Who's your top 5 QB's of all time?

[Kopy 491]

1. Russell Wilson

2. Russell Wilson

3. Matt Hasselbeck

4. Dave Krieg

5. Jim Zorn

 

Honorable mention: Jon Kitna. Hey give the kid some props.

 

Most fun to watch: Warren Moon. It was a fun couple of years he aired it out for us.

 

Biggest tease: Rick Mirer. Liked him at Dame. Had a good rookie year. Wish he could've been Bledsoe.

 

Biggest WTF? moment: Dan McGwire. Hate him, Still do. Worse than the Clip board jesus experiment.

 

Best Journey man: Tie Tarvaris Jackson/ John Friez. They are what they are. Backups

 

Fixed.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

You have Manning...

 

And then everyone else.

He changed the way the position is played. His stats are just mind numbing.

[TD Ryan2 314]

You have Manning...

 

And then everyone else.

Bill Polian and the competition committee changed the way the game is played - passing stats are just mind numbing today.

[Showboat 145]

Sure, Manning has the stats, but Unitas truly changed the game in an era when touching the QB (or receivers) was NOT a penalty. My guess is that Unitas would also put up mind-blowing stats in today's game. Would Manning be able to match Unitas' numbers if he played back then? Who knows? It is really impossible to compare QB's from different eras because there is really very little basis for making a comparison. Stat comparisons are simply unfair with today's rules that heavily favor passing games.

[jgcrawfish 232]

1. Tommy Maddox

Terry Bradshaw

Ben Roethlisberger

Bobby Lane

Bubby Brister

[FlaHawker 24]

 

1. Tommy Maddox
2. Terry Bradshaw
3. Ben Roethlisberger
4. Bobby Lane
5. Bubby Brister

 

Wow you're not even original.

[gitrdun 16]

You can not compare different era's. I would have loved to see Staubach, Stabler, Greise in today game. There really wasn't a short passing game or the west coast offense. These quarterbacks didn't throw for a high % since they thru deep so much. I think Bradshaw had a 52% career completion %. Can you imagine that in todays game.

[RoadLizard 73]

Ryan! Hey - Polian probably wasnt the only one that wanted the rules changed. Just like in Hockey when the world got tired of clutch, grab, and hook hockey played by the NJ Devils: The rules were changed and the game is WAY better because of it. I get that NE was just playing by the rules at the time but NO fans wanted to watch ball-numbing, WR mugging. Makes the game boring. Just like the trap in the NHL and the fact that goalies cannot play every puck that gets sent it deep like the used to. Goals are up and the fans are happier.

 

The Pats probably would have beaten Indy back then anyways but there is NO way they would beaten the Rams in the SB with the current rules. No effing way.

[TD Ryan2 314]

Agreed about the Pats and Rams.

And agree a bit about the benefits of the rule changes too- but only a bit though bc it has gone too far. Defenses are too handicapped by today's rules.

And IMO it's why defensive teams surprise and overachieve in post season.

Whistles are swallowed more in post season and finesse teams are forced to play a slightly different game - one they don't like as much.

[tiggo25 4]

Im fond of debating this topic. Ill get one thing out of the way, Marino isnt on the list and id even rank Drew Brees over him.

 

My criteria for judgement is 3 sections. Postseason prowess (did they win? Epic comebacks? knack for shining on the biggest stage?), Reg season stats (mvps, records, fantasy monsters), overall look and feel (guys like Marino and Moon who looked and played great despite not winning.).

 

 

That said, heres my master list.

 

1.Montana- Playoff prowess is the factor here, the 4rings are the icing. His stats were good so hes not a bum joe namath type. If Peyton wins this SB, the discussion can heat up, til then its not debateable.

 

My criteria for judgement is 3 sections. Postseason prowess, Reg season stats, overall look and feel.

 

While I agree for the most part due to his 16-7 playoff record. And I would rank Montana top 5 for sure.

 

But of those 23 playoff games, 12 were played at home. 7 games played on the road. 4 were neutral field.

Home playoff record: 10-2

Road playoff record: 2-5

Neutral Field playoff record: 4-0

 

It's hard to win on the road in the playoffs and looking at Montana's road stats makes this even more telling. I haven't looked at others, but would be curious to see what the other QBs road stats are in the playoffs.

 

I'll check some of the others when I have more time and not at work.

[TheUsualSuspect 207]

I haven't looked at others, but would be curious to see what the other QBs road stats are in the playoffs.

 

I'll check some of the others when I have more time and not at work.

Off the top of head, Eli has a pretty good road record. And whether people want to admit this or not, he will be a HOF quarterback unless his career somehow ends abruptly.

[JT 137]

Off the top of head, Eli has a pretty good road record. And whether people want to admit this or not, he will be a HOF quarterback unless his career somehow ends abruptly.

 

Let's say he has 3-5 more years where he is around his career regular season numbers of 58% comp %, pedestrian TD/Int ratio, and the team isn't a serious contender.

 

Just for comparison sake (and a very random one at that), Carson Palmer's career stats dwarf Eli's. 0-2 post season record. I don't believe he's a HOFer.

 

So do you think the two post-season runs make Eli a lock? Or would he be viewed as a guy who got in a good situation and made the best of it, like Dilfer, Plunkett or Rypien x 2? (Rypien might well be the best comparison. Similar regular season stats when you factor in the era, 4 post seasons, 5-3 record, a SB ring).

[tiggo25 4]

Here's a link to someone that has already broken down the QB playoff records.

 

http://6thring.com/nfl-qb-playoff-record-roethlisberger-brady-manning.html

 

Just picked some randomly from being mentioned in this thread. Most QBs are listed at the link.

Eli Manning

Playoff record: 8-3
Home playoff record: 1-2
Road playoff record: 5-1
Non-wild card playoff record: 6-1
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 19.82
Super Bowl appearances: 2
Super Bowl rings: 2

 

Mark Rypien

Playoff record: 5-2
Home playoff record: 2-0
Road playoff record: 2-2
Non-wild card playoff record: 3-2
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 21.125
Super Bowl appearances: 1
Super Bowl rings: 1

 

 

Peyton Manning

Playoff record: 11-11
Home playoff record: 8-5
Road playoff record: 2-5
Non-wild card playoff record: 8-7
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 23.18
Super Bowl appearances: 3
Super Bowl rings: 1* (TBD)

 

Tom Brady

Playoff record: 18-8
Home playoff record: 12-3
Road playoff record: 3-3
Non-wild card playoff record: 16-7
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 25.12
Super Bowl appearances: 5
Super Bowl rings: 3

 

Joe Montana

Playoff record: 16-7
Home playoff record: 10-2
Road playoff record: 2-5
Non-wild card playoff record: 15-5
30-30-30 seasons: 1
Playoff points per game average: 25.35
Super Bowl appearances: 4
Super Bowl rings: 4

Steve Young

Playoff record: 8-6
Home playoff record: 7-3
Road playoff record: 0-3
Non-wild card playoff record: 6-6
30-30-30 seasons: 1
Playoff points per game average: 26.93
Super Bowl appearances: 1
Super Bowl rings: 1

 

John Elway

Playoff record: 14-7
Home playoff record: 9-2
Road playoff record: 3-2
Non-wild card playoff record: 13-6
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 25.0
Super Bowl appearances: 5
Super Bowl rings: 2

Dan Marino

Playoff record: 8-10
Home playoff record: 7-3
Road playoff record: 1-6
Non-wild card playoff record: 4-8
30-30-30 seasons: 0
Playoff points per game average: 20.50
Super Bowl appearances: 1
Super Bowl rings: 0

[R8RMick 242]

Montana

Elway

Marino

P Manning

Staubach

 

I know it's a wildcard but I've always wondered what The Dodger would do if he hadn't given the Navy four prime years of his life (one spent in Vietnam). Or also if he'd been allowed to call his own plays by Tom Landry. Still, he was one clutch player.

[jgcrawfish 232]

Wow you're not even original.

I didn't even read through the thread, just popped in and posted. But on another note...

 

stalk much?

 

 

 

 

Off the top of my head, in no particular order:

 

Montana

Marino

Manning (Peyton)

Elway

Brady

[Showboat 145]

Another way to look it is to ask who was the dominant (or defining) QB for each decade? My list would be:

 

50s: Graham

60s: Unitas, Starr

70s: Bradshaw, Staubach, Tarkenton

80s: Montana

90s: Favre, Elway, Marino, Young, Kelly, Aikman

00s: Brady, Manning

To me, Montana clearly dominated the 80s relegating Marino and Elway to consideration only in the 90s where there wasn't really a dominant QB. If Brady had another ring and Manning didn't have the fortune of playing Rex Grossman in the Super Bowl, I wouldn't even consider Manning in the 00s discussion (similar to Montana/Marino in the 80s), but as it is, there is a chink in the Brady armor. It will be interesting to see who emerges as the QB of the 10s. Brees and Rodgers are clear favorites, but it would be tough to dismiss Big Ben or Eli if either earned a couple more rings and there is still time for the younger guys like Cam, Wilson, Luck or someone who hasn't even been drafted yet to put together a dominant run.

 

 

[49ER MAN 0]

Otto Graham was 7-3 in 10 championship games. He played 10 years and led his team to the title game every year he played not to mention his last year, he came out of retirement to led his team to another championship.

[rholio 339]

Otto Graham was 7-3 in 10 championship games. He played 10 years and led his team to the title game every year he played not to mention his last year, he came out of retirement to led his team to another championship.

Otto always gets my vote for best ever.

 

Otto Graham

Unitas

Montana

Manning

 

top 4 are easy imo, that 5th spot is a killer. Marino, Moon, Starr, Favre, Elway, and Brady would all fit there. Staubach and Young are right there as well, although generally a tier down for most. I'd put Marino 5th for now, with Brady right behind him.

[sirensong 111]

i don't understand why moon is getting mentions. granted, he put up 2 seasons of 90+ QBR, and had a few 4K+ seasons before the run-and-shoot trend got dissected and negated by defensive coordinators. but i just don't see him as a consistent performer approaching the level of marino, who played in the exact same timeframe.

 

he was a solid QB, no question. but i don't think he deserves mention here.

[rholio 339]

i don't understand why moon is getting mentions. granted, he put up 2 seasons of 90+ QBR, and had a few 4K+ seasons before the run-and-shoot trend got dissected and negated by defensive coordinators. but i just don't see him as a consistent performer approaching the level of marino, who played in the exact same timeframe.

 

he was a solid QB, no question. but i don't think he deserves mention here.

 

Huge numbers in Canada before getting a shot in the NFL, followed by huge numbers in the NFL. Like Staubach, he missed some prime years away from the NFL, which hurt his career stats.

[sirensong 111]

 

Huge numbers in Canada before getting a shot in the NFL, followed by huge numbers in the NFL. Like Staubach, he missed some prime years away from the NFL, which hurt his career stats.

 

that's my point. he had 4 years of huge numbers in his 17 year NFL career--2 in houston and 2 in minn--all tied to a gimmick offense. the RnS was that generation's equivalent to the pure read-option, and notice that the read option lasted 2 years as a primary attack. it's already on the downslope, and the RO QBs are now being judged on whether or not they can operate at a high level in more traditional schemes. concepts remain, but the pure scheme gets superseded by sound fundamentals.

 

looking at the career stats, that's what you see with moon--a couple of huge years, followed by a return to solid but unspectacular play as defenses figure out how to negate the gimmicks. this is IMO the fundamental difference between a guy like moon and a guy like manning. both operated in pass-first schemes, but manning has been far more consistent because he's not a scheme guy.

 

IMO, guys like marino, montana, manning, etc. could excel in any scheme. without the RnS, moon was a solid but unspectacular QB.

 

but i suppose that's a debate that could rage forever.

[Dan 59]

You realize that Moon retired with top 5 passing yard numbers, right? A few seasons? If it was only the RnS that gave him those numbers, my response is, "whatever." People will balk at calling Brady a system QB, which he clearly is . . . but most successful QBs are. But Moon gets knocked because of the system he was in? Doesn't make sense. His numbers were prolific, and that was spotting his peers a good portion of his prime.

[sirensong 111]

You realize that Moon retired with top 5 passing yard numbers, right? A few seasons? If it was only the RnS that gave him those numbers, my response is, "whatever." People will balk at calling Brady a system QB, which he clearly is . . . but most successful QBs are. But Moon gets knocked because of the system he was in? Doesn't make sense. His numbers were prolific, and that was spotting his peers a good portion of his prime.

 

just a difference of opinion--moon did nothing that fouts wasn't already doing better. and moon came into the league with a lot more seasoning.

 

no one is saying that he wasn't a good QB. i'm just saying that he doesn't belong in the same conversation with the guys at the apex of the position.

[tikigods 76]

1. Joe Montana

2. Terry Bradshaw

3. Tom Brady

4. Troy Aikman

5. John Elway

[DrG 94]

Montana I just can't argue w 4 Super Bowls.

 

AAron Rodgers to me has to be in the mix because of how he makes all the players around him so much better

[LOD01 191]

You have Manning...

 

And then everyone else.

He changed the way the position is played. His stats are just mind numbing.

 

Is this the 'who's the greatest NFL stat thread'? If so, it's Manning. If it's greatness, he's even behind Favre. Manning is a post season LOSER at 11-12. Biggest loser in NFL post season history.

[Vince44 202]

The best QB I've seen with my eyes was Steve Young and he never gets any consideration on these lists.

 

His game had absolutely no weakness.

 

I think the real problem with Steve Young is that his window of greatness only lasted from about 92-95. He started to fall off in 96/97 but rebounded big in 98. He doesn't have the decade of dominance like Montana, Elway, Favre, Brady, and Manning. The fact that he had to wait a long time till he could start for the Niners and the string of concussions that hit him in the mid to late 90's keeps him out of top 5 lists.

 

 

[plasma george 52]

Those I found most compelling to watch:

Unitas

Namath

R. Cunningham (homer bias)

Fouts

P. Manning

 

HM: Tarkenton, Favre

 

Most compelling to watch

Mike Vick

No contest

(Runner up Randall Cunningham)

[49ER MAN 0]

No particular order:

 

Otto Graham

Joe Montana

Tom Brady

Peyton Manning

John Elway

[DrG 94]

As a long time 9er fan I can tell you that Joe had better touch and accuracy and could make tight window throws

 

Steve was a better runner and stronger but not as adept w the touch pass. Joe also won more close games. Steve was a great qb but did not quite have the same knack

[DrG 94]

By decade

Otto Graham 50s

Starr Unitas and Tittle

Staunch Bradshaw 4 titles pretty impressive

Montana (Phil Simms is under rated for this time)

Favre

Brady

Aaron Rodgers

There are more prolific passers not on this list but I think being a big game qb matters

[edjr 5,567]

Brady

Bledsoe

Grogan

Flutie

Hodson

[tikigods 76]

Brady

Bledsoe

Grogan

Flutie

Hodson

 

"Fvck you." - Tony Eason

[tanatastic 2,061]

 

Another way to look it is to ask who was the dominant (or defining) QB for each decade? My list would be:

 

50s: Graham

60s: Unitas, Starr

70s: Bradshaw, Staubach, Tarkenton

80s: Montana

90s: Favre, Elway, Marino, Young, Kelly, Aikman

00s: Brady, Manning

To me, Montana clearly dominated the 80s relegating Marino and Elway to consideration only in the 90s where there wasn't really a dominant QB. If Brady had another ring and Manning didn't have the fortune of playing Rex Grossman in the Super Bowl, I wouldn't even consider Manning in the 00s discussion (similar to Montana/Marino in the 80s), but as it is, there is a chink in the Brady armor. It will be interesting to see who emerges as the QB of the 10s. Brees and Rodgers are clear favorites, but it would be tough to dismiss Big Ben or Eli if either earned a couple more rings and there is still time for the younger guys like Cam, Wilson, Luck or someone who hasn't even been drafted yet to put together a dominant run.

 

 

 

Err, I think you need to recheck your stats, Marino was an 80s qb, not a 90s one. He was garbage in the 90s and had his few huge seasons in the 80s. Losing playoff record and has been written out of the record books by Favre. Marino isnt even in the discussion for top 5 all time. Pure passer? Sure, but you gotta do something to be mentioned with the greats. Not have 2 monster seasons then 20 mediocre ones.

[Showboat 145]

Err, I think you need to recheck your stats, Marino was an 80s qb, not a 90s one. He was garbage in the 90s and had his few huge seasons in the 80s. Losing playoff record and has been written out of the record books by Favre. Marino isnt even in the discussion for top 5 all time. Pure passer? Sure, but you gotta do something to be mentioned with the greats. Not have 2 monster seasons then 20 mediocre ones.

Well, Marino started in 83 and played through 99, so technically he played more seasons in the 90s. In any case, I agree with you. Some earlier posts had listed him as a top 5 all time, but that is impossible to justify when he was never even the dominant QB of his era.

[tanatastic 2,061]

Well, Marino started in 83 and played through 99, so technically he played more seasons in the 90s. In any case, I agree with you. Some earlier posts had listed him as a top 5 all time, but that is impossible to justify when he was never even the dominant QB of his era.

I feel you on the years played but I meant he was great in the 80s so thats where he should be recognized. Just like Favre who played the whole 00' decade but dominated in the 90s. Players should always be remembered in their best decades. It gets murky with a guy like Jerry rice who was awesome in the 80s and 90s, but hes the best player of all time so he cant be put in categories at all really.

 

A guy I feel bad for is Kelly. If he had just won 1 of those 4 he would be remembered as far greater than he is. But thats how it goes with Qbs.

[big dog 0]

Joe Montana

Tom Brady

John Elway

Danny Marino

Bart Starr

[mesut 0]

Otto Graham

Joe Montana

Tom Brady

Peyton Manning

John Elway

[tanatastic 2,061]

Otto Graham

Joe Montana

Tom Brady

Peyton Manning

John Elway

This list is pretty accurate if you dont judge based on era. But to me you cant do that, games drastically change, especially in sports that didnt allow black players but are now mostly black (any athletic sport). No player is taken seriously to me if they didnt play with SB era gear and didnt play against mostly black people, they simply are superior athletes. Ill allow Johnny U but thats pushin it. Basketball is the same way as is baseball.

[Vikings4ever 496]

This list is pretty accurate if you dont judge based on era. But to me you cant do that, games drastically change, especially in sports that didnt allow black players but are now mostly black (any athletic sport). No player is taken seriously to me if they didnt play with SB era gear and didnt play against mostly black people, they simply are superior athletes. Ill allow Johnny U but thats pushin it. Basketball is the same way as is baseball.

I don't think you can put baseball in the same class, as pure athletic ability doesn't make as much difference as it does in football and basketball. Even now, only about 8% of MLB players are African American.