Transgender protections

[RLLD 3,455]

 

The Washington Post reported that the Health and Human Services Department has advocated requiring that people identify with the sex they were assigned at birth, not the one with which they identify. Their hope is that other departments will embrace that approach:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/10/23/transgender-protections-could-be-rolled-back-again-under-trump-administration/?utm_term=.57483500a426

 

 

 

I do not object to biology and science being the foundation for how we handle gender in society. If someone wants to dress as a female, fine, have at it. But legally, nope...that is not how it works, sorry.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

Poor use of words (again by the WaPo, no editors exist there). They are not advocating that people identify with the sex they were assigned at birth, at all.

[Strike 3,999]

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/10/23/transgender-protections-could-be-rolled-back-again-under-trump-administration/?utm_term=.57483500a426

 

 

 

I do not object to biology and science being the foundation for how we handle gender in society. If someone wants to dress as a female, fine, have at it. But legally, nope...that is not how it works, sorry.

I'm surprised by your stance on this issue. You've always identified as a pussey so I'd think you'd be a little more compassionate to your fellow pusseys.

[seafoam1 1,879]

I'm surprised by your stance on this issue. You've always identified as a pussey so I'd think you'd be a little more compassionate to your fellow pusseys.

 

wow. good one.

[RLLD 3,455]

I'm surprised by your stance on this issue. You've always identified as a pussey so I'd think you'd be a little more compassionate to your fellow pusseys.

 

Hello pot.....

[kilroy69 1,002]

I hope trump rolls back anything and everything Obama did. His presidency was a waste of time and effort for normal people.

[tanatastic 2,061]

No sane man wants his little girl using a restroom and seeing an unhinged grown man with a wig and lipstick in there listening to her tinkle. Feel free to play dress up all you want and mutilate your own body but you arent a woman. You are in costume. Use the mens room.

[RLLD 3,455]

No sane man wants his little girl using a restroom and seeing an unhinged grown man with a wig and lipstick in there listening to her tinkle. Feel free to play dress up all you want and mutilate your own body but you arent a woman. You are in costume. Use the mens room.

 

Any attempt to insert logic, science, fact into the argument is met with an accusation that you are transphobic, hate gays, and don't care if people kill them. It's the Obama model of hit back twice as hard....

[drobeski 3,061]

 

Any attempt to insert logic, science, fact into the argument is met with an accusation that you are transphobic, hate gays, and don't care if people kill them. It's the Obama model of hit back twice as hard....

this is one of the issues where science doesnt count to them

[Djgb13 2,338]

I hope trump rolls back anything and everything Obama did. His presidency was a waste of time and effort for normal people.

I saw where Americans were polled and it said they thought Obama was the best president we ever had

[Voltaire 4,567]

 

I'm not sure I would either. Thank God I have a daughter who identifies as a girl.

Five years ago when my eldest entered grade one, I was mortified and grinding my teeth that she was going through the Chinese school system, then her brother the next year, the third is still too young. Too much memorize and regurgitate, too much homework, too much rah-rah Chinese political indoctrination cr@p. I'm set up nicely over here, but I'd been just totally vexed by the idea of my kids going through the education mill and had been seriously thinking how I had to get out of here at some point for their sake..

 

I've largely changed my mind on it because my already poor opinion of the US public education system has gone down the sh*tter even more than when I was in it and I can't afford private school.

 

One thing that's really nice over here, is that my kids would never consider "identifying" as anything other than what they are. How much I despise that cannot be put into words. The Chinese don't suffer fools and so no other options are on the table. This nonsense does not exist. Period. Girls are girls and boys are boys and my kids aren't strugging with the identity and don't need to be encouraged to do so against their nature. There's far less Marxist indoctrination in 'Communist' China than in the US systems and what is there, kids graduate readily able to identify and see though the BS. US education seems totally whack right now and my enthusiasm to return to the US, which only stirred because of fear over my kids' education is really receding. Well... not entirely...

 

My daughter can handle it and excel. My son though.... grrr... he's ill suited to it. He can keep up with what's going on which is good, he's not falling behind per se, he knows what the teacher is saying and his hand goes up and he gets the right answers. But he has other problems I've gone over many times before regarding focus and concentration and so is getting chewed up and spit out.by the Chinese system and the poor kid's life is pretty boring and miserable. Also, I studied history. I'd much, much, much to the infinity power rather my kids learn US History and Western Civilization and Civics and cultural heritage and pride in the USA from me than the revisionist Marxist/Feminist/LGBT/BLM sh*tbags I despise that teach it in US schools.

[seafoam1 1,879]

 

One thing that's really nice over here, is that my kids would never consider "identifying" as anything other than what they are. How much I despise that cannot be put into words. The Chinese don't suffer fools and so no other options are on the table. This nonsense does not exist. Period. Girls are girls and boys are boys and my kids aren't strugging with the identity and don't need to be encouraged to do so against their nature.

Not sure how my post is not there anymore, I must have deleted by mistake.

 

But yeah. I believe that this identity politics, or schooling, or what have you in this country, along with some parents and schools and clubs like the thespians (that my niece and nephew were a part of in in HS), are trying to feel for anything that that comes up in social discussion and impart their own 'feeling' opinions on their kids or students or friends around the thoughts of, "let's try to figure out what you are as a gender", is a disgrace. Thank God my niece grew out of it. 1 out of 2 is better than none.

[kilroy69 1,002]

I saw where Americans were polled and it said they thought Obama was the best president we ever had

I personally consider gwb the worst we have ever had. That being said. Obama did nothing at all for this country. Nothing.

[seafoam1 1,879]

I saw where Americans were polled and it said they thought Obama was the best president we ever had

I wonder who they polled....

[penultimatestraw 473]

Five years ago when my eldest entered grade one, I was mortified and grinding my teeth that she was going through the Chinese school system, then her brother the next year, the third is still too young. Too much memorize and regurgitate, too much homework, too much rah-rah Chinese political indoctrination cr@p. I'm set up nicely over here, but I'd been just totally vexed by the idea of my kids going through the education mill and had been seriously thinking how I had to get out of here at some point for their sake..

 

I've largely changed my mind on it because my already poor opinion of the US public education system has gone down the sh*tter even more than when I was in it and I can't afford private school.

 

One thing that's really nice over here, is that my kids would never consider "identifying" as anything other than what they are. How much I despise that cannot be put into words. The Chinese don't suffer fools and so no other options are on the table. This nonsense does not exist. Period. Girls are girls and boys are boys and my kids aren't strugging with the identity and don't need to be encouraged to do so against their nature. There's far less Marxist indoctrination in 'Communist' China than in the US systems and what is there, kids graduate readily able to identify and see though the BS. US education seems totally whack right now and my enthusiasm to return to the US, which only stirred because of fear over my kids' education is really receding. Well... not entirely...

 

My daughter can handle it and excel. My son though.... grrr... he's ill suited to it. He can keep up with what's going on which is good, he's not falling behind per se, he knows what the teacher is saying and his hand goes up and he gets the right answers. But he has other problems I've gone over many times before regarding focus and concentration and so is getting chewed up and spit out.by the Chinese system and the poor kid's life is pretty boring and miserable. Also, I studied history. I'd much, much, much to the infinity power rather my kids learn US History and Western Civilization and Civics and cultural heritage and pride in the USA from me than the revisionist Marxist/Feminist/LGBT/BLM sh*tbags I despise that teach it in US schools.

So you'll choose 100% chance of Chinese indoctrination, over the minuscule likelihood your kid becomes a tranny, or tolerates them as a part of society? Do you really think sexuality and gender issues are a prominent component of US education?

[Cloaca du jour 2,066]

Gender is like the twin towers...there used to be two. Now its a sensitive subject.

[Voltaire 4,567]

So you'll choose 100% chance of Chinese indoctrination, over the minuscule likelihood your kid becomes a tranny, or tolerates them as a part of society? Do you really think sexuality and gender issues are a prominent component of US education?

Well, 100% chance they're exposed to Chinese indoctrination. If you know Chinese kids, the success rate for Chinese indoctrination is relatively low. Now, my wife is a Chinese bot, she is as bad as the Kool Aid drinking gets, and meh... she's not so bad; she married me after all. My friends are all much better. University professors and grade school teachers in China are far, far more frequently pro-US than they are in the US. These kids see through it.

 

On a positive note, and I'm a pessimist by nature, especially now I'd rather be surprised than enduring getting my hopes constantly thwarted over and over again, but anyway, I'm hearing is about Gen Z that they aren't so loony as the Milennials, and can't stand the PC bullsh*t so maybe there's hope yet for US kids like there is for Chinese ones. If you get stupid shoved down your throat and it doesn't make sense, many reject it.

 

My kids have had to do patriotic Chinese stuff since kindergarten. I just roll with it. No reason not to love China, China's been good to us. I wish the US schools did patriotic stuff instead of bashing and criticizing our forebearers all the time. They're half Chinese, they've lived here all of their lives except on vacation. Another nice thing that I'd mentioned in that post, it's not just the tranny stuff which is just a part of it, it's that they won't learn US/Western Civilization stuff from contaminated US teachers, they'll learn it from me.

[shorepatrol 1,738]

I hope trump rolls back anything and everything Obama did. His presidency was a massive sh!tstain on America. Purge the courts of activists. MAGA

[wiffleball 4,649]

I saw where Americans were polled and it said they thought Obama was the best president we ever had

I think it depends on the timing. The requirements and needs of an American president vary overtime. We needed Ike when we needed Ike. But we sure didn't need Ike ten years after that.

 

I'm a huge Teddy Roosevelt fan, but I'm also smart enough to know that he would have been absolutely crucified the last 20 years.

 

Obama showed up at the right time. He could speak well, didn't enter into hand-to-hand combat with the English language, and he didn't engage us in a lot of foreign bullshiit.

 

The usual trolls will have the usual things to say. Obama could have donated both kidneys to a sick puppy and the board trolls would find a way to about that too. Just like Trump can literally do no wrong today. They refused to give an inch on either side. Which is why they're not taken seriously.

 

But what I said stands. He was an eloquent speaker that followed an absolutely horrific speaker. He was a flat-out non-interventionist militarily when we were reeling from the impacts of the neocons engaging us all over the world.

 

But that's where it stops for me. No, I don't think he was particularly useful policy-wise.

 

Maybe I missed it, but I'm actually surprised that Trump hasn't repealed that stupid that Michelle pulled. Remember? She made virtually all businesses put calorie counts on their menus? Great darling, because I'm sure the person ordering the lobster alfredo with bacon sprinkles in a garlic bread bowl would be shocked to find out that the dish is / 400 calories.

 

That was some stupid . Exactly the kind of thing that I wish Trump would repeal. We shouldn't give bored Housewives projects or authority just because they're bopping the president.

 

Shiit, Hillary wasnt even qualified in that regard. And they still gave her healthcare to fuk up. At least give Healthcare to Monica. She fuking earned it.

[Kopy 493]

When I was a kid. The "in thing" was wearing a jean jacket, and putting patches of your favorite music bands on it.

Flash foward almost 4 decades later. And the "in thing" is chopping off your pen!s and wearing pink.

 

Who knew?

[RLLD 3,455]

When I was a kid. The "in thing" was wearing a jean jacket, and putting patches of your favorite music bands on it.

Flash foward almost 4 decades later. And the "in thing" is chopping off your ###### and wearing pink.

 

Who knew?

 

Y'know how people love to do that thing where they say how much better it was when they were young?

 

I am not going to do that here exactly, but I am going to say that this is potentially THE worst time to be young in my memory....I would not want to be a 20-something in this emerging culture.

[fricker66 91]

 

Y'know how people love to do that thing where they say how much better it was when they were young?

 

I am not going to do that here exactly, but I am going to say that this is potentially THE worst time to be young in my memory....I would not want to be a 20-something in this emerging culture.

 

 

This old curmudgeon agrees wholeheartedly.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

These tranny discussions always go off the rails. The government had to do legislation like this. For EEO and for Title IX the has to be a legal definition of female.

[Voltaire 4,567]

 

Y'know how people love to do that thing where they say how much better it was when they were young?

 

I am not going to do that here exactly, but I am going to say that this is potentially THE worst time to be young in my memory....I would not want to be a 20-something in this emerging culture.

Ive heard good things about Gen Z being snarky rebels against Millennial douchebaggery. I was hoping that the Geek Club could confirm this. Sadly, you havent noticed.

[Kopy 493]

This old curmudgeon agrees wholeheartedly.

 

Can you picture yourself in your 80's. Sitting around with whoevers still alive from your friends, and saying:

 

Back in my day, a boy was a boy, and a girl was a girl. If you didn't know which one you were, you just looked down.

[MDC 5,902]

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/10/23/transgender-protections-could-be-rolled-back-again-under-trump-administration/?utm_term=.57483500a426

 

 

 

I do not object to biology and science being the foundation for how we handle gender in society. If someone wants to dress as a female, fine, have at it. But legally, nope...that is not how it works, sorry.

If someone is born male and has gender reassignment surgery, takes hormones etc. and now has ladyparts, wouldnt it be more accurate to call that person a woman than a man now?

[RLLD 3,455]

If someone is born male and has gender reassignment surgery, takes hormones etc. and now has ladyparts, wouldnt it be more accurate to call that person a woman than a man now?

 

Yes. now that we are adding in nuance we can start to identify additional common ground. But even with added nuance, the standard remains, biology and science are still the foundation.

[MDC 5,902]

 

Yes. now that we are adding in nuance we can start to identify additional common ground. But even with added nuance, the standard remains, biology and science are still the foundation.

Thats my point. If somebody has a vagina and female hormones isnt that person a woman even if their birth certificate says theyre male? Scientifically speaking.

[TheNewGirl 1,039]

Do you really think sexuality and gender issues are a prominent component of US education?

 

I think it's becoming that way.

[RLLD 3,455]

Thats my point. If somebody has a vagina and female hormones isnt that person a woman even if their birth certificate says theyre male? Scientifically speaking.

 

This is a standard approach to the topic, identify the most nuanced or in most cases the saddest example one can come up with, and pretend THAT is the instance we should use to govern the standard. But this game is easier than this.

 

If you are born a female, then you are a female, if you are born a male then you are a male. You cannot magically change your gender any more than you can magically change your age. If a person endures gender dysphoria and reacts to that by enduring plastic surgery to change their body, it does not change what they are, it changes how they appear and perhaps feel.

 

If the government decides to enact law to attempt to account for it, let them have at it. But if the goal is that "I" should acknowledge them as the pretend gender, my answer is no. And that means a man walking into a female bathroom while my daughter is in there elicits a reaction, and what that person "feels" they are does not matter.

[TheNewGirl 1,039]

Thats my point. If somebody has a vagina and female hormones isnt that person a woman even if their birth certificate says theyre male? Scientifically speaking.

 

In my opinion, no.

 

If you did a DNA test on that person, they'd come back with male chromosomes, right? On a biological/scientific level...their genes are still male.

[wiffleball 4,649]

But honestly, we're bunch of out of touch 50-somethings whose entire world view is pretty much made up of extreme we see on news channels and websites.

 

My point is, don't you think it's like any other bell curve? That 80% of the kids are basically normal?

 

I think it's a given that we hear from The Fringe 10 on either side one hell of a lot more than we ever used to.

 

But at least from the kids I know, yeah they're more politically correct then I ever was. But we were more PC than my grandmother was. But they're not the Flaming freak shows that we see on talk shows and read about every damn day.

 

Thoughts?

[MDC 5,902]

 

This is a standard approach to the topic, identify the most nuanced or in most cases the saddest example one can come up with, and pretend THAT is the instance we should use to govern the standard. But this game is easier than this.

 

If you are born a female, then you are a female, if you are born a male then you are a male. You cannot magically change your gender any more than you can magically change your age. If a person endures gender dysphoria and reacts to that by enduring plastic surgery to change their body, it does not change what they are, it changes how they appear and perhaps feel.

 

If the government decides to enact law to attempt to account for it, let them have at it. But if the goal is that "I" should acknowledge them as the pretend gender, my answer is no. And that means a man walking into a female bathroom while my daughter is in there elicits a reaction, and what that person "feels" they are does not matter.

So what youre saying is in your opinion, a person who has a vagina and woman hormones is still a man if thats the gender they were born with.

 

That doesnt really seem to be based in science at all.

[RLLD 3,455]

 

In my opinion, no.

 

If you did a DNA test on that person, they'd come back with male chromosomes, right? On a biological/scientific level...their genes are still male.

Correct. To refute science what will happen is you get things such as Klinefelter syndrome thrown at you, which again affects a TINY % of the population, but the fact that it exists means we have to use this to govern the behaviors of 300 million people. make no mistake about it, the SJW ideology is well armed, but there are ways... I recommend just CONSTANT reading, you have to come into a SJW argument ready to fight at their level, which is low, lots of name calling, but if you can get them to stop name calling and using condescension you can have a legit discussion .

 

This is a good one to start with

https://www.theblaze.com/news/2014/03/20/11-rules-for-debating-a-leftist-from-ben-shapiro

[vuduchile 1,941]

Thats my point. If somebody has a vagina and female hormones isnt that person a woman even if their birth certificate says theyre male? Scientifically speaking.

Do they really have a vaj though? Isn't it really more of a stanky crotch hole that some doctor gouged out?

[MDC 5,902]

 

In my opinion, no.

 

If you did a DNA test on that person, they'd come back with male chromosomes, right? On a biological/scientific level...their genes are still male.

Thats an interesting point (seriously). But the gender on your birth certificate is based on your genetalia, not a DNA test - right?

 

Also wondering what happens if a woman goes through gender reassignment and gets male hormones and a d1ck. Is that person supposed to use the girls room now?

[RLLD 3,455]

So what youre saying is in your opinion, a person who has a vagina and woman hormones is still a man if thats the gender they were born with.

 

That doesnt really seem to be based in science at all.

 

Perhaps your version of science allows for people to have cosmetic surgery and magically change.

 

If that person with the vagina and woman hormones, due to cosmetic changes, seeks medical attention based on this cosmetic change instead of their biology they fail to get the proper medical attention, women and men do have nuanced medical needs, that a nuanced perception of self cannot account for.

 

If a person also obtains cosmetic surgery to look younger, and does effectively look younger, can they demand to be treated at any age they demand?

[wiffleball 4,649]

So what youre saying is in your opinion, a person who has a vagina and woman hormones is still a man if thats the gender they were born with.

 

That doesnt really seem to be based in science at all.

Dudes have had actual Rams horns imbedded on their scalp.

 

Doesn't make them Todd Gurley

[MDC 5,902]

 

Perhaps your version of science allows for people to have cosmetic surgery and magically change.

 

If that person with the vagina and woman hormones, due to cosmetic changes, seeks medical attention based on this cosmetic change instead of their biology they fail to get the proper medical attention, women and men do have nuanced medical needs, that a nuanced perception of self cannot account for.

 

If a person also obtains cosmetic surgery to look younger, and does effectively look younger, can they demand to be treated at any age they demand?

Id say surgically changing your genetalia and getting hormone therapy is more than cosmetic. Id also say your opinion isnt based on science any more than anyone elses on this issue.

[wiffleball 4,649]

Do they really have a vaj though? Isn't it really more of a stanky crotch hole that some doctor gouged out?

Man, I haven't thought of Nikki in a while now.