RLLD 4,254 Posted August 19, 2014 arrest people for actually crimes that they witness occurring and not take preventative measures that overstep the constitutional rights of individuals who is a looter? So your video of the cop dropping something out of his hand is meant to identify that person as a looter. This kind of approach, using a strawman, weakens your message and diminishes your position. IF any individual commits a crime, cop or not, they should be held accountable. That is simply how the world works, using the actions of some cop somewhere as a means to justify the commission of others committing a crime does not work. To answer your question, a looter is someone who takes spoils or plunder, trying to suggest that cops do that is dumb, because I think they do it all the time, does not make it right, not for the cop and certainly not for those in Ferguson. Worse, it hurts the people of Ferguson more than anyone else. Stick to the core of the issue, a young man is dead, lets find out why and lets engage this. Looting is wrong, black, white, cop or not. Our hope now should be to learn how and why this transpired, then teach our youth and police how to not let it happen again. Then maybe we can refocus on the fact that thousands of young black men are dying at the hands of other young black men, y'know, the REAL PROBLEM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 race baiter How so...it was you who was throwing out the bait chief. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crackattack 520 Posted August 19, 2014 arrest people for actually crimes that they witness occurring and not take preventative measures that overstep the constitutional rights of individuals who is a looter? I know cops can be dirty. So we expect police to act within the confines of the constitution, but not individuals? We expect the government to stand and enforce the constitution, but allow individuals to break it and deny the store owners and innocent bystanders theirs? So uphold the constitutional rights of the criminals, but not the law abiding citizens? That's a very thin line there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Voltaire 5,321 Posted August 19, 2014 I’m a cop. If you don’t want to get hurt, don’t challenge me. It’s not the police, but the people they stop, who can prevent a detention from turning into a tragedy. By Sunil Dutta August 19 at 6:00 AM A teenager is fatally shot by a police officer; the police are accused of being bloodthirsty, trigger-happy murderers; riots erupt. This, we are led to believe, is the way of things in America. It is also a terrible calumny; cops are not murderers. No officer goes out in the field wishing to shoot anyone, armed or unarmed. And while they’re unlikely to defend it quite as loudly during a time of national angst like this one, people who work in law enforcement know they are legally vested with the authority to detain suspects — an authority that must sometimes be enforced. Regardless of what happened with Mike Brown, in the overwhelming majority of cases it is not the cops, but the people they stop, who can prevent detentions from turning into tragedies. Working the street, I can’t even count how many times I withstood curses, screaming tantrums, aggressive and menacing encroachments on my safety zone, and outright challenges to my authority. In the vast majority of such encounters, I was able to peacefully resolve the situation without using force. Cops deploy their training and their intuition creatively, and I wielded every trick in my arsenal, including verbal judo, humor, warnings and ostentatious displays of the lethal (and nonlethal) hardware resting in my duty belt. One time, for instance, my partner and I faced a belligerent man who had doused his car with gallons of gas and was about to create a firebomb at a busy mall filled with holiday shoppers. The potential for serious harm to the bystanders would have justified deadly force. Instead, I distracted him with a hook about his family and loved ones, and he disengaged without hurting anyone. Every day cops show similar restraint and resolve incidents that could easily end up in serious injuries or worse. Sometimes, though, no amount of persuasion or warnings work on a belligerent person; that’s when cops have to use force, and the results can be tragic. We are still learning what transpired between Officer Darren Wilson and Brown, but in most cases it’s less ambiguous — and officers are rarely at fault. When they use force, they are defending their, or the public’s, safety. Even though it might sound harsh and impolitic, here is the bottom line: if you don’t want to get shot, tased, pepper-sprayed, struck with a baton or thrown to the ground, just do what I tell you. Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me. Most field stops are complete in minutes. How difficult is it to cooperate for that long? I know it is scary for people to be stopped by cops. I also understand the anger and frustration if people believe they have been stopped unjustly or without a reason. I am aware that corrupt and bully cops exist. When it comes to police misconduct, I side with the ACLU: Having worked as an internal affairs investigator, I know that some officers engage in unprofessional and arrogant behavior; sometimes they behave like criminals themselves. I also believe every cop should use a body camera to record interactions with the community at all times. Every police car should have a video recorder. (This will prevent a situation like Mike Brown’s shooting, about which conflicting and self-serving statements allow people to believe what they want.) And you don’t have to submit to an illegal stop or search. You can refuse consent to search your car or home if there’s no warrant (though a pat-down is still allowed if there is cause for suspicion). Always ask the officer whether you are under detention or are free to leave. Unless the officer has a legal basis to stop and search you, he or she must let you go. Finally, cops are legally prohibited from using excessive force: The moment a suspect submits and stops resisting, the officers must cease use of force. --- DON’T ARGUE WITH ME, DON’T CALL ME NAMES, DON’T TELL ME THAT I CAN’T STOP YOU, DON’T SAY I’M A RACIST PIG, DON’T THREATEN THAT YOU’LL SUE ME AND TAKE AWAY MY BADGE. DON’T SCREAM AT ME THAT YOU PAY MY SALARY, AND DON’T EVEN THINK OF AGGRESSIVELY WALKING TOWARDS ME. --- But if you believe (or know) that the cop stopping you is violating your rights or is acting like a bully, I guarantee that the situation will not become easier if you show your anger and resentment. Worse, initiating a physical confrontation is a sure recipe for getting hurt. Police are legally permitted to use deadly force when they assess a serious threat to their or someone else’s life. Save your anger for later, and channel it appropriately. Do what the officer tells you to and it will end safely for both of you. We have a justice system in which you are presumed innocent; if a cop can do his or her job unmolested, that system can run its course. Later, you can ask for a supervisor, lodge a complaint or contact civil rights organizations if you believe your rights were violated. Feel free to sue the police! Just don’t challenge a cop during a stop. An average person cannot comprehend the risks and has no true understanding of a cop’s job. Hollywood and television stereotypes of the police are cartoons in which fearless super cops singlehandedly defeat dozens of thugs, shooting guns out of their hands. Real life is different. An average cop is always concerned with his or her safety and tries to control every encounter. That is how we are trained. While most citizens are courteous and law abiding, the subset of people we generally interact with everyday are not the genteel types. You don’t know what is in my mind when I stop you. Did I just get a radio call of a shooting moments ago? Am I looking for a murderer or an armed fugitive? For you, this might be a “simple” traffic stop, for me each traffic stop is a potentially dangerous encounter. Show some empathy for an officer’s safety concerns. Don’t make our job more difficult than it already is. Community members deserve courtesy, respect and professionalism from their officers. Every person stopped by a cop should feel safe instead of feeling that their wellbeing is in jeopardy. Shouldn’t the community members extend the same courtesy to their officers and project that the officer’s safety is not threatened by their actions? -- Sunil Dutta, a professor of homeland security at Colorado Tech University, has been an officer with the Los Angeles Police Department for 17 years. The views presented here are his own and do not represent the LAPD. (Edit: but the assdart who posted it at in this 3rd rate forarm thinks it's spot on.) http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if-you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?tid=trending_strip_2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bandrus1 413 Posted August 19, 2014 So your video of the cop dropping something out of his hand is meant to identify that person as a looter. This kind of approach, using a strawman, weakens your message and diminishes your position. IF any individual commits a crime, cop or not, they should be held accountable. That is simply how the world works, using the actions of some cop somewhere as a means to justify the commission of others committing a crime does not work. To answer your question, a looter is someone who takes spoils or plunder, trying to suggest that cops do that is dumb, because I think they do it all the time, does not make it right, not for the cop and certainly not for those in Ferguson. Worse, it hurts the people of Ferguson more than anyone else. Stick to the core of the issue, a young man is dead, lets find out why and lets engage this. Looting is wrong, black, white, cop or not. Our hope now should be to learn how and why this transpired, then teach our youth and police how to not let it happen again. Then maybe we can refocus on the fact that thousands of young black men are dying at the hands of other young black men, y'know, the REAL PROBLEM The young man being dead is not the core issue to me.. As I just stated I think it will come out and the cop will be justified in his use of force... My problem in the whole situation is how everything else has been handled And my point of that video is simple that turn about is fair play... people have tried to paint the picture of people protesting as looting animals with simple a few pictures Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phillybear 366 Posted August 19, 2014 So are they protesting or not? Protesting? Are you kidding me? Yes, they're protesting. Now Stuart, if you look at the soil around any large U.S. city with a big underground homosexual population - Des Moines, Iowa, perfect example. Look at the soil around Des Moines, Stuart. You can't build on it, you can't grow anything in it. The government says it's due to poor farming. But I know what's really going on, Stuart. I know it's the queers. They're in it with the aliens. They're building landing strips for gay Martians. I swear to God. You know what Stuart, I like you. You're not like the other people, here in the trailer park. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cloaca du jour 2,151 Posted August 19, 2014 DON’T ARGUE WITH ME, DON’T CALL ME NAMES, DON’T TELL ME THAT I CAN’T STOP YOU, DON’T SAY I’M A RACIST PIG, DON’T THREATEN THAT YOU’LL SUE ME AND TAKE AWAY MY BADGE. DON’T SCREAM AT ME THAT YOU PAY MY SALARY.[/size] All of which are completely legal Just not good judgement Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vikings4ever 556 Posted August 19, 2014 DON’T ARGUE WITH ME, DON’T CALL ME NAMES, DON’T TELL ME THAT I CAN’T STOP YOU, DON’T SAY I’M A RACIST PIG, DON’T THREATEN THAT YOU’LL SUE ME AND TAKE AWAY MY BADGE. DON’T SCREAM AT ME THAT YOU PAY MY SALARY. All of which are completely legal Legal, yes. But general rule of thumb: people are less likely to go easy on you or do you a favor if you act like an azzhole. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crackattack 520 Posted August 19, 2014 By why even use the term animal...unless trying to bait in this case? There is no reason to use it in the sentence quoted...none at all. Whether its to make someone bring up race...or whatever...and its not limited to this board. Its done all the time. I don't think its a huge leap given the word being used and the context of taking the word of "animals" over police officers. As if the looters' opinions have been discussed in this thread. And I don't see it far fetched to assume it's meant to address the law breaking rioters since it's been discussed numerous times in this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimmySmith 2,782 Posted August 19, 2014 Not sure a cop involved in killing someone is always the most trusted...especially if he may have not handled it all properly. "may". Your ilk took a side against the cop as soon as the story broke. Once again, reality prevailed and your side were as much as co-conspirators in the destruction of a town. Now you'll change your tune to, "well it's the principle", "it's systemic racism". Ignoring the fact that once again, you took the side of a thug over the authority figure strictly because of race. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 And I don't see it far fetched to assume it's meant to address the law breaking rioters since it's been discussed numerous times in this thread. Which law breaking rioters have been quoted or had their opinions used to support any argument against police. The context of what he said...makes zero sense for it to be about rioters since not one person in this thread has mentioned the opinions or rioters meaning more than that of police. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 "may". Your ilk took a side against the cop as soon as the story broke. Once again, reality prevailed and your side were as much as co-conspirators in the destruction of a town. Now you'll change your tune to, "well it's the principle", "it's systemic racism". Ignoring the fact that once again, you took the side of a thug over the authority figure strictly because of race. My ilk? My ilk again has been the side looking at both possibilities...while another side has taken one side almost 100% and not given in to the possibility of any wrongdoing on the part of the cop. How is my side destroying the town? Not one person in here has sided with people looting. This is drobeski style of throwing crap at the wall and hoping something sticks. What thug did I take the side of? And where did I even take any side based on race or used race to form my opinions of what has happened here? You sure are throwing out a lot of false accusations about what has been said. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZeroTolerance 584 Posted August 19, 2014 I hope they can get as many valid witness accounts as possible. Sadly, unless there are multiple accounts from African-Americans supporting the officer's version of the story it will just be blown off by a large segment of society as a cover-up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RLLD 4,254 Posted August 19, 2014 The young man being dead is not the core issue to me.. As I just stated I think it will come out and the cop will be justified in his use of force... My problem in the whole situation is how everything else has been handled And my point of that video is simple that turn about is fair play... people have tried to paint the picture of people protesting as looting animals with simple a few pictures We can agree to disagree. I do not believe that the kid needs to be dead. I think that the cop could have been better trained to handle the situation, and I think the kids parents could have done a better job raising their son. I think this kid could have changed the way he handled himself. In the end its about teaching kids to respect others (dont rob the local shop, dont mouth off to the police, dont physically confront ANY person wielding a weapon) at the very core of this. The people conducting the looting are criminals, but animals is a term I typically reserve for those committing rape, child molestations etc. Animals typically fight each other over mating rights etc, they dont rob the local store for shoes because the opportunity arises. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bandrus1 413 Posted August 19, 2014 We can agree to disagree. I do not believe that the kid needs to be dead. I think that the cop could have been better trained to handle the situation, and I think the kids parents could have done a better job raising their son. I think this kid could have changed the way he handled himself. In the end its about teaching kids to respect others (dont rob the local shop, dont mouth off to the police, dont physically confront ANY person wielding a weapon) at the very core of this. those are all could have, would have, should haves There was a local police officer here in my town who was charged and shot with his own weapon very recently..... None of us know the details but if I was a betting man I would probably bet on the use of force being justified... Although I could wrong very easy here Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RLLD 4,254 Posted August 19, 2014 those are all could have, would have, should haves There was a local police officer here in my town who was charged and shot with his own weapon very recently..... None of us know the details but if I was a betting man I would probably bet on the use of force being justified... Although I could wrong very easy here Agreed. I prefer to find a way to avoid the "next time" of course, and then see this energy applied to the actual problem, young black men killing each other is alarming numbers. This event is a diversion that only feeds new sponsors, the pockets of Sharpton and Jackson, and the voting booths for local politicians. This is news people many people want to exploit the kids death for themselves. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bandrus1 413 Posted August 19, 2014 Agreed. I prefer to find a way to avoid the "next time" of course, and then see this energy applied to the actual problem, young black men killing each other is alarming numbers. This event is a diversion that only feeds new sponsors, the pockets of Sharpton and Jackson, and the voting booths for local politicians. This is news people many people want to exploit the kids death for themselves. well said Ray. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Moz 69 Posted August 19, 2014 The post where "animals" wasn't just used for the looters. Is Gorrilla's Okay To use. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RLLD 4,254 Posted August 19, 2014 Is Gorrilla's Okay To use. I am going to say no in this instance.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crackattack 520 Posted August 19, 2014 I am going to say no in this instance.... What if warfare or tactics follows? Eta: the looters and rioters are using gorrilla tactics?? even tho I know it's guerrilla tactics or warfare. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
drobeski 3,061 Posted August 19, 2014 Who's used the term animals in relation to anyone other than the looters and rioters ? Snuffdog making chit up again ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eaglesin14 12 Posted August 19, 2014 The post where "animals" wasn't just used for the looters. I don't know who else used the term, but I did in reference to the looters, rioters, those throwing Molotov cocktails, and the dead kid and his accomplice for robbing the store. I don't care what color any of them are.....when you do those things you are an animal. So take your race baiting somewhere else. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posty 2,714 Posted August 19, 2014 Everything is fine now, Obama is watching... http://news.yahoo.com/obama-to-send-holder-to-ferguson--says-police-should-not-be-militarized-213815107.html “I’ll be watching over the next several days to assess whether, in fact, it’s helping rather than hindering progress in Ferguson,” the president said, underlining that he had expressed his concerns to Nixon by telephone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eaglesin14 12 Posted August 19, 2014 It hasn't all been peaceful though has it? And when does the safety of both the police and protesters and bystanmders become the issue? Police, protesters, and bystanders are three groups, so "both" would not apply. Once again, your English teacher should be clubbed to death like a baby seal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IGotWorms 4,059 Posted August 19, 2014 Everything is fine now, Obama is watching... http://news.yahoo.com/obama-to-send-holder-to-ferguson--says-police-should-not-be-militarized-213815107.html Ill be watching over the next several days to assess whether, in fact, its helping rather than hindering progress in Ferguson, the president said, underlining that he had expressed his concerns to Nixon by telephone. Just out of curiosity, what do you think he should be doing? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BunnysBastatrds 2,458 Posted August 19, 2014 The facts are out civil liberties are dying and people support it Right to peacefully assemble disbanded Mandatory curfews Police going house to house without warrants Press being blocked and harassed and in some cases wrongfully detained People having tear gas fired at them while on their own private property Over militarized police state There's a credible story here that a gang of African-American males were shot on a rooftop by police and military assault helicopters and their bodies were thrown in the river. The reason they were killed is because they decided it was a good idea to shoot AK-47's at the police and the helicopters who were trying to save lives in the middle of a natural disaster. They were impeding the safety of the police and the citizens who were trying to get out. They were killed because they were shooting at police and army helicopters. Not because they were black. Are you ok with that? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 Who's used the term animals in relation to anyone other than the looters and rioters ? Snuffdog making chit up again ? Quoted the post earlier from NV. Unless one of you two can point out anyone in this thread who has quoted the words of looters vs. the words of the cop. Unlike you, I don't need to make things up and hope some crap sticks to the wall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bandrus1 413 Posted August 19, 2014 There's a credible story here that a gang of African-American males were shot on a rooftop by police and military assault helicopters and their bodies were thrown in the river. The reason they were killed is because they decided it was a good idea to shoot AK-47's at the police and the helicopters who were trying to save lives in the middle of a natural disaster. They were impeding the safety of the police and the citizens who were trying to get out. They were killed because they were shooting at police and army helicopters. Not because they were black. Are you ok with that? yes besides bodies being tossed in the river Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BunnysBastatrds 2,458 Posted August 19, 2014 My ilk? My ilk again has been the side looking at both possibilities...while another side has taken one side almost 100% and not given in to the possibility of any wrongdoing on the part of the cop. How is my side destroying the town? Not one person in here has sided with people looting. This is drobeski style of throwing crap at the wall and hoping something sticks. What thug did I take the side of? And where did I even take any side based on race or used race to form my opinions of what has happened here? You sure are throwing out a lot of false accusations about what has been said. You sure do spend a lot of time defending yourself in threads like these. Interesting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
drobeski 3,061 Posted August 19, 2014 You sure do spend a lot of time defending yourself in threads like these. Interesting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
drobeski 3,061 Posted August 19, 2014 Quoted the post earlier from NV. Unless one of you two can point out anyone in this thread who has quoted the words of looters vs. the words of the cop. Unlike you, I don't need to make things up and hope some crap sticks to the wall. this thread is titled "situation in Ferguson" ya fockin potato, news flash ....looting and rioting have a little to do with the "situation" Just a little. Eltardo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eaglesin14 12 Posted August 19, 2014 I would agree just limiting it to looters is not racist. That is not exactly how all have used the term...and they are using that term for a reason (that has little to do with it being looters...they are baiting and they know it). Who are "they"? They indicates more than one. So who are the multiple posters not limiting it to looters? Or is this just another example of why your English teacher needs to be clubbed to death like a baby seal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SouthGeorgia 2 Posted August 19, 2014 Big Mike done went and strong armed jacked a Haji for some grape flavored cigars den done went and got his ass shot in da head for trying that shiat on the PO lease. Big Mike was headed to prison long before this incident ever happened. He is a product of his parents. They might as well have dug his grave a year ago. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eaglesin14 12 Posted August 19, 2014 A St. Louis newspaper crime reporter is saying the cops have a dozen witnesses corroborating the cops version of events. Poor woman is about to be hammered by the left. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 You sure do spend a lot of time defending yourself in threads like these. Interesting. Because people of your ilk (to use that term) like to spend a lot of time mischaracterizing what other people say (especially those that disagree with you politically). Seems the only tactic you all have. Why is that? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sho Nuff 720 Posted August 19, 2014 this thread is titled "situation in Ferguson" ya fockin potato, news flash ....looting and rioting have a little to do with the "situation" Just a little. Eltardo Are you really this dense? Looting has to do with the situation...I never denied this. Read NV's post. It had nothing to do with looting. It was about people taking the opinion of "animals" over cops. So, unless anyone in this thread has quoted looters and criminals to take their opinions over the cops...he was not talking about that group. If he was...he was throwing out complete crap (like you do) hoping it would stick. But you won't see that...and anyone with any sense knows why. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bandrus1 413 Posted August 19, 2014 http://pando.com/2014/08/19/more-journalists-arrested-in-ferguson-last-night-so-much-for-freedom-of-the-press/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SUXBNME 1,516 Posted August 19, 2014 http://pando.com/2014/08/19/more-journalists-arrested-in-ferguson-last-night-so-much-for-freedom-of-the-press/ Good. They were told to leave, they didn't, so they got arrested. I fail to see the problem with that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NorthernVike 2,087 Posted August 19, 2014 Are you really this dense? Looting has to do with the situation...I never denied this. Read NV's post. It had nothing to do with looting. It was about people taking the opinion of "animals" over cops. So, unless anyone in this thread has quoted looters and criminals to take their opinions over the cops...he was not talking about that group. If he was...he was throwing out complete crap (like you do) hoping it would stick. But you won't see that...and anyone with any sense knows why. RMFF Share this post Link to post Share on other sites