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GREAT post on twitter: I watched the entire press conference with Zelensky. There was 40 minutes of discussion up to the argument. Most people saw at most the last ten minutes. The whole video gives the proper context. When I first watched the argument without the proper context, I thought it was possible that Trump and Vance ambushed Zelensky or were even trying to humiliate him. That's not what happened. You had 40 minutes of calm conversation. Vance made a point that didn't attack Zelensky and wasn't even addressed to him, and Zelensky clearly started the argument. In the first 40 minutes, Zelensky kept trying to go beyond what was negotiated in the deal. When Trump was asked a question, it was always "we'll see." Zelensky made blanket assertions that there would be no negotiating with Putin, and that Russia would pay for the war. When Trump said that it was a tragedy that people on both sides were dying, Zelensky interjected that the Russians were the invaders. For his part, Trump made clear that the US would continue delivering military aid. All Zelensky had to do was remain calm for a few more minutes and they would've signed a deal. The argument started when Trump pointed out that it would be hard to make a deal if you talk about Putin the way Zelensky does. Vance interjects to make the reasonable point that Biden called Putin names and that didn't get us anywhere. The Zelensky/Trump dynamic was calm and stable. It was when Vance spoke that Zelensky started to interrogate him. Throughout the press conference to that point, everyone was making their arguments directly to the audience. Zelensky decided to challenge Vance and ask him hostile questions. He went back to his point that Putin never sticks to ceasefires, once again implying that negotiations are pointless. Why on earth would you do this? Then came the fight we all saw. Zelensky was minutes away from being home free, and he would have had the deal and new commitments from the Trump administration. The point Vance made was directed against Biden and the media, taking them to task for speaking in moralistic terms. This offended Zelensky, and that began the argument. I've been a fan of Zelensky up to this point, but this showed so much incompetence, if not emotional instability, that I don't see how he recovers from this. The relationship with the administration is broken. Ukraine should probably go with new leadership at this point.

Russia Vs Ukraine is a battle of bad vs not quite as bad. There are no angels , no good guys. Russia never should have went in . Zelensky really screwed the pooch today

Not really. Is our support for Ukraine supposed to be predicated on whether he wears a suit or thanks Trump enough? That’s really childish don’t you think? Our support, as always, should be based solely on whether in its our best interests to support them. I think we can all at least agree on that basic idea. I say it still is, though I expect many of you to disagree with me. The minerals deal is still on the table and we need it. I have an optimistic feeling we’ll get it done, because in the end Zelensky needs our support as well.

CFO material.

I really have to challenge this. Trump says the same thing all the time, but I don’t see any evidence of it, certainly not from Zelensky. His only disagreement with Trump was about who started the war. How exactly was he being disrespectful. As always, for much of the press conference Trump told lie after lie after lie. (For example the tired lie that we’ve given 380 billion to Ukraine and received nothing back.) Zelensky could have interrupted him several times and said that’s just not true. He didn’t. Out of politeness he kept his mouth shut for the most part, disagreeing only when Trump argued that we should trust Putin. And he wasn’t rude or disrespectful about it.

"The Night of the Hunter" (1955), where the main character, a preacher named Harry Powell played by Robert Mitchum, has the word "love" tattooed on one hand and "hate" on the other.

You let a thread title hurt your feelings? Your first day posting here?

Good they can fund the war then. We can step out

You're offended by the thread title, so you created a new one?

We will see the US become the enemy here very soon. People are being plaaayyyeeeddd. Fact: Nato built military bases on Russia's border. Something the US would not tolerate if it happened to them. Fact: US tax payer money was laundered through Ukraine. It went into the pockets of rich people. Why would anyone sane want to continue this? The world is throwing a tantrum becsuee US tax payers won't subside the world's wars any more. Solution: anyone who wants to support the war can Venmo cash direct to Zelensky.

I’ll read all of it. Cato is a source I trust.

We were. Daddy is home now and and the world can hear that china cabinet rattle when dad comes home from work and pulls up in his 74 Trailduster with dual tips. Better get your sh!t together

From @warclandestine Zelensky is a dead man walking. He has two options: A) Surrender, agree to ceasefire, Trump finds out where the money went in Ukraine, and he’s a dead man. Don’t surrender, Trump shuts off all support, Putin takes all of Ukraine, and he’s a dead man. Pick your poison. At least option A will spare the lives of many innocent Ukrainian and Russian soldiers, but no matter how you slice it, there is no scenario where Zelensky survives this. Zelensky just dug his own grave in front of the entire world.

Give him the Benny Hill head slaps

Napoleon complex is always fun to watch

Let them pay for it, then.

As Nikita Khrushchev said in 1956: “We will take America without firing a shot. We do not have to invade the U.S. We will destroy you from within”.

Russia’s greatest military asset is not any bomb, tank, plane or ship. It is the Republican Party.

And Rodgers after he gets back from his ayahuasca retreat.

If Zelensky keeps it up maybe the front lines will come to him. He focked up today and Ukraine needs to meet him at the airport and tell him to turn around and apologize.

Absolutely. The reporter along with everyone else already knows Zelensky hasn't worn a suit since the war started as a way of showing solidarity with his troops.

You guys have watched too many Sopranos episodes. All I saw was an actor, a bunch of boot-lickers, and one president defending his country: the president of Ukraine. "Why aren't you wearing a suit?" That was just an ass kiss to Trump who values that sort of thing.

Like Gay Pride month?

Completely forgot that one. I know I have the DVD laying around somewhere. May have to watch it later tonight.

and Lazard and Cobb