Coronavirus - Doomsday

[Cdub100 3,380]

2 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

Oh no. I'm not trying to make a point or anything as far as a comparison, as I have no clue, but, a lot more people die of the flu here in the US, and probably around the world, than most people would guess.

And most of those are old people who are close to death not men in their primes.

 

[Utilit99 4,099]

2 minutes ago, Cdub100 said:

And most of those are old people who are close to death not men in their primes.

 

I don't have the exact numbers but someone told me just last week that they learned 30,000 of the deaths were infants.

Either way, no matter the age, they all count.

 

[Cdub100 3,380]

1 minute ago, Utilit99 said:

I don't have the exact numbers but someone told me just last week that they learned 30,000 of the deaths were infants.

Either way, no matter the age, they all count.

 

Infants and old people.

Coronavirus kills healthy adults. Right now there's no comparison.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

5 minutes ago, Cdub100 said:

Bingo!

That 80k number would be millions with a US infection.

 

I am not sure that extrapolation is valid either.  This strain is new and it is particularly troublesome to treat, but this happens with new strains.  Remember bird flu and SARS.  The key is limiting spread early on to buy time to come up with treatments to minimize impact.  

[Utilit99 4,099]

10 minutes ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

I am not sure that extrapolation is valid either.  This strain is new and it is particularly troublesome to treat, but this happens with new strains.  Remember bird flu and SARS.  The key is limiting spread early on to buy time to come up with treatments to minimize impact.  

My guess is that current day medical science will solve the mystery of this flu. It has before for others. In the end, it will be one example of why there will end up being a massive over population of this planet some day. In this type of case, for good reason, as opposed to poor families having 5+ kids that the parents can't afford to take care of and educate.

[fandandy 3,311]

I think the silver lining in all of this is going to be the realization that the world is currently overly dependent on China.  Hopefully, this is the beginning of factories coming back to the US.

I won't hold my breath but that's my hope.

[edjr 5,564]

2 hours ago, Utilit99 said:

I don't have the exact numbers but someone told me just last week that they learned 30,000 of the deaths were infants.

 

 

Sounds like cornavirus is doing god's work. 

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

It's the people's fault that so much stuff comes from China. People want it cheaper which means we can't pay American wages to those who manufacture our goods. If people would have been determined to buy homemade goods, then we wouldn't be in this mess

[fandandy 3,311]

Just now, Frozenbeernuts said:

It's the people's fault that so much stuff comes from China. People want it cheaper which means we can't pay American wages to those who manufacture our goods. If people would have been determined to buy homemade goods, then we wouldn't be in this mess

I'm sure there are a million reasons, kind of like the butterfly effect, but big picture, we need a government whose sole job is to protect its citizens and to have the foresight to know that moving all our manufacturing jobs overseas is a bad idea and to pass laws to make it difficult to do.

[NorthernVike 2,080]

How many people infected in China are treating themselves with herbal medicines?   May have an effect on mortality rates. 

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

42 minutes ago, fandandy said:

I'm sure there are a million reasons, kind of like the butterfly effect, but big picture, we need a government whose sole job is to protect its citizens and to have the foresight to know that moving all our manufacturing jobs overseas is a bad idea and to pass laws to make it difficult to do.

Trump is hopefully moving the country in that direction with the tariffs

[Baker Boy 1,485]

1 hour ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

It's the people's fault that so much stuff comes from China. People want it cheaper which means we can't pay American wages to those who manufacture our goods. If people would have been determined to buy homemade goods, then we wouldn't be in this mess

What mess is that?

[Hardcore troubadour 12,646]

1 hour ago, fandandy said:

I think the silver lining in all of this is going to be the realization that the world is currently overly dependent on China.  Hopefully, this is the beginning of factories coming back to the US.

I won't hold my breath but that's my hope.

I’d settle for them going to Mexico. 

[Baker Boy 1,485]

2 hours ago, fandandy said:

I think the silver lining in all of this is going to be the realization that the world is currently overly dependent on China.  Hopefully, this is the beginning of factories coming back to the US.

I won't hold my breath but that's my hope.

Donald J Trump POTUS is doing this. He waved his magic wand and created of 600,000 manufacturing jobs. It is voters like you who will try to change this.

[fandandy 3,311]

20 minutes ago, Baker Boy said:

It is voters like you who will try to change this.

I don't think you know me too well.

[fandandy 3,311]

It wasn't me who gave you the crazy eyes.  I hate getting the crazy eyes...

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

56 minutes ago, Baker Boy said:

What mess is that?

Being so reliant on China for medical supplies and prescriptions

[fandandy 3,311]

From an article on Gateway Pundit:

The coronavirus poses an imminent national security threat that would induce the implosion of the U.S economy and beget an unprecedented “health security” crisis, predicts Mike Bowen, executive vice president of Prestige Ameritech, the sole full-line surgical mask manufacturer in America.

More than 90 percent of surgical masks and respirators sold in the United States are produced overseas, according to the Department of Health and Human Services.

China typically produces approximately half the world’s sanitary face masks — around 20 million a day, or more than seven billion a year, while Taiwan makes 20 percent of the global supply. However, people are not showing up to the factories or their jobs, crippling the communist country’s economy. The virus has cut production down to approximately 10 million daily, which is not even meet the current demand in China.

If factories in China continuously fail to operate at full strength, the global supply chain for even the most specialized products would cause large-scale global disruption.  At any given time, these countries could easily cut off the U.S. supply chain, leaving Ameritech Prestige as the last line of America’s defense amid biological warfare.

“We make 7 percent of the [global] mask supply,” Bowen explained on Steve Bannon’s “War Room: Pandemic” podcast. “China has steadily been taking away our mask business. In a few years, it will all be owned by China – they sell the mask for less than I can buy the material.

“America’s hospitals want to save money. The way America’s hospitals buy products – it’s all rigged. GPO, group purchasing organization, bid these things out. They’re looking for the low price, that’s China. That’s why all this happening.”

The most effective mask, known as the N95 respirator, is designed to filter at least 95% of airborne particles and more sufficiently protects against the spread of virus-laden droplets than surgical masks.

China currently produces approximately 600,000 of N95 masks daily, according to figures from the Ministry of Industry. Hospitals do not stockpile these high-quality masks and typically have enough to last just two weeks.

“We are not the only manufacturer of N95s,” Bowens said. “We are the only surgical mask manufacturer still left in the USA –that’s no small thing because the N95 supply rests on the foundation of the surgical mask supply and if it collapses the N95 supply will immediately collapse.”

Last month, China, Taiwan and India banned the export of face masks to reserve them for desperate residents. India removed the ban earlier this month.  Thailand limited exports of surgical masks earlier this month.  As a result, pharmacies in the U.S. are reporting supply shortages. According to a new survey conducted by the National Community Pharmacists Association, nearly 96 percent of U.S. pharmacists said the coronavirus has led to shortages and nearly 40 percent don’t have enough N95 respirators as retailers wait to restock shelves.

As the coronavirus metastasized across 24 countries, Prestige Ameritech is receiving international orders to outsource its supply from foreign governments, including Hong Kong, Singapore and Taiwan.

“There is 200 times more demand than there is supply,” Bowen said. “My phone is ringing every two minutes, every one minute I am getting an email. I had to change my email address so that I could actually see emails from my customers.”

For over a decade, Bowen warmed government officials of the insecure U.S. mask supply, but those who had the power to preemptively remedy the situation brushed him off.

“I’ve been preaching this American-made story since 2007. Nobody listened. “The whole mass market was only interested in price,” he said. “I’ve been everywhere for 14 years trying to get people to listen. I’ve talked to congressmen. I’ve talked to generals. I’ve written the president. I wrote President Obama five or six letters and he sent me a presidential proclamation on pandemics suitable for framing.”

The Department of Health and Human Service confirmed America’s mask makers had left the country in 2007 and HHS official met with Prestige Ameritech, Bowen explained, only to conclude the department merely had “authority to study the problem.”

As of Feb. 18, a total of 72,436 people are confirmed to have been infected with the disease in China, while 1,868 people have died, according to the Chinese government.

Professor Gabriel Leung, the founding director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center for Infection Disease Epidemiology and Control in Hong Kong, estimates the number of people infected by the Wuhan coronavirus will double every six days and could potentially infect 60 to 90 percent of the world in the next couple of years unless public health authorities impose “substantial draconian measures to limit population mobility.”

People need to be prepared for the outbreak to become a global epidemic though it is “not a certainty by any stretch of the imagination…we must prepare better for it,” he told reporters in January.

The government’s apathy to the impending crisis, makes it near impossible to adequately supply the demand for masks upon the coronavirus hitting the U.S. and precipitously expanding the Prestige is a financial liability, Bowen argued.

“It’s too little too late,” he said. When the Ebola pandemic caused global panic, “we hired 150 people, we built new machines. Everybody said they’d stay with us. The day after the pandemic, they forgot who we were. We nearly went out of business. I had to sell 5 percent of the company to survive in 2011.

“The [Center for Disease Control] needs to get involved and they need to tell America’s hospitals what they’ve been telling me – this is a national security problem and they should buy American masks.  The Department of Defense should stop letting our warfighters rely on a mask supply that’s controlled by a foreign government. I can’t help everybody right now. We are going to help as many hospitals as we can. It takes months to build a mass machine.”

The United States is also entirely reliant on Chinese manufacturing for nearly all pharmaceutical drugs,   generic prescriptions and over-the-counter product supplements and medicines – including penicillin and vitamin C. If US-China tensions worsen, China could cut off antibiotic exports, throwing our hospitals into turmoil.

Bannon, a former top adviser to President Donald Trump, warns these foreign dependencies are at the heart of what it means to be made in America.

“In order to have a secure nation, it’ more than just tanks and soldiers and missiles, there is health security. We are now paying the true cost of the China price, with this just-in-time inventory,” he said. “This globalization. It wasn’t just about taking jobs, which is bad enough, it wasn’t just about stripping our factories out of here. It’s left us exposed as a nation.

“We are now supplicants to our enemies. That is unacceptable and I know that is one of the reasons why Donald Trump is president of the United States.”

 

[Big Guy 1,400]

I wouldn't doubt if this was created to kill off as many Trump voters as possible.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

11 hours ago, NorthernVike said:

How many people infected in China are treating themselves with herbal medicines?   May have an effect on mortality rates. 

That is one thing I don't think would happen in the states. People here are hiding it to avoid the horrible hospital and camps. They had to pull cough and cold medicine off the shelves to try to flush people out.

Shows me people don't trust the government as much as they pretend to here. 

[Voltaire 4,559]

7 hours ago, Big Guy said:

I wouldn't doubt if this was created to kill off as many Trump voters as possible.

Take comfort in the notion that viruses spread better in crowded areas.

[NorthernVike 2,080]

24 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

Take comfort in the notion that viruses spread better in crowded areas.

I'd like to order a case of it for both LA and nyc.

[Big Guy 1,400]

1 hour ago, Voltaire said:

Take comfort in the notion that viruses spread better in crowded areas.

what a loaded statement 

[The Observer 641]

9 hours ago, Big Guy said:

I wouldn't doubt if this was created to kill off as many Trump voters as possible.

I can see that. They say it is the older weak ones that are most vulnerable. 

[Gladiators 1,904]

3 minutes ago, The Observer said:

I can see that. They say it is the older weak ones that are most vulnerable. 

Low blow to KayJay.  He's working on it.

[Cdub100 3,380]

Has anyone start prepping stuff like cleaning supplies soaps or all the other sh!t manufactured in China?

[Strike 3,975]

Voltaire/Titans/China Geeks,

  How things over there?  Hope you're all still healthy and symptom free. 

[naomi 343]

On 2/19/2020 at 3:48 PM, Cdub100 said:

Has anyone start prepping stuff like cleaning supplies soaps or all the other sh!t manufactured in China?

Did some "if we need to get out of dodge" for a couple months shopping a couple weeks ago. Bulk food. Some PPE stuff short of suits. Water barells. Definitely the weirdest spent day off from work I've ever taken; felt like a crazy person because I felt like I had to do it.

Being prepared in general for failure of what you normally rely on...wise. Good. Getting prepared quickly, somewhat specifically, because of a notion/feeling that you rationally recognize could be your own power-of-suggestion, definitely more

[Cloaca du jour 2,064]

On 2/21/2020 at 11:12 AM, Strike said:

Voltaire/Titans/China Geeks,

  How things over there?  Hope you're all still healthy and symptom free. 

They ded?

[Hardcore troubadour 12,646]

I hope they are all well. Stock up on dog food. Protein will be hard to come by. Feed the dog then eat it when necessary. 

[jerryskids 5,206]

5 hours ago, Cloaca du jour said:

They ded?

Strike's post was midnight Chiner time.  Yours was 5AM.  I wouldn't have their funeral just yet. 

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

3 hours ago, jerryskids said:

Strike's post was midnight Chiner time.  Yours was 5AM.  I wouldn't have their funeral just yet. 

I'm fine. Going to the grocery here in a bit. Just chilling in the house otherwise. 

[Voltaire 4,559]

On 2/22/2020 at 12:12 AM, Strike said:

Voltaire/Titans/China Geeks,

  How things over there?  Hope you're all still healthy and symptom free. 

We're all symptom free. Panzhihua is now up to 15 cases, 13 have been released, two are in the hospital. The newest three cases are all connected to the same family and had already been in quarantine.

So in some regards, that feels pretty safe.

Things though may be changing. My BiL, the burn victim that I'd talked about previously, had been visiting us for the Spring Festival Holiday. He's estranged from his wife and since my wife and his hate each other, we never see her anymore. Anyway, yesterday, inter-city transport re-opened for non-Hubei and he went back to Chengdu. he had to get a check at the hospital to make sure that he was infection free to buy a ticket to get on the train.

I wonder how accurate the testing is that they're using. Hopefully it's more than just check his temperature, people can have it for days without showing any symptoms. If the economy is going to pick up, a lot of people that were visiting family will have to return to their workplaces. Panzhihua seems to have it under control well enough but who knows? People from here are now going to other places and people from other places are coming here. They're all wearing masks (likely all of them are re-using ones for days that are recommended to be disposed of after one use) and none are showing symptoms. We'll see what happens from here. It's hard to begrudge the government for wanting to get the workers back to their workplaces and kicking the economy into gear again... but the danger is obvious.

As for us, we remain stuck at home watching the days pass in the most boring vacation imaginable.

[Voltaire 4,559]

7 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

stuck at home 

We're not really 'stuck'. We're just complying with the general advice to not leave the house unless we have to buy something. If fact, I can leave and walk about anytime and as I understand it, things are loosening up and. more stores are opening. There is a bakery nearby that I can buy bread at now that has re-opened. I'd very like for my local computer repairmen to arrive back in the city but that's still not happened yet.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

2 hours ago, Voltaire said:

We're not really 'stuck'. We're just complying with the general advice to not leave the house unless we have to buy something. If fact, I can leave and walk about anytime and as I understand it, things are loosening up and. more stores are opening. There is a bakery nearby that I can buy bread at now that has re-opened. I'd very like for my local computer repairmen to arrive back in the city but that's still not happened yet.

I wish the drinking water delivery guy would get back to work. I'm down to about 8L, and carrying that sh!t up six flights sucks. 

[Voltaire 4,559]

2 hours ago, titans&bucs&bearsohmy! said:

I wish the drinking water delivery guy would get back to work. I'm down to about 8L, and carrying that sh!t up six flights sucks. 

I bought what I could pass off as the penthouse suite on the 11th floor since that's the top .... but we have an elevator. 

[Voltaire 4,559]

Panzhihua gives me a sense that we are coming out of our quarantine on the back end of this. Like I said, my BiL left this morning on a train for Chengdu this morning, but also, just now, my wife surprised me. We ate delivery food from a KFC knockoff. We hadn't eaten restaurant food since January 30th, everything was shut down. Like I said the bakery is open again.... I may just go for a walk and see just how much is coming back to life while I stay secluded from it all watching, the nice weather of Spring disappear from my bedroom window.

I hope they have and are using real detection tests rather than the ever-present temperature guns around here because temperature guns are one step removed from worthless. You could have coronavirus for two weeks and be able to spread it while not developing a fever. It's just psychological, it doesn't detect anything unless you're already in the final stages.

[JustinCharge 2,397]

 

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

1 hour ago, Voltaire said:

Panzhihua gives me a sense that we are coming out of our quarantine on the back end of this. Like I said, my BiL left this morning on a train for Chengdu this morning, but also, just now, my wife surprised me. We ate delivery food from a KFC knockoff. We hadn't eaten restaurant food since January 30th, everything was shut down. Like I said the bakery is open again.... I may just go for a walk and see just how much is coming back to life while I stay secluded from it all watching, the nice weather of Spring disappear from my bedroom window.

I hope they have and are using real detection tests rather than the ever-present temperature guns around here because temperature guns are one step removed from worthless. You could have coronavirus for two weeks and be able to spread it while not developing a fever. It's just psychological, it doesn't detect anything unless you're already in the final stages.

People here also seem to think we're coming out of it. No new cases in Shenzhen or Guangzhou. New Cases down in Guangdong province as a whole.

Pretty much everything is open, although carry out only.

Supposedly were going back to school a week from tomorrow. I don't see a chance in hell that happens. I'm sure the powers that be will change that at some point. 

[naomi 343]

Difficult times in South Korea, Iran and Italy (among some others but their news is surfacing more).

What I gather from following different balanced people - various medical leadership, epidimeologists & journos, is that the virus progress globally and supply chain ramifications are objectively, by far, the most newsworthy story right now but the U.S. government is (somewhat understandably) looking to avoid panic.

The best thing to do: