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6000 White Nationalists storm Charlottesville, VA

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100's of armed (apparently open carry was the order of the day) citizens exercising their 1st amendment right with no violence. Seems like a peaceful protest to me. :dunno:

 

What is truly sad is people do not understand that the 1st amendment was made for dissent not popularity. The brilliance of our country. :thumbsup:

If they were carrying legally, still nothing wrong there...as much as I might disagree with their groups philosophy. Aggressive counterprotestors just as guilty as anyone in this thing escalating. Yes, these guys invited it and probably were hoping for it, but people need to be smarter and not take the bait.

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I don't recall defending that the way you're here defending Nazi terrorists. What a sad pig of a man you are.

whose defending nazis ? ? Both sides are violent vile ass holes.

What's a sad little hack trans you are.

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If they were carrying legally, still nothing wrong there...as much as I might disagree with their groups philosophy. Aggressive counterprotestors just as guilty as anyone in this thing escalating. Yes, these guys invited it and probably were hoping for it, but people need to be smarter and not take the bait.

There is the problem. Rule 2 of Life: People are Stupid.

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Sadly, in this country, both have the same right to assemble and protest in a peaceful, lawful fashion.

If only they did

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If only they did

I wish many more people would have died. More deaths on both sides would have helped us all.

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I wish many more people would have died. More deaths on both sides would have helped us all.

America...fock yeah

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I've noticed how tolerant the Geek Club is when it comes to protest. Just look at how admired Colin Kaepernick is around here. :wub:

It is possible to respect peaceful protest and not support the message. If you are incapable of this, maybe the US

is not for you.

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I like how BLM protests cause some property damage and the forearm Repubtards call for rubber bullets and pepper gas. A white nationalist drives over and kills and counte protestor and it's all "Meh - lots o blame to go around." :mellow:

 

It's too bad RLLD isn't here.

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If only they did

Both "sides" are guilty in this case. I agree.

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I like how BLM protests cause some property damage and the forearm Repubtards call for rubber bullets and pepper gas. A white nationalist drives over and kills and counte protestor and it's all "Meh - lots o blame to go around." :mellow:

It's too bad RLLD isn't here.

Yeah smashing storefronts and torching cars should be ignored. Right on. Let's face it, the alt-left cannot be peaceful.

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Good post!

 

Anyone who thinks this event was organic is fooling themselves.

Just like the fake Sandy Hook massacre, huh?

 

You guys are focking nuts

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At least we mostly settled the argument about what Robert E Lee statues and confederate flags now represent.

 

Sure, people can claim "states rights, blah blah, etc, etc.".......But nazis carry swastika flags and confederate flags side by side while marching to protect Robert E Lee statues......and I haven't heard a lot of southerners angrily and publicly announcing that they don't want their flag associated with these groups in any way whatsoever (if they have and I missed it, I will apologize)...... The Detroit Red Wings did it and are considering legal action supposedly. That's how you react.

As a southerner, let me respond. I'm sure bunny and sho and Peenie and some others can too.

 

I have nothing but respect for Robert E. Lee. He was a good man, and one of the finest military commanders this country ever produced.

 

He fought for the confederacy not in defense of slavery, but in defense of his home, after much soul searching.

 

Thus I have no problem with his statue remaining. But I also see how these symbols of the confederacy have come to be seized by other groups that are deeply troubling to black Americans.

 

I don't like seeing history destroyed. But it isn't a simple solution.

 

Most of us in the south have some level of fondness for the confederacy. Not because of slavery or racial issues. But because it is a hugely important chapter of our homeland.

 

I used to be a member of the sons of confederate veterans. In order to join, you have to trace your lineage back to a member of the confederate army. My great great great grandfather served in the 48th Virginia infantry, under general Lee.

 

I am glad the south lost that war. Slavery was evil, and needed to be uprooted. But while slavery was what began the war, for the vast majority of our forefathers, it was about defending their home. Plain and simple.

 

The confederacy was led by some great men (Lee, Jackson) some good men (Davis) and some not good men (Forrest, who founded the Klan).

 

The purpose of history is to guide our future. To show us what mistakes and successes were made in the past. Hiding it does nobody any good.

 

The civil war era has lessons to learn... since it seems we are headed for a second civil war. I hate that the symbols and likenesses of great men have been co-opted by scum like the klan. But even so, they too have a right to speak their minds, no matter how foul.

 

As another great Virginian said, "I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

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who mentioned liberals ?

You are whining about media bias.

 

And the president doesn't have balls. He calls out people who are not loyal to him only.

He had worse words today for the Merck CEO than he did for Nazis. Why? Because the Merck CEO resigned from his commission because of Trump's behavior and he went to Twitter like a girl. That isn't balls.

 

The media and other politicians are calling him out because of his refusal to call this for what it was and his blatant hypocrisy on such a subject.

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At least we mostly settled the argument about what Robert E Lee statues and confederate flags now represent.

 

Sure, people can claim "states rights, blah blah, etc, etc.".......But nazis carry swastika flags and confederate flags side by side while marching to protect Robert E Lee statues......and I haven't heard a lot of southerners angrily and publicly announcing that they don't want their flag associated with these groups in any way whatsoever (if they have and I missed it, I will apologize)...... The Detroit Red Wings did it and are considering legal action supposedly. That's how you react.

 

Well...to any honest person...we know what the statues and the flag represent. A pushback against the civil rights movement. Which is why these things went up during that time.

And people are complaining about throwing out history and blah blah blah...yet these things are mostly not being just torn down and tossed out...but being put in museums and such.

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Yeah smashing storefronts and torching cars should be ignored. Right on. Let's face it, the alt-left cannot be peaceful.

I didn't say it should be ignored. I said you hacks ripped BLM because of a few broken windows at a CVS, but now a white nationalist actually drives over and kills a person you're all "Meh, plenty of blame to go around."

 

I WONDER WHAT TEH DIFFERENCE COULD POSSIBLY BE????? :o

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You are whining about media bias.

 

And the president doesn't have balls. He calls out people who are not loyal to him only.

He had worse words today for the Merck CEO than he did for Nazis. Why? Because the Merck CEO resigned from his commission because of Trump's behavior and he went to Twitter like a girl. That isn't balls.

 

The media and other politicians are calling him out because of his refusal to call this for what it was and his blatant hypocrisy on such a subject.

The paid actors are making both sides look bad.

 

Also why would Trump "call out" people who are loyal? That doesn't make any sense

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Well...to any honest person...we know what the statues and the flag represent. A pushback against the civil rights movement. Which is why these things went up during that time.

And people are complaining about throwing out history and blah blah blah...yet these things are mostly not being just torn down and tossed out...but being put in museums and such.

I have no problem with taking them off public property and into meuseums. I was not aware that most of these date back to the civil rights era.

 

What about things like Washington and lee university? Both slave owners. Washington gave the school a large chunk of its original endowment, and lee served as its president for many years, and they added his name to honor him.

 

Good by you? Or need to change?

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The paid actors are making both sides look bad.

 

Also why would Trump "call out" people who are loyal? That doesn't make any sense

 

Both sides again...BTW...you can keep believing the set up false flag crap...it only makes you look focking stupid. Well, not that there was ever a doubt about that with you anyway.

Because they are Nazis...or Putin...or a number of others that have done awful things that he refuses to talk about because they are loyal to him.

but the minute one of them does something he does not like...he has no problem calling out Sessions, McConnel, this Merck CEO and so on.

 

Its not a difficult concept.

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I have no problem with taking them off public property and into meuseums. I was not aware that most of these date back to the civil rights era.

 

What about things like Washington and lee university? Both slave owners. Washington gave the school a large chunk of its original endowment, and lee served as its president for many years, and they added his name to honor him.

 

Good by you? Or need to change?

Change that Racist name! Instead of Washington & Lee it should be Snoop & Pac Unisizzle!

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Change that Racist name! Instead of Washington & Lee it should be Snoop & Pac Unisizzle!

It's probably coming. Vanderbilt changed the name of confederate hall, which was built with funds donated by the daughters of the confederacy.

 

The city of Memphis changed the name of a park here in town and took down a statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest.

 

It's happening all over the place. I don't know how I feel about it truly. I can see good points on both sides of the argument.

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I have no problem with taking them off public property and into meuseums. I was not aware that most of these date back to the civil rights era.

 

What about things like Washington and lee university? Both slave owners. Washington gave the school a large chunk of its original endowment, and lee served as its president for many years, and they added his name to honor him.

 

Good by you? Or need to change?

 

Not all (I think the one in Charlottesville was in the 20s).

Confederate flag in SC? 1961.

Much of these things were seen as an FU during those times.

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Regarding changing the names of bridges, statues, schools, etc.

 

I do question what the endgame actually is?

 

I understood stopping flying the Confederate Flag on public grounds.. But, where does this end? George Washington was a slave owner, are we going to move the nations capital to Atlanta? Don't laugh, I once thought that was crazy thought but..........shiit is getting weird.

 

Where I'm at is that we to often try and put 2017 sensibilities into the reality / time / circumstance of 200 years ago. It's impossible to do. If IGotWorms was born in 1780 and not 1980 he would have more than likely owned slaves. Because that's what people did, that was THEIR reality in their time and space on this planet. It doesn't change the fact of all the historical good they accomplished in building this Country though.

 

But that takes deeper thought and understanding than what can be put in 140 characters on twitter.

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As a southerner, let me respond. I'm sure bunny and sho and Peenie and some others can too.

 

I have nothing but respect for Robert E. Lee. He was a good man, and one of the finest military commanders this country ever produced.

 

He fought for the confederacy not in defense of slavery, but in defense of his home, after much soul searching.

 

Thus I have no problem with his statue remaining. But I also see how these symbols of the confederacy have come to be seized by other groups that are deeply troubling to black Americans.

 

I don't like seeing history destroyed. But it isn't a simple solution.

 

Most of us in the south have some level of fondness for the confederacy. Not because of slavery or racial issues. But because it is a hugely important chapter of our homeland.

 

I used to be a member of the sons of confederate veterans. In order to join, you have to trace your lineage back to a member of the confederate army. My great great great grandfather served in the 48th Virginia infantry, under general Lee.

 

I am glad the south lost that war. Slavery was evil, and needed to be uprooted. But while slavery was what began the war, for the vast majority of our forefathers, it was about defending their home. Plain and simple.

 

The confederacy was led by some great men (Lee, Jackson) some good men (Davis) and some not good men (Forrest, who founded the Klan).

 

The purpose of history is to guide our future. To show us what mistakes and successes were made in the past. Hiding it does nobody any good.

 

The civil war era has lessons to learn... since it seems we are headed for a second civil war. I hate that the symbols and likenesses of great men have been co-opted by scum like the klan. But even so, they too have a right to speak their minds, no matter how foul.

 

As another great Virginian said, "I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."

 

Well written and I respect the viewpoint. I have no issue with the men that fought in that war, even if I loathe what they fought for.....Why? Because I recognize that our minds evolve continually and I don't intend to judge the beliefs people held 150 years ago through modern day filters....however.....

 

While minds evolve, language is an always evolving thing as well. The meaning of a word or phrase can evolve over time. Maybe not so much in terms of it's webster's definition, but a phrase's meaning can change in terms of what it represents to society......And this can happen with objects and symbols as well. Like it or not, confederate flags and tributes to those that fought against the Union now represent something else to society as a whole.

 

I have no doubt that there are many that feel like you do about the Confederacy and it's flag and it's heroes. But those that feel like you didn't get out ahead of it in time, and now it's too late. Even if the KKK and nazi like groups are the vast minority, they've been very loud (squeaky wheel, etc) and those that feel like you haven't distanced from them with enough volume for anyone to hear. In short, a large chunk of society now feels uneasy and possibly even unsafe when they see a group of people with a Confederate flag. So if the goal is for us to live together in a functioning cohesive society, then it has to go.

 

Overall, I read your post and think you understand what I'm saying, even if you are hesitant to come to the same final conclusion as I. But I hope it's clear I understand what you are saying as well.

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It's probably coming. Vanderbilt changed the name of confederate hall, which was built with funds donated by the daughters of the confederacy.

 

The city of Memphis changed the name of a park here in town and took down a statue of Nathan Bedford Forrest.

 

It's happening all over the place. I don't know how I feel about it truly. I can see good points on both sides of the argument.

It's here. The communists are taking us down without firing a single shot. The idiot leftists in the country are doing their dirty work.

 

 

You are about to read a list of 45 goals that found their way down the halls of our great Capitol back in 1963. As you read this, 39 years later, you should be shocked by the events that have played themselves out. I first ran across this list 3 years ago but was unable to attain a copy and it has bothered me ever since. Recently, Jeff Rense posted it on his site and I would like to thank him for doing so. http://www.rense.com Communist Goals (1963) Congressional Record--Appendix, pp. A34-A35 January 10, 1963 Current Communist Goals EXTENSION OF REMARKS OF HON. A. S. HERLONG, JR. OF FLORIDA IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES Thursday, January 10, 1963 . Mr. HERLONG. Mr. Speaker, Mrs. Patricia Nordman of De Land, Fla., is an ardent and articulate opponent of communism, and until recently published the De Land Courier, which she dedicated to the purpose of alerting the public to the dangers of communism in America. At Mrs. Nordman's request, I include in the RECORD, under unanimous consent, the following "Current Communist Goals," which she identifies as an excerpt from "The Naked Communist," by Cleon Skousen: [From "The Naked Communist," by Cleon Skousen] 1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war. 2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war. 3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength. 4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war. 5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites. 6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination. 7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N. 8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev's promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N. 9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress. 10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N. 11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.) 12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party. 13. Do away with all loyalty oaths. 14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office. 15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States. 16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights. 17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks. 18. Gain control of all student newspapers. 19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack. 20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policy-making positions. 21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures. 22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to "eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms." 23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art." 24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press. 25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV. 26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy." 27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity, which does not need a "religious crutch." 28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state." 29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis. 30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man." 31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over. 32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc. 33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus. 34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities. 35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI. 36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions. 37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business. 38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat]. 39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals. 40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce. 41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents. 42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems. 43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government. 44. Internationalize the Panama Canal. 45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.

 

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Unfortunately someone is probably dead over a fued between Kessler and the Vice Mayor Wes Bellamy. This has been unfolding locally for a while.

 

Bellamy has been one of the lead voices in removing the Lee statue and Kessler has called Bellamy out over his past tweets that are outright racist and sexist. Gov MCauliffe had personally appointed Bellamy to Va Board of Education and he was a teacher in Albermarle Co. He stepped down from both of those due to the tweets, but remained Vice Mayor. Kessler called for his job,but it didnt happen.

 

Do yourself a favor a Google "Kessler Wes Bellamy" and "Wes Bellamy tweets" and judge for yourself. Alot of the Alt right are saying that the CPD, Governor,Mayor/vice mayor purposefully allowed the clash between Antifa and Kesslers group.

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Regarding changing the names of bridges, statues, schools, etc.

 

I do question what the endgame actually is?

 

I understood stopping flying the Confederate Flag on public grounds.. But, where does this end? George Washington was a slave owner, are we going to move the nations capital to Atlanta? Don't laugh, I once thought that was crazy thought but..........shiit is getting weird.

 

Where I'm at is that we to often try and put 2017 sensibilities into the reality / time / circumstance of 200 years ago. It's impossible to do. If IGotWorms was born in 1780 and not 1980 he would have more than likely owned slaves. Because that's what people did, that was THEIR reality in their time and space on this planet. It doesn't change the fact of all the historical good they accomplished in building this Country though.

 

But that takes deeper thought and understanding than what can be put in 140 characters on twitter.

 

Well lets not conflate a few things.

Slavery dates back a long long time.

Washington...while a slave owner...did so during the times it was considered acceptable. When we get past those times to where we were enlightened as a people to stand up against such things...would GW still have had slaves? Hard to say.

I don't think looking back to Washington owned slaves...so, lets get rid of his stuff too is a very smart idea.

You get to that point about Worms...but statues we are discussing and the timeline was in the 1860s. No need to go back 100 years before that IMO.

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I wish many more people would have died. More deaths on both sides would have helped us all.

Only death I want to see is a fat dude with bad hair who is inciting all of this.

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Just like the fake Sandy Hook massacre, huh?

 

You guys are focking nuts

That's Big Guy's M.O. Give him a few hours and dozens of visits to whacko websites, and he'll find a video about how every event is fake.

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Also why would Trump "call out" people who are loyal? That doesn't make any sense

This is your most accurate post ever. Trump is not going to call out the KKK, Nazis, or white supremacists. They are all considered crucial votes. And the very people who drool all over themselves with erections at his rallies.

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Where I'm at is that we to often try and put 2017 sensibilities into the reality / time / circumstance of 200 years ago. It's impossible to do. If IGotWorms was born in 1780 and not 1980 he would have more than likely owned slaves. Because that's what people did, that was THEIR reality in their time and space on this planet. It doesn't change the fact of all the historical good they accomplished in building this Country though.

 

But that takes deeper thought and understanding than what can be put in 140 characters on twitter.

I understand your point and I don't disagree. Other than to say worms more than likely would not have owned slaves. Only about 1.4% of white Americans owned slaves at the height of slavery. It wasn't rampant, even in the South.

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I didn't say it should be ignored. I said you hacks ripped BLM because of a few broken windows at a CVS, but now a white nationalist actually drives over and kills a person you're all "Meh, plenty of blame to go around."

 

I WONDER WHAT TEH DIFFERENCE COULD POSSIBLY BE????? :o

Easy. Alt Right, no violence until the Alt left showed up. Alt left, violence from the start without the Alt right even showing up. :dunno: The left is violent.

 

And since you haven't researched it, it was way more than CVS windows.

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100's of Armed Marchers in Charlottesville = no shootings.

 

34 shot in Chicago over the weekend = not a news story. :dunno:

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Easy. Alt Right, no violence until the Alt left showed up. Alt left, violence from the start without the Alt right even showing up. :dunno: The left is violent.

 

And since you haven't researched it, it was way more than CVS windows.

 

Odd...what major events and deaths have come from violent leftists?

How about from 2001 to 2016...interesting the GAO has a report on that.

https://www.gao.gov/assets/690/683984.pdf

Skip to page 9 for a nice figure.

 

Since September 12, 2001, the number of fatalities caused by domestic violent extremists has ranged from 1 to 49 in a given year. As shown in figure 2, fatalities resulting from attacks by far right wing violet extremists have exceeded those caused by radical Islamist violent extremists in 10 of the 15 years, and were the same in 3 of the years since September 12, 2001. Of the 85 violent extremist incidents that resulted in death since September 12, 2001, far right wing violent extremist groups were responsible for 62 (73 percent) while radical Islamist violent extremists were responsible for 23 (27 percent). The total number of fatalities is about the same for far right wing violent extremists and radical Islamist violent extremists over the approximately 15-year period (106 and 119, respectively). However, 41 percent of the deaths attributable to radical Islamist violent extremists occurred in a single event—an attack at an Orlando, Florida night club in 2016 (see fig. 2). Details on the locations and dates of the attacks can be found in appendix II.

 

 

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Easy. Alt Right, no violence until the Alt left showed up. Alt left, violence from the start without the Alt right even showing up. :dunno: The left is violent.

 

And since you haven't researched it, it was way more than CVS windows.

Being opposed to Nazis = extremism now in Timmyland. You also missed the part about a woman getting run over and killed, as opposed to property damage. How many Chipotle's need to get a broken window before it equals one murder? There's also the thing where nobody here ever said property damage, fires an violence are ever justified but here you are, trying to tell us that counter protestors are just as responsible as Nazis, despite none of the counter protestors killing anyone.

 

JFC man. :doh:

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100's of Armed Marchers in Charlottesville = no shootings.

 

34 shot in Chicago over the weekend = not a news story. :dunno:

ROFL. So a death by a car mowing you over isn't nearly as bad as being shot? My God, you're a focking idiot. And that car could have easily killed dozens. Not sure how it didn't.

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Being opposed to Nazis = extremism now in Timmyland.

 

MDC, with all due respect I think you're simply misinformed. There were militant groups of the BLM and this Anti-Facism group who showed up there ready for a fight. It wasn't simply a bunch of college kids in flip flops protesting. You're trying to paint an incorrect picture.

 

Lots of fault to go around. For me I'd simply wish any "Nazi" group or any "KKK" group would all mount up go to some field in the woods and meet up with the militant wing of BLM and this Anti-Facism group and they just get it over with so the rest of us (99%) can go about our day in peace.

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Only death I want to see is a fat dude with bad hair who is inciting all of this.

And when the half black guy in the WH incited BLM to fry pigs in a blanket you were silent. Hypocrite.

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ROFL. So a death by a car mowing you over isn't nearly as bad as being shot? My God, you're a focking idiot. And that car could have easily killed dozens. Not sure how it didn't.

He's a loser and should be punished, but he obviously wasn't a marcher. You know, being in a car and all.

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