Blue Horseshoe 348 Posted June 15, 2023 8 hours ago, Engorgeous George said: I support the right of the accused to defend himself, and others, from immenent danger accurtately and reasonably perceived. As I understand matters the perception of real and immenent danger was not only the perception of the marine, but of several otyhers in the subway car. To me taht confluence of perception is indicative of an objective danger, not merely a subjectively perceived danger, incorrectly perceived. Jury composition will be huge in this case. People who regularly ride the subway are just going to plain feel differently about all this. Team Blue is stuck here. If Penny gets off, the eventual rioting and looting and burning will continue to turn small business owners in NY away from Democrats. These are long standing legacy voting losses that can't be recovered. Lee Zeldin got way way closer than anyone believed was possible against Hochul for NY Governor. If Penny is convicted, Team Blue continues to incite the military vote against them. Afghanistan could have lost Team Blue some military voters for up to FIVE full general election cycles in the future. The other long term problem is convicting Penny will encourage "self created justice" in the streets. You'd have to go back to Scorsese's Taxi Driver to really unpack it. See a guy committing a violent crime in NY. Take our your hidden gun, legal or not, shoot the criminal in the head. Then call no one. Tell no one. Everyone around says nothing at all. What's the problem with normalized "vigilante" justice? Eventually they figure out it's time to go after the "People In Charge" When you remove basic civil order in any large community, some kind of "surrogate system" will eventually emerge. And the pathway for that can spin out of control very quickly. Hochul and Bragg can be smug and toxic about all this, but are they prepared to see a mass of firearm related hits all over the city again and again? Then if you try to "take the guns" with more Team Blue NY public policy, how do you think people will react then? Power is mostly useless when you have people coming after you and your children non stop. If you are seen as the "reason for blame", fair or not, then people will just come after you. It's how it works. At some point, citizens will just start shooting criminals en masse. What will Bragg do then? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,893 Posted June 15, 2023 20 minutes ago, Blue Horseshoe said: Jury composition will be huge in this case. People who regularly ride the subway are just going to plain feel differently about all this. Team Blue is stuck here. If Penny gets off, the eventual rioting and looting and burning will continue to turn small business owners in NY away from Democrats. These are long standing legacy voting losses that can't be recovered. Lee Zeldin got way way closer than anyone believed was possible against Hochul for NY Governor. If Penny is convicted, Team Blue continues to incite the military vote against them. Afghanistan could have lost Team Blue some military voters for up to FIVE full general election cycles in the future. The other long term problem is convicting Penny will encourage "self created justice" in the streets. You'd have to go back to Scorsese's Taxi Driver to really unpack it. See a guy committing a violent crime in NY. Take our your hidden gun, legal or not, shoot the criminal in the head. Then call no one. Tell no one. Everyone around says nothing at all. What's the problem with normalized "vigilante" justice? Eventually they figure out it's time to go after the "People In Charge" When you remove basic civil order in any large community, some kind of "surrogate system" will eventually emerge. And the pathway for that can spin out of control very quickly. Hochul and Bragg can be smug and toxic about all this, but are they prepared to see a mass of firearm related hits all over the city again and again? Then if you try to "take the guns" with more Team Blue NY public policy, how do you think people will react then? Power is mostly useless when you have people coming after you and your children non stop. If you are seen as the "reason for blame", fair or not, then people will just come after you. It's how it works. At some point, citizens will just start shooting criminals en masse. What will Bragg do then? I don’t think you’ll see protests if Penny gets off. Anyone who rides the subway regularly sees this sort of aggressive behavior out of the deranged homeless sometimes and nobody likes it. I think it’s questionable whether Penny was warranted in restraining this dude but even a supposed lefty like me isn’t going to burn him at the stake for it. Even though I rarely agree with you and your posts are overlong I genuinely think you have some interesting takes fwiw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Voltaire 4,562 Posted July 12, 2023 https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/oakland-county/2023/07/11/person-of-interest-sought-in-troy-target-parking-lot-assault/70402520007/ God Bless the Daniel Pennys of the world, seeing sh*t and acting, risking personal injury to stand up to criminals and protect crime victims they don't know for the betterment of their communities. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted July 12, 2023 7 minutes ago, Voltaire said: https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/oakland-county/2023/07/11/person-of-interest-sought-in-troy-target-parking-lot-assault/70402520007/ God Bless the Daniel Pennys of the world, seeing sh*t and acting, risking personal injury to stand up to criminals and protect crime victims they don't know for the betterment of their communities. Amen my Friend Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RLLD 3,455 Posted July 12, 2023 20 minutes ago, Voltaire said: https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/oakland-county/2023/07/11/person-of-interest-sought-in-troy-target-parking-lot-assault/70402520007/ God Bless the Daniel Pennys of the world, seeing sh*t and acting, risking personal injury to stand up to criminals and protect crime victims they don't know for the betterment of their communities. Let's not forget how "the system" failed this criminal, forcing him to take violent action against others...../sarcasm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alias Detective 1,179 Posted July 12, 2023 On 7/10/2023 at 4:31 PM, dogcows said: Hmm… Why did the cop need subdued? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,657 Posted March 15 Turns out some people are allowed to defend themselves in the subway. Even kill a guy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
