tipping the scales in one direction or the other. The only reason to give one demographic preferential treatment on a level playing field is if you think that demo is incapable of succeeding on a level playing field. There's a word for that as well. 

 

No I don’t advocate for discrimination against whites. I say it right in the post you quoted.

White people are not being denied any of the things you mention. Just look at the statistics. White people are far more represented in every area you brought up.

You’ve ignored the argument about compensation for injustice. A white lady can get $1 million for spilling McD’s coffee on herself, but black people never got anything to compensate for slavery 1776-1860s and Jim Crow up to the 1960s. And when somebody suggests giving them preference in hiring or in school admissions (as opposed to cash payouts), that’s a bridge too far? A nation built on free labor from black people can’t be bothered to do what it takes to create equal outcomes, and then, once that has been achieved… great. Level the playing field. The game was played with whites having 11 men and blacks having 5, and the score is 100–0 at the half. Letting blacks have 11 men for the 2nd half without leveling the score at 0-0 is hardly fair. Forget about the last 200 years… things are fair starting now, so good luck catching up!

Think of the game monopoly. Imagine a player not allowed to own any properties and starting halfway through the game. All the properties are already owned, and the only way they can make it through is collecting $200 for passing go and maybe getting lucky on a community chest. Meanwhile, they’re paying rent on every property owned by the people who started playing the game before. Granted, America has more opportunities than the game of monopoly, but it still is good to remember how valuable property is, and that it can be passed to your kids, and that black people basically had no property until 50 years ago.

PS - The government did pay out slave reparations at one time - they gave $300 to slave owners for each slave they freed in the District of Columbia.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

Dumbcows is obviously ashamed of the United States. He ought to look elsewhere to live, and find what he’s looking for. The Scandinavian countries don’t have the racist past or present that we do, according to the left, and are very progressive on all fronts. Why not try them out? “Free” healthcare too.  You can claim refugee status form the racist hellhole that the US is. Come to NY, you can apply at the embassies. 

[5-Points 3,528]

31 minutes ago, dogcows said:

No I don’t advocate for discrimination against whites. I say it right in the post you quoted.

White people are not being denied any of the things you mention. Just look at the statistics. White people are far more represented in every area you brought up.

You’ve ignored the argument about compensation for injustice. A white lady can get $1 million for spilling McD’s coffee on herself, but black people never got anything to compensate for slavery 1776-1860s and Jim Crow up to the 1960s. And when somebody suggests giving them preference in hiring or in school admissions (as opposed to cash payouts), that’s a bridge too far? A nation built on free labor from black people can’t be bothered to do what it takes to create equal outcomes, and then, once that has been achieved… great. Level the playing field. The game was played with whites having 11 men and blacks having 5, and the score is 100–0 at the half. Letting blacks have 11 men for the 2nd half without leveling the score at 0-0 is hardly fair. Forget about the last 200 years… things are fair starting now, so good luck catching up!

Think of the game monopoly. Imagine a player not allowed to own any properties and starting halfway through the game. All the properties are already owned, and the only way they can make it through is collecting $200 for passing go and maybe getting lucky on a community chest. Meanwhile, they’re paying rent on every property owned by the people who started playing the game before. Granted, America has more opportunities than the game of monopoly, but it still is good to remember how valuable property is, and that it can be passed to your kids, and that black people basically had no property until 50 years ago.

PS - The government did pay out slave reparations at one time - they gave $300 to slave owners for each slave they freed in the District of Columbia.

If you support affirmative action you support discrimination against whites because that's what affirmative action is. 

More qualified and, therefore, more deserving whites are being denied those things in favor of diversity. It's undeniable. Those white people are absolutely being discriminated against whether you admit it or not. 

Blacks weren't the only enslaved people in this country. We just called what happened to white people Indentured Servitude instead of slavery. Do we pay white people reparations too? I'll agree to pay any actual former slave the wages they would've earned for services rendered at that time. Other than that, no. 

As far as creating "equal outcomes", that's a fairy tale. The best we can do is create equal opportunity, which we have. But that's not good enough for some. There's always more that "we" need to do to help "those" who can't/won't help themselves. 

Slavery was wrong but it was an institution of the times. We didn't invent it but we did put an end to it.To hold people today responsible, financially or otherwise, for the actions of people back then is retarded. To compensate people today for things that happened to people back then is equally retarded. 

Everybody in this country has equal opportunities for success. Some may have to work harder than others to achieve that success but the opportunities exist nevertheless. 

 

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

Millions have left other countries to come to America for opportunity. Why don’t the ones who feel they aren’t getting any go somewhere that will give it to them? 

[5-Points 3,528]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Millions have left other countries to come to America for opportunity. Why don’t the ones who feel they aren’t getting any go somewhere that will give it to them? 

Because nobody in any other country gives a sh!t about them or their poor me buIIshit. 

[Fireballer 2,642]

15 hours ago, dogcows said:

I’m not uneducated, especially on this topic. If we want to discuss the term itself, then let us.

You’ve listed 2 definitions. Do you see any problem with the first? I don’t think anybody should.

As for the second, IMHO only those who feel the system is flawless as it is would be offended by such a belief. If one doesn’t think that pervasive racism exists in America, perhaps they’ve never been black nor actually talked to black friends or neighbors about it. Driving while black is unquestionably a real thing. Banks are regularly cited for showing racial bias in lending. Hiring and promotion are affected by race too.

Here’s a very concrete example of a recent anti-racist action. The Army has always included pictures of soldiers in the promotion process. They recently finished a study where they ran promotion boards with pictures and without pictures of the soldiers. In the board with pictures, the black soldiers were selected for promotion at a lower rate than the board without pictures. So the Army took photos out of the promotion process for all ranks going forward. That is an anti-racist action by the definition above. They found actual racism in the system and rooted it out. Why would anybody have a problem with that?

So far, the people most concerned about anti-racism are racists and people who (IMHO) have been tricked into thinking it’s accusing all white people of being racist. It’s actually much more boring, and the example above is a perfect example of this.

Do you have links to these studies by the Army?  And some info on the actual process of promotion? Did anything change other than literally not including a picture? I actually think this is a fascinating topic.

[jerryskids 6,797]

I’m not sure what to say to @dogcows at this point.  He talks about us “mischaracterizing” anti-racism because that’s what the MSM tells him to say, but before that on multiple occasions he equated it with “being against racism,” which is 100% not the Kendi version being discussed.  So there really is nowhere to go with it.  He did however provide an example of unintended racism in the Army promotion process, which shocks me because until he said that I thought that all racism had been 100% rooted out.  Again, this is the simple message from the MSM:  if you oppose anti-racism, you are for racism.

Thankfully he has moved on to one of my favorite topics, reparations, which is quite possibly the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.  But it is the ultimate guilt-driven white elite woke virtue signaling move you can make.   

ETA:  the simple message is more than the MSM, it is literally what anti-racism teaches.

[Reality 3,121]

3 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I’m not sure what to say to @dogcows at this point.  He talks about us “mischaracterizing” anti-racism because that’s what the MSM tells him to say, but before that on multiple occasions he equated it with “being against racism,” which is 100% not the Kendi version being discussed.  So there really is nowhere to go with it.  He did however provide an example of unintended racism in the Army promotion process, which shocks me because until he said that I thought that all racism had been 100% rooted out.  Again, this is the simple message from the MSM:  if you oppose anti-racism, you are for racism.

Thankfully he has moved on to one of my favorite topics, reparations, which is quite possibly the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.  But it is the ultimate guilt-driven white elite woke virtue signaling move you can make.   

ETA:  the simple message is more than the MSM, it is literally what anti-racism teaches.

It's funny to watch these discussions evolve, folks get educated along the way, changing their argument etc. 

At least we no longer hear from the idiots claiming it wasn't happening.

[Fireballer 2,642]

4 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I’m not sure what to say to @dogcows at this point.  He talks about us “mischaracterizing” anti-racism because that’s what the MSM tells him to say, but before that on multiple occasions he equated it with “being against racism,” which is 100% not the Kendi version being discussed.  So there really is nowhere to go with it.  He did however provide an example of unintended racism in the Army promotion process, which shocks me because until he said that I thought that all racism had been 100% rooted out.  Again, this is the simple message from the MSM:  if you oppose anti-racism, you are for racism.

Thankfully he has moved on to one of my favorite topics, reparations, which is quite possibly the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.  But it is the ultimate guilt-driven white elite woke virtue signaling move you can make.   

ETA:  the simple message is more than the MSM, it is literally what anti-racism teaches.

I believe the Khendi also says that you can't overcome past discrimination without present discrimination.  I do agree with one of his ideas, and the present day Dems are a shining example.  He says most racism isn't rooted in hate, it'd rooted in self interest. 

[dogcows 1,030]

18 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I’m not sure what to say to @dogcows at this point.  He talks about us “mischaracterizing” anti-racism because that’s what the MSM tells him to say, but before that on multiple occasions he equated it with “being against racism,” which is 100% not the Kendi version being discussed.  So there really is nowhere to go with it.  He did however provide an example of unintended racism in the Army promotion process, which shocks me because until he said that I thought that all racism had been 100% rooted out.  Again, this is the simple message from the MSM:  if you oppose anti-racism, you are for racism.

Thankfully he has moved on to one of my favorite topics, reparations, which is quite possibly the dumbest idea I’ve ever heard.  But it is the ultimate guilt-driven white elite woke virtue signaling move you can make.   

ETA:  the simple message is more than the MSM, it is literally what anti-racism teaches.

The MSM doesn’t tell me to say anything. I don’t even have cable, so CNN and MSNBC are not able to “indoctrinate” me as you seem to indicate.

So which definition of anti-racism do you want to discuss? The one you posted on this forum or another one? I spent a decent amount of time going over your provided definition and pointing out that it’s actually a good thing. Instead of contesting that analysis, you transition to the “Kendi” version. It’s a bit hard to discuss something when its definition keeps expanding. Do we want to discuss a certain book or article of Kendi’s? Ok let’s have that discussion.

On reparations: Hypothetical question: would you have been in favor of reparations for slaves right after slavery ended?

[dogcows 1,030]

1 hour ago, Fireballer said:

Do you have links to these studies by the Army?  And some info on the actual process of promotion? Did anything change other than literally not including a picture? I actually think this is a fascinating topic.

Here you go. Task and Purpose is a site focused on military news.

https://taskandpurpose.com/news/army-promotions-racial-bias/

[Fireballer 2,642]

18 minutes ago, dogcows said:

The MSM doesn’t tell me to say anything. I don’t even have cable, so CNN and MSNBC are not able to “indoctrinate” me as you seem to indicate.

So which definition of anti-racism do you want to discuss? The one you posted on this forum or another one? I spent a decent amount of time going over your provided definition and pointing out that it’s actually a good thing. Instead of contesting that analysis, you transition to the “Kendi” version. It’s a bit hard to discuss something when its definition keeps expanding. Do we want to discuss a certain book or article of Kendi’s? Ok let’s have that discussion.

On reparations: Hypothetical question: would you have been in favor of reparations for slaves right after slavery ended?

There's no "Khendi" specific anti-racism.  It's all the same

[jerryskids 6,797]

17 minutes ago, dogcows said:

The MSM doesn’t tell me to say anything. I don’t even have cable, so CNN and MSNBC are not able to “indoctrinate” me as you seem to indicate.

So which definition of anti-racism do you want to discuss? The one you posted on this forum or another one? I spent a decent amount of time going over your provided definition and pointing out that it’s actually a good thing. Instead of contesting that analysis, you transition to the “Kendi” version. It’s a bit hard to discuss something when its definition keeps expanding. Do we want to discuss a certain book or article of Kendi’s? Ok let’s have that discussion.

On reparations: Hypothetical question: would you have been in favor of reparations for slaves right after slavery ended?

Pro tip:  CNN and MSNBC, and even NYT and WaPo, post information on this new thing called the internet.  I think I’m getting insight into your knowledge gap.

The general dictionary one was an approximation for Kendi, sorry for the confusion.  I was trying to show that even the dictionary disagrees.  Jeebus, I can’t believe I am still arguing about what anti-racism means in America in July 2021.

As to your question, I would support money provided to slaves upon their emancipation.  I wouldn’t call it reparations, that evokes white elite guilt.

[dogcows 1,030]

44 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Pro tip:  CNN and MSNBC, and even NYT and WaPo, post information on this new thing called the internet.  I think I’m getting insight into your knowledge gap.

The general dictionary one was an approximation for Kendi, sorry for the confusion.  I was trying to show that even the dictionary disagrees.  Jeebus, I can’t believe I am still arguing about what anti-racism means in America in July 2021.

As to your question, I would support money provided to slaves upon their emancipation.  I wouldn’t call it reparations, that evokes white elite guilt.

IMHO, anti-racism and CRT are labels that are liberally applied to just about anything these days. I think most Republicans think “reverse racism” when they hear the terms, which isn’t really accurate. The reason you’re arguing about what anti-racism means is because it’s exaggerated and portrayed negatively every single day in right-wing media. So everybody consuming that news thinks it is a threat to America! Right-wingers love to talk about Dems and their TDS, but the right’s irrational overreaction to CRT and anti-racism is pretty much the same thing.

Sadly, freed slaves were not compensated in the 1860s. Instead they were subject to another century of Jim Crow laws, lynchings with no punishment for the murderers, etc. I agree with you on one thing: Let’s take blame completely out of the equation. The question is: can anything be done to help fix the situation? Any minor benefit given only to black people is not going to hurt white people. I reject that argument. So why not try it and see if we can improve the lives of black people in America?

I wish we had a strong affirmative action push in the last 1960s, but it never happened. Now it’s supposedly too late. Maybe that is true. Maybe the best we can do is stuff like what the Army did: locate policies that still lead to racist outcomes (regardless of the intent) and fix them… and wait for the passage of time to remedy the situation. That doesn’t seem great to me, but I guess it’s unrealistic to expect more.

PS - MSM is a term that, depending on how far right one is, can apply to any media organization. I’ve seen some people claim Fox and WSJ are part of it too. I read a variety of different sources.

[Utilit99 4,099]

4 minutes ago, dogcows said:

IMHO, anti-racism and CRT are labels that are liberally applied to just about anything these days. I think most Republicans think “reverse racism” when they hear the terms, which isn’t really accurate. The reason you’re arguing about what anti-racism means is because it’s exaggerated and portrayed negatively every single day in right-wing media. So everybody consuming that news thinks it is a threat to America! Right-wingers love to talk about Dems and their TDS, but the right’s irrational overreaction to CRT and anti-racism is pretty much the same thing.

Sadly, freed slaves were not compensated in the 1860s. Instead they were subject to another century of Jim Crow laws, lynchings with no punishment for the murderers, etc. I agree with you on one thing: Let’s take blame completely out of the equation. The question is: can anything be done to help fix the situation? Any minor benefit given only to black people is not going to hurt white people. I reject that argument. So why not try it and see if we can improve the lives of black people in America?

I wish we had a strong affirmative action push in the last 1960s, but it never happened. Now it’s supposedly too late. Maybe that is true. Maybe the best we can do is stuff like what the Army did: locate policies that still lead to racist outcomes (regardless of the intent) and fix them… and wait for the passage of time to remedy the situation. That doesn’t seem great to me, but I guess it’s unrealistic to expect more.

PS - MSM is a term that, depending on how far right one is, can apply to any media organization. I’ve seen some people claim Fox and WSJ are part of it too. I read a variety of different sources.

How many slaves do we have in this country? 

How many black racists do we have in this country?

[Hardcore troubadour 15,429]

17 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

How many slaves do we have in this country? 

How many black racists do we have in this country?

You’re still reading that crap he writes? 

[Utilit99 4,099]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

You’re still reading that crap he writes? 

I read the first sentence of the first and second paragraphs. I chose the second one to respond to. That guy is nuts. I don't think he's a troll like the proven rats mdc or worms, but he is nuts. 

[jerryskids 6,797]

58 minutes ago, dogcows said:

IMHO, anti-racism and CRT are labels that are liberally applied to just about anything these days. I think most Republicans think “reverse racism” when they hear the terms, which isn’t really accurate. The reason you’re arguing about what anti-racism means is because it’s exaggerated and portrayed negatively every single day in right-wing media. So everybody consuming that news thinks it is a threat to America! Right-wingers love to talk about Dems and their TDS, but the right’s irrational overreaction to CRT and anti-racism is pretty much the same thing.

Sadly, freed slaves were not compensated in the 1860s. Instead they were subject to another century of Jim Crow laws, lynchings with no punishment for the murderers, etc. I agree with you on one thing: Let’s take blame completely out of the equation. The question is: can anything be done to help fix the situation? Any minor benefit given only to black people is not going to hurt white people. I reject that argument. So why not try it and see if we can improve the lives of black people in America?

I wish we had a strong affirmative action push in the last 1960s, but it never happened. Now it’s supposedly too late. Maybe that is true. Maybe the best we can do is stuff like what the Army did: locate policies that still lead to racist outcomes (regardless of the intent) and fix them… and wait for the passage of time to remedy the situation. That doesn’t seem great to me, but I guess it’s unrealistic to expect more.

PS - MSM is a term that, depending on how far right one is, can apply to any media organization. I’ve seen some people claim Fox and WSJ are part of it too. I read a variety of different sources.

You act like this would be the first time we’d ever give money to a black person.  They’ve gotten trillions in the past 50 years.  A lot of others including white people have gotten money as well, through welfare and a host of other programs specifically designed to provide money to people in need.  Is that what bugs you, that white people get some?  Will you not feel whole until we specifically have a program to give black people money but not white people?  If so, can you be any more white guilt virtue signaling?

In your opinion, this extra new money does what?  It lifts a significant number of black people out of poverty? This gift of TBD size is the incremental amount needed to push the inner city black community over the edge and adopt values like hard work, nuclear family, importance of education?  Perhaps millions of black people will start a small business with this endowment?  

We haven’t even gotten to how we identify who gets what.  Self-identification?  Melanin measurement?  My radiation oncologist is black, pretty dark too, I suspect Nigerian from his name but I’m not sure — does he get it?  Perhaps one of those DNA tests?

This generation of adults is lost.  So are older generations.  The only hope is the kids, and to help them we need to wrest them away from this CRT and anti-racism divisive frameworks which take away any progress they’ve made in embracing personal accountability.

[Fireballer 2,642]

1 hour ago, dogcows said:

 The reason you’re arguing about what anti-racism means is because it’s exaggerated and portrayed negatively every single day in right-wing media.

Womp, womp...you couldn't be more wrong.  The left media and info sources define anti-racism as what it is.  Its  all over the lefty innerwebs.

[dogcows 1,030]

2 hours ago, Fireballer said:

Womp, womp...you couldn't be more wrong.  The left media and info sources define anti-racism as what it is.  Its  all over the lefty innerwebs.

Is it possible you got it backwards? Fox talks about it incessantly, way more than any left-leaning sources. Over 1300 times in 3 months? JerrysKids, you might not be the only one with a stalker. CRT might want to put a restraining order out against Fox…

https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-critical-race-theory-mentions-thousand-study-2021-6

Interesting that you say liberals define anti-racism and/or CRT. I’ve got multiple conservatives telling me I’m the one who doesn’t know what it is. So do liberals define it or not?  None of you here are accepting my definition or even abiding by the definition posted by JerrysKids.

I think some of this discussion has been interesting, when we have talked about affirmative action and reparations and other issues… I see no need to put them all under a big CRT or anti-racism umbrella. When we get down to the actual issues instead of CRT BAD or ORANGE MAN BAD, I like that. I appreciated the perspectives once we got into it a bit. I think @jerryskids might be right about something he mentioned elsewhere: a combinator for black-owned businesses is something that could work and doesn’t require the government. As much as I think something like reparations might help and feels like a “fair” thing to make up for past mistreatment, I think there’s pretty much zero chance of it ever happening… so I may as well not waste my time on it.

[Fireballer 2,642]

22 minutes ago, dogcows said:

Is it possible you got it backwards? Fox talks about it incessantly, way more than any left-leaning sources. Over 1300 times in 3 months? JerrysKids, you might not be the only one with a stalker. CRT might want to put a restraining order out against Fox…

https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-critical-race-theory-mentions-thousand-study-2021-6

Interesting that you say liberals define anti-racism and/or CRT. I’ve got multiple conservatives telling me I’m the one who doesn’t know what it is. So do liberals define it or not?  None of you here are accepting my definition or even abiding by the definition posted by JerrysKids.

I think some of this discussion has been interesting, when we have talked about affirmative action and reparations and other issues… I see no need to put them all under a big CRT or anti-racism umbrella. When we get down to the actual issues instead of CRT BAD or ORANGE MAN BAD, I like that. I appreciated the perspectives once we got into it a bit. I think @jerryskids might be right about something he mentioned elsewhere: a combinator for black-owned businesses is something that could work and doesn’t require the government. As much as I think something like reparations might help and feels like a “fair” thing to make up for past mistreatment, I think there’s pretty much zero chance of it ever happening… so I may as well not waste my time on it.

Dude, I haven't even mentioned CRT for probably a couple of weeks here.  I don't give 2 shats that Fox is ranting about it.  They're wrong, and so many people railing against CRT are wrong. I'm talking about anti racism and how I've gotten all my info about it from non-conservative sources.  No less sinister than CRT, anti-racism is what we are being indoctrinated into and what people need to take the fight to.